Going pro, 1st regulator set on purchase?

[Jonathan Österlund]

Hi there! I'm going professional soon enough, but before I leave for DM internship, I want to buy my own gear. The price range at my destination is pretty much higher than what I can do from Europe, so I'm purchasing my gear back home, but I'm not 100% sure about regulator / low pressure connection / air gauge hose.

There might be some dumb questions (I know there is no dumb questions) but better to be safe than sorry, right?!

So to start at the beginning:

1. The first stage, that attaches the regulator set to the scuba tank. The way it's attached to the bottle, is there only 1 type, or is there different types available? (I've heard about 'DIN' and 'yoke'? Yoke's the usual thing right?)
2. The second stage, regulator so to speak, when you attach it to 1st stage (to the port), is the threads on the hoses always same? Is there a possibility to purchase a hose with different thread than what's in the 1st stage of the set (in the port)? Same question about the other hoses, air gauge connection and BCD low pressure connection?
3. Is there a huge difference between the regulators? As they go from 100 to 1000 euros anyway.

Thanks for the answers!

 

[Phil_C]

Hi Jonathan,

I'll answer your questions - however whilst there are no dumb questions, there are basic things that you really should understand to make an informed choice.

1 - there are two common types of methods of connecting first stages. The first is "Yoke" also called A clamp and is a method where the first stage fits over the pillar of the tank valve, the o-ring is on the pillar valve and this type of connector is limited to the lower pressure 232 bar tanks. The second common type of connector is DIN, and with this the first stage screws into the pillar valve. The o-ring is 'captive' inside the pillar and it is generally considered more secure and less likely to suffer an o-ring failure. Because the o-ring is internal and the connection more secure DIN first stages are rated to 300 bar, so can be used with higher pressure tanks where they are available. So DIN is generally felt to be a 'more secure' connection and can take higher pressures. BUT not all dive centres use DIN compatible tanks (it needs a different type of pillar valve). Many A clamp type tanks can be easily converted by removing the central donut with an Allen key but not all can, so you need to check what type of tanks are used wherever you will do your DM internship.

2 - generally all low pressure hoses these days use the same thread, so a regulator hose should fit all first stages, BUT low pressure and high pressure hoses are different so you cannot mix and match hoses. If you stick to the same make of regulator and first stage you should not have a problem, and this is wise because the first stage will be tuned for a particular IP (intermediate pressure) and second stages are also tuned for a certain IP. Within manufacturers products, i.e. scuba pro first stages and second stages it is likely to be the same. It MAY not always be the same if you mix first stages from one company with second stages from another. Normally it will be fine, but it is best not to mix and match first and second stage makes (and not recommended by manufacturers).

3 - yes - there is a lot of difference, some types are more suited to cold water (sealed first stages) some have adjustable inhalation effort, certain materials are better for heat transfer and so on. All regulators on sale from reputable companies will be safe and fit for purpose, but some will be better than others.

So in order to make your decision you need to know what you require from your regulator, what conditions you will use it in and so on.

Best

Phil.

 

[Jonathan Österlund]

Well, that's the most specific answer I could hope fore, cheers!

 

[Jonathan Österlund]

Is there also any difference between BCD connection (low pressure) ports?

 

[Phil_C]

Again generally no, most new BCD's will come with an appropriately sized hose in the box. The hose to BCD connection therefore will not be an issue, and the hose to first stage connection is again just a standard low pressure threaded connection.

The only thing to be careful about is if you buy an older second hand BCD. Some of these have a slightly different connection at the inflator end, so if you do buy second hand see if the hose comes with it. This is also the case with a few older drysuits, the inflator connector is slightly different, I know as I have been caught out and spent time hunting down the right connector.

But all new kit will be the same, and normally as I say BCD's (and drysuits for that matter) come with an appropriate those in the box. - P

 

[herman]

To add a little to Phil, which you choose, yoke or DIN is best done based on the prevailing valve variety at the location you plan to regularly dive at. Here in the US and Caribbean, yoke is more common and at times finding a DIN tank can be problematic although that is getting a little easier. There are adapters available but they are less than ideal solutions. If you are going to be predominantly using one style of tank its best if you use the same type of connection. All regs can be easily converted between the 2 so buying one type and converting it to the other later is always an option.


A few more comments on the difference between them. There is a common misconception in the scuba world that the sealing interface is different between the 2 types, it is not. Both "capture" the oring in the same manner, the only differences are where the oring groove is located, on the male (regulator) side of the DIN connection as opposed to the female (tank) side of the Yoke and the oring is seated deeper into the DIN valve. The actual seal is exactly the same and has the same sealing capacity. The only real difference is in the structural strength of the mechanical connection itself and while the DIN is capable of withstanding higher pressures than the yoke, it has its disadvantages as well. It is much less tolerant to abuse and is more easily damaged than its yoke counterpart. Another common misconception is yokes are limited to 3000psi/ 232 BAR. While it is true many yokes are rated at 3000psi/232 BAR, there are a number of them that are rated to 4000 psi/272 BAR. This however, is a moot point outside the technical diving community since no (or at least none I am aware of) recreational diving location uses high pressure tanks and again, the reg can be converted to a different connection type if high pressure tanks become common where you dive. Bottom line, both types work well and which you choose is best determined by the predominant type used in the dive location you most frequent.

 

[halocline]

Here's my advice:
1. Contact the dive op you will be working with for your DM internship. Ask them whether they generally use yoke or DIN tanks. Buy a regulator that matches their answer.
2. There are standard size threads for the hose/2nd stage connections. Most regulators adhere to this, but there are a few that don't. Buy one that does. That means 7/16" high pressure connections and 3/8" low pressure connections. Just ask the salesman about it, if he doesn't know, find another salesman.
3. As long as you don't buy one of the octo/inflator combo devices (like the scubapro air2) you will have a standard LP inflator hose, and that hose probably will come with the BC. Again, ask the salesman to make sure your LP inflator hose is standard.
4. There is a slight difference between regulators in terms of breathing performance, but they all work fine for recreational open water diving, except in extremely cold water. My advice would be to not spend a lot of money. It's best if the regulator you bring with you can be serviced where you're going, in case there's a problem. A good idea would be to contact your DM dive op and ask them what brands of regulators can be serviced in the area. If it's a good internship, you'll be there a while and do maybe 100+ dives, including all the OW classes and skills sessions.
5. Don't take this the wrong way, but these are pretty basic questions about regulators, and you'll want to educate yourself as you head in the pro direction. There's no reason that DMs or instructors have to be experts about regulators (although many just assume they are, hehe) but you do need to have a working knowledge of the basics. So get reading!...
6. Have a great time at your internship!