CESA - why? I'll never run low on air!

[Rick Murchison]

... if you're ascending at a normal rate, and you have air, why not breathe while ascending ...

In all of the circumstances other than "out of gas" (and my basic premise for this thread is that gas supply is not an issue) you should absolutely inhale whenever you need to during the emergency ascent. If you're ascending so fast that air needs to come out of your lungs while you're "inhaling" it will do just that. Breathe during the ascent. The only reason we teach "exhale all the way" is that if you have no gas, in order to be "always breathing," that is exhaling. Instructors should make sure this point is driven home - exhaling is breathing, and so is inhaling.
Rick

 

[in_cavediver]

You missed one word...

Thanks - PC was acting up as I was typing - kept posting updates before I was done.

 

[Karibelle]

In all of the circumstances other than "out of gas" (and my basic premise for this thread is that gas supply is not an issue) you should absolutely inhale whenever you need to during the emergency ascent. If you're ascending so fast that air needs to come out of your lungs while you're "inhaling" it will do just that. Breathe during the ascent. The only reason we teach "exhale all the way" is that if you have no gas, in order to be "always breathing," that is exhaling. Instructors should make sure this point is driven home - exhaling is breathing, and so is inhaling.
Rick

thanks - then we're just having a terminology issue. In my world, a "CESA" is conducted by breathing out, not in, because you have no gas left. Therefore, if gas supply is not an issue, one would not conduct a CESA, but would conduct some other sort of ascent, perhaps "ESA" as indicated by a previous poster.

kari

 

[DeepBound]

My point is simply this: running out of gas is not the only circumstance that puts you in a situation where your time of useful consciousness is very limited. There are other circumstances that can do that, and an ability to make a controlled, emergency ascent without killing yourself - without reverting to the natural tendency to hold your breath underwater - must be so ingrained that it is automatic and overcomes instinct.

Wouldn't you continue breathing on the way up in that scenario? if so, is it really a CESA? I thought CESA is something you do without breathing?

 

[Rick Murchison]

I am gonna pick on all of you because people keep confusing terms and meaning. OK, for the definitions:

1) CESA - Controlled Emergency Swimming Ascent - as taught in PADI. This is where you exhale continuosly to the surface maintaing neutral buoyancy. You do not inhale.

2) ESA - Emergency Swimming Ascent - Essentially the same as a CESA but you have air to breathe - so you breathe it. This could be your air or an air share

3) Bouyant Ascent - this is basically the I must get to the surface and I may not be able to do it myself mentality. This is only marginally controlled and may or may not be done with air or while breathing. Very much the last ditch effort

Everything Rick posted above is for ESA or Buoyant ascents simply because you have gas.

Wouldn't you continue breathing on the way up in that scenario? if so, is it really a CESA? I thought CESA is something you do without breathing?

I guess we need to define terms here... when I say "CESA" my emphasis is on "Controlled" and not restricted to "normal" or "out of gas." If I'm reading you right then what I'm calling a "CESA" is called an "ESA" by PADI if you have gas. If that's the case then I'm talking about "ESAs" here, or even "modified ESAs" because I'll accept an ascent rate that's greater than 60FPM for myself. (This is not to advise any of you to do that - if you do you'll die immediately!)
I was raised in the 60/60/60 school... "emergency" connotes something outside that
The shift to "buoyant" is made when you make the "I'm not going to make it" decision and you decide your only option is an uncontrolled ascent.
Rick

 

[DeepBound]

It's all fine and dandy to say that if you do everything perfectly and have perfect buddy skillz, you'll never need to do a CESA.

But how about having it in your arsenal just in case one day you don't quite reach perfection. It happens. I'm not perfect yet, so I like backup plans.

I've only used it once, and only from 17ft deep, and yes it was because I screwed up, but I'm glad it was an option.

 

[letterboy]

I took the air bags outof my car because I will never get into a car accident because I am a good driver. . .

 

[Rick Murchison]

Wouldn't you continue breathing on the way up in that scenario? if so, is it really a CESA? I thought CESA is something you do without breathing?

OOooo.... target in sight... two's in hot...
Now it's my turn to parse words
Never hold your breath! Always breathe! If you have no gas, what does "always breathe" mean? Gotta exhale, right?
All too often we confuse "without breathing" and "without inhaling."
(sorry... couldn't resist )
Rick

 

[in_cavediver]

I guess we need to define terms here... when I say "CESA" my emphasis is on "Controlled" and not restricted to "normal" or "out of gas." If I'm reading you right then what I'm calling a "CESA" is called an "ESA" by PADI if you have gas. If that's the case then I'm talking about "ESAs" here, or even "modified ESAs" because I'll accept an ascent rate that's greater than 60FPM for myself. (This is not to advise any of you to do that - if you do you'll die immediately!)
I was raised in the 60/60/60 school... "emergency" connotates something outside that
The shift to "buoyant" is made when you make the "I'm not going to make it" decision and you decide your only option is an uncontrolled ascent.
Rick

Yep. I bet most of the people argueing over the CESA stuff really agree as well.

My opinion - teach ESA, CESA and Buddy Breathing. Mention buoyant ascents but don't actually do one. (on the fence about whether to do CESA's or not)

Again, these are all tools an OW diver should have and know. They also need to know the ratings of how best choose. Clearly the buoyant ascent is the bottom rung last ditch survival option. Buddy breathing falls in bottom options as well. CESA's may be better than buddy breathing - may not. Ultimately though, an ESA with buddy's air or pony etc is much better than CESA, Buddy Breathing or Buoyant ascent.

 

[PerroneFord]

I took the air bags outof my car because I will never get into a car accident because I am a good driver. . .

Did you practice with those airbags? Did you drive with your seatbelt off because you had those airbags?

Again, running out of air is preventable in nearly all circumstances. I believe that is all the "don't do CESA" camp is putting forth.