Dive Master vs Master Scuba Diver

Discussion in 'Q and A for Scuba Certification Agencies' started by chachee99, Mar 9, 2008.

  1. chachee99

    chachee99 Scuba Instructor

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: South Korea
    73
    0
    0
    What are the main differences between a dive master and a master scuba diver . What is the difference between the two programs offered through PADI? I am finishing up my rescue diver course and want to continue learning. Currently I have over 50 logged dives and two specializations with Nitrox. Are the benefits the same or different between a dive master and master diver? Please explain.

    Thanks

    Chachee
     
  2. Divedoggie

    Divedoggie Scuba Instructor

    # of Dives:
    Location: Ft Collins, CO
    2,043
    197
    0
    Master Diver is simply a recognition that you have completed 5 specialties, rescue diver, and have at least 50 logged dives. Its kind of a pat on the back and an acknowledgement that you have made a commitment to diving as a recreational diver.

    DiveMaster is the first professional level. Most divemaster courses are conducted over an eight to 12 week period. You must pay for liability insurance and membership dues annually. As a divemaster you can lead local dives, assist instructors, and conduct certain scuba reviews and discover scuba classes. There are numerous requirements and a serious time commitment necessary for the course.
     
    still new likes this.
  3. Jim Lapenta

    Jim Lapenta Tech Diver

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Canonsburg, Pa
    15,925
    7,394
    113
    For master diver the specialties required are deep and uw nav. Nitrox counts as do other more useless specialities such as boat diver, fish ID, project aware, etc. If you go for it get some useful ones like search and recovery, night/low vis, drysuit if applicable, wreck, peak buoyancy, etc. Ones that will actually help your skills. The others can be done later when you have money to throw away.

    As was said DiveMaster is the first pro level. Some of us refer to it fondly as indentured servitude depending on where you are or who you do the course with. You'll focus alot on theory, teaching methods, organization, and marketing. Your skills will be tested and will need to be demonstration quality. You'll get alot of time in the water and also schlepping gear, cleaning it, putting it away, perhaps "volunteering" at the shop, etc. If you don't plan on ever teaching or trying to work as a divemaster I'd skip it. The theory you can get by reading,the organizational skills by working at most any job, and the marketing is a big waste of time as far as your diving goes.
     
  4. Carribeandiver

    Carribeandiver Deep South DIR

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: New Orleans
    611
    1
    0
    Master Scuba Diver with PADI is nothing more then the completion of 5 specialties and 50 logged dives. Master Scuba Diver certification through NAUI is a comprehensive course that teaches many things including indepth physics, rescue, and numerous other skills.
    Dive Master is the first level of being certified a professional which mandates certain things as DiveDoggie outlined above.
    If you wish to become a professional, then Dive Master is the program for you. Upon completion you will have learned and practiced many skills beyond the PADI Master Scuba Diver.
    But, if you merely wish to remain recreational but wish to enhance your diver skills and learn more, then NAUI Master Scuba Diver is the course I would recommend.
    Go to the respective web sites and look over the requirements for a bette idea of what is required for certification as a Master Scuba Diver through PADI and NAUI. I think you will agree NAUI is a much better MSD course.
    Good Luck and safe diving.
     
  5. DivingPrincessE

    DivingPrincessE Single Diver

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Miramar & Fort Lauderdale, FL
    3,424
    120
    0
    Are you saying that for master diver you have to do the deep and uw navigation specialties? I did them as part of my AOW, but I have not done the extra dives to get the official "specialty". It doesn't say anything about that on the Master Diver section on the PADI website, and I've never heard that before...

    PADI Master Scuba Diver Course Details

    I thought it was Rescue Diver, AOW, and any five specialties.

    Also another question related to that. Do you get Master diver automatically when you complete the pre-reqs, or are there classes and dives associated with the card?
     
    Capt Ryan likes this.
  6. GTaylor

    GTaylor Surface Interval Member

    # of Dives: 100 - 199
    Location: Avon, IN
    84
    1
    0
    When I got my Master Diver there were no requirements on which specialties were needed, I think it is still any five.

    It is not automatic, you have to send in the form with a processing fee and proof of five specialties.
     
  7. DivingPrincessE

    DivingPrincessE Single Diver

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Miramar & Fort Lauderdale, FL
    3,424
    120
    0
    Oh ok, but it's just a form and fee (of course there is a fee, it's PADI). I just wanted to know if there was a test or anything.

    Caribbeandiver-
    If you wanted to do the NAUI Master Diver, would your PADI specialties count or would you need to get NAUI open water certified and do X amount of NAUI specialties?
     
  8. Jim Lapenta

    Jim Lapenta Tech Diver

    # of Dives: 500 - 999
    Location: Canonsburg, Pa
    15,925
    7,394
    113
    Gtaylor is correct. any 5. So I guess boat diver, fish ID, project aware, bug eye mask, and manatee wrangler, make you a master diver. See why it's not worth the 40 bucks. I wish it would require some actual diving specialties that are worthwhile. And no your padi specialties woukd not count towards NAUI master diver. It's set up quite differently. 23 hours of estimated classroom time, widest variety of diving envrionments as possible. Required dives in deep w simulated decompression, limited vis/night, search and recovery- light salvage, emergency procedures and rescue. Number of dives is set by the instructor but a minumum of 8 is required in the course. The 5 noted plus 3 of the following elective dives involving practical applications of skin diving, basic scuba skills, environmental study or survey, air consumption, boat diving, shore diving, hunting and collecting, special interest. Usually the instructor requires a demonstration of the practical applications with an academic presentation of each. Academics include classroom sessions covering applied sciences-physics, physiology, medical aspects and fitness. Diving equipment, Diving risks, diving environment, uw navigation, limited visibility, search and recovery- light salvage, deep and simulated decompression( theory and practical applications). the instructor may require exams and tests in all the areas. ALso it is not unusual for the instructor to require a set number of dives before starting the course and doing a skill eval to see if you're ready to start it.
     
  9. DEEPLOU

    DEEPLOU Manta Ray

    # of Dives:
    Location: Long Island, NY (THE ISLAND)
    725
    6
    0
    Sounds like the NAUI Master diver is more than the PADI "card collector" recognition. But is still less than Dive Master.

    BTW: how do you simulate decompresion?? Every dive is a decompresion dive. its just that those within the "recreational limits" are, as I prefer to call them, NO STOP DIVES. (not including safety stops)

    Don't have to answere the question, just being a WA.
     
  10. fisherdvm

    fisherdvm Great White

    # of Dives:
    Location:
    3,423
    6
    0

    Divemaster actually does not require completion of any specialties at all. It is actually focused on learning theories, science, and testing of scuba knowledge through 6 written exams. The exams apparently are similar to what will be on the instructor exam, I believe. From this basis, it is similar to the NAUI's master diver exam, which I believe is the same one that you have to take before progression to the NAUI's divemaster/instructor program. Divemaster require the internship, which is the attendance of 4 or 5 confined water training of students, and 4 or 5 openwater training of students completing OW, AOW, or other specialties. There is a physical stamina requirement for PADI's divemaster program, as I believe a physical test is also required of NAUI master diver program. I think to enter the NAUI divemaster program you will have to score higher on the written exam than if you simply want to get your NAUI master diver status. The scuba skill test of the PADI program is essentially performing the 20 skills required of the OW class, but in a "demonstration quality". You also are suppose to perform a skill which tests your problem solving. When I did it, I had no idea what to expect. You can read it in my post. The NAUI master diver program has more skills required - I think like diving gear ditch and recover, etc. The NAUI divemaster program encompasses the internship part, which include teaching students. From what I've read of the NAUI master diver program, it is quite comprehensive. I would consider doing it if it were near my home. My sister and her husband did it, and enjoyed it very much. The difference then between PADI's DM and Naui master diver program then is that one - PADI divemaster - is a "professional" status, and you can get liability insurance for leading dives, teach under supervision of an instructor, and teach a limitted number of water related program (skill refreshment, skin diver, snorkeling). While the other - NAUI master diver program - while comprehensive, does not allow you to work as a diver - whether it is cleaning tank or assisting in class. At least, you can not get liability insurance.

    Both SSI and PADI has a master diver program. I believe it is simply completion of 5 speciaties, and X number of dives, plus AOW/rescue. You get it verified, pay a fee, and get a card stating that you are a master diver. But the NAUI master diver card require much more skills, testing, and committment than either SSI's or PADI. In my opinion, any of the 3 routes - PADI divemaster, NAUI master diver, or the ssi/padi master diver implied a diver with supposedly better skills. I just can't fathom why someone would pay for the ssi or padi's master diver card? Except for the prestige. PADI divemaster program is good to improve your understanding of diving science. But does it add more to my diving skills? Not really. Does it increase my confidence under water? Yes - I am much more comfortable buddy breathing, and know that I can handle stress very well when out of breath. Is my basic scuba skills better - yes - after observing multiple instructors teaching confined water sessions - I learn a few things or two.... There are more than one way to skin a cat - and more than one way to teach students. I think doing either PADI divemaster or NAUI master diver program will increase your comfort in the water and your confidence as a diver. My gut feeling is that you will learn more in the NAUI master diver program.
     
  11. pir8

    pir8 NAUI Instructor

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Philadelphia
    2,659
    4
    0
    Actually Deep & Nav are not required for MSD. They are required dives for AOW though.
     
  12. fisherdvm

    fisherdvm Great White

    # of Dives:
    Location:
    3,423
    6
    0
    You don't have to pay for liability insurance, nor do you have to pay your annual membership annually.

    It is just like a doctor's medical degree. I can chose not to pay liability insurance, but my butt is not covered. I can chose not to renew my licensure. But I can't practice medicine.

    In the same way, getting your divemaster certificate does not require you to renew it. Nor teaching student's require that you are insured. If you are dirt poor, what can they sue you for?
     
  13. pir8

    pir8 NAUI Instructor

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
    Location: Philadelphia
    2,659
    4
    0
    So then they'll sue whoever else is involved.
     
  14. fisherdvm

    fisherdvm Great White

    # of Dives:
    Location:
    3,423
    6
    0
    I think the average cost of a successful lawsuit is about $100K. If the LDS, the instructor, the assistant instructor, and the divemaster didn't have to money, they'll go after the gear manufacturer, the fin manufacturer, the school that owns the pool, and the wetsuit manufacturer.

    Who ever has the deepest pocket, and it could very much be that divemaster who was doing nothing except standing there watching.
     
  15. SlowRain

    SlowRain Scuba Instructor

    312
    0
    0
    Master Diver for SSI is 5 specialties...one of which must be stress/rescue and I believe 50 dives. They differentiate by having a Master Diver certification and their version of a PADI Divemaster is called a Dive Control Specialist (aka DiveCon). Active DiveCon's must carry liability insurance and pay annual dues.
     
  16. Divedoggie

    Divedoggie Scuba Instructor

    # of Dives:
    Location: Ft Collins, CO
    2,043
    197
    0
    Why bother to spend the time and money to become a Divemaster and then NOT be active? There are plenty of people who are no longer active DMs, but they most likely initially paid their insurance and membership fees. Now the OP knows what to expect.

    Sure, a person can elect to not pay liability insurance and still be active.
    If you are dirt poor and you get sued, the court could garnish future wages, go after relatives, and basically screw you for life. Liability insurance could come in handy. I teach at a University. Both the University and the my LDS require that my DMs are fully insured and current with membership.
     
  17. DiverBizz

    DiverBizz Manta Ray

    812
    1
    0
    just for your information

    Master Diver PADI 5 specialties
    Master Diver SDI 8 specialties

    plus all the other requirements
     
  18. craracer

    craracer Manta Ray

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location:
    895
    69
    0
    I'm a little disheartened to read that, in essence, the PADI master diver course is a waste of time.

    I just completed my rescue diver and master scuba diver courses last week. I found the courses to be very demanding and challenging. This may have been due to the diligence of my instructor.

    Either way, I feel that my skills have been greatly enhanced. I agree that fish I.D. was somewhat of a joke but, on the other hand I enjoyed learning about the fish and can actually name a few of them now.

    I did: underwater nav, search and recovery, deep diving, fish I.D., and peak performance buoyancy. I learned a great deal from each specialty and am glad that I took them. Unfortunately, NITROX was not offered.

    IMHO, I learned a vast array of important skills, which greatly enhanced my diving abilities. I am also confident that I can assist other divers who might be in dire need of emergency help.

    I didn't "collect cards" just for the prestige. I collected them to improve my diving. How often do you hear people bragging about what credentials they have while on the boat or top-side? I don't ever recall anyone doing so.

    I'm sorry if I sound a bit miffed but I worked hard for the certifications. I feel that I have benefited from my hard work. Who knows, I might start working towards my DM certification. I know that my current certifications will serve as building blocks for the DM course and will benefit those whom I might end up teaching.
     
  19. Don Wray

    Don Wray Scuba Instructor

    # of Dives: 200 - 499
    Location: Sardis lake, Ms.
    1,594
    0
    0
    Congratulations on your accomplishment. Well done.:14:
     
  20. diverdwn71

    diverdwn71 Nassau Grouper

    # of Dives: 50 - 99
    Location: Kansas
    152
    1
    0
    When I did my MD I did DPV, Night, Search and recovery, Underwater Nav, & Boat. Then I went on and got my DM. Now I'm getting ready to go to DUI days and get my Dry Suit class.
    Just remember.
    P - Put
    A - Another
    D - Dollar
    I - In
     

Share This Page