Emergency Life-Support Equipment - Oxygen and AED? - Who Carries on Dive Trips?

[DaleC]

I'd just like to say, this was quite an interesting and positive discussion so far.

 

[TMHeimer]

Back to the poll. I voted I have neither available on dive trips. As pointed out--does trips mean plane, driving, local charters? Our local shop's charters have Ox kit, as have others I have been on. I would doubt most divers bring either unless it involves very deep or tech. dives. I don't really know. I personally don't carry either with me anywhere. The question should be re-worded. Perhaps direct it toward shops, dive ops. Or ask if divers patronize places that have or don't have them?

 

[AFD362]

AED's

Dale, I like your focus on early recognition and focusing on the basics, however AEDs, while probably cost prohibitive for the average diver, can not be replaced by CPR. CPR in and of itself serves more to sustain blood flow to critical organs (brain preservation). The reason for no pulse checks is to get compressions going faster, thus increasing the patients chance of survival. Even with an AED available the recommendations now say to do 2 mins of compressions before shocking when a cardiac arrest is not witnessed. The public safety agency I am involved with as well as the college I teach for have implemented these changes in the past few years (not with out resistance) and have seen a marked improvement in survival rates with percentages now running in the 30% range compared to the poor survival rates of the past. As for cardio version it is not possible with an AED, they are only capable of defibrillation. The name of the game today is compression, compressions then more compressions.

 

[DaleC]

AFD,
I agree with what you are saying. CPR cannot replace an AED anymore than an AED can replace CPR. They are two different tools.
While I also understand the reasoning for no pulse checks, I (personally) feel this leaves a skills deficit where one needs not be. We can do both, but again, I won't argue. Good CPR, no matter the details, is better than bad or none. My experience anyways is that every couple of years CPR protocol changes as the result of some study or other so I'm sure this trend will be changed again in the future.

And thanks for the correction - I have used the term cardioversion to represent the use of electrical energy to alter cardiac rhythms in a general sense when I should be more specific. Because my experience has always been BLS related I tend to clump advanced protocols in general categories like that.

 

[RobertSikes]

This is a greatdiscussion about AEDs.

I wanted to point out a case recently which has prompted more research onresuscitation. A man was given CPR for 96 minutes, 12 shocks and amiodarone. Hehas recovered and doing great.

I bring this up to make the point that we should never give up. Contact EMS and do CPR on a victim of cardiac arrest until adefibrillator is available...period (unless a physician is present and tellsyou to stop.) In the case I mentioned, it took more than 20 people taking turnsgiving quality CPR. That is not always possible, but this shows how nevergiving up really makes a difference.

An AED, oxygenand other tools are not always going to be available, but when CPR can help, itshould be performed as long as necessary.


---------- Post added May 8th, 2012 at 11:57 AM ----------

Sorry for the spacing errors. I am not sure what happened there.

 

[fjpatrum]

When on a boat, I always ask if it's available. When shore diving, I don't have any. I've considered getting some oxygen but haven't pulled the trigger yet.

---------- Post added May 8th, 2012 at 02:13 PM ----------

Unbelievably, in my last recert HCP CPR course I was told the new standard is not to even check for a pulse because it's "too hard to do". We were shown an AED, the instructions for it, and told it would do the diagnosing for us - just follow the prompts. Uggh.

This is a very good reason to take a "wilderness first responder" course that includes CPR. There is no assumption that you will have all the amenities of a modern US shopping mall available and makes a much better course, in my opinion, than what is taught as CPR and first aid, these days.

 

[NorthStar Med]

I'm noticing a lot of incorrect information about AEDs in this thread. With advances in technology and new kinds of AEDs available, not only can many AEDs be used properly by literally anyone, but they are less expensive than they used to be. Basic AED packages begin around $1200 and go up fromt there, but usually you can contact a seller directly and receive an additional discount. AEDs are the only thing that can treat a cardiac event, CPR alone is not enough, it is the combination of CPR + a shock from an AED that will save a cardiac arrest victim. AEDs now have voice-automated prompts that tell the rescuer how to administer CPR and when to deliver a shock. According to the American Heart Association, cardiac arrest kills more people every year than Aids, Breast Cancer and Lung Caner combined. More and more laws are being passed requiring AEDs in public places. The best emergency aid kits contain an AED and I wouldn't want to go on any dive that did not have an AED available, because when cardiac arrest occurs, the only thing that can save a person is an AED and that is a fact.

 

[fjpatrum]

The best emergency aid kits contain an AED and I wouldn't want to go on any dive that did not have an AED available, because when cardiac arrest occurs, the only thing that can save a person is an AED and that is a fact.

Don't dive overseas, then. Not many boats have them in the pretty places we like to go...

 

[lobbolt]

Wow, this thread has become a very informative discussion.

I assume the dive scene where I am is somewhat disconnected to the ScubaBoard dive scene. Not once have I heard nor seen emergency oxygen anywhere near a dive. Nor is it available easily on the market.

 

[Tigerman]

I havent actually clicked anything in the poll and Im not sure I actually answered the question either..
When I go out diving at my very local lakes I dont carry either (not that there would be anyone to use it on me anyways as thats mostly solo diving).
All the boats Ive paid to be on has had minimum o2 kit.