PADI Junior Open Water Diver

Discussion in 'Q and A for Scuba Certification Agencies' started by dujubber, Mar 28, 2009.

  1. dujubber

    dujubber Angel Fish

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    I feel MISLED!

    My whole life as an instructor I believed the depth limit for a PADI Junior Open Water diver aged between 12 and 14 was 12m/40ft! On a trip the other day I was speaking to a fellow instructor who challenged me to find that restriction anywhere in the PADI instructor manual. Well I could not, and have now lost an expensive bet.

    I am probably the worst at this but I take fellow instructors word as law. I must of heard this particular rule somewhere in my early diving days, and trusting him/her, never bothered to check it up in my manual when I became an instructor myself.

    I doubt I would be making such a big deal of this if I had not made a bet. I would have shrugged it off with a 'well fancy that' and replaced the lies with the truth.

    I have found depth restrictions for certified Junior Open Water divers aged 10 and 11, but, please could someone tell me that my previous assumption on depth restrictions for 12-14 year old divers was right, and give me a sound reference for the law.

    PLEASE!!!
     
  2. Jim Ernst

    Jim Ernst Scuba Instructor

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    Um... sorry I also thought the same as you did.

    Though I found this.. 10/11 year old is to 36 feet, 12 to 14 year olds 63 feet.

    New news to me.



    £375

    Course Dates


    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    From the age of 10 years the kids can participate in the full Certificated Open Water course

    Which consists of the same as the adult

    5 theory modules. (Knowledge Reviews) in the classroom

    5 confined /pool water modules in the pool

    4 Open Water Dives



    After the course is complete 10 to 11 olds must ONLY dive with a qualified parent, guardian or a PADI professional with a maximum depth limit of 12 metres.12 to 14 olds maximum 21 meters



    NO HIDDEN EXTRAS!!

    ALL study materials and certification is included in the course price, as is the equipment hire

    They will receive a logbook and certification card



    Price includes Equipment Hire
     
  3. mickeylb

    mickeylb Angel Fish

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    this is from the padi web site

    Bubblemaker (ages 8+)

    This is a good way for children to experience scuba diving in the pool in less than six feet of water. Celebrate a birthday by throwing a memorable, exciting Bubblemaker party with friends at your local PADI dive shop or resort.








    Seal Team (ages 8+)
    The PADI Seal Team is for young divers who are looking for action-packed fun in a pool by doing exciting scuba AquaMissions. Divers are introduced to underwater photography, navigation, environmental awareness and more.








    Junior Open Water Diver (ages 10-14)
    Young people can take the full PADI Open Water Diver scuba certification course and upon completion will become Junior Open Water Divers with certain age limitations for scuba diving:

    Junior Open Water Divers ages 10-11 years old must dive with a PADI Professional or certified parent/guardian. Dives must not exceed 12 metres /40 feet.
    Junior Open Water Divers ages 12-14 years old must dive with a certified adult. (13+ years old can take the Open Water Diver course online.
    Junior Advanced Open Water Diver(ages 12-14)
    Young people can continue the adventure and build their skills by taking the Advanced Open Water Diver course with a few limitations

    Junior Open Water Divers ages 10-11 years must complete three adventure dives to become a Junior Adventure Diver. They must dive with a PADI Professional or certified parent/guardian. Dives must not exceed 12 metres/ 40 feet
    Junior Open Water Divers ages 12-14 years may complete three Adventure Dives to earn the Junior Adventure Diver rating or five Adventure Dives to earn the Junior Advanced Open Water rating They must dive with a certified adult.
    Junior Rescue Diver (ages 12-14)
    Young divers ages 12-14 rise to challenges and learn how to master them in the PADI Rescue Diver course. Upon completion, they become Junior Rescue Divers. They must dive with a certified adult.








    Junior Master Scuba Diver (ages 12-14)
    Young divers ages 12-14 can continue building experience and exploring unique diving environments on their way to the Master Scuba Diver Rating. They must dive with a certified adult.
     
  4. Cerveza

    Cerveza Divemaster

    # of Dives: I'm a Fish!
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    this info i credit to Mark C @ yorkshire divers forums
    Junior Open Water Diver (ages 10-14)

    Young people can take the full PADI Open Water Diver scuba certification course and upon completion will become Junior Open Water Divers with certain age limitations for scuba diving:

    * Junior Open Water Divers ages 10-11 years old must dive with a PADI Professional or certified parent/guardian. Dives must not exceed 12 metres /40 feet.
    * Junior Open Water Divers ages 12-14 years old must dive with a certified adult. (13+ years old can take the Open Water Diver course online.

    PADI Junior Adventure Diver and PADI Junior Open Water DiverJunior Advanced Open Water Diver(ages 12-14)

    Young people can continue the adventure and build their skills by taking the Advanced Open Water Diver course with a few limitations

    * Junior Open Water Divers ages 10-11 years must complete three adventure dives to become a Junior Adventure Diver. They must dive with a PADI Professional or certified parent/guardian. Dives must not exceed 12 metres/ 40 feet
    * Junior Open Water Divers ages 12-14 years may complete three Adventure Dives to earn the Junior Adventure Diver rating or five Adventure Dives to earn the Junior Advanced Open Water rating They must dive with a certified adult.
     
  5. Gen San Chris

    Gen San Chris Barracuda

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    For a junior Open Water Diver aged 10 & 11 years old, the max depth is 40ft - 12 meters!
    The junior diver must then dive onty with a Professional Diver!

    For a Junior Advanced Open Water Diver age 12 - 14 years old, the deepest dive he may dive to is a max depth of 70ft - 21meters!
    The junior Diver must then dive with a certified adult!

    I can find nothing that states that a diver over the age of 12 can go deeper than 40ft - 12 meters!
     
  6. Walter

    Walter Scuba Instructor

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    I find it disturbing that you, as an instructor, haven't read the standards.
     
  7. The Kraken

    The Kraken He Who Glows in the Dark Waters (ADVISOR) ScubaBoard Supporter

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    "On a trip the other day I was speaking to a fellow instructor who challenged me to find that restriction anywhere in the PADI instructor manual. Well I could not, and have now lost an expensive bet."

    From the statement of the OP, I must conclude that he did read the standards in order to provide and answer to the question.

    the K
     
  8. Steve50

    Steve50 Scuba Instructor

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    Shouldn't he have read the standards right before or around the time he became an instructor as opposed to later - to verify that what he had been told about them was untrue?
     
  9. Walter

    Walter Scuba Instructor

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    Excellent point. I'll rephrase.

    I find it disturbing that you, as an instructor, don't know the standards from having read them and have instead been relying on hearsay.

    It's a matter of when he finally got around to reading them.
     
  10. sglake

    sglake Scuba Instructor

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  11. dujubber

    dujubber Angel Fish

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    sglake, walter...

    I have not yet had the opportunity to teach a JOW course and therefore have not read up on the standards for that course. Nor did that question come up in my GSAP exam. Now, I wonder if you can honestly admit to reading the inst manual cover to cover. I also wonder if you have a right to be on a high horse and judge other instructors. Finally, I wonder if you would have the stones to admit is when you make a mistake.

    I would prefer it if this thread stuck to the subject at hand instead of deviating to criticism or issuing of unnecessary advice.
     
  12. sglake

    sglake Scuba Instructor

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    As for mistakes I know of no one who is perfect including myself. That is how we learn. You brought up the point of taking other instructors word as law! You will find that if you ever do have any type of problem the excuse of "well that is what he told me " won't hold up! i don't think anyone here has meant to criticize but you as an instructor have the responsibility to know the standards for the agency that you represent!......and yes I have read the instructor manual cover to cover....It sits beside me at home to review and update as necessary. Good luck on your career. Also it is forums and threads like these that we learn from, but if you hear something make sure it is supported by your agency before you believe it as law.
     
  13. Walter

    Walter Scuba Instructor

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    I've been a YMCA and CMAS Instructor and am currently an SEI Instructor. In addition to the standards for those agencies, I've also read and studied the complete standards for NAUI and, with the exception of some specialties for PADI even though I've never been an instructor for either of those two agencies.

    No high horse or judgement involved. Nowhere did I say you should have your card pulled or even be disciplined. I did say I find the situaton disturbing and I do. I don't find it particularly surprising. PADI standards are written in a particularly cryptic fashion.

    I make mistakes on this board and off it. I admit it when I see I've made a mistake and, when appropriate, I apologize. Do you think I've made a mistake here? I don't see it, please explain.

    I'm sure you would. We all get uncomfortable when called on our screwups. As for "unnecessary advice"... well when you make statements like, "I am probably the worst at this but I take fellow instructors word as law," I hardly think advising you to stop the practice and starting to read the standards for yourself is unnecessary. Unwanted perhaps, but not unnecessary.
     
  14. Gen San Chris

    Gen San Chris Barracuda

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    Instructors are not expected to remember every word in th training literature, thats why the manuals etc are called reference book so that when an instructor is in dought or teaching a new course or one he has not taught for a long time he can watch the DVD's and read up in the manual and get him up to speed!
    The question on this little problem was simple and the guy lost a bet! It was correct though as there is no mention of a depth limit for the older Junior open water divers, it did get a few of us to dig out our PADI Manuals and check so also it was a good excercise for some of us!
     
  15. sglake

    sglake Scuba Instructor

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    I agree and I also got out my manual to check......We never stop learning...
     
  16. Kaiser

    Kaiser Scuba Instructor

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    So what is the depth limit for a 13YO JOW Diver? Going by the PADI website looks like the only restriction would be to dive with a certified adult.
     
  17. knotical

    knotical perpetual student Staff Member

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    In general, PADI recommends maximum depths after certification be the same as the maximums during training, so for your specific question, 60 feet.

    To expand, I first double checked by searching on words like "depth" in the Instructor Manual.

    For 10-11 year olds, the maximum depth is 40 feet, both in training, and after certification.

    For 12-14 year olds in training, the maximum depth during the Open Water course is 60 feet.
    This increases to 70 feet during the AOW course.

    For age 15 and above the maximum depth during OW training is 60 feet.
    During AOW training it is 100 feet.
    And during Deep Diver Specialty training,130 feet.
    Only those age 15 or older can take the Deep Diver specialty.

    After certification, recommended maximum depths are 60 feet for novices, 100 feet for AOW, and 130 feet with the Deep specialty.
    I did not find a specific recommendation for 12-14 year olds with Junior AOW, but suggest that the training maximum of 70 feet would be appropriate.
     
    MauiScubaSteve likes this.
  18. Kaiser

    Kaiser Scuba Instructor

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  19. cindivan

    cindivan Angel Fish

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    Is there somewhere I can reference this or print out? I think every time I have dove with my 12 year old, we are told his max depth is 40 until he is 15. THey usually allow him to go 60, but make an issue out of it and tell us we are wrong. I have tried to find on PADI website and cannot find what you stated, which is what we were told when he got certified when he was 10: it was up to 40 ft until 12, then up to 60 until he is 15, then up to 70 unless advanced.
     
  20. tddfleming

    tddfleming Manta Ray

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    How does a Jr AOW go from Jr to reg. OW? Is there another class, test. Do they go from Jr AOW to OW then progress to AOW??
     

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