**Split Fins – Let the Bashing Begin!**

[danvolker]

Diver Doug, many split fin's are FLAT, but then one design is curved and came out one year before the others.YouTube - ForceFin2020's Channel You might to know how Flat works over a curved shape.

Still waiting for you to revolutionize freediving with a Freediving Force Fin.....You will let me know when you have one for me, right?

Regards,
DanV

 

[Bob Evans]

Dan, I have a meat grinder for you. The hockey fin I made is a hammer meant for the nail. It toasts every fin out their, including several of my early models. Ready to flip out..I didYouTube - ForceFin2020's Channel The U.S. Marines never bashed the Foil Force, which was designed for in line to shore use, no dilly dally folks here.

 

[Bogie]

I have tried several paddle and split fins. I think it is a personal choice.

I use Apollo's because they are very comfortable, easy on my joints and are quite fast. I do long surface swims and love these fins. I dive for fun and don't cave dive or wreck dive.

I found the paddle DIR fins hurt my joints and cause cramping.
The stiff paddle DIR fins are better at frog, helicopter turns, and backward kicks. I can helicopter turn well, frog kick ok, but not backward kick (don't need to swim backwards much) in my Apollo fins.

No dive shop pushed me into any fin. I researched and personally tried many fins and made my choice and Apollo fins were the best for me.

I don't think their is one best fin.

It is an individual choice.

 

[danvolker]

Dan, I have a meat grinder for you. The hockey fin I made is a hammer meant for the nail. It toasts every fin out their, including several of my early models. Ready to flip out..I didYouTube - ForceFin2020's Channel The U.S. Marines never bashed the Foil Force, which was designed for in line to shore use, no dilly dally folks here.

Well, I can say right now that my C4 Mustangs would NOT do well in a test like on your video
However, what I am always looking for is a very long fin that you can use the freediving techniques with...a very slow amplitude, fairly large radius kick....dolphin kicks are great for freedivers, and even frogkicks will be amazingly efficient with a good freediving fin....the big thing is, the slow motion kick holds the bend so long, there is huge thrust with no effort.
The last Force Fins I used impressed me with the power I could get out of them, but they required more of a high cadence effort--more like my bike riding( which would be fine for scuba)....and unlike splits which just wimp out with high cadence power, the Force Fins really got me moving fast...but at a cost of more heart rate increase than I want.
The difference( in my way of thinking ....If you were a SEAL, you would want to maintain a steady good pace, for potentially a very long distance ( as when dropped off miles from shore with a long swim in).....This is kind of like an elite cyclist on a century ride, will want to spin a medium to easy( small) gear, to allow the cardio system( heart) to do the real work, and leave the legs fresh and full of glycogen( energy). If the cyclist were to use a big gear instead, he could either ride much faster( emptying the legs of energy), or, ride with a considerably lower heart rate in the bigger gear, but again, the long term consequence would be freshness at the end of the ride( where you might need to sprint but would have nothing left). Obviously the SEALs would want to be fresh if headed in to combat situations
The freediver makes the conscious decision to push a very big gear ( the long fin) very slowly, to make heart rate run at the lowest it possibly can. The soft flex of the long fin allows this long lever to be managable, particulalry at the very slow cadence. If I am freediving to 80 feet deep, I want my heart rate to be 50 to 70 beats at most, and lower if I can manage it. Very low cadence in the fin kick is part of this. Freedivers train for the duration they will enjoy on a dive outing, so the greater use of leg muscle and lower use of heart rate is expected and planned for. We expect to get tired at some point, whether in 2 hours, 4 hours, or whenever, and this is also why some freedivers have extra soft freedive fins for competitions where they may be swimming for up to 8 hours--these fins will still be kicked slow, but the bend will be extreme if any real power is applied, so the effect is top speed is limited a little when compared to fins used for 1 or 2 hours maximum.

For scuba, I also enjoy running a low heart beat, as this translates to a slow breathing rate--low requirement for ventilation. So the perfect Force Fin for freediving could also be good for scuba, just as my C4 carbons are.

I attached an image of me using the C4's, and being boosted a little by a Gavin...sometimes you want to cover a lot of ground, and really not use up much gas

Regards,
Dan Volker

 

[TN Traveler]

I think that when Bob starts making the "Hockey" Fin in a softer material than the original "test" fins, you might find a fin that comes close to your wishes. Probably not quite as good for free diving as your C4's - but better for scuba. A real good compromise if you only want one fin. Plus they are going to be shorter than your C4's - which will help with travel (also not as fragile when on a boat and some other diver steps on them :depressed: .

 

[danvolker]

I think that when Bob starts making the "Hockey" Fin in a softer material than the original "test" fins, you might find a fin that comes close to your wishes. Probably not quite as good for free diving as your C4's - but better for scuba. A real good compromise if you only want one fin. Plus they are going to be shorter than your C4's - which will help with travel (also not as fragile when on a boat and some other diver steps on them :depressed: .

I do believe Bob is capable of creating a "game changer" for freediving fins.
I hear people talk about freediving fins being too long for travel---and I just don't get that at all. I have been all over the Caribbean, and as far as Fiji with my freediving fins--and have NEVER had any issues at all with transporting them in my luggage. Now the "fragile" part is true. I have to be careful of people dropping a tank on my carbon fiber C4's, and I don't "like" people to step on them .
Getting into the water I have to dive headfirst, as a giant stride would overflex the fin...ofcourse, I always do a negative descent anyway, so I prefer to be swimming down the instant I hit the water anyway.
I see Bob making a non-fragile alternative to a pair of C4's, and maybe even able to transform between freedive associated flex stiffness for deep drops over 80 feet, or the alternative of long duration ( 3 to 8 hour diving) with 30 to 40 foot depths and much softer flex charicteristics for this. As it is now, freedivers often own 3 different pairs of $200 fins, and if they are using C4's, you can more than double this!

Also, the only places I have ever dived where the freediving length and control potential of my freediving fins were not superior to scuba length fins, was in CAVES or serious Shipwreck penetration with silting potential. Freedive lengths are not intelligent for that kind of diving. Every reef I have ever scuba dived on, every shipwreck without deep penetration, even any beach entry, my freediving fins gave me better movement potential in water than fins "aimed" at the scuba market.
I would almost question why there has not been more experimentation with fins longer than the normal freediving fins used today.....

One thing I would never do is consider ( with even a spec of interest) the issue of walking with fins on the dive boat. We buy fins for swimming, not walking in. I can walk fine on a boat with c4's, so this is a non-issue...the dumbest fins I have ever seen are those ridiculous fold up fins that you can fold up on your shin and walk around like your in shoes with---forget that they propel you even less effectively than the worst split fins !!!!



Regards,
DanV