Tip for OW classes?

[oly5050user]

Should a teacher expect a "tip" for spending some extra time helping out a student?

Teachers are PAID to spend extra time helping a student.
When a student signs up for a relatively cheap OW course in a group setting and does not progress at the same speed as the rest of the class and requires additional help from the instructor or DM if there is one assisting YES the student should tip.
Some classes tip generously,even if they had absolutely no issues in the course work and others expect you to work with them for hours at NO pay for them to succeed.
Standard time for our ow course is usually around 16 to 18 hours for a weekend schedule class.That is what the instructor is paid for in a group class setting. Maybe from now on,knowing the students in question will not tip, instructors should just continue the class at a rate that just everyone else in the class can do and allow problem child to continue with the group.
At end of course time inform problem child that they cannot meet standards established by agency and if they wish to continue they can PAY for private time,being that they most likely will not tip.Instructors are underpaid as it is.Would any of you like to stay after a 8 hour work day at your jobs and not be compensated for it?? Instructors must realize that this is a business,yes it is a passion for many and that is great,but after all the bubbles are gone how do you pay the bills? Do you not feel taken advantage of or used like a cheap date?
Perhaps put a statement in the student learning agreement before a course starts that if they cannot keep up this-private time at a cost$$ would be an option.

 

[James R]

T... To
I... Insure
P... proper
S... Service

Should be "TEPS" then since the proper word to use would be ensure in this case

I completely avoid working with classes as a DM if at all possible. The only exception is if I am working the charter and it's got classes only booked on it. Its rare to make any tips from classes, and I don't even expect to.

I would say that most OW students probably have no idea how much (or how little) a DM is actually doing in a class b/c they're too focused on what they are doing and don't have the experience or awareness to see...

 

[Bubbletrubble]

Teachers are PAID to spend extra time helping a student.
When a student signs up for a relatively cheap OW course in a group setting and does not progress at the same speed as the rest of the class and requires additional help from the instructor or DM if there is one assisting YES the student should tip.
Some classes tip generously,even if they had absolutely no issues in the course work and others expect you to work with them for hours at NO pay for them to succeed.
Standard time for our ow course is usually around 16 to 18 hours for a weekend schedule class.That is what the instructor is paid for in a group class setting. Maybe from now on,knowing the students in question will not tip, instructors should just continue the class at a rate that just everyone else in the class can do and allow problem child to continue with the group.
At end of course time inform problem child that they cannot meet standards established by agency and if they wish to continue they can PAY for private time,being that they most likely will not tip.Instructors are underpaid as it is.Would any of you like to stay after a 8 hour work day at your jobs and not be compensated for it?? Instructors must realize that this is a business,yes it is a passion for many and that is great,but after all the bubbles are gone how do you pay the bills? Do you not feel taken advantage of or used like a cheap date?
Perhaps put a statement in the student learning agreement before a course starts that if they cannot keep up this-private time at a cost$$ would be an option.

Reading between the lines, it doesn't sound like you are happy being a scuba instructor. I'm sorry about that.

 

[boulderjohn]

I found this thread fascinating because it really brought home to me how different are the ways instructors and DMs are paid across the nation and the world. People who are responding are generally responding based upon the ways with which they are familiar, which may not be anything like the ways people are paid elsewhere.

Where I work, there are very few independent instructors. Almost all work for shops. They have no say over how much students are charged, how much DMs are paid, or how much they themselves are paid. Some of the people in this thread have said that the instructor should pay the DM more per student than the instructors here are paid themselves. When I was a DM, my pay was MUCH less than minimum wage. As an instructor, it is not much more. The reason to do it is for perks such as discounts on gear, air fills, personal use of equipment too expensive to purchase, etc.

So why don't I (or others) go independent? Because the overhead for instruction (pool rental, student gear, gear maintenance, advertising, etc.) is too much for us to afford. The shops generally operate instruction as a loss leader to get students into the shop to purchase gear. The standard price for instruction is thus something that anyone not selling gear cannot match.

In such cases, the instructor really cannot pay the DMs anything beyond what the shop is paying them, which may be next to nothing.

 

[j yaeger]

perks!!!!!
and don't forget all the chicks!!!!!!!
70 yr old "laverne" gave me a $10 tip for cutting the classroom short...
"i'd rather be squaredancing,ya know!!'
it's all good
yaeg

 

[Phil_C]

T... To
I... Insure
P... proper
S... Service

I'm afraid that I can't agree with this acronym at all, I expect to pay a fair price for goods or services and that the 'fair price' includes proper service. I don't expect to be quoted a price for a shoddy service and have to give a tip to ensure I get proper service - that is what I am paying for in the first place.

I also don't understand this culture that you have to tip or you won't get good service, and that it is acceptable to pay staff less and to factor tips in to an empoyees wages, to me this is appalling - in my last post I employed 130 staff, every one was paid the rate for their role and not expected to make up their wages with tips, and every one was expected to provide good customer service as a requirement of their job, not at the whim of whether they were tipped or not.

Sorry - rant over, but then I am from the UK where tipping is nowhere near as common, although it is starting to creep in.

And no I didn't tip after my CMAS 1* course, I paid a fair and appropriate fee for it. But I did buy the instructor a silver dolphin broach for her birthday, because I wanted to, as thanks for the great instructions and friendship she gave me.

 

[hypertech]

The instructor or the shop should be covering the DM - unless these are open water boat dives and the DM is crew. Then, I could see expecting a tip.

I'm a DM and when I help with classes, I'm paid by the instructor - just about enough to hope to break even on the costs to participate in the class and have a little bit to throw towards the insurance costs. Really, unless your class is really big or you paid a lot, your instructor isn't netting out much either.

While I don't expect a tip, I am given one occasionally and graciously accept it. More often it is from a scuba review student when I am leading the class rather than an open water student. Although not too long ago, an open water student brought in little bags of baked treats for myself and the other instructors and DMs that helped their class. It was very much appreciated. In other words, being nice, just saying thank you, or offering some token of your appreciation is a nice appreciated thing to do if can't or don't want to tip in cash.

 

[dmoore19]

When I did OW I did not tip, I don't think anyone in my class did. I did however buy lunch for the instructor and gave the instructor and the DM a bottle of my hand crafted wine after the OW dives were completed. The instructor and DM still remember me and the wine.

 

[oly5050user]

Reading between the lines, it doesn't sound like you are happy being a scuba instructor. I'm sorry about that.

Very happy to be an instructor who can easily pay his insurance/fees without complaining about it..Too many instructors give their time away for free thinking they are saving the world and then complain about the costs of being an instructor. People in this industry should get realistic and start charging what they are worth and getting paid accordingly.The business model of low cost instruction as a lead in to gear sales is gone.The internet is one reason and the airlines charging for checked bags is another. Too many people get certified and never purchase gear,they rent at the location they fly to. I have certified over 1,000 students over the years and still going. For myself I am teaching more than ever before. Many of those I taught are instructors themselves now and a few own their own stores. I am paid a fair amount by the LDS and it is what the market will bear for the area. I will not teach someone for nothing. If they cannot learn in the scheduled amount of time set out for the course that they paid for then they can pay me or the LDS for additional time they require.
No one should work for free.

 

[mheaster]

When "working" as a Divemaster with my Mentor Instructor, I think I was given a tip by a student once and I was quite shocked. My Instructor Buddy did very often "quietly" cover my Quarry Entrance fees and air as often as it was feasible and even slipped me a $20 occasionally to cover a little bit of my gas(oline). I was grateful for opportunity to dive and continue my diving experience/education.

I did a lot of leg work in staking out a gear staging dive site area by setting out a tarp (earlier than Student arrival. Humping tanks to start day and for fills during day.

I can understand if I did the majority of my tasks before and after students arrived/departed and if everything else went right during classes, it would appear to the Students as I was not doing much (just hovering around watching).

I do not approve of telling people to tip, nor telling people how much to tip. (I will provide an opinion of what I think are suitable tips only if brought up by student and pressed for an answer. Often I would simply state to tip what they feel is appropriate, which is always the right decision) It infuriates me when a restaurant calculates and adds a mandatory tip to a check!

I do mention to classes in my to thank my Divemaster/s for their hard work in support of their class and feel that in addition to an occasional free lunch, discounted/free diving and air and additional experience working with classes and making the acquaintance of an occasional new dive buddy friend; my divermasters are receiving satisfactory albeit modest compensation for their services.

I also quietly mention to my groups about fairly common practice of tipping mates on Dive Charter Boats if they feel their services were beneficial and/or appreciated. Some of them also work very hard to make sure their diver clients enjoy themselves on a charter trip!

I feel that providing these bits of diver etiquette are very appropriate Open Water Diver topics that are just not specified in classroom materials.