Thinking about PADI "Wreck Diving" Cert

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Pseudocyber

Contributor
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Location
Charlotte, North Carolina, United States
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50 - 99
I've got AOW, Nitrox, Rescue. Going to Caymans on Aggressor in August - and it looks like there's some cool wrecks we'll be diving on - the Kittiwake and a Russian ship.

So, I'm kind of a "by the book" guy :dork2: - and would stay out of wrecks unless a DM said, "swim through, from here to there" like I did once on one of my AOW dives. But I'd like to go in the wrecks - so is the Wreck cert worth it? Some friends (with way more experience) were like, aw, you don't need that. But I've read a few books about accidents and posts - I'd rather have some basic training at least.

Thoughts?

Thanks,

PC
 
I think the vast majority of wrecks reward an external survey.

If you have a wreck that you think is stable, and you have a strong desire to do wreck penetration, you really and truly need training. Even more than cave diving, wreck diving can punish the unwary -- the structure may be unstable, the construction of a wreck offers many opportunities to become entangled. Corridors that don't maintain the usual up-down orientation can be incredibly disorienting, and rust and silt can make it extremely easy to destroy the visibility.

Outside of heavily prepared wrecks with large cutouts to allow swim-throughs, I think wreck penetration is best left to the fully trained technical diver. If you really want to go inside, at least get trained on running line and following it. I think it's possible that you may decide, after training, that the rewards don't justify the risk.
 
The quality of a wreck course depends entirely on the instructor concerned. Like many courses, the actual syllabus is quite basic, but it is also written vaguely enough to give a good instructor the flexibility to make the course truly beneficial. This is especially true in terms of penetration skills. Be warned, the course can be run without any actual penetration (penetration dive is optional), so you definitely need to discuss the course content with your potential instructor before you sign-up, to make sure that the training you recieve will be focused on giving you some tangible penetration skills.

Wreck penetration diving is one of the 'real' diving activities with increased hazards. It is an over-head environment, with limited exits and a significant risk of silting (severely reduced visibility). A wreck dive may appear easy, but a silt-out can change the environment from very benign to very dangerous in a few heartbeats.

Without the knowledge and training to function under those circumstances, then any penetration into a shipwreck is really just going to be a 'trust me' dive, where luck is the primary factor guaranteeing your safety. If you get unlucky, then you won't have the capability to guarantee extracting yourself from the situation.

Here is the course dives (with my notes in red):

Wreck Training Dive One

Performance Requirements.
By the end of this dive, the student should be able to:
• Swim on the outside of a wreck, maintaining proper buoyancy control, and identifying and avoiding potential hazards, under the direct supervision of a Teaching Status PADI Instructor.
• Navigate on a wreck so that the ascent point can be located without surfacing, with the assistance of the instructor.
• Maintain neutral buoyancy and body position so that the bottom is avoided.

This is the 'wreck introduction' that many divers will experience on their AOW course as an elective dive. The focus here should be about hazard identification, buoyancy and trim. I use this dive to demonstrate zero viz (not inside a wreck), along with issues such as sharp edges, collapse and hazardous marine life etc. The remainder of the dive is spent as a 'primer'; working on buoyancy and trim, with some tuning of the weighting and distribution to enable a good horizontal position to be achieved, followed by work on horizontal hovers. We also work on non-silting propulsion, including frog kick, modified flutter kick, helicopter turns and back kick.

Wreck Training Dive Two
Performance Requirements.
By the end of this dive, the student should be able to:
• Swim along the outside of a wreck, in a buddy team, identifying and avoiding potential hazards.
• With a buddy, map a wreck (or portion of a wreck), determining approximate size and marking points of interest.
• Survey a wreck for a penetration dive and evaluate possible entrances.
• Navigate on a wreck, returning to the ascent point without surfacing.


During this dive, there is more work to fine-tune buoyancy, trim and fin techniques. The student takes a slate and makes notes/maps the wreck with the goal of planning a penetration on subsequent dives. The notes/map enable post-dive discussion of penetration options, including a critical risk assessment. Depths, times etc are used to forumlate a no-deco dive plan and gas management plan for the penetration. If student doesn't already know their SAC/RMV, then we record it on this dive. I also introduce the concept of team diving, discussing the various team roles and how divers can support eachother to achieve objectives.


Wreck Training Dive Three
Performance Requirements.
By the end of this dive, the student should be able to:
• Demonstrate the deployment and retrieval of a penetration line, for practice, on the outside of a wreck, while working in buddy teams.
• Swim along the deployed penetration line so as to maintain contact with the line without kicking up silt and holding on to a dive light.
• Navigate on a wreck so that the ascent point can be located without surfacing.

This is the line-laying practice dive. At least 1 hour spent deploying and following a guideline. Practice is developed over the session, until the student can follow the guideline blindfolded (zero viz simulation) and can communicate via basic tactile signals. The team have to navigate a guideline that they have laid, 'escaping' from a silted-out wreck scenario whilst maintaining team cohesion. This dive also introduces light signals and places emphasis on team roles. I also like to ensure that students are comfortable applying all their core skills; such as air-sharing, mask clearing, reg retrieval etc, whilst following the line, maintaining neutral buoyancy and team cohesion.

Wreck Training Dive Four A or B
There are two final dives to choose from in this specialty course. Dive Four A outlines an actual penetration dive for training on a wreck that can be safely penetrated. Dive Four B outlines a nonpenetration wreck dive for training on a wreck that cannot be penetrated. Go to section XI, Wreck Training Dive Four B if you will not have students make an actual penetration dive.

Two options for instructors here. Unless the student has a strong preference not to conduct penetration, then Option A should always be taken. If the instructor doesn't have access to a wreck suitable for penetration training, then why are they teaching wreck courses there??

Wreck Training Dive Four A

Performance Requirements.
By the end of this dive, students should be able to:
• Plan and perform an actual wreck penetration under your direct supervision:
• Determining air supply and penetration limits.
• Swimming without causing excessive silt disturbance.
• Maintaining contact with the line.
• Using a dive light while following a penetration line.
• Navigate on a wreck so that the ascent point can be located without surfacing.

This dive is the crux of the course. It allows the instructor to enable a comprehensively planned team dive, with pre-designated goals and objectives. Divers conduct Gas Management planning, to determine turn-points based on the rule of thirds, along with pre-calculation of their air consumption requirements. Previously made maps are used to plan the penetration, bearing in mind calculated turn-points, no-decompression limits and gas contingencies.


Wreck Training Dive Four B
Performance Requirements.
By the end of this dive, the student should be able to:
• Organize and conduct a wreck dive with a buddy, but with only minimal instructor assistance.
• Swim on the outside of a wreck, identifying and avoiding possible hazards.
• Navigate on a wreck so that the ascent point can be located without surfacing.

What can I say... it is a scuba dive around the outside of a wreck...

When I teach Wreck courses, I typically offer extra dives to reinforce the penetration training. I don't think that a single penetration dive on a guideline is sufficient to really enable the student to develop ingrained skills necessary to actually use that guideline in low/zero viz scenarios.

The extra dives consist of more guideline laying, team skills and practice penetrations. Depending on diver skill and the amount of post-course refinement dives available, then the practice can be extended to include certain emergency drills (lost line, lost buddy, line entanglement and broken line).

Here are my notes that I use to supplement the basic wreck manual, which give an idea of the real breadth of skills/knowledge that can be opened up on a good wreck course...

Advanced Wreck Diving - Workshop Notes - Scuba Tech Philippines

The biggest benefit of a well-run wreck course is that it provides you with the knowledge to make your own personal decisions and risk assessments about wreck diving and/or penetration. At the very least, you won't have to rely on a stranger (a 'dive pro' of unknown competence) telling you what is safe for you. It allows you to take increased personal responsibility for your diving safety, improves your core scuba abilities and provides the basic skills to conduct simple penetrations.

If you really get addicted to wreck diving (as many of us do), then further training is needed before you can increase the complexity of the penetrations. PADI have clear limits on wreck penetration, such as no more than 40m horizontal and vertical from the surface, within the 'light zone' and no restrictions (defined as spaces two small for 2 divers to pass side-by-side whilst air-sharing). Going beyond the basic wreck courses means technical diving, with double cylinders and a technical wreck course.
 
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The PADI wreck diving class is not a wreck penetration course. While it is optional to penetrate the wreck during the final dive, it's not mandatory and it's supposed to be a "simple" penetration. If you find a good instructor to teach you wreck diving, the course can make the dives much more enjoyable, but I don't consider it a great course to qualify you to begin doing big penetrations, especially if you're only in a single cylinder recreational rig. Enjoy the outside of the wrecks. There is actually a lot more to see outside the wrecks than inside.
 
I just did my PADI wreck course and it was taught by someone that is a trained in technical wreck diving. With the PADI wreck cert you are trained to run a line from the entry point to return to, further the penetration is limited to 140' total including depth and your entry point must always remain visible. Can't go around corners. The two wrecks you mention were intentionally sunk and are intended for diving so should have cut outs and cleared interiors. They both are upright so going into an area should make sense with preconceptions about room layout. Additionally tropical wrecks in the kind of ocean that is Caymans don't get silt as readily over time that wrecks around the nor west pacific do and the Kittiwake is brand new underwater as well. The PADI course is an intro to diving in overhead envirnoments, specifically wrecks. I picked my instructor because she was trained and experienced well beyond what she was going to be teaching me. When doing this training my SAC rate was 50% higher than it is normally due to task loading running lines.

When you got your open water certification you were told to dive within the limits of your experience and training and that was when a solution to any problem always had go to the surface as a choice. Diving in an overhead envirnoment does not have that immediate option to fix things. Plan, prepare and train accordingly.
 
The A or B option in the PADI course is intended to allow the instructor to certify the student with what they are confident to sign off on. If I was teaching this and was asked about the option A or B thing I would say it depends on how I judge your progress at that point.
 
The A or B option in the PADI course is intended to allow the instructor to certify the student with what they are confident to sign off on. If I was teaching this and was asked about the option A or B thing I would say it depends on how I judge your progress at that point.

That is nonsense.

For a start, the instructor should make the dive option clear at the start of the course.

Given that the wreck course is not a 'license' for wreck penetration, then there is no meaning to the idea of 'signing off' the student based on their competency for wreck penetration. That's ludicrous.

The options of Dive Four A or B, stem from providing instructors with the capacity to conduct wreck courses, where they don't actually have a penetrable wreck in their area. Using Option B, you could literally conduct a wreck course on a sunken car, or small wooden canoe. Yes... it is that cynical..
 
DevonDiver - I loved the long write up. I hope you dont mind if I cut and paste it into my description. I also agree with you comment above. Cheers.
 
... or small wooden canoe. Yes... it is that cynical..

LMAO.

Thanks for all the GREAT replies, I really appreciate you "guys" taking the time to reply in such detail.

I think with the risk of wreck penetration, my limited experience, and the "randomness" of just taking whatever instructor happens to be on the boat - I'm going to wait on starting wreck dive training - and just enjoy the warm, clear water, and wrecks - from the outside. Your replies have really helped me.

Thanks again.

Cheers!
 
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