Why do the LDS's take it????

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DavidHickey

Contributor
Messages
196
Reaction score
0
Location
Kingsman, Ohio. Near Wilmington and Waynesville
# of dives
50 - 99
I just read a thread about a bad experience at the local dive shop. I have had similar experiences with my LDS and have been on their bad side and have now gotten on their good side by spending a few grand with them. I have just never in my life seen an industry were they try to make the CUSTOMER feel as if he needs to earn the respect and loyalty of the business. But this thread is not about that. My question to all of the LDS owners who were upset on the last thread, is why do you just sit back instead of doing something about it? My LDS knows I have purchased equipment online and they are not happy about it but since I have also spent thousands with them they tolerate the fact and do treat me with respect. But what I don't understand is when I talk pricing with them they are usually unwilling to budge and tell me that alot of the equipment is price protected by the manufacturer and they cannot lower the price without getting in trouble with the manufacturer which could mean losing the line of equipment. Well HELLO!!!!!! Obviously the manufacturer is currently back dooring them with a huge smile on their face. There are many discount stores and web pages selling this same equipment at half the price. The LDS owner tells me that these online stores and web pages are not authorized to do what they are doing and that the manufacturer does not allow it. Well unless they are deaf dumb and blind they have to know about it, these stores actually publish CATALOGS, have Huge WEBSITES, and advertise every make and model known to man. Do you LDS owners actually think that the manufacturers are not aware of this? And do you actually think that they do not encourage this or profit from these sales? Leisure pro even prints catalogs with prices and mails them to anyone interested and matches any manufacturers warranty. Either my LDS is lying about the pricing restrictions, or in my mind it sounds like the manufacturers are giving you guys a raw deal. How many times have you as a dealer researched these supposively protected prices and called the manufacturer and officially filed a complaint about sellers who are not complying? If Scott from Zeagle is on here, not putting you on the spot, but HOW does leisure pro offer a complete line of Zeagle equipment without Zeagles authorization or knowledge and below everyone elses rate? I would have to guess that the volume of sales from Leisure pro has to make them at least one of your top 10 distributers. There has to be a way manufacturers could track this equipment to see where its actually going and find who is abusing the system. If not they could implement a system. But my guess is they don't mind the extra profit they are making and would rather look away. Anyhow I could be way off base here due to bad info from my LDS but it seems to me that instead of taking your frustration out on your customers you guys should ban together and put some pressure on the Manufacturers who are suppose to be protecting your rights as dealers.
Oh and just something on trying equipment out in the pool at the LDS which was part of the topic on the sour deal thread. My LDS will let you try anything out in the pool. BUT there policy is they charge you for the item upfront, and if it does not fit or you do not like it you get a store credit in the full amount. So you can pick out another item or something that fits better. Kinda weeds out the people who are out to waste their time or just want a fitting to buy on-line. Might be a thought for you guys who are having problems.
 
I've been reading quite a few of these posts lately, both in Scuba boards as well as computer forums. I myself am a computer retailer, selling both computer parts as well as systems. When I have customers come in here to "price shop" me, I try to keep a positive attitude when I hear "I can get that at Newegg for cheaper". But in reality, Newegg even says "shop your local stores and then buy from us!" That's great, but just wait until your town loses their scuba shop like mine has. Now I get to drive 45 minutes for fills, equipment, and advice. I'm sure a lot of that has to do with online retailers, who can't give you the face-to-face help, can't have you try on a product before you buy it, and sometimes will not even take returns after 30 days.

If you know exactly what you're looking for, or want to call the e-tailer you are buying from, then go ahead and use the Internet. I myself like to know that I have a local shop that is able to recognize me (not by an ID number in their database) know how I dive, what I dive and what I like. True, their prices are normally higher than the 'net, but the value of being able to talk to someone about a couple thousand dollar purchase and know that they will be there to back it up is worth it for me (and my customers.)

Just think where the Internet stores would be without the brick-and-mortar local shops... How many drysuits would they send you before you get the fit you want?

SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL LDS :wink: - If you want to waste their time and not buy from them, just remember how they pay for their building, knowledge and support that they freely give their customers. Where is your Internet site when you need some advice??? :06: Or local dive site info???
 
Allanon:
That's great, but just wait until your town loses their scuba shop like mine has. Now I get to drive 45 minutes for fills, equipment, and advice. I'm sure a lot of that has to do with online retailers, who can't give you the face-to-face help, can't have you try on a product before you buy it, and sometimes will not even take returns after 30 days.

SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL LDS :wink:

BINGO....

You don't know what you got till its gone.
 
Well my question really was not about supporting the LDS I have supported mine and bought other equipment online and feel good about all of my purchases. My question is why do the LDS's allow the Manufacturer to have double standards and punish them if they sell below a preset price, yet they let the online stores run rampant selling at what ever price they choose. I would think the LDS owners would band together and fight the manufacturers and try to make them more liable for tracking down and stopping sales to these unauthorized dealers. I just think the manufacturers have no incentive to stop, if its sold thru an unauthorized dealer, they number one still make a sale and profit, number 2 they do not have to honor their warranty which saves money. Just seems like a win win for the Manufacturer.
 
Allanon:
SUPPORT YOUR LOCAL LDS :wink:

sure. the day they match internet prices, i will support them

heck, if they even came close i would support them

that said, there is one local dive shop i like a lot. i have spent a lot of money
there, even though they are more expensive than the internet, because
i felt i was getting value for my money (know-how, expertise). up to
a point. some stuff just doesn't make sense to pay that much for locally
when you can get it so cheap on line.

as for advice and local dive knowledge, NOTHING matches ScubaBoard
in my experience, which is why i loved this site from the moment i discovered it.
 
welcome to capitalism. someone will figure out how to increase volume and decrease margins and run you out of business every time. people always whine about it, but that doesn't stop wal-mart, starbucks, barnes and noble, etc. its like getting mad at the tide for coming in and ruining your sand castle.

if you want to make a buck, sell high price, high margin, low volume -- or compete with leisurepro on the internet at their own game. don't complain because your business model needs to change due to competition. nobody guaranteed you that the scuba shop business would be easy, and it isn't your customer's fault, its your own.
 
"... but HOW does leisure pro offer a complete line of Zeagle equipment without Zeagles authorization or knowledge and below everyone elses rate? "


Do a search on Grey Market. That's how a lot (not all) online retailers can do it.

Leisure Pro is probably the most famous grey market retailers.
 
I work with a boat and shop. The only work I do in the shop is done with the assistance of a compressor. I don't sell gear for profit or own a dive shop. That being said, here's my opinion:

A local dive shop has more in common with a family restaurant than a 7/11. Regulars come in, their tanks are filled with their "preferred" mix, maybe even set at their preferred spot on the boat. They are greeted by name and exchange pleasantries (plus the other info; who's sick, how the pictures turned out, what the weather is doing, etc...). If they need gear, they say, "Hey, I need a new mask. When can it be here?" "Next week," may be the reply, followed by an "Excellent, should I pay for it now or then?"

Now, someone walks in. They are treated fairly and respectfully. The staff does their best to answer questions. The topic of internet purchasing may come up. Sorry, Scubapro does not allow that deal to meet that price. The BEST we can do to earn your business is provide 'x' training for the cost of books. We are sorry that we can't meet the Leisurepro price, but we run a fair and honest business where we play by our boss' rules.

Either they like it or they don't. Yelling at a customer is not a way to keep business.

I purchased a lot of stuff off the internet. I saved $50, $20, $150, whatever... Nobody ever shook my hand and said, "Let's go diving so you can try it out. There is a nice Loggerhead out at Black Condos that would enjoy seeing us today:wink:."

Some people would rather have $50 and get typing practive than a friendly, knowledgeable dive buddy (who knows the area and the gear) to dive with.


My advice is simple: Enjoy your dive with Ben Franklin! I'd rather be diving with friends at (***insert local dive site here***).

Cheers,
Jamie

P.S. The two hours of diving today saw friends, turtles, eels, Bluespotted Cornetfish, and so much other great stuff. Leisurepro saw smog and a keyboard:wink: Wonder what that does for the "bottom" line?
 
Allanon:
Where is your Internet site when you need some advice??? :06: Or local dive site info???
Scubaboard, TheDecoStop, etc.

What kind of idiot takes the advice of someone trying to sell them something??
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/peregrine/

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