Solo Diving, How about WHY we should not instead of just NO you should not.

[DavidHickey]

I probably should have kept this on the post below, but I'm just curious guys I'm really new to diving, and I've read alot on the horrors of solo diving here on the board. I've read how dangerous it is and how you should have 1000's of dives before ever attempting it and should by NO means EVER consider it unless you can snatch the pebble out of the masters hand. BUT I have never read any reasons why people are so strongly against it. For instance my dives to date have been in shallow gravel pits 30' or so and in shallow tropical areas about the same depth. From these depths in good dive conditions can you explain the dangers you may face that would make this any more dangerous than snorkeling solo in the same waters? I am by NO means trying to say there are not dangers but being new and naive, I think to myself that in a worse case scenario you simply do a CESA inflate your BCD and swim to shore. Once again I'm not advocating solo diving, just wondering what hidden dangers await that basic scuba skills we are all taught could not remedy at these shallower depths. Most the answers I've read are to the extent of "If you have to ask your not ready" well thats not a real informative answer.

[jonnythan]

Because if ANYTHING happens underwater that would require a buddy's help, you're dead.

Hit your head on a rock, get knocked out by a jetski when trying to surface, get badly stung by some sea creature, get tangled up in some fishing line or net, have a runaway ascent that leaves you unsconscious on the surface, get bent on the surface and find yourself unable to swim back, whatever.

[cornfed]

Hit your head on a rock,Dive Rite makes nice helmets...

[Rick Murchison]

Three years ago I lost a friend to drowning in less than six feet of water. We don't know why, because no one was with him to pull him out until after he was dead.
Certainly there are things you can do to improve your chances while diving solo. Redundancy, training, experience, good health.. But the bottom line remains that debilitating events can and do happen. If you have one under water and there's no one there to pull you out, you're dead.
Rick

[DA Aquamaster]

Because if ANYTHING happens underwater that would require a buddy's help, you're dead.

Hit your head on a rock, get knocked out by a jetski when trying to surface, get badly stung by some sea creature, get tangled up in some fishing line or net, have a runaway ascent that leaves you unsconscious on the surface, get bent on the surface and find yourself unable to swim back, whatever.Hitting your head on a rock is preventable as is getting hit by a jet ski (you can hear them in the area and you should be looking for boat traffic when you surface anyway), gettin stung by sea creatures, getting badly bent etc. If you are having runaway ascents, you should not be diving, let alone solo diving, and diving long and deep enough to get an immediate incapacitating hit from the bends upon surfacing is beyond the scope of anything anyone should be doing in a basic scuba discussion.

Getting tanlged is generally avoidable and when it occurs, the inital reaction of the diver is what prevents them from getting "badly tangled".

So in short there are two ways to look at it. Some divers choose to believe that having a buddy provides additioanl resources to get you out of a mess once you get into it. Other divers tend to be more self reliant and focus on avoiding problems in the first place and increasing their self help skills to resove them individually.

The second catagory of divers tend to be those who solo dive. Even when diving with a buddy, those divers are in a better position to avoid or get out of trouble in the event of a buddy separation. And, you with solo diving you donlt tent o have the muliple fatalities that occur whennthe buddy systme goes south and the panicked budy ensares or other wise does something stupid that results in the death of the buddy trying to assist.

Solo divign is not with out risk. In some instances that risk will be elevated compared to buddy diving and in some instnaces the trisk will be reduced. The ability to assess the conditions and conservativly remain within mangeable limits is a critical solo diving skill, and the one that most peopel will say requries experience.

I'd argue a more middle of road approach and say that properly equipped, many divers of average experience and training could solo dive in excellent conditons (shallow water, no surf or surge, good visibility, no overheads, no entanglement hazards etc) and do it safely. Expanding thise limits is where more experience is required.

[m3830431]

I don't see any reason why you can not dive solo if you don't go anywhere close to you limit.

I probably wouldn't go more than what you are doing (30 ft.) let people know where your going and maybe have someone at the surface

[Rick Murchison]

Lost another friend - a youngster; only 38 - in a swimming pool about two years ago. In this case we do know what happened. He was practicing his breath-holding without a safety man, passed out on the bottom and drowned.
The general rule to "never swim alone" is a good one.
If you want to solo dive, great. Just don't try to rationalize away the increased risk of not having anyone around should your ability to get out of the water be compromised.
Rick

[ScubaSixString]

Because if ANYTHING happens underwater that would require a buddy's help, you're dead.

Hit your head on a rock, get knocked out by a jetski when trying to surface, get badly stung by some sea creature, get tangled up in some fishing line or net, have a runaway ascent that leaves you unsconscious on the surface, get bent on the surface and find yourself unable to swim back, whatever.


First off, theres a section on solo diving on the board, probably the best place for this discussion. That being said, you run these same risks in diving on a boat with a buddy you don't know, diving low viz, or diving in any situation where it is possible to lose sight of a buddy.

If you are a newbie, it really makes sense to dive with someone else THAT YOU TRUST. Read a few of the accidents/incidents in that section and count how many times a dive master or equivilant has nearly killed someone and ask yourself if those folks might not have been better off on their own (equipped properly). For what its worth, i'd much rather dive by myself than with someone i don't know/know is an accident waiting to happen. Please consider:

1>Smack your head on a rock (resulting in unconciousness). Learn buoyancy/stay out of overhead environments until you are trained for them. You get knocked out with a diver you don't know and he may decide to help you by inflating your bc fully and watching you shoot to the surface......

2>get knocked out by a jetski. Dive with a dive flag and surface near it. You get hit by a jetski and there might be little a dive buddy can do. If you're surfacing near each other the odds are he'll be hit too.

3>badly stung by some sea creature. Leave them alone. Barring that, a buddy might be helpful here. Assuming they know whats happened to you.

4>get tangled up in some fishing line or net. This one actually does help to have a buddy. They can see behind you and help you cut yourself free. Slashing a sharp object around behind your head near reg, spg, and inflator hoses probably isnt the smartest of ideas.

5>get bent on the surface and find yourself unable to swim back. In the unlikely event that you get severely bent on the surface and your buddy doesnt, then its probably best to have a buddy that can tow you back and get help.

An OOA situation was not mentioned here. Thats because the risk of one can be mitigated to an acceptable level by carrying a completely redundant air source. All of the risks above can be mitagated. But only if you know what you are doing, plan your dives better than most do, and dive that plan.

Thats one of the reasons they say not to solo before you've been diving for awhile. But I stand by my original point. Diving with a buddy you don't know is just as risky/riskier than soloing. Should we stay away from dive charters until we have 1000s of dives?

Just my 2 cents :)

[ScubaSixString]

I don't see any reason why you can not dive solo if you don't go anywhere close to you limit.

I probably wouldn't go more than what you are doing (30 ft.) let people know where your going and maybe have someone at the surface

Depth is a factor. But people have drowned in bathtubs. One's capacity to deal with underwater emergencies is the biggest factor in a solo determination, followed by the individual's willingness to figure out the risks and accept the ones they can't mitigate

[Rick Murchison]

Getting tanlged is generally avoidable and when it occurs, the inital reaction of the diver is what prevents them from getting "badly tangled".
About four years ago we lost a (very experienced) spearfisherman off Gulf shores. His buddies had had equipment problems and he'd decided to head on down solo. Suddenly the guys on the boat saw a huge boil of bubbles, followed a minute or so later by the body of the now dead spearfisherman.
He probably speared a big Amberjack who probably wrapped him up and knocked the regulator out of his mouth while at the same time preventing his ability to reach his octopus before he'd drowned. He apparently was able to reach his power inflator to put some air in his BC but not bring it to his mouth.
We'll never know for sure because by the time he hit the surface the fish and the spear and most of the line were gone.
While spearfishing is usually pretty much an "every man for himself" endeavor, having a buddy in the vicinity ain't a bad idea.
Rick

[Rick Murchison]

First off, theres a section on solo diving on the board, probably the best place for this discussion.No, the solo diving forum is to discuss solo diving techniques, not its efficacy. This is the right place :)

That being said, you run these same risks in diving on a boat with a buddy you don't know, diving low viz, or diving in any situation where it is possible to lose sight of a buddy.
Not really. The risks in those situations are different - not necessarily less, just different. Just being in the water, whether swimming, snorkeling or diving all by yourself carries a unique set of risks that can't be removed by anything other than another person. That doesn't mean you can't manage to make having another person around "more dangerous" - you can... but you can't reduce the risk of solo diving by changing the subject to bad buddies or lousy conditions. That risk is just a part of solo diving, and if you choose to solo dive then you're choosing to take it.
I'm not about to tell you "don't solo dive."
I'm just telling you that you need to keep your eyes open about it - if you have a debilitating event under water, whatever it is, and you don't have someone there to haul your hide out, you die. That's the risk. The choice to take it or not is all part of the dive/don't dive decision.
Rick

[Boogie711]

I think you all make valid points - many of the accidents in Scuba are at least partially preventable. (But for the record, anyone who claims you can hear a JetSki before it's virtually on top of you has never dove cold water with Jetski's in the area.)

But there's an even stronger point that needs to be made here. It's mentioned but I think it tends to get sluffed off and thrown onto a pile of stuff to be justified later...

If you dive carefully, and avoid all opportunity for accidents, stuff can still happen to you. I think everyone agrees on that.

When that 'stuff' happens, if you are diving solo... you DIE. Dead. Funeral time. Grieving widow, life insurance claims, shopping for caskets, writeups in the newspaper, children who never knew their father, dead.

Not hurt, not "wow, that was close..." Dead. Final. Kaput. Friends dropping by the house to claim gear, a loved one sending out an email to everyone in the address book because she doesn't know who all your friends are... deceased dead.

Whereas if you're with a buddy, you are alive.

To me, there's nothing out there that won't wait another day until my buddy's schedule free's up to go do that dive.

[MikeFerrara]

First off, theres a section on solo diving on the board, probably the best place for this discussion. That being said, you run these same risks in diving on a boat with a buddy you don't know, diving low viz, or diving in any situation where it is possible to lose sight of a buddy.

Dives with an unknown buddy should be easy dives for the purpose of getting to know them. Doing otherwise is asking for trouble.


If you are a newbie, it really makes sense to dive with someone else THAT YOU TRUST. Read a few of the accidents/incidents in that section and count how many times a dive master or equivilant has nearly killed someone and ask yourself if those folks might not have been better off on their own (equipped properly). For what its worth, i'd much rather dive by myself than with someone i don't know/know is an accident waiting to happen. Please consider:

Having an agency certification as a DM or instructor does NOT insure that the person is a good buddy or even a good diver.


1>Smack your head on a rock (resulting in unconciousness). Learn buoyancy/stay out of overhead environments until you are trained for them. You get knocked out with a diver you don't know and he may decide to help you by inflating your bc fully and watching you shoot to the surface......

2>get knocked out by a jetski. Dive with a dive flag and surface near it. You get hit by a jetski and there might be little a dive buddy can do. If you're surfacing near each other the odds are he'll be hit too.

If jet ski riders know what a dive flag is, they must aim for them on purpose. In one lake I dive they have one or two deths like this every year but I've never heard of both divers being hit at the same time by the same jet ski.


3>badly stung by some sea creature. Leave them alone. Barring that, a buddy might be helpful here. Assuming they know whats happened to you.

4>get tangled up in some fishing line or net. This one actually does help to have a buddy. They can see behind you and help you cut yourself free. Slashing a sharp object around behind your head near reg, spg, and inflator hoses probably isnt the smartest of ideas.

5>get bent on the surface and find yourself unable to swim back. In the unlikely event that you get severely bent on the surface and your buddy doesnt, then its probably best to have a buddy that can tow you back and get help.

Not that unlikely. Every person I know who has been bent was the only person in the team to get bent. They were all able to get themselves out of the water though.


An OOA situation was not mentioned here. Thats because the risk of one can be mitigated to an acceptable level by carrying a completely redundant air source. All of the risks above can be mitagated. But only if you know what you are doing, plan your dives better than most do, and dive that plan.

Thats one of the reasons they say not to solo before you've been diving for awhile. But I stand by my original point. Diving with a buddy you don't know is just as risky/riskier than soloing. Should we stay away from dive charters until we have 1000s of dives?

Just my 2 cents :)


I'm with Rick on this one. Dive solo if you want but rationalizing it is a wast of time...especially by comparing it to diving with a bad buddy. Don't ever dive with a bad buddy. BTW, I think following along on charters is a great way to get in trouble if you let others plan your dives and pick your buddies. I wouldn't say we should stay away from tha until we have thousands of dives. I'd say we should stay away from that for our entire diving career!

[cnctina]

If you are diving with a buddy and have a minor problem that you fix yourself, does this mean you are diving solo?

[Rick Murchison]

If you are diving with a buddy and have a minor problem that you fix yourself, does this mean you are diving solo?
uh, no....
Rick

[MikeFerrara]

Another thing I would note here is that some of our local quarries have some of the highest accident rates. A few are regular slaughter houses some years. Even though they lack things like tides, currents and rough seas, some are deep, cold and amoung the few places that average divers actually dive without some level of supervision.

We are training an entire race of resort divers many of which don't do well at all on their own. They need some one else to pick the sight, plan the dive and set limits for them or they get into trouble.

[ScubaSixString]

Dive solo if you want but rationalizing it is a wast of time...especially by comparing it to diving with a bad buddy. Don't ever dive with a bad buddy. BTW, I think following along on charters is a great way to get in trouble if you let others plan your dives and pick your buddies.


And unfortunantly thats what happens. I'm not trying to rationalize soloing. Just trying to point out that people who would turn pale at the thought of *BUM BUM BUUUUUUMMMMMMM* solo diving... are completly fine with hopping in the water with someone they met 10 minutes ago on their one dive of the year.

BTW, i meant to add earlier, If you solo dive, let someone know where you are, when you're coming back, planned depth, etc. It won't save you if something goes wrong, but at least they'll know where to begin the search.

[wedivebc]

I think you all make valid points - many of the accidents in Scuba are at least partially preventable. (But for the record, anyone who claims you can hear a JetSki before it's virtually on top of you has never dove cold water with Jetski's in the area.)

But there's an even stronger point that needs to be made here. It's mentioned but I think it tends to get sluffed off and thrown onto a pile of stuff to be justified later...

If you dive carefully, and avoid all opportunity for accidents, stuff can still happen to you. I think everyone agrees on that.

When that 'stuff' happens, if you are diving solo... you DIE. Dead. Funeral time. Grieving widow, life insurance claims, shopping for caskets, writeups in the newspaper, children who never knew their father, dead.

Not hurt, not "wow, that was close..." Dead. Final. Kaput. Friends dropping by the house to claim gear, a loved one sending out an email to everyone in the address book because she doesn't know who all your friends are... deceased dead.

Whereas if you're with a buddy, you are alive.

To me, there's nothing out there that won't wait another day until my buddy's schedule free's up to go do that dive.

Can you be more specific as to the definition of stuff. I think the original poster wants to know what stuff can happen that a buddy is essential for survival. (me too)

[Rick Murchison]

Can you be more specific as to the definition of stuff. I think the original poster wants to know what stuff can happen that a buddy is essential for survival. (me too)
"Stuff" is any debilitating event.
Heart attack.
Stroke.
Embolism.
Seizure.
Severe Injury.
Entanglement.
Entrapment.
Severe Hypothermia.
Box-jelly sting.
Shark bite.
'Cuda bite.
"Stuff" happens. We bury one with far too much regularity.
Rick

[ScubaSixString]

No, the solo diving forum is to discuss solo diving techniques, not its efficacy. This is the right place :)

Yeah...now that i think of it, i haven't seen too many...."Hey guys ...should i do this" in there :)


Not really. The risks in those situations are different - not necessarily less, just different. Just being in the water, whether swimming, snorkeling or diving all by yourself carries a unique set of risks that can't be removed by anything other than another person. That doesn't mean you can't manage to make having another person around "more dangerous" - you can... but you can't reduce the risk of solo diving by changing the subject to bad buddies or lousy conditions. That risk is just a part of solo diving, and if you choose to solo dive then you're choosing to take it.
I'm not about to tell you "don't solo dive."
I'm just telling you that you need to keep your eyes open about it - if you have a debilitating event under water, whatever it is, and you don't have someone there to haul your hide out, you die. That's the risk. The choice to take it or not is all part of the dive/don't dive decision.
Rick


For the most part, i'd agree. As i said, its a choice. And its one you should make with a full knowledge of the risks.

[gratefuldiver2]

I don't think solo diving is for everybody, or diving at all for that matter. I also don't think I'm being unsafe by diving a redundant gear set up by myself. By redundant I mean a set of doubles w/isolation manifold, back plate with dual wings, two computers, watch, tables in pocket, backup mask. Not to mention any stage bottles that might be required. I don't want anyone to put themselves in a bad place to help me. I would rather not be tied to a buddy. I don't think I would have considered diving solo until well after 1000 dives. I would always dive with a buddy when diving someplace new or doing something new. I also would never tell my students that solo diving is a good practice for them.

[mjh]

Many have covered the pros and cons of Solo diving. Even with redundancy if you have a problem death is a possibility. This applies to Skydiving, Mountain Climbing, Back Country Skiing and a myriad of other potentially high-risk sports. Either you accept the risks or you don’t do it.

I have been Solo diving for the last +20yrs. I enjoy diving with buddies, my wife but I prefer the peace and freedom of diving on my own. I do not recommend it for anyone with less than 200 dives and have buddy dove in many situations, current, low viz, etc. Of course redundancy in your equipment is mandatory, at least a pony and extra computer. If you need to ask if it is OK to Solo dive you are probably not ready to do it. Most Solo divers I know it is something that was just a natural progression as they gained more experience over yrs of diving.

[NWGratefulDiver]

I won't tell anyone they should not solo dive ... but I will say that I think you shouldn't do it without knowing all the risks, and preparing for them through skills, training, and preparation. Otherwise, you're just gambling that nothing will go wrong.

Basic skills would include a basic level of comfort in the water, the ability to remove and replace your gear underwater, the ability to remove and replace a mask while hovering, the ability to make a free-water ascent and hold a safety-stop without assistance, and some basic knowledge about how to manage your air supply.

As to basic comfort, that's the main reason SDI requires a minimum of 50 dives before letting you take the solo diver class ... for most folks, 50 dives is about sufficient to start giving them the idea that there's an awful lot to this activity that they haven't had time to learn yet. They're starting to relax in the water and get comfortable with basic skills, but they've also gotten over the notion that everything they needed to know about diving was contained in their OW and AOW class. In other words, caution starts to set in.

Being able to hold a stop while replacing your mask is a pretty essential skill. Like it or not, if you dive often enough sooner or later somehow your mask WILL become dislodged ... perhaps even come off ... and you'll have to put it back on and clear it. Doing this essentially blind while holding your depth is not an option, if you start to ascend while putting your mask back on you run the risk of an uncontrolled ascent ... at some point the gas in your BCD will expand faster than your ability to release it, and then you ARE going to the surface.

Removing and replacing your BCD ... well, a likely place for an entanglement is around your tank valve/first stage, and without a dive buddy you'll need to untangle yourself. In this case, your only option will be removing and replacing your BCD underwater. Now, of course, most of us practiced this in OW ... but have you done it since? At depth? Without supervision? I'd recommend practicing it several times in the presence of a safety diver before betting your life on the fact that you could do it if you needed to.

Free-water ascent ... you'll need to manage your buoyancy not just on the way to the surface, but also during your safety stop. Can you do it? Have your practiced it? What about deploying a surface marker buoy? If you're diving in areas where there's boat traffic, that's something you'll want to learn as part of your basic ascent skills.

Air management is a requirement. Guess what ... if you suddenly find yourself low on air, your only choice is going to be an emergency ascent. So the obvious solution is going to be not allowing yourself to get in that situation. Developing good gas management habits is important for any diver ... the solo diver even more so.

Redundant air is pretty much essential, but make sure your gear-up routine includes checking initial pressure, leak testing, and a practice deployment before starting your dive. We had a death in our area not too long ago from someone (fairly experienced) who actually planned to use his pony for ascent, but neglected to make sure it could be deployed. It couldn't, and before he could manage the problem he drowned. Don't just assume that because you've got a pony bottle on your back you are "safe" ... there's a lot more to solo diving safely than just packing a redundant air source.

Just some things to consider ... if you think solo diving is for you, then go for it. Just don't take shortcuts. Take time to get some practice on your basic skills, assess your ability to deal with problems calmly (and be honest with yourself, your life depends on it), get some training, learn how to plan your dives properly ... and then assess your readiness ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[matt_unique]

....
So in short there are two ways to look at it. Some divers choose to believe that having a buddy provides additioanl resources to get you out of a mess once you get into it. Other divers tend to be more self reliant and focus on avoiding problems in the first place and increasing their self help skills to resove them individually.

The second catagory of divers tend to be those who solo dive. Even when diving with a buddy, those divers are in a better position to avoid or get out of trouble in the event of a buddy separation.....

Solo divign is not with out risk. In some instances that risk will be elevated compared to buddy diving and in some instnaces the trisk will be reduced. The ability to assess the conditions and conservativly remain within mangeable limits is a critical solo diving skill, and the one that most peopel will say requries experience.
....

I agree with DA.

I prefer a good buddy over solo diving, I prefer solo diving over a bad buddy. I think the best buddy team would be two solo divers bar none. It is one thing to have a similarly equipped self sufficient buddy available for help in the most remote circumstances. It is an entirely different game altogether to have to "rely" on a buddy for air, gear, or problem resolution. I think that concept is crazy and more dangerous than properly equiiped solo diving.

--Matt

[pants!]

I prefer a good buddy over solo diving, I prefer solo diving over a bad buddy. I think the best buddy team would be two solo divers bar none. It is one thing to have a similarly equipped self sufficient buddy available for help in the most remote circumstances. It is an entirely different game altogether to have to "rely" on a buddy for air, gear, or problem resolution. I think that concept is crazy and more dangerous than properly equiiped solo diving.

--Matt
And people blast DIR divers for not wanting to buddy up with unknown or obviously marginal buddies.

You are very correct in your statements, Matt.

[ranger979]

What I find interesting is why the diving industry makes it such a taboo while other equally or more dangerous activities don't seem to make a big deal of it, climbing, flying, backcountry hiking, etc.

I think this is why most new divers will ask why solo diving is so risky. The original poster mentioned a specific set of very conservitive dive paramaters and compared it to the risks of snorkling solo. Most of the same risks mentioned for scuba would also apply to snorkling, yet no one mentioned, although Rick alluded to it, that you shouldn't be solo snorkling either.

The buddy system is generally a great system and could eliminate a lot of unnecessary death if used throughout your life. Let's face it, heart attack, stroke, hitting your head on a rock could happen as you walk to the bathroom, well maybe not the rock thing, having a buddy could potentially save your life. If someone did a detailed study they would probably find the woman have fewer bathroom related death because they are more likely to go as a group. The point is, you need to look at the risks and decide what risks you are willing to take. Some of these risks you are going to think to minor to worry about and take.

[Louie]

There isn't one undisputable reason. As previous responders had said, diving the buddy system increases the likelihood of having assistance (success not guaranteed) if problems occur.

This is true for any outdoor/sporting activity - or any life activity for that matter. At the end of the day, the choice is yours. You balance the pros and cons (is that mountain hike risky enough for me to put up with an irritating companion or can I manage on my own and enjoy the solitude).

So, in diving, you have to consider various things.

Level and experience of the diver - you would never advise a newly qualified Open Water diver to jump in solo

The dive - a nice dive off the beach in calm waters is not in the same league as a wreck dive at 50m in current

The confidence and knowledge of the diver to deal with problems should they occur.

[pants!]

What I find interesting is why the diving industry makes it such a taboo while other equally or more dangerous activities don't seem to make a big deal of it, climbing, flying, backcountry hiking, etc.
You're obviously not a climber or backcountry hiker.

Doing these things solo is widely accepted as being more dangerous, particularly climbing. Hiking is not as big a deal as long as you let someone know when to expect you back and where to find you if you don't come back. Underwater, you die much faster than while on a trail.

Remember that guy who cut his arm off with a swiss army knife because he got trapped by a boulder? He wouldn't have had to do that if he either went with someone or simply let someone know where he was going and when he was going to be back. Despite media worship, he was widely criticized for being a dolt.

[lamont]

i've done two solo dives just to see what was up with the taboo.

lessons learned:

- you must have your **** together on entry and exit. this is probably one of the most dangerous points of the dive for the solo diver.

- nobody is there to give you a bubble check, you have to be good at planning and monitoring your gas supply. if you can't look at your SPG 20 mins into the dive and determine that you don't have any leaks, imo, you don't have any place solo diving.

- if you run out of gas you will not be able to inflate your BC.

- even on a super weenie solo dive with good gas management you could still have IP creep in your first stage cause catastrophic gas loss. recovery from this is not elegant if you are solo with only a single air source.

- the first time i went down the fish looked a whole lot bigger and more dangerous without having human backup around, that was actually kinda cool, but it wears off.

- downsides in addition to it being more risky, you don't have an extra set of eyes spotting cool stuff for you, and you don't have opportunity for feedback ("was i head down? did i have any air in my wing on that stop?", etc)

so, i think that got the solo diving out of my system, it just doesn't hold any attraction for me and i've got enough people around that'll dive with me that i don't need to.

honestly it did help to do a couple solo dives just to prove that i could do it. it immediately made me stop worrying about buddy separation. there were actual benefits in confidence which translated to buddy diving so that when i look around and don't see my buddy i don't think "oh no, i'm alone!" but just "where the f did my buddy swim off to?".

and i do think that there's a little bit of FUD about solo diving with some misplaced risk assessment. if you pick your dive site and dive conservatively with no penetration and with good viz you should be able to minimize your risk of entaglement and those issues. the bigger issues that are more likely to kill you are probably related to air and buoyancy. its going to be an uncontrolled free flow, or a valve rolled off, or a regulator that you can't get at, or a BC/wing dump that is stuck open. your pre-dive checks need to be flawless and your gas management needs to be excellent. in retrospect i've got considerably less confidence in my skills to solo dive now than i did when i did those two dives.

[Snowbear]

Just some things to consider ...
Don't forget this one (http://www.scubaboard.com/showpost.php?p=715092&postcount=11) ...

[MikeFerrara]

What I find interesting is why the diving industry makes it such a taboo while other equally or more dangerous activities don't seem to make a big deal of it, climbing, flying, backcountry hiking, etc.

The dive industry does lots of strange things.


I think this is why most new divers will ask why solo diving is so risky. The original poster mentioned a specific set of very conservitive dive paramaters and compared it to the risks of snorkling solo. Most of the same risks mentioned for scuba would also apply to snorkling, yet no one mentioned, although Rick alluded to it, that you shouldn't be solo snorkling either.

I don't know about any one else but I didn't mention snorkeling because it wasn't the topic of conversation. When I taught free diving though I taught it using the buddy system.


The buddy system is generally a great system and could eliminate a lot of unnecessary death if used throughout your life. Let's face it, heart attack, stroke, hitting your head on a rock could happen as you walk to the bathroom, well maybe not the rock thing, having a buddy could potentially save your life. If someone did a detailed study they would probably find the woman have fewer bathroom related death because they are more likely to go as a group. The point is, you need to look at the risks and decide what risks you are willing to take. Some of these risks you are going to think to minor to worry about and take.

The big difference between a bathroom accident when your alone and an accident under water is that you can breath in the bathroom without needing to be consiouse to keep a reg in your mouth and needing breathing gas in a tank. There is inherantly more time pressure associated with underwater problems.

Other than that your right. We have young barely broke horses and I rpefer that my wife doesn't get to ambitiouse with them when she's home alone. You could lay out behind the barn for a long time before some one found you.

[matt_unique]

And people blast DIR divers for not wanting to buddy up with unknown or obviously marginal buddies.

You are very correct in your statements, Matt.

Of course DIR is totally against the concept and gear required for solo diving as I understand it.

--Matt

[Kestrell]

Here it is, short and sweet.

I personally don't recommend it and I won't do it since I am no where skilled enought to even think about it.

Would I look down on someone doing it? No.

There are plenty of people who are diving solo who have never had a problem. In fact they might be safer than diving with a reckless buddy who will get them in trouble.

Just undestand the risk and be prepared.

Also, make sure you let someone know where and when you are diving so if you are missing, they know where to start looking.

[Dutchman]

I guess I look at solo diving as being another alternative to not diving at all. I like the buddy system but I am not going to miss an opportunity to dive. I practice self reliance. I adjust my dive plan accordingly. I know the risk. I make an educated decision. If I go to a scuba park and there are 40-60 people diving, I don’t feel I really need a buddy. Everyone there is my buddy. I have been diving and snorkeling since 1964. Two years before PADI began certification. More dives by myself than with a buddy. I had some issues but remain calm, cool and collected. I think that comes with experience. You develop a comfort factor. Most new divers have very little swimming and ocean time. I think this is one reason the certificating agencies push buddy diving so much. They realize there are a lot of inexperience individuals out there. Lower your risk, dive with a buddy.

One more thing, I just got my certification card after years of refusing to join the club. I did learn some things, nothing about equipment or technique. More by the way of terminology.

[jhelmuth]

I see people diving solo every week... they just don't know it. MOST of the people diving today are just a group of mostly solo divers in the same body of water. Put to the test (a real test), I have serious doubts about todays "resort" diver being a real buddy. I'm an advocate of buddy diving WITH buddies who can be self-sufficent and understand why that is an advantage. Attitude is everything. Most rec dives going on today are "trust me" dives as that is the expectation. God forbid anything serious happens (and thank God that the percentages keep it to the level it's at today - it could be much worse).

[drbill]

I dive solo 80% of the time, and began doing so in the early 1970's.

Just as I will not tell anyone else they should dive solo, I will not tell anyone else they shouldn't. There are risk elements in solo diving AND risk elements in buddy diving. They differ. I only suggest one think long and hard about whether solo diving is appropriate for you. If you feel it is, a solo diving certification is a good idea as is reading a few books on the subject. And REDUNDANCY, redundancy, redundancy (oops, am I being too redundant?).

[MASS-Diver]

Although I think that in general it's safer to dive with a skilled buddy team, I don't think it is correct to characterize any solo dive done by anyone as reckless.

Getting in the water alone and doing an aggressive dive over one's skill level is certainly not a good idea, however simply adding a buddy to the equation will not always make a dive safer, if fact, if the team does not function well, it could actually make the dive more dangerous.

IMO, if you don't practice sharing gas with your buddy on a regular basis - you might as well dive alone. All this stuff about about hitting your head is addressing a risk which is pretty insignificant - the main role of buddy (espically at the rec level) is to give you gas - if they aren't trained to do that, they aren't much good.

[akscubainst]

I dive solo 80% of the time, and began doing so in the early 1970's.

Just as I will not tell anyone else they should dive solo, I will not tell anyone else they shouldn't. There are risk elements in solo diving AND risk elements in buddy diving. They differ. I only suggest one think long and hard about whether solo diving is appropriate for you. If you feel it is, a solo diving certification is a good idea as is reading a few books on the subject. And REDUNDANCY, redundancy, redundancy (oops, am I being too redundant?).


I do as well and I agree with you completly. Diving is like a day in the office for me. I don't think twice about solo diving, I've been doing it for years mostly working dives. There's a level of confidence you need to achieve, it's not over confidence you just have to cross that line. I don't usually sport dive solo but when I'm working at 20' and drop something I have no problem dropping down to 100' to look for it.

The other time I dive solo is when I'm teaching, did you ever stop to wonder who's the instructor's buddy?

I don't condone solo diving but I don't hide the fact that I've done at least 20 solo dives this week.

There's no Scuba Police if you wan't to dive solo, then who's going to stop you. You just darned well better be sure you know what you're doing or you'll just be another statistic.


Dave

[Cacia]

Anyone who gets really involved with a camera, especially shooting macro, is diving solo to some extent. Even if I have a buddy watching my back, he doesn't really have one, does he? I have to admit I love being off by myself without all those "tank rappers". Of course, they (hi Chris) don't even let me bring the camera if I am leading clients around.

[cnctina]

If your buddy team system breaks down, are you and your buddy diving solo?

[NWGratefulDiver]

Anyone who gets really involved with a camera, especially shooting macro, is diving solo to some extent. Even if I have a buddy watching my back, he doesn't really have one, does he?
That depends on who you're diving with. I dive regularly with photographers. Some view the entire dive through the lens of a camera, and if I ceased to exist, they would not even notice till the dive was over. Others ... including one professional photographer I dive with regularly ... have training that enables them to keep a watchful eye out for both photography subjects and dive buddies ... of course, I have the same training, and make sure to keep myself where I can be seen in his peripheral vision at all times. Sometimes I even dive as part of a 3-person team where both of my dive buddies are engaged in photography ... and we all keep an eye on each other just fine.

Point is diving solo is a choice ... and in this case you can choose whether to adapt your diving style to fit the circumstances or to use the circumstancs to rationalize your diving style ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[Santa]

For instance my dives to date have been in shallow gravel pits.


I'm all for conservatism but that sounds like a pretty dry dive ;0)

[Santa]

Another thing I would note here is that some of our local quarries have some of the highest accident rates. A few are regular slaughter houses some years. Even though they lack things like tides, currents and rough seas, some are deep, cold and amoung the few places that average divers actually dive without some level of supervision.


This may be a little off the point but it sounds like you have experience with quarries, so beyond the above: What would you consider the major risk/cause of accidents associated with quarries?

I've been taught since childhood to respect them because they're cold - but so is the winter sea where I live (I'm aware of the salt/temperature difference).

regards

[Santa]

And unfortunantly thats what happens. I'm not trying to rationalize soloing. Just trying to point out that people who would turn pale at the thought of *BUM BUM BUUUUUUMMMMMMM* solo diving... are completly fine with hopping in the water with someone they met 10 minutes ago on their one dive of the year.


I'm undecided on the subject but that carelessness in the choice of buddy is a very real phenomenon is technically not an argument for solo diving nor against the buddy system.

It's just carelessness - which we should strive to avoid in either case.

regards

[DavidHickey]

I'm all for conservatism but that sounds like a pretty dry dive ;0)


Yep!!! Unforutnately being land locked in the big ole USA does not give me many other options short of vacations. Nothing wrong with a 25 foot shallow quarry dive with 3 feet of visibility. As long as I'm blowing bubbles underwater and see an occasional fish I have a great time!!! Thanks for the advice everyone, I'm far from having the experience to solo dive, but I just think with my personality "not being anti social I just sometimes like the peace and quiet of doing things myself sometimes" that solo diving would be something that will interest me down the road as I progress.

[DA Aquamaster]

What I find interesting is why the diving industry makes it such a taboo while other equally or more dangerous activities don't seem to make a big deal of it, climbing, flying, backcountry hiking, etc.There is an elevation of risk in some circumstances , but it is not an issue if the risk is managed and is not deemed excessive. Also sometimes what appears to be riskier really is not.

For example single engine aircraft accident rates have historically always been better than twin engine aircraft accident rates. This is conunter intuitive if you restrict yourself to only looking at the obvious fact that a twin engine aircraft has one more engine and the theoretical ability to continue flying in the event of an engine failure.

But there are other less obvious factors at work. A pilot in a single engine aircraft has a more limited set of options when the engine quits and if they are unable to get a restart, they quickly move to identify a spot to make an emergency landing as there is never any remaining doubt they are going down. And during that emergency landing, they are in a lighter aircraft that lands at a slower speed which reduces the energy that needs to be dissipated and improves surviveability exponentially.

In constrast in a twin, there is usually a belief that you can stay in the air, but this is often more a case of being able to extend your glide at higher altitudes, higher temps, and/or higher loaded weights. Flying a twin on one engine is also more demanding with a much increased potential to depart from controlled flight if you screw it up. So when an engine fails on a twin, you often have a pilot in denial trying to keep a twin in the air when they really ought to be finding a place to put it down. I know of at least one case with airframe damage accompanying an engine/propeller failure where the pilots would have been far better off pulling the power back on both engines rather than attempting to fly on one.

If you want to get really counter intuitive, one year a single engine helicopter, the Bell 206, had the best overall safety rate (and it usually ranks up there as being one of the safest aircraft anyway). Most uninformed people think helicopters just more or less fall out of the sky when the engine fails.

I think the same types of misconceptions and limited views are at work in the solo/buddy diving argument and I think we also tend to ignore or downplay the increased risks in some circumstances in buddy diving.

And Personally, I get very careful about legislating or mandating what anyone else does. For example, people on motorcyles are more likely to be killed in the event of an accident. Conversely, people who drive SUV's are 3 times more likely to kill someone else in a smaller vehicle in an accident. Other than some elements insisting on helmet laws, no one is restricting motor cycle use or sales and absolutely no one is pointing out safety risks associated on what is the largest becoming the largest segments of the US auto market. So as long as successful middle aged men are buying harleys for themselves and sending their teen age daughters out on the roads in SUV's, I think we can live with solo (or buddy) diving.

No matter what you do, it is probably dangerous from someone's point of view, but I would much rather accept an elevated level of personal risk than a reduced level of personal freedom.


The buddy system is generally a great system and could eliminate a lot of unnecessary death if used throughout your life. Let's face it, heart attack, stroke, hitting your head on a rock could happen as you walk to the bathroom, well maybe not the rock thing, having a buddy could potentially save your life...The point is, you need to look at the risks and decide what risks you are willing to take. Some of these risks you are going to think to minor to worry about and take.I agree with you everywere but the heart attack. If you have a heart attack underwater during a dive, your chance of survival is still very small even with a buddy along to "help". The odds are good that the buddy's help will essentially be one of recovering your body and there is always the risk of a double fatality if the buddy panicks and or is stressed and is in an equally poor cardiovascular situation. In the case of a solo diver, the dive rescue team will at least get some valuable experience in body recovery.

[WaterDawg]

In the case of a solo diver, the dive rescue team will at least get some valuable experience in body recovery.


Can I make that my sig?

[DA Aquamaster]

Probably not, it's one of those things that sends an entirely different message when read out of context.

[DA Aquamaster]

If your buddy team system breaks down, are you and your buddy diving solo?No. You and your buddy are just "alone" and need to surface to regroup if you don't find each other in about a minute.

Unless of course you and your buddy are properly trained and equipped for solo diving, each of you are maintining your own navigation and it was previously agreed that if a separation occurred, you would both continue solo. But that is probably more accurately described as a group solo dive rather than a buddy dive as all the requirements in terms of training, equipment, redundancy, situational evaluation and planning were in place before the dive ever started.

[WaterDawg]

just kidding DA,

I agree that folks should do what they please as long as they are informed.

What pissesd me off was that about 2 years ago Rodales Scubadiving magazine had an article about solo diving and how much better it is. On the next page an ad for SDI and their then new solo course. If you look at the mags target audiance I belive that was an unethical thing to do. Writing articles that are "sponsored".

When you see folks who on SB say the have 16-50 dives asking about going solo and more experianced folks telling them its even safer than having a buddy, that makes them think about it more and more. How many divers w/ 50-100 dives have you met that think they are allready "seasoned vets". I had a guy walk into the shop who was cert the month prior (4 day class), he dives solo now but can barely set up his gear. He thinks that people who have accidents are stupid.

I know that alot of folks w/ alot more experiance than I have dive solo and thats their call, they've been around and are qualified to asses the risk. However alot of divers are not.

[DA Aquamaster]

i've done two solo dives just to see what was up with the taboo.

lessons learned:

- you must have your **** together on entry and exit. this is probably one of the most dangerous points of the dive for the solo diver.And it is one of the areas that requires careful assessment and adequate judgement to recongnize when solo may not be the way to go.

- nobody is there to give you a bubble check, you have to be good at planning and monitoring your gas supply. if you can't look at your SPG 20 mins into the dive and determine that you don't have any leaks, imo, you don't have any place solo diving.A leak check is actually easy to perform. You just drop down about 10 feet, hover, stop breathing long enough for the last exhalation to reach the surface, and look up to see if you there are any bubbles coming from behind your head. It will catch all but the really really slow leaks, which arguably are not going to be an issue on the dive. And this should actually be the second leak check. The first occurs on the boat or shore when you set up your equipment. Pressurize the system, note the pressure when it stabilizes and turn the valve off. If the pressure does not hold over 5 minutes or so, you have a leak.

This does admittedly create the potential to jump in with the valve still off if you blow off the subsequent checks, but being able to reach back and turn the valve on should be a required skill for solo diving. Worst case, you surface on the pony bottle/back up reg on the manifold/indpenedent doubles, etc and start over.

- if you run out of gas you will not be able to inflate your BC.This is only true if either your mouth or your oral inflator is broken. You have to remember if you are solo and properly equipped, you still have the pony bottle, which needs to be large enough to handle all aspects of the ascent. If you are diving with properly configured doubles and a drysuit or redundant wing, you don't even need to orally inflate.

Then of course there is the larger argument that if you run out of gas in the first place, you probably don't have either the experience or situational awareness needed to solo dive. You should be very good at gas planning, be experienced enough to know whether you are using more gas than planned, check the SPG often enough to know how much you have left even if the SPG failed since you looked at it last (and be able to tell if it is stuck) and carry and reach the surface with an ample reserve (not including the pony bottle).

- even on a super weenie solo dive with good gas management you could still have IP creep in your first stage cause catastrophic gas loss. recovery from this is not elegant if you are solo with only a single air source.IP creep is caused by a very slow and progressive failure of the HP seat. It should be noticeable on the boat or shore after a minute or two with the reg being re-pressurized (after the valve is turned back on from the surface leak check) as it will result in a slight hiss and freeflow from one of the second stages. Consequently you have several dives to catch the problem, and even if you screw that up, you will encounter a slight freeflow between breaths long before it develops to catastrophic freeflow levels. And if for some reason you let it get to that point, you still have a redundant air source.

- downsides in addition to it being more risky, you don't have an extra set of eyes spotting cool stuff for you, and you don't have opportunity for feedback ("was i head down? did i have any air in my wing on that stop?", etc).The upside is that you do not have twice the movement and bubbles to scare fish away and you can hover or settle on the sand and breathe slowly and quietly until the residents come right up to you. That seldom happens with a buddy thrashing around in the water or rototilling the bottom. Things like trim should be self evident and not require input from a buddy. Self awareness is a key component of solo diving.

the bigger issues that are more likely to kill you are probably related to air and buoyancy. its going to be an uncontrolled free flow, or a valve rolled off, or a regulator that you can't get at, or a BC/wing dump that is stuck open.None of the above are anything more than routine failures that proper redundancy and a proper response by the diver can address. If any of those failures are "likely to kill you" you have no business solo diving.

your pre-dive checks need to be flawless and your gas management needs to be excellent. in retrospect i've got considerably less confidence in my skills to solo dive now than i did when i did those two dives.I agree with you completely and I'd concur with your self assessment that you are not ready to dive solo.

[MikeFerrara]

[QUOTE=MikeFerrara]Another thing I would note here is that some of our local quarries have some of the highest accident rates. A few are regular slaughter houses some years. Even though they lack things like tides, currents and rough seas, some are deep, cold and amoung the few places that average divers actually dive without some level of supervision.
QUOTE]

This may be a little off the point but it sounds like you have experience with quarries, so beyond the above: What would you consider the major risk/cause of accidents associated with quarries?

I've been taught since childhood to respect them because they're cold - but so is the winter sea where I live (I'm aware of the salt/temperature difference).

regards

Good question. I think the problems we sometimes see at local site has more to do with the overall situation than any specific or unique hazards. When a novice diver goes on a charter he is hopefully taken to an appropriate site. Some of our quarries have appropriate sites right next to 350 ft of water. In mid summer when surface temps my be 80 F, novice divers equiped for warm water may end up in fairly deep cold water. While cold water is common, summer fresh water conditions in this part of the country/world have very warm water and very cold water as well as very shallow water and very deep water all located within a few feet of each other. Combine that with the fact that many of these divers are novices and you can have touble.

We've seen a fair number of accidents and near misses occure during classes like AOW deep dives. Often you'll see an 80 ft training dive planned in 120 ft of water. Free flows and buoyancy control problems are pretty common and sometimes result in rapid ascents and injury. Just such an accident happened a couple years ago and was discussed here on this site. As I recall a student on an AOW deep dive lost a fin at about 80 ft with the bottom at 120 or so. He lost control of his buoyancy, may have panicked, sunk and shot to the surface. I don't remember if a free flow was involved or not but he shot to the surface and hit the surface unconciouse and not breathing. This one was revived and lived.

Another incedent that was discused on the board involving a board member was an AOW deep dive where the student had a free flow and the student, buddy and the instructor all ended up in an unintentional rapid ascent from like 80 ft. There were no injuries in this case.

Those are just a couple of examples of the kinds of things that happen. I think training standards complicate the issue in several ways. First a student can be doing a "deep" training dive on their 5th lifetime dive and with an instructor who isn't a very experienced deep diver. Again, the students who can't dive for a couple of minutes without a fin or manage a free flow while maintaining pocition and buddy contact.

A specific hazard I haven't mentioned is vis. Most quarries are very silty, at least in places, and we have sulfer clouds sometimes too. Divers are taught finning techniques that might work fine for diving over sand but the majority leave a nasty silt trail behind them in a quarry. The result is that you may have great vis one second and ZERO the next. Entry level dive training just seems too often to be tailored for warm water resorts. I think most quarries are really easy, calm dives but you see lots of divers there who are still ill-prepared for the environment skillwise.


Recreational solo diving...
Unfortunately it's often these same skill challanged divers who get miffed when they aren't alowed to dive alone. I know lots of divers who dive in caves, deep wrecks or wherever else alone. They don't ask any ones permission or opinion and no one argues with them. They just do it. Except for the fact that some are friends and I worry about them it doesn't bother me much. OTOH hand when the subject of solo diving comes up in a recreational diving context, I can't help but get nervouse knowing how divers are being trained and what the average skill level is. Shoot, we've pulled at least 2 solo divers out of the drink. One never even started his dive before getting into trouble. he got himselfe chicken winged trying to get his bc on in shallow water and fell over. My wife reached in and lifted his head out of the water when it started to look like he wasn't comming back up on his own. Ther depth was less than 3 feet. The other was one that I left a rescue class I was teaching to go after. He surfaced in the middle of the quarry with his tank falling off and jerking the reg out of his mouth. Niether of these should have needed any help but they did and the one with the tank comming off got mad when I wouldn't put it back on for him so he could continue his dive.

The decision to solo dive or not is just another choice that divers should have the right to make for themselves. What I have trouble swallowing is that dive training today is designed to get divers to the resort as fast as possible. The jump from what they are trained for to solo diving is HUGE, IMO. I also have trouble believing that a short little 2-dive solo class is going to change anything.

[drbill]

That depends on who you're diving with. I dive regularly with photographers. Some view the entire dive through the lens of a camera, and if I ceased to exist, they would not even notice till the dive was over. Others ... including one professional photographer I dive with regularly ... have training that enables them to keep a watchful eye out for both photography subjects and dive buddies ... of course, I have the same training, and make sure to keep myself where I can be seen in his peripheral vision at all times. Sometimes I even dive as part of a 3-person team where both of my dive buddies are engaged in photography ... and we all keep an eye on each other just fine.


As a videographer, my eye is usually on the viewfinder through most of my dive. Several of my regular buddies are still photographers so our styles are comfortable. When I dive with a buddy who is not a regular one, my attention is constantly diverted towards them since I recognize the responsibility. That is why I don't like pick-up buddies or diving with people still new to the sport and developing their skills. It requires me to focus attention on them rather than the reason for 99% of my diving... to gather imagery to use in educational programs. If I agree to dive with a new diver (which I do), I focus on them and only use the camera for those "Sony" moments.

Dr. Bill

[NWGratefulDiver]

When you see folks who on SB say the have 16-50 dives asking about going solo and more experianced folks telling them its even safer than having a buddy, that makes them think about it more and more. How many divers w/ 50-100 dives have you met that think they are allready "seasoned vets". I had a guy walk into the shop who was cert the month prior (4 day class), he dives solo now but can barely set up his gear. He thinks that people who have accidents are stupid.
You see them here too ... folks who say they have 16-50 dives and some percentage of them have already been solo dives.

Those folks haven't yet enough experience to realize how little they know ... and they're just asking for trouble. In scuba, ignorance and overconfidence can be a deadly combination ...

... Bob (Grateful diver)

[NWGratefulDiver]

As a videographer, my eye is usually on the viewfinder through most of my dive. Several of my regular buddies are still photographers so our styles are comfortable. When I dive with a buddy who is not a regular one, my attention is constantly diverted towards them since I recognize the responsibility. That is why I don't like pick-up buddies or diving with people still new to the sport and developing their skills. It requires me to focus attention on them rather than the reason for 99% of my diving... to gather imagery to use in educational programs. If I agree to dive with a new diver (which I do), I focus on them and only use the camera for those "Sony" moments.

Dr. Bill
By developing good situational awareness skills, you can do both comfortably. One of my favorite dive buddies is a videographer (in fact, one of her vids was featured at the San Diego film festival last year), and yet her awareness of her surroundings ... which include her dive buddy ... is quite sufficient for me to say that I trust her with my life and safety while we're diving together. Certainly, part of it is familiarity ... but part is also how you apply your skills to fulfill your own responsibilities as a dive buddy.

Let's be honest here ... the vast majority of the time people complain about bad dive buddies, what they're really talking about is that person's lack of situational awareness. This is a skill that can be learned ... but the diver has to be willing to put in the effort to learn it ... and often the "bad buddy" doesn't even realize that it's something they should know about.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[Finatik]

Being new and all to the sport I find that the comments about never diving with someone who isn't an experianced buddy perplexing. How if you're new could you ever go diving if this was followed? Isn't part of diving giving back and teaching those that are willing and want to learn?

I'm an avid camper and backpacker. I always go out of my way to teach people who want to learn outdoor technique and skills (in the right situation). Many people spent time teaching me. It's my way of giving back or paying it forward so to speak. Maybe it's a little off topic but so many posts I read say something to the effect "never dive with someone who isn't a dive master" (my interpretation - I could be wrong it happened one time before LoL).

Eventually the sport would die (thoretically) because no one would dive with someone new. Just a thought.

[diverbrian]

Being new and all to the sport I find that the comments about never diving with someone who isn't an experianced buddy perplexing. How if you're new could you ever go diving if this was followed? Isn't part of diving giving back and teaching those that are willing and want to learn?

I'm an avid camper and backpacker. I always go out of my way to teach people who want to learn outdoor technique and skills (in the right situation). Many people spent time teaching me. It's my way of giving back or paying it forward so to speak. Maybe it's a little off topic but so many posts I read say something to the effect "never dive with someone who isn't a dive master" (my interpretation - I could be wrong it happened one time before LoL).

Eventually the sport would die (thoretically) because no one would dive with someone new. Just a thought.

Actually, there are a lot of newer, OW divers that I would dive with sooner than some DM's/Instructors that I know of. The way that I am taught is to not dive as a dependent dive buddy. Also, dive with competent dive buddies who stay within the limits of the team. This makes life far easier than diving with someone that will:

a) go into a situation where you have to be responsible for them and isn't within their limits.

or

b) ask you to dive in a situation where you are not comfortable and are dependent on them to guide you through.

[Jim Ernst]

First off, theres a section on solo diving on the board, probably the best place for this discussion. That being said, you run these same risks in diving on a boat with a buddy you don't know, diving low viz, or diving in any situation where it is possible to lose sight of a buddy.

If you are a newbie, it really makes sense to dive with someone else THAT YOU TRUST. Read a few of the accidents/incidents in that section and count how many times a dive master or equivilant has nearly killed someone and ask yourself if those folks might not have been better off on their own (equipped properly). For what its worth, i'd much rather dive by myself than with someone i don't know/know is an accident waiting to happen. Please consider:

1>Smack your head on a rock (resulting in unconciousness). Learn buoyancy/stay out of overhead environments until you are trained for them. You get knocked out with a diver you don't know and he may decide to help you by inflating your bc fully and watching you shoot to the surface......

2>get knocked out by a jetski. Dive with a dive flag and surface near it. You get hit by a jetski and there might be little a dive buddy can do. If you're surfacing near each other the odds are he'll be hit too.

3>badly stung by some sea creature. Leave them alone. Barring that, a buddy might be helpful here. Assuming they know whats happened to you.

4>get tangled up in some fishing line or net. This one actually does help to have a buddy. They can see behind you and help you cut yourself free. Slashing a sharp object around behind your head near reg, spg, and inflator hoses probably isnt the smartest of ideas.

5>get bent on the surface and find yourself unable to swim back. In the unlikely event that you get severely bent on the surface and your buddy doesnt, then its probably best to have a buddy that can tow you back and get help.

An OOA situation was not mentioned here. Thats because the risk of one can be mitigated to an acceptable level by carrying a completely redundant air source. All of the risks above can be mitagated. But only if you know what you are doing, plan your dives better than most do, and dive that plan.

Thats one of the reasons they say not to solo before you've been diving for awhile. But I stand by my original point. Diving with a buddy you don't know is just as risky/riskier than soloing. Should we stay away from dive charters until we have 1000s of dives?

Just my 2 cents :)
ill take that to the bank, i do a lot of solo diving sense the GF and i split a few months ago, what can i say i love to solo dive and doing a lot of photography that i do, solo is the only way to go, ;)

[in_cavediver]

Being new and all to the sport I find that the comments about never diving with someone who isn't an experianced buddy perplexing. How if you're new could you ever go diving if this was followed? Isn't part of diving giving back and teaching those that are willing and want to learn?

I'm an avid camper and backpacker. I always go out of my way to teach people who want to learn outdoor technique and skills (in the right situation). Many people spent time teaching me. It's my way of giving back or paying it forward so to speak. Maybe it's a little off topic but so many posts I read say something to the effect "never dive with someone who isn't a dive master" (my interpretation - I could be wrong it happened one time before LoL).

Eventually the sport would die (thoretically) because no one would dive with someone new. Just a thought.

The key to your comment is expierence and what is considered appropriate expierence. This should be measured for each dive. I consider myself to be a fairly expierenced diver (in some environments but no all) and collected numerous cards to clutter my wallet. I can be very picky on who I dive with for some dives. I also am willing to dive with just about anyone on other dives. This flexibility would allow a newer diver to dive with a more expierenced diver given the dive is appropriate for the new diver.

The other option is for a newer diver to go and buy more cards with an instructor to build expierence. Or pay a divemaster etc.

[Snowbear]

Being new and all to the sport I find that the comments about never diving with someone who isn't an experianced buddy perplexing.
Who said that?

Most folks comment about never diving with a buddy who has proved unsafe or who has a poor attitude toward buddy diving. I must have missed the comments about never diving with inexperienced buddies..... most of us are more than willing to do that, as long as the new guy has a good attitude and is willing to work on being a good buddy.

[Santa]

No matter what you do, it is probably dangerous from someone's point of view, but I would much rather accept an elevated level of personal risk than a reduced level of personal freedom.

.


I don't solo-dive unless I'm putting out a buoy for an instructor or something but I agree. If my mother owned PADI I'd be diving in the shower.

THe whole thing sorta comes down to the fact that it's hard to determine how well any one individual is able to realistically assess risk and take countermeasures and that goes for both types of diving. And that becomes all the more important if that persons activities has the potential to bring harm to others - which many rescue situations have.

I think that is one restraint I can live with; That what I do should not endanger others.

regards

[DiveTub]

Well I did 2 solo dives today of the boat on my PRISM Rebreather.
Spent 20 mins with a school of 15 Eagle rays doing circles round me.
Watched half a dozen King Fish attacking a bait ball, I was inside the bait ball!! was just outstanding.
Spent half an hour sitting in the middle of a school of what I would guess was 300-400 Sweet Lips as they swam so close to me I could not see anything but fish.
Had three grey Nurse sharks swim up and sit right beside me as I filmed them

Got back on the boat to the moans of 7 Open circut divers that rekon they saw nothing on their dives.

Thanks but I will stick with Solo Diving.

Cheers
Chris

[Hockeynut]

You see them here too ... folks who say they have 16-50 dives and some percentage of them have already been solo dives.

Those folks haven't yet enough experience to realize how little they know ... and they're just asking for trouble. In scuba, ignorance and overconfidence can be a deadly combination ...

... Bob (Grateful diver)


I'm one of the 16-50 group and thanks to 2 humbling experiences in the recent past, I realize I know more about women than I do about diving. Thankfully, I can learn something about diving.
But what you said there, I think you could widen that out to 16-100 dives. I see the overconfidence all the time in plenty of folk who have 75 or 80 dives.

[NWGratefulDiver]

I'm one of the 16-50 group and thanks to 2 humbling experiences in the recent past, I realize I know more about women than I do about diving. Thankfully, I can learn something about diving.
But what you said there, I think you could widen that out to 16-100 dives. I see the overconfidence all the time in plenty of folk who have 75 or 80 dives.
I agree with you ...



Thankfully, I can learn something about diving.


There's the key, right there ... and as long as you keep that attitude, you will always continue to improve, no matter how many dives you log ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[AK49]

Remember that guy who cut his arm off with a swiss army knife because he got trapped by a boulder? He wouldn't have had to do that if he either went with someone or simply let someone know where he was going and when he was going to be back. Despite media worship, he was widely criticized for being a dolt.


That's the kind of guy that I'd rather be diving with!

[WICKED_WIZARD]

There is no textbook answer for Diving solo or with a buddy.

You as the diver have to decide if you accept the risk of either.
You have to view your experience; equipment and ability to the conditions and type of diving you are doing, to what can go wrong. Since you can be diving in different conditions and types of diving (air, eanx, heliox, trimix, rebreathers, etch) your equipment will change from dive to dive.

You have to just sit down and look at the equipment you are using and ask yourself, what if this fail or I loose it. Will it affect my dive to an extent that my live is a t risk? Having a computer flood on a 30-ft no deco air dive might be no big deal. But on a 300-ft trimix or reabreather deco dive it is. As is losing a mask or a fin. On a no deco 30ft dive, your o-ring goes (not likely on a din). You deflated your BC to sit on the bottom to take a close up picture of some critter (sand bottom). In the excitement caused by bubbles suddenly coming from behind your head, you lost one fin and the current takes it away. You are now out of air, no air in your bc and have only one fin. Yes you can make it to the surface with one fin and possibly by dropping your weights. But a competent buddy would have been helpful. On a deep deco dive shooting to the surface is not normally an option. You have a decompression obligation.

Then there are problems with you as person. Blackouts, fainting, seasick, ill from food you ate before the dive, muscle cramps, and many more. And on the technical side you add a lot more, esp. if you dive on gas other than air. But even on air you can have a bad air fill with a faulty compressor with too much CO in the mix. No real warning signs for you as you rarely detect it yourself. You just go to sleep, suck your cyl dry and drown.

So all in all. There is a lot that can go wrong. You have to look at your type of diving, see what can go wrong, and then decide if you accept the risk.

As to the run away ascent comment that you should not be diving. Gear does fail. Power inflators do get stuck. Esp. in diving conditions with a lot of sediment or sand in surge. Dirt goes in and can cause a problem.

Happy diving.

[hvulin]

I never dive solo, I allways have camera with me... It's a perfect buddy, allways with me (in my hand) and never want's to go the other way... If I need help it will be as helpfull as 99% of the worlds buddies = no help at all, just leave it down there and help yourself...

[tedb]

1) Murphy's law: Whatever can go wrong will go wrong
2) When something even small goes wrong under water is often escalates into a life-threatening emergency
3) A (reliable and trusted) buddy and his equipment can often solve problems and prevent escalation.

If you accept these three principles you will never dive alone.

Keep safe!

TedB

[DavidPT40]

Some divers are better suited for solo diving than others. Almost every problem is preventable and treatable.

I think in general, a solo diver needs to have more redundant equipment, and be in better shape than the average diver.

But is solo diving really that much different from diving from a boat, with your dive buddy 100 feet away, and being surrounded by newby divers who can barely take care of themselves?

[GrierHPharmD]

I didn't solo until I had roughly 100 dives under my belt and was adept at maintaining good bouyancy. I probably wouldn't have started solo diving then if I hadn't had a string of boat buddies that disappeared as soon as they hit the water. In effect, by diving on boats with strangers for buddies, I was diving with all of the liabilities of using poor buddies and getting none of the benefits of the buddy system.

So I started diving solo. Not on every dive, not on deep or challenging dives. I dive solo in familiar, shallow environments when conditions are such that I can predict a relatively uncomplicated dive.

As for training and gear configuration, I practice redundancy and routinely practice gear removal and replacement underwater. I also carry at least two cutting devices that I can reach with either hand. As almost all of my solo diving is in water shallower than 30 ft, I don't carry redundant air. I'm considering a pony, but haven't gotten one yet.

I like the solitude that solo diving provides. I enjoy the lack of structure and my ability to explore on my own pace, to practice skills for as long as I'd like without feeling like I'm taking up somebody else's valuable dive time. I like the fact that, once I learned to slow down and hover, I started seeing much, much more underwater life.

I also like the mindset that solo diving requires. Attention to detail, focus, self-reliance. Yes, we should have those traits before ever entering the water, with or without a buddy, but solo diving requires them to a greater degree.

I understand the reasons for buddy diving and agree that the buddy system can be helpful in the event of some types of emergency, especially entanglement and OOA situations, and for that reason, I usually dive with a buddy, but for many of my shallow, near-shore dives, solo diving just makes more sense. That being said, I don't think it's for everybody and think that it should probably be discouraged until a diver has a pretty large repertoire of dives.

Safe ascents to all,
Grier

[ScubaSarus]

By solo diving you are ppaying the odds of not having a surprise physical ailement, not getting tangled, not blacking out for unknown reasons, have a perfect dive etc. I only occasionaly do solo diving but it has to be in good conditions, at certain depts, with a pony, and I have to be feeling well both physically and also mentally sharp.

[Rainy]

Out of my 200+ dives half has been leaning photography and taken photos these have been mainly solo dives all off my boat with my Wife aboard as deckie and look out. Most of my solo dives are between 5-10metres and in waters I know very well. When I go with a buddy its usally in new waters and deeper situations and someone Ican trust and have set rules. I personally love diving solo as there isno-one to look after and it makes me more aware on my own responsiblities with equipment and safety.

[Highfeedback]

I've read with interest all the expert opinions in this thread. My opinion is that they all miss the main point.

Training and preparation is what it takes to scuba dive safely. Training and preparation is also what it takes to solo dive safely. Accident reports show us that in as many as half the instances where a bubby is asked for help they do not effectively give it.

This idea of “always dive with a buddy” had it’s origin in the fact that the YMCA was originally the main scuba certifying agency and their “always swim with a buddy” got carried over into their scuba curriculum. It was not then and is not now based on statistical evidence showing that diving with a buddy is safer.

Underwater problems need to be solved underwater. Be prepared to do that whether you’re diving solo or with a buddy.

I would never dive solo without carrying with me everything that a buddy might be able to supply me with if I needed it. That includes a completely separate, redundant air source with its own first and second stage regulator. If you’re at 30 feet a Spare Air is adequate. In you dive deeper you’ll need a pony bottle with 15 to 30 cubic feet of gas. When I dive solo in overhead environments I carry a separate aluminum 80 in addition to the 240 cubic feet of gas in my back mounted doubles.

Self sufficiency is what’s needed for solo diving and what’s needed to be a good diver period. One source of information is the book “Solo Diving” by Robert von Maier (ISBN 0-922769-13-3). Some of his points may be a bit conservative but it’s a good place to start.

Solo diving isn’t the reckless pursuit it’s made out to be by most of the certification agencies. On the other hand it’s not something to be entered into lightly. If you feel you have the ability and personal discipline to safely pursue solo diving, first seek all the information you can about it and any training that is available in your area. When you start, move forward in easy steps with short, shallow dives to test the self sufficient package you’ve put together. Build up to longer and deeper dives with time.

Although diving is a safe pursuit when done properly and within the limits of your training and ability, you are in an alien environment that requires life support equipment to stay alive. Treat it as such and you'll be diving safely.

That's my opinion.

[sandjeep]

Hello,

I have read this thread with great interest. I noted that some writers base a persons ability to solo dive on the number of dives they have made with buddies or the amount of training they have received. What of other skills a new diver may have acquired elsewhere in life, such as problem solving, looking at details and risk checking? I'm not speaking of problems in the office, but of situations that a person must face or be hurt if they do not correct them, such as Parachuting or Mountain Climbing. Does a persons thought process play a role in self evaluation to solo dive?

[rzanussi]

I have been diving solo for years now, mind you I am never deeper than 20 ft, the rest of my shore party know where I am, I avoid overheads etc. Why have I been doing it this way? Simply because I was too far from anywhere to find a buddy to dive with. None of my shoreparty (usually my immediate family) were divers and being in a tourist area I really didn't want to have someone new out with me every dive.
Now, my daughter is old enough to dive, so I have a buddy, but due to her age and inexperience it is almost like I am diving alone still.

Rob - lost on an island somewhere in Georgian Bay

[serambin]

. . .I'm with Rick on this one. Dive solo if you want but rationalizing it is a wast of time...especially by comparing it to diving with a bad buddy. Don't ever dive with a bad buddy. BTW, I think following along on charters is a great way to get in trouble if you let others plan your dives and pick your buddies. I wouldn't say we should stay away from tha until we have thousands of dives. I'd say we should stay away from that for our entire diving career!

All of us accept risk when we choose to dive. With the exception of commercial divers, we just don't have to dive. Having said this, we get to pick the level of risk based on our own judgement. For example, no one has to cave dive, or dive deeper than 30 feet, or dive in cold water. Each of these represent some level of quantifiable increase in risk.

I dive solo somethimes, but when I do my predive check list you can bet I'm looking closely at each item. If fact, I am for more likely to make a stupid mistake when diving with friends (who may be able to help me).

So, why do I dive solo, because the choice is between dive solo or not diving and I accept the additional risk sometimes as preferable to only diving a few times a year.

Stan

[GrierHPharmD]

Training and preparation is what it takes to scuba dive safely. Training and preparation is also what it takes to solo dive safely. Accident reports show us that in as many as half the instances where a bubby is asked for help they do not effectively give it.

Underwater problems need to be solved underwater. Be prepared to do that whether you’re diving solo or with a buddy.

I would never dive solo without carrying with me everything that a buddy might be able to supply me with if I needed it.

Self sufficiency is what’s needed for solo diving and what’s needed to be a good diver period.

Solo diving isn’t the reckless pursuit it’s made out to be by most of the certification agencies. On the other hand it’s not something to be entered into lightly. If you feel you have the ability and personal discipline to safely pursue solo diving, first seek all the information you can about it and any training that is available in your area. When you start, move forward in easy steps with short, shallow dives to test the self sufficient package you’ve put together. Build up to longer and deeper dives with time.

Although diving is a safe pursuit when done properly and within the limits of your training and ability, you are in an alien environment that requires life support equipment to stay alive. Treat it as such and you'll be diving safely.


What a great summary of the pertinent points! I think we should distill them as I've done above and call it the Solo Diver's Creed.

Seriously, I agree completely with everything you said. Great job of refocusing us on the issues.

-Grier

[Scubageezer]

Although I don't dive solo, I will probably will at some time in the future when I have a bit more experience and am better equipped (hardware-wise and brainware-wise). In weighing the risks, it always seems as though we look at buddies as reducing risk and maybe on the whole that's true. But what about that risk of having a buddy? The big scary for me is the panicked buddy, the one who's unintentionally drowning my sorry arse gouging my reg out of my face cause his air has failed. I know it gets back to "what's a good buddy?" and preparation/discipline, but if someone hasn't taken a good Stress & Rescue course and practiced the skills, they might find themselves in trouble. I know it sounds selfish, but I took the instruction in large part to protect myself and make me better prepared, not necessarily to make me a better buddy (although I think it did). Having a buddy might be nice in the event YOU have a problem but not if your buddy does.

[ayubimoak]

I have been diving now for about 10 years, logged hundreds of dives and have never, ever been alone on a dive. Yes, experience does make a huge difference, but when something does go wrong like a failed regulator, out of air condition, entanglement in vegetation like kelp, disorientation inside a wreck, narcosis at depth, etc. (and it eventually will if you dive long enough) it is paramount that you have someone with you to help out. When I first started diving back in the mid 90's, I too had it beat into my head to NEVER EVER dive alone. I thought, ok I am a pretty smart and level-headed person. I was in the military at the time and had gone through lots and lots of highly specialized and pressure-intense training. I was a Naval Officer and had been trained to remain level-headed even during chaotic circumstances. I thought to myself, "This is nothing. If I ever get into trouble, I can take care of myself and I won't panic. I'll just use the training I have and respond the way I have practiced so many times." Well, that sounds really good in your head, but the honest truth is that when you do get into trouble the first few times, YOU DO PANIC a little and fear does some strange things to that rock-hard ego inside that tells you that you can handle anything. And even with a buddy next to you or a few meters away, you still feel a little isolated and alone. It was not until after 100 or so dives that I built up the confidence in my own abilities and skills to venture 20-30 feet away from my dive buddy or out of their line of sight. Because getting into trouble (like getting caught on something, having your tank come loose, or losing a piece of equipment in strong current , etc) is only compounded when your are alone or far from your buddy. I recently (after 10 years of diving experience) completed the Advanced Open Water course and am enrolling in the Emergency First Responder course as well. I had certainly experienced (many many times) the types of diving we did during the advanced course, but I still learned a great deal about diving and how to respond to emergencies in advanced circumstances.
So to answer your question about what are the inherent risks of diving alone, I would have to say(especially for a new diver) that mistakes made due to FEAR are probably the most important additional risks you assume if you choose to dive alone. I do know several people who routinely dive alone on a regular basis. They are all extremely experienced divers that are either at the Master Diver level or beyond. I do not agree with their decisions to dive alone, but I do understand their love for the sport. Experience is one thing, and goes a long way when something goes wrong. But it does not take the place of another person's ability to remain level-headed and calm during a diving emergency. Having a buddy with you increases the probability that you will respond appropriately during an emergency and they can assist you and possibly save your life should you suffer any medical trauma on your way back to the surface. Imagine you have an out-of-air condition and you have to do a controlled emergency ascent to the surface. Well, if you have never actually done this for real (I have once), controlling your emotions and general tendencies to "freak out" is a little harder than you might think. Having a buddy's spare regulator or pony bottle, or spare air can make this emergency a more controlled one. Also, if you are injured, who is going to help you once you make it to the surface. You certainly cannot give yourself CPR, for instance. How would you make it out of the water, back into the boat, or back to shore without assistance? This is just one circumstance out of hundreds that you could find yourself in if you are diving alone.

The choice is obviously still your's to make, but I would highly recommend that one not feel so confident in his/her skills that common sense gets pushed aside in the process. Depending upon your skills, equipment, and training is a necessary component in this sport, but common sense is also pretty important. Your ego and faith in your ability is not going to save you in an emergency, but a buddy certainly can and probably will.








I probably should have kept this on the post below, but I'm just curious guys I'm really new to diving, and I've read alot on the horrors of solo diving here on the board. I've read how dangerous it is and how you should have 1000's of dives before ever attempting it and should by NO means EVER consider it unless you can snatch the pebble out of the masters hand. BUT I have never read any reasons why people are so strongly against it. For instance my dives to date have been in shallow gravel pits 30' or so and in shallow tropical areas about the same depth. From these depths in good dive conditions can you explain the dangers you may face that would make this any more dangerous than snorkeling solo in the same waters? I am by NO means trying to say there are not dangers but being new and naive, I think to myself that in a worse case scenario you simply do a CESA inflate your BCD and swim to shore. Once again I'm not advocating solo diving, just wondering what hidden dangers await that basic scuba skills we are all taught could not remedy at these shallower depths. Most the answers I've read are to the extent of "If you have to ask your not ready" well thats not a real informative answer.

[wwolfson]

First, I dive solo AND I dive with a buddy. Which I do depends on the situation and the buddy available. I've been diving since 1971 and have always done this. Diving solo requires no more care than PROPER diving with a buddy. That implies that BOTH require skill, judgment and experience. Diving with a buddy doesn't give you license to do foolish things in the belief that your buddy will save your sorry butt. And, by the way, are YOUR rescue skills up to date so that you can do the saving if necessary?

[jbeuoy]

Just adding into the discussion. I am you average open water certified diver with about 45 dives in. Something I've never heard said in discussions of this kind (didn't read every last post in this one) is the dangers of buddies.

I dive in Minnesota in lakes with often limited visibility. I have accepted that the buddy rule is true, but am beginning to have some contrary leanings. It seems to me that in limited visibility my buddy and I run more risks with staying together than if we just carefully dived solo.

When you turn left, right and all around and upside down and you know how this goes, and you don't find him there is always a controlled moment of panic. Where did he go? Is he in trouble? Do I go to the surface again and look for him? It certainly pushes you into a heightened state of awareness, and you tend to breath harder, and when such a dive is over you are often worn out by this hide and seek game.

It seems to me that if I did get into trouble, most of the time my buddy would be as useless as teets on a boar hog. With the vis we usually have he wouldn't find me until it would be too late. Relying on him as we are trained is a potential danger in itself. The discussions and magazine articles seem to assume clear water ocean conditions where a half way concientious diver will be staying with his buddy.

In talking to a dive shop owner who dives similar conditions she confided that she often dives alone for these reasons. I've never done it, and my wife has given me heck for even thinking of it, but it has its appeal. The thought of one complete dive where I wasn't spinning around looking for my buddy half the time would be a welcome relief.

[markfm]

There's an excellent solo diving forum here, might be worth reading. Generally, people who don't solo dive tend to be more than slightly antagonistic towards solo diving, though I believe they are well intentioned. Those who do dive solo, whether occasionally or often, recognize that it isn't for everyone, and that you really need your act together -- redundancy of key items, good planning.

For example, I have no problems going solo in a training area, for gear and skills work, or a few other spots that I've been to many times. Likewise, if I'm traveling and the buddy teaming doesn't work, I'm content to be "odd man out" -- dive my own profile, though in the general vicinity of other buddy teams. I always carry a pony, dual cutting tools, and stay away from entanglement areas, plus I limit my depth.

If the vis is all that cruddy, I probably wouldn't go solo -- that just adds one more variable, an unnecessary complication. A buddy line, one end held by each diver (not clipped off) is a better option, in my opinion.

[Charlie99]

Something I've never heard said in discussions of this kind ... is the dangers of buddies.

... It seems to me that in limited visibility my buddy and I run more risks with staying together than if we just carefully dived solo.

When you turn left, right and all around and upside down and you know how this goes, and you don't find him there is always a controlled moment of panic. Where did he go? Is he in trouble? Do I go to the surface again and look for him? It certainly pushes you into a heightened state of awareness, and you tend to breath harder, and when such a dive is over you are often worn out by this hide and seek game.

It seems to me that if I did get into trouble, most of the time my buddy would be as useless as teets on a boar hog. With the vis we usually have he wouldn't find me until it would be too late. Relying on him as we are trained is a potential danger in itself. The discussions and magazine articles seem to assume clear water ocean conditions where a half way concientious diver will be staying with his buddy.

........ The thought of one complete dive where I wasn't spinning around looking for my buddy half the time would be a welcome relief.I'm not clear why you think having a buddy is more dangerous. If momentary loss of buddy contact freaks you out, gets you breathing fast, and wears you out, then having some sort of incident while diving solo will probably really freak you out.

"Relying on him as we are trained is a potential danger in itself" is another statement that confuses me. One should be both self reliant and ready to assist. You should avoid situations where you are dependent upon your buddy for your safety.

Doing solo dives because you can't develop good buddy skills is avoiding the problem rather than solving it.

Charlie

(About half of my dives are solo, most of the other half are with insta-buddies.)

[Spearfisherman]

That's my answer in a nutshell. Most dives sites are not as 'sterile' as a 30' gravel pit. If that were the case, sure - diving alone would be safe. The worst that could happen is you'd doff your gear and surface.

But you don't know what's down there, even in clear, shallow water like a reef; especially if it's a place you've never been. Even if you've been there, things at the bottom may have changed since your last visit.

It may look 'peaceful' from the surface, but you can tell nothing about currents at depth, marine life that might become a nuisance, or man-made or natural 'obstructions' or other objects that can cause you to become entangled (e.g. fishing nets adrift, swift currents, debris piles that can cut or injure you should you brush up against them.

And, while I'm sure you maintain your equipment to a high degree (which everyone should, but often don't), there's always the possibility of a catastrophic equipment failure and you can never predict these things.

I've done some diving alone, with mixed results.

I go regularly to a bridge that crosses the intracoastal waterway here in South Florida to collect tropicals. It's 15-20' deep in the channel. I go with a pony tank, weight belt, BC, knife, mask fins and snorkel...and the 'slurp gun' to take home fish. I've never had a problem, but I've been diving in much deeper water since '84, so I'm confident I can do this and get away with it.

I avoid enclosed spaces (like between the channel markers and the bridge piles, even though I know I can fit).

I always have a knife - not to use as a weapon, but to free myself in case I become entangled in something.

When I was still new to diving (2 years after certification), I once broke away from the buddy they'd hooked me up with and, with my speargun, headed out into the 'big blue' in 65 feet of water off Jupiter, Florida (ironically, where I live now). I bagged a few fish.

When I felt the tug on my regulator, I knew my tank had slipped out of the cheap rubber 'band' that held it to my (cheap) BC.

I doffed the BC and tried to reassemble it...no good, the current was driving me too hard, I had no control. The hose got twisted. I tried to put down the speargun and fish, and everything got picked up by the current. I said 'f uck it' to myself, gathered everything into my arms - BC/tank/regulator hose/speargun/bag of fish and, with the regulator held in my mouth with my teeth, slowly surfaced. I'd been down a while, and stopped for a couple of minute interval about ten feet from the surface, which I could see was now up to a 3-5 foot sea - not good.

After 10 minutes I surfaced the rest of the way. It was thundering and lightning. The relieved look on the captain's face as he saw me surface indicated he'd been looking for me for a while - everyone else was back on the boat.

These are two more reasons to not go it alone. You may jump into flat seas in sunny conditions. But, by the time you're done, the sea can be pitching like a mother and you may have drifted too far down current from your ride to swim against the current to get back to it. In pitching seas, it can be difficult and dangerous to climb up in even 3-5 foot seas.

That said, pick your conditions to dive alone if you insist on doing it.

Inland waterways are safest, especially when there's no boat egress involved (I carry the pony tank from the car down a short hill to the base of the bridge - I'm never more than 20 feet from where I can stand up with my gear on - this is easier than pool training).

This is provided there are no 'unseen hazards', which may not have been there your last time.

[stevetim]

No, the solo diving forum is to discuss solo diving techniques, not its efficacy. This is the right place :)

Not really. The risks in those situations are different - not necessarily less, just different. Just being in the water, whether swimming, snorkeling or diving all by yourself carries a unique set of risks that can't be removed by anything other than another person. That doesn't mean you can't manage to make having another person around "more dangerous" - you can... but you can't reduce the risk of solo diving by changing the subject to bad buddies or lousy conditions. That risk is just a part of solo diving, and if you choose to solo dive then you're choosing to take it.
I'm not about to tell you "don't solo dive."
I'm just telling you that you need to keep your eyes open about it - if you have a debilitating event under water, whatever it is, and you don't have someone there to haul your hide out, you die. That's the risk. The choice to take it or not is all part of the dive/don't dive decision.

Rick

Spot on.

[opiniongirl]

Solo diving is a lot like rock climbing without a rope.

People do it for the right reasons, as well as the wrong ones. Unless in specific applications, it's usually done for the wrong reasons. The "reasons" and "right" or "wrong" are only the generally accepted and promoted opinions of the community as a whole. Based on DAN reports, an above-average number of diving fatalities involve divers diving alone.

Would you climb without a rope? If not, then consider that a buddy is your redundancy for another critical life support system: your brain.

[mnydvr]

I dive for a living and I almost always work solo,whether it is recovery of an expensive piece of jewelery or clearing a prop. I had an experience that will forever change my life and it bothers me to even think of it ,nevermind talk about it.Imagine,80ft. down and a stranger appears in front of you with the fear of god in his eyes,rips your primary from your mouth and won't let go of your octo!I grabbedhim and my spare airand made a safe ascent to my deco stop,needless to say some words were passed !!,thanks,I'll dive alone and take my chances of dying through my own fault rather than someone elses!!!!!!!
dive safe,dive long,god speed

mnydvr - out!

[Dean810]

Whether we like it or not, we often dive solo. If you have an inattentive buddy, or are diving with a group that forgets you are there, then you are diving solo. I think that all the comments here have merit on both sides of the question. I think the bottom line is we have to be responsible for outselves. I think all the diving courses emphsize this to one extent or another.

That being said, I can't imagine myself diving without a buddy. If I do get in trouble under the water, I want that extra level of safety.

[Divindave]

I have just read over a number of posts on this thread and I am left wondering why any of the divers who are against solo diving even dive themselves. How can they possibly say people shouldn't dive solo because of this or that possibly happening and then turn around and jump in the water with their lives hanging precariously in the hands of another diver they may or may not know? As one person wrote, what if your buddy panics and drowns the both of you? Obviously, along the same lines of this or that possibly happening, having a buddy is no guarantee you'll ever make it to the boat or shore alive.
So why do these divers look at our sport this way? Most likely either, or in combination, their level of risk aversion is higher then that of solo divers or their levels of perceived risk is higher. Neither position is wrong, it's just the way these divers look at the risks and odds affecting their mortal wellbeing. What I find interesting is how they can do anything alone. From the time we wake up in the morning till the time we go to sleep at nite, and even in our sleep everything we do has the possible outcome of our earthly demise. So does anyone accompany them to the bathroom in the morning, after the spouse has showered, lest they slip on the possibly wet tile floor and shatter their cranium against the tub, what precautions do they take when they fly in an airplane, do they carry a parachute, or how about driving a car, do they require a second driver with with his/her own driver controls so that person can safely drive the car if the first driver should become incapacitated? How many antisolo diving divers reading this have ever started to nod off whille driving a car with the real possibility of losing control and continue to drive alone to this day? From the show of hands I can see it is all of you. So why does hurtling alone down the freeway at 65 mph seem any more of a natural setting for the human body then breathing compressed air at 65 feet? Ya' got me! Well, actually cars have become almost a natural extension of our bodies and we have lost our fear of them. They are everywhere, and you don't have to be a driver to see them in action, just look on any street, or better yet you may interact with them by trying to cross that street, and you see and experience most of the time they will stop for you. So they must be safe! But diving is different. People only see divers on the surface where they breath air and walk and talk like the rest of us, well almost, but then they go under the water into their intended element and those on the surface don't get a chance to see what's really going on and that awakens one of our most basic fears, fear of the unknown. And I think for many divers, even with many years of experience, coupled with the training organizations mantra of "thou shall not dive alone" that fear is a hard obstacle to overcome.
It is my opinion that sometime in the near future these training organizations will begin to certify solo diving as a specialty (though its more like a reality), for two very good reasons, 1) so we can have another card in our wallet and have the honor of Putting Another Dollar In to get it, and 2) because equipment and yes, even training, have gotten to the point where it is just as safe to solo dive as to buddy dive.
I don't see the dangers facing solo divers as any greater then those facing buddy divers, so I guess what it comes down to is, in light of the possible dangers of scuba diving, how safe and prepared are you and do you feel to handle these dangers. To my way of thinking one properly trained solo diver will be more aware of possible trouble long before two untrained buddy divers are and who may not see the danger coming until they're hit with it. I might also add that, besides any legal consideration, organizations like PADI put the ball in the divers hands, and absolve all others in other divers final decision making by stating that in the end it is ultimately up to the individual diver to make his or her own decision as to dive or not dive.

[FARMHAND]

Agree with you completely. Primary reason I dive solo: I personally require 100% concentration on me, my gear, and my immediate u/w environment, leaving me zero per cent concentration on a buddy. Only two exceptions: my daughter and/or my son.

[toodive4]

Weighing in late... and without reading the entire thread... some of this is sure to be repetition.

Why SOLO Diving is not just Dangerous... but somewhat foolish can be easily established... and I will establish it clearly for you. With that said, it can also be dangerous and somewhat foolish to dive with a buddy. Situations vary, so to each diver I say... dive smart with or without a buddy.

Solo diving for new divers is foolish because there is no conceivable way a new diver has the experience under his or her belt to handle what may come at them. The only way to gain these experiences - and likely live through them - is to dive with more experienced divers. They may or may not be your direct "buddy" but they must be in the water around you if you have much chance of surviving your "experience building" stage. Solo divers have died due to a variety of situations where a buddy may have been able to offer assistance - or at least returned to the surface to effect a rescue by someone more experienced. Some situations dangerous to a solo diver include entrapment, entanglement, running out of air, getting lost, ascending or descending out of control, experiencing vertigo, etc... I have personally been involved with saving less experienced divers - and myself - from situations involving all of the aforementioned hazards. Some will argue that running out of air is one with remedies... (dive doubles, carry spare air etc...) but those too have failed, or failed to have been used properly. There is safety in numbers... on land in a dark alley and underwater with the fishes.

Now with all that said... you may be in even greater danger if you're diving with a less experienced buddy or a buddy who is an incompetent boob. I have seen buddies damn near kill their buddies with everything from plain stupidity to outright overt acts I thought to myself may have been attempted murder. I've seen buddies think it was funny to swim up behind their buddy and turn off their air... I've seen buddies follow buddies into wrecks or caves where they had no business going etc. etc...

Know yourself - and if you have a buddy - know them as well as you know yourself. If you dont - dont dive with them.

The final reason I like diving with a buddy is so that if god forbid something did happen to me and I didn't make it back to the boat... at least someone would know what happened to me... They can go back with a great story like - Ken got eatin' by a shark or Ken got stuck in the wreck and I couldn't get him out... yada yada yada...

Good stories like that are hard to come by... and rarely are first hand accounts available.


Ken

[DavidPT40]

Oh man, MNYDVR, did that really happen to you?

I've thought about what would happen if a crazed diver ripped the regulator out of my mouth, and I couldn't get to my Air 2. Or if my regulators stopped working, and I swam over to an inexperienced diver, gave the out of air signal, and he fumbled around trying to find his octopus.

So, lets look at this mathematically. If you are diving with a *true* buddy, someone you have dove with many times before, have talked about emergencies with, and are sure that he wont panic if one of you has an emergency, then your risk from dying or getting the bends is probably 25-50% less if you have an emergency.

But if you are diving with a group of inexperienced or rusty divers whom you just met 20 minutes before on the dive boat, then your risk is multiplied by every diver there. If one of those divers has an emergency and panics, they could involve you. Most likely they would try to shoot you to the surface.

[serambin]

I have just read over a number of posts on this thread and I am left wondering why any of the divers who are against solo diving even dive themselves. How can they possibly say people shouldn't dive solo because of this or that possibly happening and then turn around and jump in the water with their lives hanging precariously in the hands of another diver they may or may not know? As one person wrote, what if your buddy panics and drowns the both of you? Obviously, along the same lines of this or that possibly happening, having a buddy is no guarantee you'll ever make it to the boat or shore alive.


I hate the lack of paragraphs. You make me wirk too hard!!! :06:

[Green Hand]

Hi all, this is my first posting so please bare with me.

I totally understand the motivation of wanting to dive alone: self reliance, adventure, no one else to worry about, or have to organise etc. But I truely believe that diving is a 'team' sport, much like hiking, skiing, and surfing.

I'm based in Australia and grew up at bording school, where I spent year 9 living in the Victorian mountains at a campus called Timbertop. We went on 20 klm. runs, five day hikes, downhill skiing in winter etc. and the first thing we learnt [some through theory and others through practical experience] was don't do dangerous activities alone no matter how competent you are [or think you are].

I knocked myself out skiing a couple of years ago [I'm now 40] skiing a run alone [but with friends further down the slope] and skiied another run with them because I didin't know that I had been unconcious. They assesed my behaviour, had me rest and called patrol. I was medi-vacced to hospital with concussion. To this day I don't know what happened and can't remember. On my own I may have kept skiing and plowed into a tree with dire consequences.

I have had friends break the cardinal rule of not surfing alone who have had encounters with large sharks[which tend not to approach a group of surfers]. In the last two weeks we have two diver deaths by Great Whites and one surfer attack by a Great White. If the surfer had been alone he would have bled to death on the beach.

People fly alone and die from a heart attack, stroke, or asma because they did not have a back-up pilot. OK they probably know the risk and accept it but a back-up plan for the unexpected is, I think, part of risk assessment. We all think it wont happen to us - until it does.

I guess my point is - some sports are just not designed to be done alone [Aron Ralston who hacked his arm off after 6 days can tell you that]. Boards hit people unexpectadly in the face, sharks have a taste of your leg and find your not what they thought you were and if alone you bleed to death, if accompanied you get to hospital and have a great scar and storey for life.

All 'extreme / dangerous' sports have levels of risk that we assess and base our actions on. Personally I don't want to sky dive again because I and my family have agreed that the risk is to great if something goes wrong. I also won't mountaineer as the percentage of fatalities puts it in my 'too dangerous / uncontrolable' basket and I think it is irresponible for me to do it when I have a family. If I was still young, single and fit enough maybe I would re-evaluate the risk level and on-going repurcussions if the unknown did occur.

Diving alone, for me, presents an unacceptable risk - if something goes wrong [like you suffer an unexpected seizure, or stroke] a buddy could assist getting you to shore and getting medical help. Alone you would probably drown. We are not fish and the ocean is not our natural environment. We should always treat it with the utmost respect - and in doing so have a lot of fun and adventure in it.

Anyway who would you have a beer with and swap stories after the dive if you were alone?

[Gary D.]

Hi all, this is my first posting so please bare with me.

I totally understand the motivation of wanting to dive alone: self reliance, adventure, no one else to worry about, or have to organise etc. But I truely believe that diving is a 'team' sport, much like hiking, skiing, and surfing.

I'm based in Australia and grew up at bording school, where I spent year 9 living in the Victorian mountains at a campus called Timbertop. We went on 20 klm. runs, five day hikes, downhill skiing in winter etc. and the first thing we learnt [some through theory and others through practical experience] was don't do dangerous activities alone no matter how competent you are [or think you are].

I knocked myself out skiing a couple of years ago [I'm now 40] skiing a run alone [but with friends further down the slope] and skiied another run with them because I didin't know that I had been unconcious. They assesed my behaviour, had me rest and called patrol. I was medi-vacced to hospital with concussion. To this day I don't know what happened and can't remember. On my own I may have kept skiing and plowed into a tree with dire consequences.

I have had friends break the cardinal rule of not surfing alone who have had encounters with large sharks[which tend not to approach a group of surfers]. In the last two weeks we have two diver deaths by Great Whites and one surfer attack by a Great White. If the surfer had been alone he would have bled to death on the beach.

People fly alone and die from a heart attack, stroke, or asma because they did not have a back-up pilot. OK they probably know the risk and accept it but a back-up plan for the unexpected is, I think, part of risk assessment. We all think it wont happen to us - until it does.

I guess my point is - some sports are just not designed to be done alone [Aron Ralston who hacked his arm off after 6 days can tell you that]. Boards hit people unexpectadly in the face, sharks have a taste of your leg and find your not what they thought you were and if alone you bleed to death, if accompanied you get to hospital and have a great scar and storey for life.

All 'extreme / dangerous' sports have levels of risk that we assess and base our actions on. Personally I don't want to sky dive again because I and my family have agreed that the risk is to great if something goes wrong. I also won't mountaineer as the percentage of fatalities puts it in my 'too dangerous / uncontrolable' basket and I think it is irresponible for me to do it when I have a family. If I was still young, single and fit enough maybe I would re-evaluate the risk level and on-going repurcussions if the unknown did occur.

Diving alone, for me, presents an unacceptable risk - if something goes wrong [like you suffer an unexpected seizure, or stroke] a buddy could assist getting you to shore and getting medical help. Alone you would probably drown. We are not fish and the ocean is not our natural environment. We should always treat it with the utmost respect - and in doing so have a lot of fun and adventure in it.

Anyway who would you have a beer with and swap stories after the dive if you were alone?
An activity that is far more dangerous than diving, flying, skiing, hiking and many more is done alone on a regular basis. That activity is driving to the site of the activity what ever it might be.

One thing a lot of people forget is "IF" you or your buddy has a serious problem you or your buddy are now a SOLO diver, SOLO Skier, SOLO Hiker, SOLO Climber or what ever else. Once one or the other is unable to help the other you are on your own with a lot more tasks to deal with.

Gary D.

[Wreck]

I guess I look at solo diving as being another alternative to not diving at all. I like the buddy system but I am not going to miss an opportunity to dive. I practice self reliance. I adjust my dive plan accordingly. I know the risk. I make an educated decision. If I go to a scuba park and there are 40-60 people diving, I don’t feel I really need a buddy. Everyone there is my buddy. I have been diving and snorkeling since 1964.

Nothing opens your eyes more to the inventiveness of Murphy's Law than sheer experience. That awareness can come at a very costly price. I think I'll go out on a limb and say that most people never really understand what their risk/limitations are until they get hurt or are about to die.

I could answer the original poster with some additional issues faced by solo divers, but having answers for all of those (and maybe even all of Sheck Exley's list of 100 what-if's) is not what's going to make you a safe solo diver. Having the right equipment is not what it's all about. Having the right training is not what it's all about. This is why many experienced divers caution against it to most reacreational divers and don't bother to offer specific reasons. It's something only experience can teach you.

Don't ever think you've got Murphy taken care of - he can always surprise you.

[Wreck]

I've thought about what would happen if a crazed diver ripped the regulator out of my mouth, and I couldn't get to my Air 2. Or if my regulators stopped working, and I swam over to an inexperienced diver, gave the out of air signal, and he fumbled around trying to find his octopus.


Many divers necklace their "octo" so they can grab it with just their mouth. Hands-free, no fumbling, out of the way, and right where you need it.

[seaseer]

I've solo dived a few times, it was fun. If you are properly trained, follow procedure and the limits you set for yourself, the risk should be very minimal. I personally have a very detailed dive plan, don't push myself beyond any limits, and have at least two sets of redundancy. I dive with a pony bottle with separate regulator system, two knives, scissors, dual computers and dual air pressure readouts. I also limit myself to no deeper than 30 feet, no current, and pick dive sites that are very public. Some of you may think, "that's just crazy". I used to think that also, mainly because I was uncomfortable about my abilities, but if you are properly trained and disciplined, you gain that sense of what you can and can't do. I gained my confidence through the years by diving tough dives, fast currents, and doing some things that were down right scary. Given that, I know I'm reasonably save when I solo dive with conservative limits. Yes, the risk is a little greater without a buddy, but not that much. To each their own. Happy diving.

[stevetim]

An activity that is far more dangerous than diving, flying, skiing, hiking and many more is done alone on a regular basis. That activity is driving to the site of the activity what ever it might be.

One thing a lot of people forget is "IF" you or your buddy has a serious problem you or your buddy are now a SOLO diver, SOLO Skier, SOLO Hiker, SOLO Climber or what ever else. Once one or the other is unable to help the other you are on your own with a lot more tasks to deal with.

Gary D.

I love your first statement about driving to the site being far more dangerous than solo diving.

He is right, you know? Besides, a car is basically life support for the duration of your trip. How many of us actually open our car hoods on a regular basis to clean, maintain, and make sure our car engines are working as well as our dive equipment? Just weigh the number of hours you wash and check your dive gear vs. the number of hours you check your vehicles and all the sudden it makes sense. Of course anyone whom makes like 5 dives a year(e.g.) doesn't fit into this category. If you aren't worried about a catastrophic failure of your car as you drive, don't fear it with something you actually take care of on a regular basis.

And by the way, I am not advocating solo diving. It's people's choice to do it and that's that. Just like stubborn people who still won't leave their homes in New Orleans while there is no water, food, electricity, or anything capable of supporting their families, much less their lives.

[ayubimoak]

Not really sure if the reponse from WWOLFSON was to my original input on this thread, but if it was, it sure sounded like my input ruffled this diver's fins a bit.

An individual's decision to dive solo is a personal choice and one that he/she in the end must choose to live (or die) with. Personally, I have never gone diving with anyone less experienced than myself and usually dive with someone a few years more experienced than myself and someone that is familiar with the dive site/profile/area etc. However, that being said, it would be pretty narrow-minded and plain stupid to put your safety and well-being in the hands of your buddy by assuming that they will save "your sorry butt." So it is important to be honest with one's self as to whether or not they could rescue their buddy in an emergency or not. Diving with a more experienced person doesn't automatically mean that you no longer have to worry about your own safety and can haphazardly go off and goof around! It just means that you at least have some form of a "human" redundancy available. Regardless of whether or not you dive solo or with a buddy, it is important to maintain a certain level of proficiency in such things as first aid, CPR, etc., that can be acquired and honed through PADI's EFR and Search & Rescue courses. Saying you can rescue someone and actually doing it for real are two very different things. Fortunately, I have never had to administer first aid or CPR to another diver, but having the knowledge, the skill, and the real confidence to do so in an emergency can make a lot of difference and could possibly save someone's life. I came to this realization after diving in Mexico earlier this summer. I began to wonder if I could actually assist or save another diver should the need arise, and I honestly couldn't answer my own questions. So I enrolled in the above-mentioned courses.

Rather than getting emotional over a webboard thread and posting a random emotional response, well-thought out comments and dialog are what are really helpful, informative and useful for other divers. Otherwise, your are simply wasting your time responding, regardless of your experience level or diving expertise. You can be an "experienced" or "seasoned" diver and still make mistakes (or have gear fail on you, even redundant gear!), but the failure to admit that to yourself ultimately is far more dangerous than solo diving at 30 ft in clear water under favorable conditions with plenty of redundant gear.




First, I dive solo AND I dive with a buddy. Which I do depends on the situation and the buddy available. I've been diving since 1971 and have always done this. Diving solo requires no more care than PROPER diving with a buddy. That implies that BOTH require skill, judgment and experience. Diving with a buddy doesn't give you license to do foolish things in the belief that your buddy will save your sorry butt. And, by the way, are YOUR rescue skills up to date so that you can do the saving if necessary?

[scubahound_1]

As you can see we all have differing opinions. The bottomline is that every story I have ever read where an accident has happened it is because broke one of the cardinal rules. I am not saying that diving with or without a buddy is one of those rules, but you have to really know what you are doing out there and dress accordingly. Also knowing the area you are diving is paramount if you do go solo. Whether I am teaching a class or on a fun dive I always assume I am a solo diver. Regular diving is one way to reduce (not eliminate) your risk level to yourself and others, DAN has many stats to back that up. So many times I have watched divers jump in the water and ask their buddy(s), "so what are we going to do?" That is a form of solo diving just because a lack of planning ahead. Two things that every diver needs to remember, 1) plan your dive and dive your plan 2) leave your arrogance at home. Whether you have 4 dives or 4000 dives, every time out is different just enough to get you killed if you aren't careful.

[NWGratefulDiver]

As you can see we all have differing opinions. The bottomline is that every story I have ever read where an accident has happened it is because broke one of the cardinal rules.
In fact, most diving accidents are the result of breaking more than one safety rule ... a "chain of events", if you will. Break the chain at any point, and the accident would not have happened.

One of the best reasons to dive with a buddy is that you won't often be in a position to notice the chain of events ... either because of perception or due to circumstances. A dive buddy can notice things about yourself that you won't notice ... the leaking first stage, the improperly stowed pony reg, your altered behavior due to narcosis, and a raft of other common examples.

This, of course, assumes that you're diving with a buddy who's taking their responsibility to you seriously. I can see in this thread that many folks don't believe such buddies are common ... or even that they exist at all.

So it boils down, ultimately, to perspective and choices ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[AK49]

I get a big kick out of the individuals who ride their bikes on the shoulder of the highways. They have their bright colored windbreakers donned over proper biking attire and plod along near the white line with their noses to the pavement and not a care in the world. Once when I was driving recently, an oncoming pickup swerved into my lane on a fast collision course and I had to quickly screech onto the shoulder at highway speed. Scared the crap out of me After I got it back together I wondered what I might have done if I had to choose between a head-on and a biker on the shoulder. It seems that the shoulder bikers have effectively placed their lives in my hands. I'm glad I didn't have to make that decision since either would have been devastating.
I have yet to dive solo, but I will. When I'm ready I will start with the simplest of dives and when I'm ready I'll go the next step from there. I know that any solo diving I do will be at limits that I feel confident with and will not go as far as I will with my dive buddies present. I have always had a sense of adventure and I have found that to satisfy my needs I've had to be willing to occasionally do things by myself.
I have great dive buddys and I trust them as much as I enjoy their company. I have found myself at times seperated from them and it was always nice to enjoy the more relaxed pace of not having to keep up with their competiveness. It also took away the responsibility of being there for them and allowed me to focus on buoyancy and looking at what I wanted to without wondering if they had took off without me. We do a lot of adventure and adrenaline activities together and know eachother well so I could always hook back up with them before they would start to worry. We all appreciate eachothers independance as it allows us to enjoy the experience more than when we have high maintenance people along.
What I don't have is any intrest in riding bikes on the shoulder of the highway or placing my life in someone elses hands.

[tedb]

Having read the enourmous number of responses I think I should add some nauance to my previous comment (see "Murphy's Law)

There is no sphere of human activity which is risk free; we spend our lives taking calculated risks. I have no time for people who try to ban all sorts of sporting activities just because they are dangerous.
I believe that what is important is to be able to correctly assess a risk before deciding to take it, and this is the essential point in this discussion about solo diving.
Most (all?) of the solo divers who have taken part in this discussion are highly experienced divers and clearly feel that they have a good understanding of the situation to which they expose themselves - their decision to solo is a responsible decision.
David, who asked the original question, indicated that he is new to diving, so is unlikely to be able to foresee the dangers. This is the reason for my response to respect Murphy's law and dive with a (good!) buddy.
When do you have enough experience to decide to dive alone? This is extremely personal but needs at least scores of loged dives, lots of training and lots of conversations with very experienced divers.

Keep safe (but have fun)
Ted

[Rick Murchison]

How many of us actually open our car hoods on a regular basis to clean, maintain, and make sure our car engines are working as well as our dive equipment?
Doesn't everybody?
Rick

[Rick Murchison]

Not to beat a dead horse... well, maybe swat it a time or two :)
Personally I don't think "number of dives" is a very good yardstick as a solo dive measure. When I think back on my own diving, in the late 60's/early 70's, many of my first dives - in fact many of my pre-cert dives, and my very first post-certification dive, were solo.
In those days it was just impossible to find a buddy much of the time. And so if I wanted fresh fish for supper I went alone.
But... though I don't think "number of dives" is a very good yardstick, I do think "a mature realistic view of solo diving risk" is a necessary one.
From the very first time I went solo, I made some accomodation for the risk. Less depth, less dive time, smaller targets, closer to shore, someone ashore with my schedule. No equipment change though... redundancy just didn't exist in those days.
Now when I dive solo it is for the same reason - no (competent) buddy available for the dive - and my accomodation includes redundancy.
I'll also make the dive "envelope" smaller. Sometimes drastically smaller.
But I ain't stayin' dry for lack of a buddy, either.
Rick :)

[Heffey]

I get a big kick out of the individuals who ride their bikes on the shoulder of the highways. They have their bright colored windbreakers donned over proper biking attire and plod along near the white line with their noses to the pavement and not a care in the world. Once when I was driving recently, an oncoming pickup swerved into my lane on a fast collision course and I had to quickly screech onto the shoulder at highway speed. Scared the crap out of me After I got it back together I wondered what I might have done if I had to choose between a head-on and a biker on the shoulder. It seems that the shoulder bikers have effectively placed their lives in my hands. I'm glad I didn't have to make that decision since either would have been devastating.
I have yet to dive solo, but I will. When I'm ready I will start with the simplest of dives and when I'm ready I'll go the next step from there. I know that any solo diving I do will be at limits that I feel confident with and will not go as far as I will with my dive buddies present. I have always had a sense of adventure and I have found that to satisfy my needs I've had to be willing to occasionally do things by myself.
I have great dive buddys and I trust them as much as I enjoy their company. I have found myself at times seperated from them and it was always nice to enjoy the more relaxed pace of not having to keep up with their competiveness. It also took away the responsibility of being there for them and allowed me to focus on buoyancy and looking at what I wanted to without wondering if they had took off without me. We do a lot of adventure and adrenaline activities together and know eachother well so I could always hook back up with them before they would start to worry. We all appreciate eachothers independance as it allows us to enjoy the experience more than when we have high maintenance people along.
What I don't have is any intrest in riding bikes on the shoulder of the highway or placing my life in someone elses hands.
I don't mean to burst your bubble, but you are already diving solo.

[DrSteve]

I had to put my 2c into this. Afterall, here I am bored at work.

The buddy system can work. It worked for me and my buddy when I had my computer blow off the end of its hose in the Bahamas. We followed standard procedure and all was well.

Now take the other approach of there being lots of other divers around you. If you are "solo" you can get help from them. Possible. In the previous incident I just mentioned as we were swimming, buddy breathing with a stram of bubbles coming from my hose another buddy pair swam by us, looked at us and ignored us. OK we looked fine, we weren't panicked, but an "OK?" would have been nice. Also those other divers are not there to keep an eye on you! When I think the amount of times my wife has tried to point out a specific formation or life form *in front of me* and I fail to see it, makes me wonder how observant other divers are during the dive of anyone other than themselves (and their buddy?)

I dove solo for the first time 2 weeks ago, dive number 125 in 20 feet of water. All my buddies had left and I wanted to dive some more. I had a great time, got to spend 5 minutes trying to get that one perfect picture (failed miserably, but that's why I practice). That's a good reason to dive solo. If I had a buddy I would have done, but finding a buddy who has the exact same interest as me (sight seeing and photography) is tough. Hell, finding any buddy is tough!

I've also dived with "pick up" buddies and found them lacking more often than not. That's why I would prefer in many cases to dive solo. When I think of the amount of dives I missed because I didn't have a buddy...

Also...just curious what the cert level is of some of the self-acknowledged solo divers. Have you taken one of the various "Stress and Rescue" courses? I think that course really seperates the keen divers from the ones who just want to be allowed to do a 100 foot dive with the AOW ticket.

[Johan]

I don't have much to say on this topic. If you dive alone you die alone. We all know what can happen and everyone must take the responsibility that goes with diving.

[brussellsprouts]

After hyperventilating, take a deep breath, dive, and keep on going. It's amazing how deep you can dive without that constant supply of air. There are no uncontrolled ascents, and there are no fatal embolisms, since the intake of gas was done at the lowest pressure.

[serambin]

I don't have much to say on this topic. If you dive alone you die alone. We all know what can happen and everyone must take the responsibility that goes with diving.

Even if we're in a crowd, we all die alone. Ain't nobody getting out of here alive.

Stan

[dive_junkie]

I'm new to diving, and from what i've heard, solo diving is pretty dangerous, but also, one reason i would never dive solo is because if something truly amazing happens(and i mean not bad) and you are by yourself, it will be hard to prove it to people, but if you have a buddy, you guys can talk about it and its a memory with a friend of yours

[DrSteve]

After hyperventilating, take a deep breath, dive, and keep on going. It's amazing how deep you can dive without that constant supply of air. There are no uncontrolled ascents, and there are no fatal embolisms, since the intake of gas was done at the lowest pressure.

Isn't that also the easiest way to pass out without warning?

[serambin]

I'm new to diving, and from what i've heard, solo diving is pretty dangerous, but also, one reason i would never dive solo is because if something truly amazing happens(and i mean not bad) and you are by yourself, it will be hard to prove it to people, but if you have a buddy, you guys can talk about it and its a memory with a friend of yours

I would like to see the actual numbers on the increase in risks associated with solo diving. I'll start at DAN.

Stan

[Charlie99]

I would like to see the actual numbers on the increase in risks associated with solo diving. I'll start at DAN.

StanNumbers are pretty hard to come by.

1. Even if we knew about every accident, we don't know the denominator in the equation --- the total number of dives solo and total number of dives with buddies.

2. Solo diving risks can be greatly exaggerated simply by counting lost buddies as "solo". In many accidents, the dive starts out as a buddy dive, but then there is either intentional or unintentional separation.

Solo ascents and solo aborts are common in accidents. A typical scenario is the recent Death off Block Island, RI (http://www.scubaboard.com/showpost.php?p=1238223&postcount=5) where a diver aborted at 12 minutes into the dive. He apparently had medical problems, but his buddies thought he was just going back up to get something he forgot. "Solo diving accident" or "bad buddy accident" or "medical incident underwater"? Take your pick.

[mnydvr]

We seem to be going WAY off track on this thread,we should go back and look at the title,the subject seems to invlove those of us who solo dive and why it is such taboo,why is it such a problem if those of us who do feel we are resposible and/or comfortable enohg to do so.We are all aware of the danger and inherint risk, however ,as a working diver and the background and experience of 20 or so years ,I find it not only nessacary from time to time ,but as stated in the thread,it is a mental check to know it is all up to you and your expertise.I do not rebut or condone this practice for everyone,but then again,not everyone can drive a 200mph race car safely either,it is a personal choice as well as a challenge for those of us who do ,and may be a goal for others.For those of us who do ,be safe and enjoy,for thse of you who don't, but may want to,be patient,be sure and most of all,know your limits,your average air consumption,your equipment ,your dive area and anything else that may make you doubt your dive,then........enjoy and be safe!!!!!

[ultravinnie]

i've been solodiving for a while now.

first my reasons for solodiving :

i'm into photography and most of the time my buddies aren't interested in sticking to a spot for 10 minutes to get the shot i want of some tiny little creature, so i don't want to force anyone to endure this.

Sometimes its easier when no-one is around to poke you in the eye or get all hyperexcited or stir up all the sand.

When and how i solodive:

i had 600 + dives before i started solodiving. have gotten experience in different circumstances and got adequate training ( NAUI master diver course )

My self made rules :
1) Stay in visual contact with the boat or the mooring line, or if wreck diving : no swimthru . stay outside at all times.

2) limit depth to well within deco limits i dont go beyond 80 feet
3) dive NITROX ( voodoo gas ) for added safety. tune the nitrox mix for minimum nitrogen load. you're better off limiting your depth ( unless you need to be there for a particular reason ). if you know your depth upfront you can max the oxygen level out to run at your preferred ppo. oxygen is good , nitrogen is bad
4) surface with at LEAST 500 PSI in the tank and go up the mooring line or directly underneath the boat.
5) only solodive on sites where you have done at least 5 buddy dives so you know the orientation and layout. it's easy to get caught in the spur of the moment and violate rule 1.
6) a rule 1 violation is basically a 'lost buddy drill'. look for 1 minute and start spiral upward in a controlled ascent. if you are able to etrieve mooring line or visual on boat continue, if not go all the way to sueface.
7) carry ,at ay point of the day ( whether nightdive or daytime dive doesnt matter ) a flashlight , a surface marker buoy ( get the 8 foot long one ) , a whistle , signalling mirror
8) use your brain ! common sense is most important whether solo diving or not.
9) dive with a dive operator that allows what you are doing and UNDERSTANDS what you are doing and why you are doing it. Explain the rules you will follow and prepare for contingency. Add rules if necessary according to dive operator wishes. Since you stay close to the boat you will see all others return and do their safety stop. then its time for you to terminate the dive as well.
10 be aware at all times of your surroundings. keep an eye out for other divers ( buddy pairs )
11 make sure your gear is in perfect working order ( including the so often overlooked octopus ) and know it inside out. i strap all my gear using bungee cords so i know exactly where to find it if i need it ( even blindly )
12 check and recheck. keep an eye on your gauges and computer. you should check your stuff at least once every two minutes. i keep my computer strapped in a position where i can read all numbers handsfree ( i have an air integrated one on a hose. i strap it with a retractor to my arm. while holding my camera i can look sideways to read the computer. Also, during check and recheck: keep an eye on the boat. maybe it shifts in the current ! if there is a mooring line: the anchor spot on the ocean floor is you reference !


all of the above rules are equally important.


i have now 250 + solo dives. i stll do buddy dive. no problem, but when i have done a site a number of times and have seen special stuff i will re-visit solo.

its fun and you get to see different stuff. If you hang motionless for a while and control breathing ( reduce 'noise' ) the fish will come to you. they grow accustomed to you after couple of minutes. slow motions will not scare them. i can position my camera often inches away fro my subject without scaring it.

[Johnnie Murphy]

I'd back Jonnythan's assessment - if ANYTHING goes wrong, you're on your own. And no one should underestimate the significance of that. Underwater IS a very hostile environment (however comfortable you feel there) and even the toughest person can panic when the unexpected happens there, and panic often leads to bad decisions. As you gain experience and undergo more and more training, you're exposed to all kinds of new situations, and that experience makes you better equipped to handle the real thing when it happens. But until you're very experienced, you'll be playing russian roulette each time you dive solo. If you have a crisis underwater, your buddy is usually just 'detached' from your crisis enough to be more rational than you can be, and can provide assistance more calmly. Of course, your buddy must be competent and someone you can trust - but that's the whole point of buddy diving.

Dive solo if you want, but please, please don't kid yourself that you can handle anything that may happen - imagining it on the surface is entirely different from experiencing it underwater.

[Rec Diver]

Three years ago I lost a friend to drowning in less than six feet of water. We don't know why, because no one was with him to pull him out until after he was dead.
Certainly there are things you can do to improve your chances while diving solo. Redundancy, training, experience, good health.. But the bottom line remains that debilitating events can and do happen. If you have one under water and there's no one there to pull you out, you're dead.
Rick

About three months ago an instructor drowned in a swiming pool that had only four feet of water. There were two instructors and a class of newly trained divers in the pool with him. I wonder why with all those buddies he still died. They don't know why either, yet they were only a few feet away. Maybe we should all learn to be self-effiecient, then we don't have to worry about being saved, we would be able to save ourselves. What a concept that would be, saving yourself!

[pants!]

Because they were not his buddies. They were other divers.

[Rec Diver]

Because if ANYTHING happens underwater that would require a buddy's help, you're dead.


Bullcrap!

[GrierHPharmD]

About three months ago an instructor drowned in a swiming pool that had only four feet of water. There were two instructors and a class of newly trained divers in the pool with him. I wonder why with all those buddies he still died. They don't know why either, yet they were only a few feet away. Maybe we should all learn to be self-effiecient, then we don't have to worry about being saved, we would be able to save ourselves. What a concept that would be, saving yourself!

Maybe we're thinking about differernt cases, but I thought that the instructor who died in the pool was using a rebreather and died from hypoxia.

Doesn't change your point about being self-sufficient, which I agree with.

Safe ascents,
Grier

[Rec Diver]

Maybe we're thinking about differernt cases, but I thought that the instructor who died in the pool was using a rebreather and died from hypoxia.

Doesn't change your point about being self-sufficient, which I agree with.

Safe ascents,
Grier

You are correct.

[NWGratefulDiver]

About three months ago an instructor drowned in a swiming pool that had only four feet of water. There were two instructors and a class of newly trained divers in the pool with him. I wonder why with all those buddies he still died. They don't know why either, yet they were only a few feet away. Maybe we should all learn to be self-effiecient, then we don't have to worry about being saved, we would be able to save ourselves. What a concept that would be, saving yourself!
Um ... self-sufficiency won't save you if you're having a heart attack ... but having someone pull you out of the water, perform CPR, call 911, and perhaps use an AED to get your heart beating again might ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[Cacia]

Um ... self-sufficiency won't save you if you're having a heart attack ... but having someone pull you out of the water, perform CPR, call 911, and perhaps use an AED to get your heart beating again might ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)


I just have to make one point. Sometimes certain types of people just really enjoy and need to be alone occasionally and so they decide that it is worth the risk just to be in their own world, away from all the tank-rappers... And lets be honest, what do you think the chances really are that someone will have an AED right there when your heart fibrillates?....I don't mean theoretically, I mean real-life?

[pants!]

I just have to make one point. Sometimes certain types of people just really enjoy and need to be alone occasionally and so they decide that it is worth the risk just to be in their own world, away from all the tank-rappers... And lets be honest, what do you think the chances really are that someone will have an AED right there when your heart fibrillates?....I don't mean theoretically, I mean real-life?
I personally agree that everyone should be perfectly allowed to take whatever risks they want as long as they understand those risks.

It sounds like both of us would agree with each other, and disagree with those like Rec Diver. We would say that solo diving is indeed riskier and more likely to kill you, even when you do everything very very well.

Others might say that solo diving is not riskier, or is indeed safer, than diving with a good, trained buddy.