Etiquette of “NO, you are not diving with us”

Ok we blew it. We didn’t know how to say no. How do you guys do it? Give a few witty lines for reserve because here are two divers who obviously have problems with peer pressure and pleasing…

So, how to say no and not feel like you ruined someone’s day (instead of your own)? And how do you tell NONONO, YOU (point) aren’t coming but WE are still going… which now feels selfish even though it’s not you who turned up on the site without adequate equipment. And to add to insult, how do you say NO after you already had told Yes but changed your mind in water after dozen doubts flood your mind, and you’re starting to get scared to take this guy with you?

Someone got a real good lesson this week but is struggling to capitalize...

Details, man, details . . .

I don't say "No", unless someone is obviously going to hurt themselves.

However, if I'm unsure of the other diver, we will stay shallow and find something interesting to look at around the the grass, top edge of the wall, etc.

There's always another dive, and I'd much rather change my plans to accomodate a new diver, than blow someone off who's just getting started. When the dive is over, it's easy to discuss what worked and what didn't and what they/you might want to change next time.

Equipment may or may not be an issue. If by "adequate", you mean you don't like the brand/quality/age, that's really not your call, unless you think there's real chance of getting hurt. I went diving with a guy who had nothing but a wetsuit, a tank and a regulator from "Sea Hunt" and we both had a great time.

If you mean that they showed up with no tank, a garden hose and a cinder block, and and expected to do a 100 foot dive, that's a different story.

Terry

piikki:

Ok we blew it. We didn’t know how to say no. How do you guys do it? Give a few witty lines for reserve because here are two divers who obviously have problems with peer pressure and pleasing…

So, how to say no and not feel like you ruined someone’s day (instead of your own)? And how do you tell NONONO, YOU (point) aren’t coming but WE are still going… which now feels selfish even though it’s not you who turned up on the site without adequate equipment. And to add to insult, how do you say NO after you already had told Yes but changed your mind in water after dozen doubts flood your mind, and you’re starting to get scared to take this guy with you?

Someone got a real good lesson this week but is struggling to capitalize...

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The Kraken:

Details, man, details . . .

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Second that!

What circumstances are you talking about?

Tell em you prefer to dive in pairs and not as a group for this dive and they are on their own.

If you're on a boat, make the DM do it.

---
Ken

Ok, more of our scenario… we were shore diving, on our SI… a guy approaches us asking if we have a float/flag. We say sure. He asks if we are going back in, and we say we need to burn a bit but we will. He asks a few questions of what’s there because he only dove the beach once. Then he asks could we give him a sign when we go in because he ain’t got a flag, and he’d like to go in same time. We say sure, the area will be pretty much covered by one flag. He takes a look at our bottles and remarks something like ‘good you have same tanks’, and points to a direction saying ‘we are at that picnic table so just wave to me’.

Ok, so fine. Unfortunately, when we wave him in it takes him ages, and we are in the water when we see him coming ALONE! Now we get very uncomfy immediately. I ask him if he is going to solo but he says he is going to tag along. So now we need in a hurry go thru our first threesome check… We ask his hand signs, and check his releases. We ask him how long he’s been diving, and he says he is AOW/4yrs, so basically he is way more experienced than us. But we are kneeling in about 4f of water and his bladder is about to burst with air, he can’t get his fins on and his face is going blue in too tight hood. We ask if he’s alright and he is mumbling. We are supporting him and same time notice he has this crushed neoprene drysuit. Now, we have never been diving with drysuits nor with anyone in a drysuit, so we ask how do we get that air out off him if needed. He says all his air is in the bladder, so that’s OK. He’s getting more purple, so we repeat the question about too tight hood but he shrugs it off.

At this point, I tell him our dive plan and basically taking into account that he has about 4yrs more diving than us, I just tell that if he gets bored when we are doing our drills on our two planned stops it’s kind of his problem but if he thumbs we will have to come up with him, so can he please tell us if he has a sign for just ditching. He says that’s all good. All this time both of us are screaming NONONO – but neither of us can get it said. This guy is sweating his balls off and we want to sent him back to the beach now that he has finally gotten his fins on with both of us supporting him… Gee… He is pleasant, no jerk signs but vague and at no point did he ask one question about our gear/signs/experience etc or if we ever dove in threesome.

Needless to say the dive went south, bad

piikki:

But we are kneeling in about 4f of water and his bladder is about to burst with air, he can’t get his fins on and his face is going blue in too tight hood.

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If he's turning blue in a drysuit, his neck seal is probably too tight. It's possible to die or have a stroke from that.

Just tell him that you're sorry, but you're not comfortable diving with 3 people.

I'd also mention that turning blue isn't a good sign.

Terry

So far, I've never said no to anyone. As long as they are certified, I'll talk to them to find out the frequency and experience level of their diving. If they are nervous and/or inexperienced, I'll keep it shallow and easy. I look at them as an opportunity for a teaching experience. I love to teach and it's good practice for my ultimate goal of becoming an instructor, retiring from my day job and getting paid to dive.

Sometimes being a new diver has its advantages - and you could use the same excuse as you gain experience.

If a diver wants to come along as a third, just politely inform him/her that you are new divers who have been diving together for a short time and, at this time, are not comfortable diving in a threesome. You can cite communications, dive plan . . . whatever you decide, but the crux would be simply that you aren't comfortable with the situation.

It's your dive. By bringing in a third person you're adding an additional level of possible stress/anxiety and thereby increasing the risk of an accident.

While to some this may sound as being unfriendly and selfish. But personally I would prefer to be safe and alive as opposed to friendly and injured.

Once again, it's all about planning your dive and diving your plan.

the K