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Cacia
December 16th, 2006, 07:27 PM
The tilt trim/ engine lift is empty but the hole is only three inches from the water, and goes sideways. I feel like I need a special funnel or something so as not to spill in the water.

Are there any types of delivery systems that could help? (I keep think a cake frosting decorator would do it, but don't have one) Certainly there must be a solution to putting this in sideways and not spilling. One drop looks like Valdez.

oilman66
December 16th, 2006, 07:37 PM
Check with West Marine- they have all sorts of pumps/evac systems that would probably work.

NetDoc
December 16th, 2006, 07:45 PM
Most horizontal holes also determine the level of the fluid within that chamber. The use of an automotive pump such as THIS (www.toolsource.com/ost/product.asp?sourceid=NO+SOURCE&dept%5Fid=500&pf%5Fid=90075&mscssid=DFXE74DHBD1B8G73AB42VG3QN7BT3SC6) just might be the ticket.

Cacia
December 16th, 2006, 07:49 PM
hot dog. Thanks netdoc.

Those horizontal holes seem like a bad design for something sitting in the water.

cool_hardware52
December 16th, 2006, 07:51 PM
hot dog. Thanks netdoc.

Depending on the fluid in question, it's sometimes sold in a bottle that's similar to a catsup squeeze bottle. If it isn't you can transfer some to a clean, dry squeeze bottle. Nice thing about this is they are cheap, and there's nothing to clean up or store, just throw it away when done. You can usually "roll up" the bottle like big tube of toothpaste.

That's way I buy 90 weight if I need to fill a differential.


Tobin

Cacia
December 16th, 2006, 07:58 PM
yes, it came in a toothpaste looking big tube but the tip point still doesn't seal to the resevoir opening and I think I am supposed to add some and then run the engine up and down to get any air out and then add more.

The mechanic told me I should pull the boat out, but that would cost a lot since we don't have a trailor. If I can get a seal, then the spilling won't happen maybe. I'll get somebody to hold a rag under it. That thing Pete posted might be found at west marine or an auto store. I was picturing an IV bag or something.. I do need to seal though.

mrjimboalaska
December 16th, 2006, 07:58 PM
Catherine,
Are you sure it is the trim fluid level OR the leg oil that is low?
Regular ATF (automatic transmission fluid) for the trim should work.
But if its the leg oil itself, I'd recommend synthetic gear oil.
BE SURE before adding anything.....
and the pump that Netdoc linked will do the job. I have sevral and they screw on to a quart jug, West Marine should have what you need.

Cacia
December 16th, 2006, 08:06 PM
oh, okay. Well, it's not the hydraulic motor. It's the transmission fluid that goes in the trim/lift system that lifts the marine outboard keg out of the water. I think. I will check. He told me which hole it goes in...

Isn't the leg oil for the lower end unit? the prop? The boat runs great, I just can't lift one of the engines out electrically. A couple guys have to lift it

cobaltblue
December 16th, 2006, 09:18 PM
Got pictures? Alot of the engine or drive trim/tilt mechinisms and where the fluid is are located in the boat.

cool_hardware52
December 16th, 2006, 09:55 PM
oh, okay. Well, it's not the hydraulic motor. It's the transmission fluid that goes in the trim/lift system that lifts the marine outboard keg out of the water. I think. I will check. He told me which hole it goes in...

Isn't the leg oil for the lower end unit? the prop? The boat runs great, I just can't lift one of the engines out electrically. A couple guys have to lift it


Are you sure it's low fluid that's the only problem? Hydraulic fluid is not consumed, if the fluid is low you have leak. What actuates the trim pump? Is it electric? If so do you hear the pump running, but nothing moves? Could be valves. If you have an electric pump and you don't hear it running, could be swtiches, wiring, etc.

If the fluid level is good, and the pump is running, might be valving.

Low fluid would normally start to evidence it's self by moving the motor, but not all the way out of the water.

Good luck,


Tobin

Chuck Tribolet
December 16th, 2006, 10:30 PM
What make, HP, and year is the motor?

Wildcard
December 16th, 2006, 11:43 PM
oh, okay. Well, it's not the hydraulic motor. It's the transmission fluid that goes in the trim/lift system that lifts the marine outboard keg out of the water. I think. I will check. He told me which hole it goes in...

Isn't the leg oil for the lower end unit? the prop? The boat runs great, I just can't lift one of the engines out electrically. A couple guys have to lift it
Is THAT why you always have all the young hardbodies on your boat?;)
If you seal it, it can't vent to allow fluid in. Just get the small funnel with a flexable hose like I told you and add a little at a time. keep a couple of paper towels under it while pouring.
2002 Honda 90s

Cacia
December 17th, 2006, 12:10 AM
What make, HP, and year is the motor?

They are twin Honda 90's, Chuck. I bought the service manual, I'm trying.

Yea, WC, there is something to be said for that.


Low fluid would normally start to evidence it's self by moving the motor, but not all the way out of the water.



It did that for awhile.. He said put fluid in it and then if it leaks out (he said it might be super slow) then we might need to rebuild it when we haul out next month to do bottom paint.


Got pictures? Alot of the engine or drive trim/tilt mechinisms and where the fluid is are located in the boat.

yes, there is something on the steering column too.

Wildcard
December 17th, 2006, 12:51 AM
This is an electricaly operated self contained trim/tilss unit. The fluid is added in the fill hole which she knows where it's at. Nothing special or tricky here..
Did you get a new cap? Id order two if not cuz they will get droped again.

Cacia
December 17th, 2006, 01:31 AM
I ordered two caps and two of those discs that go on the bonnet where we do the fresh water flush. 68 buckeroos.

I need a new parts source. Windward boats is....high.

Wildcard
December 17th, 2006, 01:46 AM
Try the next dock over at night, much cheaper!
Keep telling you, Ebay.

Bill51
December 17th, 2006, 03:04 AM
The trim tab reservoir on my boat was a bear to get at to top off as are the brake cylinders on some airplanes I deal with. I found the same solution for both of them. I get cheap ketchup bottles at the store and a couple feet of different size surgical tubing to keep handy. Pick a tubing that will fit in the fill hole but not completely plug it (need a vent for the air) and slide the tubing over the nozzle of the squeeze bottle and you’re all set for mess free, drip free top offs.

I’ve had trim pumps and marine power steering systems go for 6 months to a year with no drop in level and suddenly they’re low and after I top them off and they never drop again. Many times it’s caused by air that has gotten trapped somewhere in the system and not completely purged when the system was open and for some reason the bubble finally gets moved out. Surprisingly all at once the system works much better than new because it no longer has the air in it.

WarmWaterDiver
December 17th, 2006, 03:33 AM
Catherine,

My mom would often complain at my dad for taking her turkey baster when it wasn't holiday season to top off car manual transmission levels, which also use a horizontal hole, and failing to mention it was now in the garage and she'd need to buy a new one when she was ready to make a holiday meal again. Just one suggestion.

herman
December 17th, 2006, 10:28 AM
This is the pump you need. It is made specifically to do the job and screws directly on to a quart oil container. Here is a link to West Marine but I have seen it in a lot of places including Walmart. I see it has an adapter for Honda engines as well.
http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/SiteSearchView?catalogId=10001&Ntx=mode%2Bmatchallpartial&keyword=lower+unit+quart+pump&Ntt=lower+unit+quart+pump&N=0&y=16&x=18&storeId=10001&Ntk=All_2&ddkey=SiteSearch

Donnie1442000
December 18th, 2006, 01:11 PM
Catherine I ran a pair of 90’s off the back of my boat and in my honest opinion I wouldn’t spend the money on the pump just because like someone else said it will be a very rear occasion you will need to add oil to your trim tilt unless it’s leaking. That and being you are running outboards the power trim tilt is about the only thing that is hard to get at. The ketchup bottle works awesome and is cheap to replace when someone miss places it. They have the hole in sideways to prevent over filling and ease of checking fluid level. (no dip stick)
Here is a link to a supplier in Seattle. These guys are reasonable at least as boating supplies go and if you need help there is usually someone on staff that knows what they are talking about and can help.
http://www.fisheriessupply.com/online/

Donnie

Cacia
December 18th, 2006, 02:48 PM
great sources, thanks.

Herman, if that actually screws on, that would be perfect.

Surprised the mechanic did not know about these. he told me I would need to haul out. Honda 90 issues, you'd think would be straight forward. We don't have enough mechanics here, it's a labor issue.

herman
December 18th, 2006, 03:22 PM
Not sure if it will screw in the TT pump because it's intended for the lower unit oil. In any case you, need one to service the lower unit and you can easily remove and replace the screw on piece. It's press fit on the plastic tubing. You can also remove the tubing and add a lot longer section if you need to.

Wildcard
December 18th, 2006, 03:27 PM
Plenty mechanics just not enough that are honest. JUST SQUIRT THE STUFF IN!

Cacia
December 18th, 2006, 03:47 PM
JUST SQUIRT THE STUFF IN!


It will spill in the water if I don't have a seal at the mouth. Trust me, I tried.

Do you really think I would be here looking at all these links if I could just shoot it in?

GEEZ. Not like you are here to hold the rag. Bully.

mrjimboalaska
December 18th, 2006, 04:03 PM
a teaspoon is not going to kill anything, IF you do spill any. Those pumps you get at West Marine will have a hose and fitting that will insert into the fill hole.........it wont screw down( thus no back pressure ) but will fit into the hole so you should really have no leaking go on.......

cool_hardware52
December 18th, 2006, 04:19 PM
It will spill in the water if I don't have a seal at the mouth. Trust me, I tried.

Where do you think the fluid that leaked out went?


Do you really think I would be here looking at all these links if I could just shoot it in?

Squeeze it in, squeeze it


GEEZ. Not like you are here to hold the rag. Bully.

If a little spill is your concern take trash bag and wiggle it up over the prop / lower end, now you have a way to contain any sheen. Mop it out. Take a little spray bottle of simple green along. If you do something ugly spray some on the "slick"

Good luck,


Tobin

WarmWaterDiver
December 18th, 2006, 11:33 PM
Mosquito control used to be performed by atomizing diesel fuel in the swamps. A monomolecular layer is all that's required. I don't believe this method is still in use.

Wildcard
December 19th, 2006, 12:49 AM
Oil from transformers used to be used to control dust on playgrounds. Nice clear clean oil, cept of course for the PCBs. Life was much easer when we had no enviroment.

Bill51
December 19th, 2006, 02:48 AM
I always keep one of these aboard to cover the fuel vents while fueling, and I’ve found that one can creatively attach them to places other than the hull side and work down through the open cap to capture any possible spills.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/producte/10001/-1/10001/25838/0/0/fuel%20spills/All_2/mode+matchallpartial/0/0

You can also cut up a small oil absorber sheet and tape it below the fill hole to catch any possible spills.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/producte/10001/-1/10001/91572/0/0/oil%20absorb/All_2/mode+matchallpartial/0/0

You DON’T want something that attaches to the reservoir airtight and then pumps fluid or you’ll risk creating enough backpressure to mess up the check valves on the hydraulic pump. Plus, you’ll have a fun time unscrewing it with the reservoir slightly pressurized – and it just may pop out spewing more fluid than you could possibly spill.

Tortuga James
December 21st, 2006, 05:40 PM
here is what you do. Take the tube off of the pump designed for lower unit oil. It screws in perfectly to the port in the tilt pump after you remove the screw. It is the same size as the ones on your lower unit. Replace the pump with a funnel. Pour in the fluid until it stops going in. Then begin to raise and lower the engine to purge any air from the system. At first, it will pull the fluid, and then you will see the air coming out. Start putting in less and less as it begins to fill to capacity. I keep raising the engine up and down until no more bubbles come out. It takes 2 people, one to hold the funnel and one to tilt the engine up and down.

Pour the remaining fluid out of the funnel before unscrewing the hose. Otherwise, you will make a mess. Don't ask how I know.

NEWENGLANDCHARTERS
December 27th, 2006, 10:20 AM
DO NOT USE Transmission FLUID! It will eat the "O" rings and you will be rebuiling the entire Trim/Tilt unit.

Use ONLY Hydraulic oil. It must be fresh from a airtight sealed can as the fluid is hydroscopic. ( That means it asorbs water) since the system is Sealed there should be no leakage. But most leak just a tad. maybe 1-2 cc per year. Caused mostly by temature variations and "O"ring seepage.

The best Hydraulic oil can be bought at your local airport from the Airplane Mechanics FBO. Jets use it and you can too! It is expensive. About $25 per Gallon. Still Local Automotive shops have General purpose Hyd Oil for about half that price.

There is a bleeder/vent hole on your Hyd. Resivoir. Differ places for difverent units. Find it. open it and then make a little pipe fitting with some Tygon tubing and brass fittings and a funnel available at your local hardware store. Screw the brass fitting into the fill hole and pour the fluid into the funel slowly. Raise the Hyd Ram to fully extended position. You will see air bubbles rising in the clear tubing. Do not underfill and do not overfill. when the bubbles stop, close the vent. remove your filler hose and screw in the plug.

Done.

The LOwer Gear Unit has two holes also. Fill this with 80-90 wieht Gear Oil. Remove both plugs. Drain the old oil and fill from the bottom up with the squeeze bottle or a pump. When the new oil come out of the upper hole. Plug it, remove the pump and plug the bottom hole quickly.

This should be done with the boat out of water as you will make a mess. Unless someone can design an underwater oil change rig????

NEWENGLANDCHARTERS@maine.rr.com


http://home.maine.rr.com/newengland/

Tortuga James
December 28th, 2006, 12:33 PM
DO NOT USE Transmission FLUID! It will eat the "O" rings and you will be rebuiling the entire Trim/Tilt unit.





There is a bleeder/vent hole on your Hyd. Resivoir. Differ places for difverent units. Find it. open it and then make a little pipe fitting with some Tygon tubing and brass fittings and a funnel available at your local hardware store. Screw the brass fitting into the fill hole and pour the fluid into the funel slowly. Raise the Hyd Ram to fully extended position. You will see air bubbles rising in the clear tubing. Do not underfill and do not overfill. when the bubbles stop, close the vent. remove your filler hose and screw in the plug.

Done.

The LOwer Gear Unit has two holes also. Fill this with 80-90 wieht Gear Oil. Remove both plugs. Drain the old oil and fill from the bottom up with the squeeze bottle or a pump. When the new oil come out of the upper hole. Plug it, remove the pump and plug the bottom hole quickly.

This should be done with the boat out of water as you will make a mess. Unless someone can design an underwater oil change rig????

NEWENGLANDCHARTERS@maine.rr.com


http://home.maine.rr.com/newengland/

On my engine, the port on the hydraulic resevoir is the same size as on the drain ports on the lower unit. The nylon fitting on the end of the tube on one of those cheap pumps you can buy at K Mart for lower unit oil is the same. Just pull the tube off the pump and add a funnel. Or you could make it easily with brass fittings like NEWENGLANDCHARTERS suggests.

cool_hardware52
December 28th, 2006, 01:31 PM
DO NOT USE Transmission FLUID! It will eat the "O" rings and you will be rebuiling the entire Trim/Tilt unit.

Use ONLY Hydraulic oil. It must be fresh from a airtight sealed can as the fluid is hydroscopic. ( That means it asorbs water) since the system is Sealed there should be no leakage. But most leak just a tad. maybe 1-2 cc per year. Caused mostly by temature variations and "O"ring seepage.


Use what the Honda Owners Manual recommends.


The best Hydraulic oil can be bought at your local airport from the Airplane Mechanics FBO. Jets use it and you can too! It is expensive. About $25 per Gallon. Still Local Automotive shops have General purpose Hyd Oil for about half that price.

Use what the Honda Owners Manual recommends. There are a variety of fluids used in aircraft hydrualics. Some are pretty unpleasent. It's never a good idea to mix unknown fluid combo's in hydrualic system. Also do everything you can to keep the fluid clean, wipe down the area around the fill hole, etc. Contaminates are really hard on hydrulaic pumps, valves etc.

Tobin

Wildcard
December 28th, 2006, 01:33 PM
DO NOT USE Transmission FLUID! It will eat the "O" rings and you will be rebuiling the entire Trim/Tilt unit.

Use ONLY Hydraulic oil. It must be fresh from a airtight sealed can as the fluid is hydroscopic. ( That means it asorbs water) since the system is Sealed there should be no leakage. But most leak just a tad. maybe 1-2 cc per year. Caused mostly by temature variations and "O"ring seepage.

The best Hydraulic oil can be bought at your local airport from the Airplane Mechanics FBO. Jets use it and you can too! It is expensive. About $25 per Gallon. Still Local Automotive shops have General purpose Hyd Oil for about half that price.

There is a bleeder/vent hole on your Hyd. Resivoir. Differ places for difverent units. Find it. open it and then make a little pipe fitting with some Tygon tubing and brass fittings and a funnel available at your local hardware store. Screw the brass fitting into the fill hole and pour the fluid into the funel slowly. Raise the Hyd Ram to fully extended position. You will see air bubbles rising in the clear tubing. Do not underfill and do not overfill. when the bubbles stop, close the vent. remove your filler hose and screw in the plug.

Done.

The LOwer Gear Unit has two holes also. Fill this with 80-90 wieht Gear Oil. Remove both plugs. Drain the old oil and fill from the bottom up with the squeeze bottle or a pump. When the new oil come out of the upper hole. Plug it, remove the pump and plug the bottom hole quickly.

This should be done with the boat out of water as you will make a mess. Unless someone can design an underwater oil change rig????

NEWENGLANDCHARTERS@maine.rr.com


http://home.maine.rr.com/newengland/
Oil is NOT hygroscopic. Oil/water, polar/nonpolar? Any of this ringing a bell from high school chem?
My god, she just wantedto know how to squirt some oil in a hole. Aircraft oil, great idea there.:shakehead

cool_hardware52
December 28th, 2006, 01:46 PM
Oil is NOT hygroscopic.

I think somebody is confusing oil with brake fluid. Some Brake fluids are Hydroscopic, but you are correct oil is not.


Tobin

herman
December 28th, 2006, 08:18 PM
DO NOT USE Transmission FLUID! It will eat the "O" rings and you will be rebuiling the entire Trim/Tilt unit.

Use ONLY Hydraulic oil. ..............................


What the proper fluid is depends on the manufacturer. Automatic trans fluid IS a fluid that is commonly used in trim and tilt units. Johnson/Evinrude recommends GM Dextron II automatic transmission fluid, per the official J/E service manual. Use what Honda recommends which may well be ATF fluid.


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