Ear infection ... update

[shark_tamer]

Hi everyone,

I am doing a follow up on my original thread dated July 30th, about my reoccuring ear infection problem ...

To DocVikingo, tracydr, Hank49, DandyDon and everybody who suggested from Ear Beer, to PramOtic Ear Drops and Auro-Dry as a preventive solution, here's my update.

I went to my local drugstore to get one of the items you suggested.

I found the item Auro-Dry and started to read the indications on the label, and I understood that this medication is mostly to clean the ear canal of excess wax, and relieve ear pain. Not a preventive item !!!

I did not find the item named ParmOtic Ear Drops on the shelf, so I enquired to the pharmacist. He did not know that particular brand .... could not be available in Canada ???

I explained my problem to him about getting something to prevent future ear infections, and he suggested the item named buro-sol .

It contains 0,5% aluminium acetate, 0,03% benzethonium chloride, and is alcohol free.

Is is made by a canadian company name Stiefel Canada Inc, based here in Montréal. Here's the link for that company's product ..Dermatology products: Stiefel Canada (http://www.stiefel.ca/en/our_products/index.html)

I haven't tested the product so far, but I am leaving for the Carribean on October 20th for a 1 week dive vacation and I am bringing with me the buro-sol and an ear pump. I will use the drops before diving and clean my ears with fresh water after diving.

When I get back, I will let you know if this product prevented possible ear infection, and will hopefully have nice pictures to show you all ....

[DandyDon]

I found the item Auro-Dry and started to read the indications on the label, and I understood that this medication is mostly to clean the ear canal of excess wax, and relieve ear pain. Not a preventive item !!!
I'm confused. Could be a different product by that name up there, but it's an ear drying product as the name suggests. I don't think it'd help with excess wax?

I have no idea about the product you're taking? The homemade solution of vinegar, alcohol and sterile water costs pennies for a months supply and works so well, I'll stick to it, but let us know how you do.

[FunkyDiver]

I agree with DandyDon on the home made remedy. When I started diving last year, I was getting ear infections just about every time I dove (except in the pools). I read many of the threads on SB and decided to try the 50/50 mix of alcohol and white vinegar. As long as I use the solution within a few hours of being finished diving for the day (minimum of 5 minutes per ear), I no longer get the infections. I did recently start adding a little glycerin to the mix, because I thought the mix was drying my ears too much. This has also helped my ears to get back to normal right away.

[shark_tamer]

I'm confused. Could be a different product by that name up there, but it's an ear drying product as the name suggests. I don't think it'd help with excess wax?

I have no idea about the product you're taking? The homemade solution of vinegar, alcohol and sterile water costs pennies for a months supply and works so well, I'll stick to it, but let us know how you do.

Hey DandyDon,

Maybe I read the label too fast !!! Did a search on the product ... here's what I found.

**********************************************

Auro-Dri Ear Water-Drying Aid - 1oz - Eye & Ear care (http://www.medshopexpress.com/128160.html)

TITLE: Auro-Dri Ear Water-Drying Aid - 1oz

Dries and relieves water-clogged ears due to swimming, diving, surfing, showering. Water-clogged ears can occur when water remains in the ear following swimming, diving, surfing, or showering. Auro-Dri is recommended to dry up excess water and make the user more comfortable.

Please see Manufacturer's Directions for Use Instructions *

Helps relieve the discomfort of water-clogged ears by drying excess water.

***********************************************

On the box of the product I bought, it is written ( and I quote )


" Prevents swimmer's ear "

What do the others think ??

[DandyDon]

Yeah, I started with that, contains Isopropyl Alcohol, 95% Anhydrous Glycerin. Now I refill the same bottles myself, as that mix lacks the vinegar. Don't know why you thot it was for ear wax? You can make it yourself with alcohol and glycerin, but I like vinegar, too.

[spectrum]

Be sure to read the instructions. When the Navy resolved the ear infection problem they discovered it was imperative that you lay on a side, flood the ear and let it stand for a full 5 minutes. Roll over and repeat.

Just squirting a drop in each ear is probably just a feel good exercise.

What I have learned and what has worked for me. (http://home.gwi.net/~spectrum/scuba_ears.html)

Pete

[jupitermermaid]

Another solution you might want to try is the Pro Ear 2000 mask. I always got ear infections after being in the water (even after just swimming laps). I used the homemade solution before and after every dive and found it beneficial, but if I was doing a lot of diving, it dried my ears out too much. I found that with the Pro Ear 2000 I not only have to not use anything to put in my ears, but I can equalize a lot easier, and I have no mask "squeeze" issues since I can control the amount of air I put into the mask. You can find this mask on the internet for all kinds of prices from $48.88 -up to $69.00. Same mask, so shop around and bargain.

Good luck. I know I enjoy diving a lot more these days :-)

[DocVikingo]

Hi spectrum,

The article you posted, "Caring for Your Ears," has few problems. For example:

1. "Swimmers ear is a bacterial growth in the outer ear."

About 10% of cases are fungal, not bacterial in nature. On rare occasion, such infections can even be caused by microorganisms which are neither.

2. "Swimmers ear was a huge problem for Navy divers taking many out of service at a time. They began to use Otic Domeboro with good results. Otic Domeboro happens to be a prescription item so it's a bit of a hassle."

This was somewhat expensive prescription preparation that the U.S. Navy used to recommend for its divers. However, the Bayer Corporation, the original manufacturer, ceased production of Otic Domeboro in December 2000.

Diver's with concerns about swimmer's ear are referred to DAN's "Alert Diver" magazine's latest article on the topic:

Preventing Swimmer's Ear
Doc Vikingo's Preventing Swimmer's Ear (http://www.awoosh.com/DocVikingo/Preventing_Swimmers_Ear.htm)

You are quite correct about the "5 minute rule" and thanks for the reminder.

Regards,

DocVikingo

[DocVikingo]

Hi shark-tamer,

DandyDon is quite correct. Auro-Dri and similar products are designed to dry the external auditory canal, not remove excess ear wax.

These are quite different than products designed to remove ear wax, which include Debrox (GlaxoSmithKline - Debrox® (http://www.debrox.com/)) and Murine EAR Carbamide Peroxide Ear Wax Removal Aid (Amazon.com: Murine EAR Carbamide Peroxide Ear Wax Removal Aid, Drops, 0.5 fl oz (15 ml) (Pack of 4): Health & Personal Care (http://www.amazon.com/Murine-Carbamide-Peroxide-Removal-Drops/dp/B000HMBC6C)).

BTW, "ParmOtic Ear Drops" is correctly spelled as "PramOtic Ear Drops" (Hawthorn Pharmaceuticals - PramOtic Drops (http://www.hawthornrx.com/pramotic/)). It is a different product than either ear drying or ear wax removing solutions. It is designed to treat already existing bacterial and fungal infections of the ear and contains both an antibiotic and a topical anesthetic to reduce itching and pain.

The product you intend to use, BURO-SOL Otic Solution (Dermatology products: Stiefel Canada (http://www.stiefel.ca/en/our_products/index.html)), is designed to prevent swimmer's ear and treat otitis externa (swimmer's ear). It seems likely that used as directed it can be of help with recurring outer ear infections associated with scuba.

Helpful?

This is educational only and does not constitute or imply a doctor-patient relationship. It is not medical advice to you or any other individual and should not be construed as such.

Regards,

DocVikingo

[spectrum]

DocVikingo,

Thanks for clarification on those details. They are reflected in an update made a moment ago.

Pete

[DandyDon]

Thanks DrV! Always good to have your info on these matters.

For 10c a week, I think I'll keep using the vinegar & alcohol that seems to work so well, I carry a small bottle in my mask box to use a bit after every dive, then another bottle in my room for the end of the dive day treatment, altho adding a bit of glycerin as FunkyDiver suggested is probly a good idea. I produce so much ear wax, maybe that's why I never felt that need.

I've never seen anyone diving the Swimming Ear Protection Diving Masks ProEar 2000 (http://www.proear2000.com/) How many dives have you made with yours, JMermaid?

[Mitchell]

I use this stuff all the time. It has been rerelease as a Bausch and Laumb product. The Dr. can cross reference the product. I pay $10 every 3 months for a new bottle. Works great.

[DandyDon]

I use this stuff all the time. It has been rerelease as a Bausch and Laumb product. The Dr. can cross reference the product. I pay $10 every 3 months for a new bottle. Works great.
Which? We've discussed several...??

[shark_tamer]

Hi shark-tamer,

The product you intend to use, BURO-SOL Otic Solution (Dermatology products: Stiefel Canada (http://www.stiefel.ca/en/our_products/index.html)), is designed to prevent swimmer's ear and treat otitis externa (swimmer's ear). It seems likely that used as directed it can be of help with recurring outer ear infections associated with scuba.

DocVikingo

Hi DocVikingo,

Exactly what I was looking for ... a product that will prevent my reccuring ear infections

Regards,

[DocVikingo]

October 5th, 2007 10:12 AM: "I use this stuff all the time. It has been rerelease as a Bausch and Laumb (sic; Bausch & Lomb) product. The Dr. can cross reference the product. I pay $10 every 3 months for a new bottle. Works great. Mitchell."

October 5th, 2007 10:14 AM: "Which? We've discussed several...?? DandyDon."


The cross-reference has been mentioned in various of my board posts on ear issues and is cited in the recent DAN Alert Diver article on swimmer's ear I linked earlier in this thread. It is Bausch & Lomb Pharmaceuticals NDC 24208-615-77.

Regards,

DocVikingo

[jupitermermaid]

Thanks DrV! Always good to have your info on these matters.

For 10c a week, I think I'll keep using the vinegar & alcohol that seems to work so well, I carry a small bottle in my mask box to use a bit after every dive, then another bottle in my room for the end of the dive day treatment, altho adding a bit of glycerin as FunkyDiver suggested is probly a good idea. I produce so much ear wax, maybe that's why I never felt that need.

I've never seen anyone diving the Swimming Ear Protection Diving Masks ProEar 2000 (http://www.proear2000.com/) How many dives have you made with yours, JMermaid?

Today was my 12th dive using the Pro Ear, and my ears feel great! I had some water get in them once (didn't get all the hair out of the way) and was able to flush it by breathing through my nose. I love it and can't imagine using any other kind of mask with the confidence I have in this one. It keeps my ears dry, bacteria out, and it's cool to be able to hear underwater.

[SparticleBrane]

I'm betting that better ear-clearing technique would trump having to use a mask to keep your ears dry...

[jupitermermaid]

I've gone the alcohol/vinegar route, and it dried my ears out too much (and burns like hell when you have an infection that hasn't notified you via any pain yet). My ENT advised me not to put anything in my ears that he hasn't prescribed because he's sent three children to college already due to people trying to cure their own ear problems. I would rather use a $49.00 mask that keeps my ears dry and healthy than not being able to dive because of recurrent infections. It's not just keeping the ears dry that's at stake.....it's keeping bacteria out that makes a home in my attractive ears that's the problem, and which the mask provides protection (a prophylactic, if you will). I'm happy with my mask and have no intention of messing with mixtures that have not benefited me in the past. I'm glad they work for the majority of people and would in no way try to talk them out of using it.......they just don't work for me.

[DandyDon]

Right on, jupitermermaid - whatever works best for you, especially following physician instructions - usually anyway, or find a doc your trust. I have a few who shouldn't be practicing, whom I replaced, but the majority are good. ;)

[Charlie99]

It's not just keeping the ears dry that's at stake.....it's keeping bacteria out that makes a home in my attractive ears that's the problem, .......I'm glad the pro-ear mask is working for you. Contrary to SparticleBrane's snide comments, better equalization techniques don't help to keep water out of the outer ear.

I just want to point out to both you and others that are reading this thread that more likely than not, the bacteria are already in your ear canal.

While you might be getting bacteria into your ear with the water, the more normal problem is that having a wet ear makes for a more hospitable environment for the bacteria that is already there ---- in other words, even if you were diving in pure distilled water it would probably cause problems for you.

[jupitermermaid]

While you might be getting bacteria into your ear with the water, the more normal problem is that having a wet ear makes for a more hospitable environment for the bacteria that is already there ---- in other words, even if you were diving in pure distilled water it would probably cause problems for you.

Well said, Charlie. Why invite the varmites for a feast when measures can be taken to ensure the environment doesn't create a party atmosphere for them? If the bacteria is already there but they're behaving themselves, I can co-exist peacefully with them, but not when they "act up" at my comfort's sake. And you're right about any kind of water being a factor . Sometimes I used to get infections just from getting too much water in my ears after taking a long shower. It's dry ears for THIS woman! I'm just glad that not everybody has the same problems as some of us....otherwise there would be a lot less divers. It's good that people are coming up with ways to help the rest of us who are prone to problem ears able to join the "healthy ear" people under water!

[SparticleBrane]

I'm glad the pro-ear mask is working for you. Contrary to SparticleBrane's snide comments, better equalization techniques don't help to keep water out of the outer ear.
:rolleyes:

Here are a few good articles about ear solutions.
DAN Divers Alert Network : Can You Prevent Otitis Externa, or Swimmers Ear? (http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/medical/articles/article.asp?articleid=48)
DAN Divers Alert Network : More On Swimmers Ear (http://www.diversalertnetwork.org/medical/articles/article.asp?articleid=49)

My main concern with using the proear mask is that at some point, it's likely going to get kicked off your head (just like any other mask), including the ear cups -- resulting in wet ears. Apparently this is an issue with your ears since you say you can't use the alcohol/vinegar combination. Hence why I just posted links to a few DAN articles with recommendations for slightly different solutions.

[Jason B]

My ENT advised me not to put anything in my ears that he hasn't prescribed because he's sent three children to college already due to people trying to cure their own ear problems.

I bet he put those 3 kids through college through money made off office visits from those seeking a prescription.

[DocVikingo]

Hi SparticleBrane,

The DAN pieces you linked obviously are quite dated. They both mention Otic Domeboro, a somewhat expensive prescription preparation that the U.S. Navy used to recommend for its divers but which the Bayer Corporation, the manufacturer, permanently took of the market 7 years ago.

Diver's with concerns about swimmer's ear are referred to DAN's "Alert Diver" magazine's most recent article on the topic:

Preventing Swimmer's Ear
Doc Vikingo's Preventing Swimmer's Ear (http://www.awoosh.com/DocVikingo/Preventing_Swimmers_Ear.htm)

Regards,

DocVikingo

[SparticleBrane]

That's actually the article I was trying to find. Thanks!

[jupitermermaid]

Great article, Doc!!! I'm going on a live aboard in July, and I don't want anything to interrupt my diving. I want to get as many dives as I can get in while I'm on it without having to worry about ear problems. I love my Pro Ear mask (as you've probably ascertained....lol), but I'm well aware that nothing is foolproof. I also am wearing Doc's Proplugs for the times when my mask might get kicked off (as ParticleBrain....I mean SparticleBrane) mentioned. Since I have a problem with both dry ears and flaking and excessive moisture which leaves me prone to ear infections (can ears be bipolar? lol) I have Zolene HC ear drops for the dryness, which works well as long as I don't use it continuously for a long time, and my ENT gives me a script when I get the infections, which I haven't gotten since I started swimming and diving with the Ear Pro and have left it up to him to remove excess ear wax instead of trying homemade remedies. Is mineral oil a main ingredient in Zolene? It seems to have that feel to it.

If I have your permission, I'd like to print out your article and ask him about if it could work for me. I know the vinegar/alcohol burned my throat (not to mention my ears) when I used it on a regular basis when I was in Bonaire, and I don't care to experience that again. Do you think if I dive enough I'll grow gills and can get rid of the ears completely? That would make life so much easier for me.....lol. Besides, with my hearing loss, I hear better underwater.

Thanks for being such a valuable member to SB. I really appreciate you and all you do for the family here. <kiss, kiss>

[SparticleBrane]

I know the vinegar/alcohol burned my throat (not to mention my ears) when I used it on a regular basis when I was in Bonaire, and I don't care to experience that again.
Putting that solution into your ears and feeling the burning sensation down past your eustation tubes and into your throat would usually indicate a punctured tympanum.

[DandyDon]

I bet he put those 3 kids through college through money made off office visits from those seeking a prescription.

:lol:

Sometimes it seems that way, huh? Anyone with ear problems really should see a physician, tho - if not an ENT, and follow orders from one. Follow up needs are often handled over the phone; if not possible, then he really needs to examine first. I am one of the worst about self treating, but if OTC meds and DAN articles don't work, go for the doc!

Putting that solution into your ears and feeling the burning sensation down past your eustation tubes and into your throat would usually indicate a punctured tympanum.
It does sound like it. I can't imagine a 1/3 mix of alcohol burning a healthy ear, but again - if she is follow doc's orders, she's right. :crafty:

[pescador775]

Hey Dan, I've never had an ear infection but I remember back in the '50's when a dive shop owner named DeLucia (Balt, MD) complained of it. I had never heard of it but it sounded bad. Later that year, he was killed when a cascade bottle exploded. Based on what he said it is questionable which was worse. We'll never know. Anyway, all these comments got me to thinking. How about adding some antibiotic ointment, something which would mix with, and be added to, the alky/vinegar brew? If it worked it would possibly cost the drug companies a billion dollars which they normally make on $200 worth of prescription products- meanwhile, helping some divers.
Chuckles,
Pesky

[DandyDon]

Hey Dan, I've never had an ear infection but I remember back in the '50's when a dive shop owner named DeLucia (Balt, MD) complained of it. I had never heard of it but it sounded bad. Later that year, he was killed when a cascade bottle exploded. Based on what he said it is questionable which was worse. We'll never know. Anyway, all these comments got me to thinking. How about adding some antibiotic ointment, something which would mix with, and be added to, the alky/vinegar brew? If it worked it would possibly cost the drug companies a billion dollars which they normally make on $200 worth of prescription products- meanwhile, helping some divers.
Chuckles,
Pesky
Who's Dan?

I'm sure there are good reasons for having never heard of any sort of ear ointment, altho I don't know what they are exactly. I'm sticking with the Doc's brew - works great for pennies.

[gert7to3]

A brief comment to SparticleBrane about the Pro Ear mask. You are certainly correct in your observation that the mask could be dislodged resulting in a wet ear. However, the ear problems discussed in this thread are the result of repeated, prolonged exposure to water. Not a single incident of getting an ear wet.

This is also a good caution. If your eardrum is not intact, then the Pro Ear mask cannot guarantee protection.

[Diver Lori]

I've gone the alcohol/vinegar route, and it dried my ears out too much (and burns like hell when you have an infection that hasn't notified you via any pain yet). My ENT advised me not to put anything in my ears that he hasn't prescribed because he's sent three children to college already due to people trying to cure their own ear problems. I would rather use a $49.00 mask that keeps my ears dry and healthy than not being able to dive because of recurrent infections. It's not just keeping the ears dry that's at stake.....it's keeping bacteria out that makes a home in my attractive ears that's the problem, and which the mask provides protection (a prophylactic, if you will). I'm happy with my mask and have no intention of messing with mixtures that have not benefited me in the past. I'm glad they work for the majority of people and would in no way try to talk them out of using it.......they just don't work for me.

How does it work when wearing a hood? Have you tried? Luck? I'm thinking there would be a significant increase in water flow in the hood due to the gap.

[sytech]

I had an ear problem several months ago. Read my posts.

My ENT said to NEVER use alcohol because of it's drying effects. Bottom line: She said to use Domeboro-Otic (Burroughs solution) after diving each day. Haven't had any problems since.

Good luck,

Sy



How does it work when wearing a hood? Have you tried? Luck? I'm thinking there would be a significant increase in water flow in the hood due to the gap.

[Diver Lori]

I had an ear problem several months ago. Read my posts.

My ENT said to NEVER use alcohol because of it's drying effects. Bottom line: She said to use Domeboro-Otic (Burroughs solution) after diving each day. Haven't had any problems since.

Good luck,

Sy

I was asking how her mask worked with a hood, not the solution. I realize the solution is used after the dive.....been using it for years.

[jupitermermaid]

How does it work when wearing a hood? Have you tried? Luck? I'm thinking there would be a significant increase in water flow in the hood due to the gap.

I have a hood that has holes in the ear area that accommodate the mask. It's one I bought that was made specifically for this type of mask, but it can easily be made out of a regular hood just by cutting the holes.

You're right about the gap if the holes weren't there.

[gert7to3]

I bought the Pro Ear Mask hood and modified a regular hood. The Pro Ear Hood has two layers. An inner hood layer has holes over the ears. An outer layer goes over everything. The design struck me as complex and I haven't used it yet.

On the modified hood, I made the ear holes slightly smaller than the edges of the outer earcups. After donning the mask, I pull the hood's earhole edges over skirt of each earcup. It really seals off well against your head and will help hold the earcups in place if you get bumped. Remember the earcups act as insulators. In fact, you are equalizing the earcps with exhaled, warm air. This keeps your ears and the sides of your head warmer.

Only downside is you look really goofy with your ears sticking out of cutdown hood. You will attract the attention of your DM.

Happy New Year!

[Wayan]

I used to have lost of problems with ear infections but as soon as a friend put me on to DOC PROPLUGS I have not had a problem, Doc's Proplugs: The Doctor's Choice for Ear Protection (http://www.proplugs.com/scubadiving.shtml)

[DPP Santa Cruz]

Hi everyone;

It's true, Doc's proplugs helps prevent otitis, exostosis, and ruptured eardrums. In addition they also do help equalize more efficiently. That's pretty much the gist of it. I wanted to share these files with you that we just received from our people in Italy. I am too excited to speak/type right now, so I'll just post them...

vid: www.proplugs.com/media/plugsinaction.mpg
document: www.proplugs.com/media/SIMSICongress2006.doc

Cheers;

[Juha_Kristian]

Hi there,

I'm suffering from chronic otitis externa (http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/diving-medicine/412512-chronic-otitis-externa-persistent-ear-canal-infection.html) and I have to keep my ear canal dry at all times. Pro Ear (http://www.proear2000.com/) mask sounds just what I need. I have couple of general questions about Pro Ear mask.

I'm diving always with dry suit, because I live in cold Finland. Is it possible to dive with Pro Ear mask and dry suit? I'm using Pursuit X3 (http://www.ursuk.fi/en/diving/dry-suits/product/6/pursuit-x3/) with integrated hood.

117659

I have ordered Docs Proplugs (http://www.proplugs.com/scubadiving.shtml) too. Have you been diving with Proplugs and Pro Ear mask?

Thanks in advance.