What plate Ally, SS? How much Lift?

Hey all, im currently about to purchase a Halcyon Eclipse rig, first let me say that i am definate on this rig so i dont need info on other brands thanks anyway!

My questions are

1. Should i go stainless or Aluminium?
(what are the benifits of each and what are people using?

2. Should i go 30Lb or 40Lb?
(Is there a big size difference my LDS doesn't have both in stock currently and how much do i need?)

Ok a quick background on myself and plans to aid with advice
I currently dive a Seaquest balance and use 8kg (could prob use a little less) I'm making a transition to more tech oriented diving and will in the next couple months also get an Evolve wing and set up twins. I dive a 5mm Semi-dry but am also looking at a tri-lam drysuit (mainly for use with twins on cave diving and what not) Still the majority of diving will be done in wetsuit
Hopefuly with this info u guys ...and gals will be able to help me make a choice with your wealth of knowledge

Cheers in advance,
Bradley

frozenwarp:

Hey all, im currently about to purchase a Halcyon Eclipse rig, first let me say that i am definate on this rig so i dont need info on other brands thanks anyway!

My questions are

1. Should i go stainless or Aluminium?
(what are the benifits of each and what are people using?

2. Should i go 30Lb or 40Lb?
(Is there a big size difference my LDS doesn't have both in stock currently and how much do i need?)

Ok a quick background on myself and plans to aid with advice
I currently dive a Seaquest balance and use 8kg (could prob use a little less) I'm making a transition to more tech oriented diving and will in the next couple months also get an Evolve wing and set up twins. I dive a 5mm Semi-dry but am also looking at a tri-lam drysuit (mainly for use with twins on cave diving and what not) Still the majority of diving will be done in wetsuit
Hopefuly with this info u guys ...and gals will be able to help me make a choice with your wealth of knowledge

Cheers in advance,
Bradley

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Required wing lift is a function primarily of the buoyancy of your exposure suit. Without any information about what cylinder you are using it's hard to say how buoyant your current suit is.

Having said that it's very unlikely that you need a 40 lbs wing. Most "5mm" suits will be about 12-18 lbs positive. Your future drysuit will probably be more buoyant depending on the undrgarment, but damn few drysuit / undergarment combo's will be more than 30 lbs buoyant.

For singles with your 5mm suit you will need ~12-16 lbs of total ballast. If we assume your tank is -2 lbs empty (typical for many steel tanks) and your reg is -2 you will be 8 to 12 lbs short of the ballast you need. That makes the ballast provided by a SS plate an obvious choice.

Unless you anticipate using very negative tanks and thin exposure suits for doubles the SS plate should be appropriate for doubles also.

Tobin

Whoops I forgot to mention i dive 12 lt steel single and will dive 12Lt steel twins, I know that in my 5mm wetsuit with a SS BP, evolve 40Lb and twin steels i would say i'm atleast a couple kg overweighted (used a mates rig)

Thanks for the reply,
Look foward to hearing more,

Bradley

frozenwarp:

I know that in my 5mm wetsuit with a SS BP, evolve 40Lb and twin steels

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You may want to rethink double steels in a wetsuit.

Tobin

cool_hardware52:

You may want to rethink double steels in a wetsuit.

Tobin

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How about using smart steel tanks from Sea Hornet? They seem to have different buoyancy characteristics to the Faber's. Of course the Fabers are a lot cheaper.

http://www.seahornet.com/image/Cylinder-Chart.gif

Kudos to you Tobin.
I've only spoken to you once (when you helped me get all my gear figured out and ordered) and here you are in a thread where the OP has stated that in no way will he deviate from the blue H and you're still in there helping him to figure out what he needs. That's why I bought my gear from you and will send anyone who asks about gear your way. Your customer service and love of the sport is far above the call. The OP is very lucky he didn't have to wait for H to come along and help him figure it out.

Bryan

bryanmc57:

Kudos to you Tobin.
the OP has stated that in no way will he deviate from the blue H. The OP is very lucky he didn't have to wait for H to come along and help him figure it out.

Bryan

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I quickly clarify to my reasoning,
1. I'm located in Australia and not all Brands are readily availible (yes i know i can have shipped over but i'm not going to this time)

2. I'm doing DM work with mu LDS and he stock's Halcyon, he prefers i wear gear they sell but doesn't really force it

3. I have used Halcyon gear borrowed from my LDS and am very happy with

4. I am getting a fairly good deal from my LDS compared to what i'd pay for other brands here in Australia

So YES i really appreciate all help given and would under different circumstances would be looking at other Brands harder. but for this purchase the Blue H has me

thanks again to all who have replied


Oh and i do have Sea hornet steelies

frozenwarp:

Whoops I forgot to mention i dive 12 lt steel single and will dive 12Lt steel twins, I know that in my 5mm wetsuit with a SS BP, evolve 40Lb and twin steels i would say i'm atleast a couple kg overweighted (used a mates rig)

Thanks for the reply,
Look foward to hearing more,

Bradley

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In my 12lt twin SH steelies & my Cressi 7/5mm semi wet with a Transpack I start the dive overweighed a little with no ballast & if I breath the tanks down to 30 bar I'm about neutral. I figure diving wet I'd be overweighed in a SS BP.

In my DS (I'm new to it, so still trying things) I did a dive yesterday using a BP with an extra 6lb of lead on my hips. I had to fight a head down attitude all dive & on the second dive I became too buoyant at about the 45 bar mark to bother prolonging the dive. I'm hoping another 3lb on the hips will take care of both problems. If not, maybe I'll have to contact Tobin & discuss a lighter plate or something.

frozenwarp:

Oh and i do have Sea hornet steelies

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For single tank dives with a ~14 lbs positive suit and a cylinder that is ~+2 empty you would benefit from the ballast a SS plate provides.

Doubles

I'm not sure I understand the buoyancy numbers for the 12L SH steel tanks. If these bottles are "100 cuft" then one would expect ~8 lbs swing from full to empty, not the ~6.4 lbs listed.

If we assume the tanks are indeed +2 lbs empty then my quick and dirty estimate is your rig will be about -30 lbs with a SS plate and full tanks, and about -14 with empty tanks.

That means no weight belt, and it means with full tanks, compressed suit and failed wing you could be 30 lbs negative. :11::11:

With a lightweight plate the numbers are a little better. Your rig is now -26 lbs and you have ~4 lbs of weight belt. Full tanks, compressed suit, failed wing and dropped ballast leaves you ~26 lbs to swim up, and leaves you -12 at the surface. Dump your gas and you might be slightly positive at the surface :11:

What happens if you use al 80's and a lightweight plate? Your rig is now about -18 and you have about 8 lbs in a belt. With a compressed suit, failed wing and dropped ballast you have 18 lbs lbs to swim up, and you will be -4 lbs at the surface. Dump your gas and you are ~+8 at the surface.

Pick your poison, just understand the risks you are taking.

Makes that dry suit seem like a good idea to me.

Tobin

cool_hardware52:

Doubles

I'm not sure I understand the buoyancy numbers for the 12L SH steel tanks. If these bottles are "100 cuft" then one would expect ~8 lbs swing from full to empty, not the ~6.4 lbs listed.

Tobin

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I hadn't thought about the swing before. But no, the numbers don't seem to make sense.