Skin Ditch and Don

[twinkles]

Will I or won't I. I am not sure. I sure didn't come close today. Nothing else has been a problem, but I haven't figured out how to do this one. Going to try again tomorrow.

[mkutyna]

I found it was easier to break it up into parts. Start out without swimming away from your gear and just swimming down and putting it back on and doing the controlled ascent. Once you master that, move away a few feet and do it again. Keep moving away until you're 20 yds from your gear. What helped me the most was to make sure and take my time swimming to my gear. Trying to swim fast really eats up your air.

Let us know how you're doing.

[ClayJar]

Biggest tips: *Slow* *down*, and take a *smaller* breath.

If you take a large breath, you'll be struggling to get down, which will build up too much CO2 too quickly and make you abort. Same thing if you go too quickly.

For a complete breakdown with lots more info, look at "Need help please with NAUI skindiver ditch and recovery". That thread was very useful in explaining how to approach the skill. (Don't skim it; read it. :biggrin:)

[twinkles]

Thanks Clayjar. I am going to study it before I go back to the pool. I am wondering if there are exercises to build up breathhold tolerance. I was doing some little exercises, runnng back and forth and putting on my fins while holding my breath. At about 22 seconds be start to get very anxious to breath. Therein is my problem. I can remember as a kid being able to hold my breath for 60 seconds. (Fortunately I did complete the 25 yard swim, but it seemed line the end was more certain.) I am really beginning to fear that this might be my gate that I can't get through (and that is probably not helping any).

[keys girl]

I had the same fears. I never have been one to hold my breathe for very long. I always lost those contest. My best advise would be to relax.
Then make your plan as to how to attack this problem. Obviously the first thing you want to get is your air. After that it is easy. If your next worry is mask, go for that.
Let us know how it turns out.

[twinkles]

My last post was rather incoherent. Sorry about that.

[ClayJar]

Obviously the first thing you want to get is your air.Actually, your air is the last thing you go for, since in the skin ditch and recovery, your air is at the surface. :D

Anyway, if you can't hold your breath for a minute, there are breath-holding exercises you can use to improve that. It's all in being calm and relaxed (even in the face of having to go to and from the bottom).

If it takes you a bit longer than it takes some other people, that's nothing to worry about. Just keep at it. You don't have to do it the first time, and you'd be well-served to keep working at it until it's just another trivial skill (like mask clearing). It'll make you a better dive leader -- even if it's not as directly relevant, it's valuable nonetheless.

[twinkles]

Well I still didn't get the cigar. But I got closer. I probably tired a dozen or so times today. At least today, I got to the point I can get the gear off and on the bottom. And one time today I got the fins on, and the mask on, but not the snorkel in my mouth and the mask wasn't clear. But that was my best attempt.

Every other time something seemed to go wrong. My fins would float away, I put the mask on upside down...something. On my last attempt, I grabbed the mask by the snorkel and apparently yanked so hard the snorkle came out of its clasp--I had a snorkel and no mask.

Keys girl I think you were mixing this skill up with the SCUBA ditch and recovery, but I still appreciate you responding. Had no problem with SCUBA ditch and recovery. Did it first time and kept doing it until it was smooth. Secret to smooth seemed to be to ride the tank like a pony so that your unit wasn't floating around while you put on your mask, fins and weight belt.

In any event I am going to spend the week practicing breath hold exercises. I just did 53 seconds in a resting position.

ClayJar, I got glimpses of insight into your advice to stay calm and relaxed. Yesterday I couldn't even get my gear off on the first dive, much less back on on the second dive. Today I was able to take it all off and stack it with the fins upright, straps under fins, and didn't feel rushed. I just couldn't make that breakthrough on the second dive. I was always frantic to get everything on.

My buddy who is going through the course got it after a couple of trys. He said he just decided he was either going to do it or drown.

I think I have the weighting about down, which seems important, including a couple of ankle weights to help me get into a less energy intensive position.

Next Saturday I have to get it...this is my last watermanship skill.

[ClayJar]

Not much I could do to help me with the fins; I just had to get in the zone, so to speak. When it came to the mask and snorkel, I went back to my basic class (and to those with which I'd assisted) to remember a useful tidbit: You don't need a strap to clear a mask.

When I went back down, I put my fins on as calmly as I could. Then I *immediately* started swimming up diagonally toward the surface. As I started swimming up, I pressed the mask to my face and cleared it -- partially or completely didn't matter, just that I could see at that point was psychologically relaxing. Then as I continued to ascend, I pulled the strap over my head and stuck the snorkel in my mouth. Finally, I made sure my mask was clear as I leveled out at the surface and blew the snorkel clear.

I found that starting my ascent early worked quite nicely, and going diagonally gave me plenty of time on the ascent to get the mask clear and snorkel in place. I actually ended up slowing down and just cruising underwater just a bit before sliding onto the surface.

Anyway, just a couple tidbits which may or may not be relevant.

[JimLap]

When I did it for my instructor exam I found out jus thow much air you have when you need it. After getting the fins on I felt myself floating up and was so determined to complete the exercise I kicked BACK DOWN to be sure I had enough time to get the snorkel in and clear the mask. Even the examiner was impressed and said that it took balls to do that. I was worried about it as well so we decided to practice it. First couple times I had results similar to yours. Took it in stages and finally got it. But I have to say that once you do it, it is not that bad. Do it once and it's like a wall is broken down. You feel like a million bucks and your confidence goes up. And when it comes time to do it, you don't think about it, you just say ok and do it. And as clayjar said going diagonally helps alot. You need to keep moving in order to get it. Stop to do anything for more than a split second you'll float and clear too late or not clear at all. WHen we do the mask snorkel recovery with ow students it's what I tell them. Pick it up and put it on on the fly. Stop and you'll never get it.

[sphillips3]

I just went through this. As I am on the plus side of the half-century mark I was a bit worried but eventually managed to get it.

1) I built up my breath-holding tolerance by holding my breath and walking at a brisk pace. I did this at work walking between buildings. After a week of doing this a few times a day I was able to get to up over 1 minute without much problem.

2) There is a very big psychological component to this. Call it "zen" or meditation or whatever, you really have to mentally visualize success.

3) You should be able to swim the distance and put on the gear in about 15 seconds. Coupled with #1 (I *can* hold my breath for 1 minute while working) and #2 (I *will* do this) this gets a positive mental picture going.

4) In the YMCA program you get 30 seconds between the surface swim and then the underwater swim back to the gear. I used this time to really *really* relax and focus (more mental stuff) and did some really deep breaths to get the CO2 down (I've had a very brief static apnea training session and I used some of what I learned here)

5) Finally, just do it - yes - your brain is screaming at you to go up for air but you really can stay down for as much time as it takes.

I'm not particularly young or a great swimmer. I really believe that if you are healthy enough to pass the surface swimming skills test that you can do the underwater part too. My instructor-trainer kept telling me the same thing - you can do it - and he was right. I just want to pass along all the encouragement possible. Keep a positive attitude and you will get it done.

Jim is right - once you get this skill, you will feel like you can take on the world.

[twashowich]

This is twinkles buddy from the pool....My name is Todd

He is on the verge of getting it.....almost had it once but the snorkle was not in and mask was full.

The key for me to getting this done was WEIGHT! I took 5 pounds and sat on the bottom....thereby I did not exert energy by be a spaz underwater..I was CALM.

I also went SLOW and was confident, he is right by saying I would drown myself before coming up :) Heck everyone there is Rescue Certified and CPR trained, I would be in good hands :)

He has plenty of underwater breath time.....its the last bit that his brain is screaming BREATH and he must say No way, not till I get these dang fins on and clear this mask.....That's all I did....basically defy my brain.

[twinkles]

I have started practicing breath hold. While resting I got it up to a minute fifty seconds. But walking around the house and up and down stairs, I stalled at 47 seconds last night. I have five more days to practice breath hold. Then I think the key is going to be relaxing. And as Todd and SPhillips say, just staying down till it is done.

[twinkles]

Oh, and welcome to the board twashowich (http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/members/twashowich.html) a/k/a Todd

[twinkles]

For what it is worth, I am starting to feel confident I will complete the Skin ditch and don this weekend. I have been practicing breath holds while walking around. I am up to 70 seconds (each) for two breath holds back to back with a 5 breath recovery in between. I have been trying to walk around slowly to simulate the mild activity the exercise requires. I am confident that 70 seconds is enough to do each of the two phases of the exercise--the ditch followed by the recovery.

Mostly what I have learned from practicing breath holding is that I can keep holding my breath well beyond the point where I first start feeling like I really really have to breath. I was hoping that I could get to the point that the urge to breath didn't become urgent until at least a minute. I still want to breath after about 30 seconds, but now I know I can still go another 40 seconds more if I force myself. I beleive knowing that will be the key to success.

Moreover, I am going to borrow some spring straps and ankle weights which I think will make things easier.

[freediver]

Someone gave you a great tip above when they mentioned visualization. This may help: Go to the bottom of the pool and sit (or lie) there while you visualize doing this skill. Chances are you will visualize it at a rather quick pace. The key is, however, to perform every subsequent visualization at a slower rate. In other words, slow down the skill in your mind as you mentally rehearse it. This will direct your attention to relaxing and performing the skill while taking the focus off of the unpleasant feeling in your lungs.
By the way, a great way to induce relaxation in a rather quick way is through some alternate nostril breathing...very effective...look into it! Best of luck.

[twashowich]

I know you will do it.....just go slow and don't SPAZ under water :)

[twinkles]

Piece of cake. It didn't even seem hard. I can't remember even feeling like I needed air.

[twashowich]

Yeah!!!!!!

[ClayJar]

Piece of cake. It didn't even seem hard.Now, *that's* how to do it! :biggrin: Congrats.

[keys girl]

Congrats!!!! I am glad that you did so well.

[sphillips3]

Piece of cake. It didn't even seem hard. I can't remember even feeling like I needed air.

Good Job, Twinkles - congrats!