Ok folks, I am putting a back plate together, I bought my 2" webbing from AUL when I ordered my plate. After string the harness through the plate the concept is simple seems very sturdy. But now I have some questions?
I have some extra webbing for the crotch strap. Seems to me 2" webbing is a little wide for a crotch strap? Feedback welcomed.
Also, I understand to make a loop for the waist band to go through to secure the crotch strap to the harness. How is it secured to the backplate? Do I have it fitted and sewn in place so it is non adjustable? Do I run the webbing through and secure it by behind me under the back plate with a buckle?
SeaJay
March 15th, 2003, 11:57 PM
Freeze! Don't do anything until you read this!
I dove many backplates before buying one, and the crotchstrap issue was a big one to me. With very large thighs, I found 2" crotchstraps to stab and pinch, and be pretty uncomfortable. I found the 1" crotchstrap to work much better for me, but I still wasn't a fan. In fact, I almost didn't buy a BP/wings because I found that BP/wings weren't stable without them, and I simply wasn't a fan of them.
That's when I tried a Halcyon backplate and wings that was set up at Extreme Exposure (in effect, Halcyon's retail outlet). They used a 2" crotchstrap, but made it out of much softer and more pliable material than their standard 2" webbing. The 2" wide crotchstrap did a better job at loading any weight or pull across a wider area (making it more comfortable) without any undue stabbing or pinching.
...So when I ordered my stuff and built my backplate, I called Extreme Exposure and ordered a Halcyon crotchstrap. In my humble opinion, it's $35 very well spent.
Sure, I could have made one and used the same stiff 2" webbing that I used (for it's durability) for the rest of the rig... But why torture myself?
No doubt you will also appreciate the specialized material!
LUBOLD8431
March 16th, 2003, 12:26 AM
$35 for a CROTCH STRAP??? Please tell me you did not pay $35 for a piece of "soft webbing"???? I must be missing something here... Please tell me that there is something else there...
ANyways... sylvester: one inch webbing will be fine for most people. If you get one from dive rite, oms, or zeagle, or even someone else, the pieces that you get would be a piece of one inch webbing with a sewn loop in it with a scooter ring sewn into the loop, and then a little piece of plastic with two holes in it to pass the webbing through and hold it in place behind you (near backplate). Good Luck...
Uncle Pug
March 16th, 2003, 01:26 AM
I have one plate with a soft 2" crotch strap and one plate with stiffer 2" weight belting for the crotch strap. Neither are uncomfortable.
Make your loop using a D-ring and weightbelt keeper... use the same thing for attaching the strap to the plate and you have a butt ring and a scooter ring.
If you don't use a scooter then pass the loop through the D-ring when gearing up to keep it out of the way.
If you ever do use a scooter you will be glad you have 2" webbing... especially if you have a Gavin hooked to the crotch strap and set on 9. :D
SeaJay
March 16th, 2003, 01:51 AM
LUBOLD8431 once bubbled...
$35 for a CROTCH STRAP??? Please tell me you did not pay $35 for a piece of "soft webbing"???? I must be missing something here... Please tell me that there is something else there...
Well, it was a complete unit, with the rubber holders, the D-ring sewn in, and the rear D-ring and keeper and all...
But of course, that does not justify a $35 price tag either.
What DOES justify it is trying it on... Swimming with it. Soft 2" webbing is very difficult to find... I've not found it anywhere else. I was told by someone other than Halcyon that the stuff is available in like 500 yard spools only... Thus, it's not cost effective to purchase for distribution unless you're a large(ish) company up the street manufacturing these things yourself.
You'll be very interested to know that the crotch strap I bought was the last one on the shelf. I tried to buy two, for my other backplate, but they only had one available. When I had called to price it originally less than a week earlier, there were several in the shop. My point is that I'm not the only one who feels this way about a $35 piece of webbing.
For me, it was truly the difference between comfort or no comfort. Interestingly, even WITH the price of this crotchstrap, my rig STILL costs less than an upper-echelon jacket style BC, and will last many times longer... And do more as I grow into more technical forms of diving.
In all, I would have purchased this strap at twice the price. Had they had two of them, I would have. :D
Apparently, UP doesn't have the thigh problem that I do... Perhaps it's sensitive to body type. For me, though, I found a big enough difference to warrant the specialized crotch strap.
When I ordered this plate from Gary Hoadley, I specifically asked him about the soft webbing as a crotch strap. He told me that his crotch straps were made of "unstiffened" 2" webbing, much softer than the standard 2" webbing that he uses for the rest of his rigs. I was excited to find this.
However, when I got the plate, I was disappointed. It was true that he used an "unstiffened" material which appeared to be the same 2" webbing as what was on the rest of his rig, just not as thick. It still felt too stiff to me, though
The Halcyon stuff is super-soft and very nice. :D
Perhaps UP will sell you his if he doesn't care about it.
trymixdiver
March 16th, 2003, 02:02 AM
I agree $35 is rediculous but...
I actually got seatbelt webbing by mistake to reweb my harness. I got the correct stiffer webbing and used the seatbelt webbing for my crotch strap. I like it alot, i dont even know its there during a dive. Very comfortable as far as i am concerned!
Andy
And i managed to get the 2 in material throught the small 1" OMS plate slot. My Oragami skills paid off :)
Uncle Pug
March 16th, 2003, 02:02 AM
SeaJay once bubbled...
In all, I would have purchased this strap at twice the price. Had they had two of them, I would have. :D
I'll sell you as many as you want... nice~n~soft too....
And since seat belts come in all sorts of colors... and most auto wrecking yards are infested with 'em... I'll even let you pick your favorite color.
$4 worth of weight belt keepers/d-rings and $2 for the webbing... I can definitely sell them to you for $70.
BTW.... Seajay... I actually have a genuine Halcyon crotch strap in stock if you need another official one.
SeaJay
March 16th, 2003, 02:23 AM
I also bought two backup lights... You know, the Delrin ones that go on my chest... I bought a pair of those things for $89 each! I even bought a Halcyon DIR knife at $80, and get this... A Halcyon hard pocket for a whopping $80! Yes, that's for a pocket!
Do I have regrets? Absolutely not!
Look, you guys... I don't think that any person tried as many BC's as I did. I know what works. I know how serious I am abou this. I quit smoking for this, fer chrissakes. I changed my eating habits, man. This money is nothing by comparison of the other committments I've made to diving!
Here's the funny thing... Go ahead and laugh at how much this stuff costs... Guess what... It was still less than the "mainstream" BC I was looking at!
I can't wait to get it all wet. :)
Uncle Pug
March 16th, 2003, 02:35 AM
SeaJay once bubbled...
I even bought a Halcyon DIR knife at $80
This is what George thinks a DIR knife (http://www.wkpp.org/images/pina_equip/knife_sheath_knife_on_top_r.jpeg) looks like.
And this is what I think DIR knives (http://www.scubaboard.com/attachment.php?s=&postid=153826) look like.
SeaJay
March 16th, 2003, 02:41 AM
Jeez, man... I can't believe I'm giving up my pigsticker... Now you guys think that we should all go down to ground-down steak knives?
Don't you guys ever run into the occassional anchor line? I mean, when I find something like that, I go find that anchor and bring it up for the captain. They love us for it... But you've always got to cut the line off, and there's just no way you're cutting through a one-inch line with a half-inch blade...
Uncle Pug
March 16th, 2003, 02:50 AM
SeaJay once bubbled...
I go find that anchor and bring it up for the captain. They love us for it... But you've always got to cut the line off, and there's just no way you're cutting through a one-inch line with a half-inch blade...
I send the line up with a bag. Then pull the anchor from the boat. Course I'm the captain... so I don't get brownie points for it... my wife just sez, "We already have a garage full of anchors!"
SeaJay
March 16th, 2003, 03:40 AM
Not me, man.
I always use my BC as a lift bag.
No, wait... I just whip out my redundant bladder and use that as a lift bag.
No, wait... I just tuck it into the folds of my wing... You know... Behind the bungies.
Yes, I am kidding. :D
RichLockyer
March 16th, 2003, 03:53 AM
SeaJay once bubbled...
Don't you guys ever run into the occassional anchor line? I mean, when I find something like that, I go find that anchor and bring it up for the captain. They love us for it... But you've always got to cut the line off, and there's just no way you're cutting through a one-inch line with a half-inch blade...
You'd be surprised at what they can do.
Last May, my buddy and I found an anchor at a local site. I whipped out my "Squeeze Knife" and attempted to cut the line.
No go... I sawed for a while and made NO headway.
Okay... next time.
We returned last August, and it was still there.
This time, the squeeze knfie had been replaced by a genuine DIR knife, complete with the Betty Crocker Seal of DIR Approval on the package.
I sat my butt down on one rock, figuring it would be a while, and laid the rope over another rock for a solid backing.
One slice... cut through like butter. I could have held the line in one hand and cut through the loop.
sylvester
March 16th, 2003, 06:31 AM
That car seat belt webbing will suffice?
Hell I can cut some out of her car, dont even have to leave home to get what I need. :)
Cave Diver
March 16th, 2003, 09:51 AM
sylvester once bubbled...
That car seat belt webbing will suffice?
Hell I can cut some out of her car, dont even have to leave home to get what I need. :)
I dont see why it wouldnt work (unless of course your wife catches you cutting up her car and breaks your hand :D).
The purpose of the crotch strap is to limit the movement of the backplate from "lifting" away from your back. I would think that pretty much anything you were comfortable wearing pretty snug would work.
Re: 1" and 2" straps, I hafta agree with SJ on that one. I found the 2" much more comfortable. The 1" seemed to have a "cutting" effect like wearing floss <shudder>.
I haven't noticed a real issue between soft or hard webbing, except if there is a long walk to the water. In that case, the harder webbing seems to chaff a bit, but I solved that problem by just leaving the strap undone til I actually get down to the water.
sylvester
March 16th, 2003, 01:36 PM
Folks thanks for the help.
Doppler
March 17th, 2003, 04:33 PM
sylvester once bubbled...
Folks thanks for the help.
I did not help... but I will accept the thanks and just add a small reinforcement for previous advice... Halcyon uses 2-inch seat belt webbing for its crotch straps... available in the cave diving section of your local auto accessory store at a few cents per foot!
And it is not sewn but simply 'held together' using weight belt keeper/clip...
Take care
DD=-)
dmdalton
March 17th, 2003, 05:13 PM
Black 2" polypropolene webbing (soft as a baby's bottom) at your sewing and notions store at about $0.35 per foot, I've found to be a match for the $35 one. Halcyon's front loop is sewn but you may use small stainless steel bolt & nylock nut with small SS washer on either side of the d-ring weight retainer.
Here's a tip for you boys and girls, run the webbing through the slot in the bottom of the backplate and then up to the lower band bolt. Put a hole in the webbing, or several if you would like it to be adjustable. Slip the webbing over the bolt before putting the backplate on - no muss, no fuss, no slip!
As for knives/linecutters-
http://home.earthlink.net/~toddclagett/NovaTech/knifesheath.htm
Dave D (ILTMS)
Spectre
March 17th, 2003, 05:13 PM
SeaJay once bubbled...
Jeez, man... I can't believe I'm giving up my pigsticker... Now you guys think that we should all go down to ground-down steak knives?
SeaJay, what else'll you do with those old steak knives you don't need anymore? :)
dmdalton
March 17th, 2003, 05:15 PM
dmdalton once bubbled...
[B]Black 2" polypropolene webbing (soft as a baby's bottom) at your sewing and notions store at about $0.35 per foot, I've found to be a match for the $35 one. Halcyon's front loop is sewn but you may use small stainless steel bolt & nylock nut with small SS washer on either side of the d-ring weight retainer.
I forgot, the crotch strap can be seen on this site
What is the difference between the harness and the crotch strap webbing? How much stiffer is the harness webbing?
I was placing a fifthD order anyway, so I threw in the harness webbing. I couldn't bring myself to shell out the cash for the crotch strap, since I didn't need the hardware.
The reason I ask is the reason I'm changing my harness. The webbing on my current harness is just too stiff. Anyplace I left a D-ring for more than a couple minutes has a bend in the webbing. All the different adjustments I made to my buckle to get it right has caused the waist strap to have so many creases that it's a pain getting it through the buckle. I've been fearful of adjusting my crotch strap at all since the stiffness of the webbing caused me to spend a couple hours with pliers getting it originally setup.
So... I'm assuming that this webbing is going to be softer... is that a safe assumption?
Uncle Pug
March 17th, 2003, 05:24 PM
Spectre once bubbled...
[B]Anyplace I left a D-ring for more than a couple minutes has a bend in the webbing[B]
Jeff when you wet the webbing the lumps should flatten out.
I personally like the stiffer webbing as it is easier to chicken wing out of the shoulder straps that way... but to each his own.
SeaJay
March 17th, 2003, 05:25 PM
Doppler once bubbled...
Halcyon uses 2-inch seat belt webbing for its crotch straps... available in the cave diving section of your local auto accessory store at a few cents per foot!
And it is not sewn but simply 'held together' using weight belt keeper/clip...
DD=-)
Hm.
The seat belts on my cars don't look like this. And the Halcyon crotch strap is sewn.
Someone mentioned that Halcyon is using polypro webbing... That may be true, but isn't the rest of the rig also made of polypro webbing? How can you specify the difference?
IMHO, $35 solves the problem. I've spent more than that on dinner. Sure, it's expensive... Who cares? We're not talking hundreds here... It's overpriced by what... $15? There are better places to save money...
Whatever, man... Dive as you see fit. I found that for $35, I got a much more comfortable rig... And apparently others feel this way too. :D
SeaJay
March 17th, 2003, 05:31 PM
Spectre once bubbled...
What is the difference between the harness and the crotch strap webbing? How much stiffer is the harness webbing?
There is a huge difference. One's stiff and perfect for the rest of the harness. Even stiffer than the webbing that you find on your weight belt...
The other's more like woven fabric... And it will contour around those "sensitive areas." :D
The reason I ask is the reason I'm changing my harness. The webbing on my current harness is just too stiff. Anyplace I left a D-ring for more than a couple minutes has a bend in the webbing. All the different adjustments I made to my buckle to get it right has caused the waist strap to have so many creases that it's a pain getting it through the buckle. I've been fearful of adjusting my crotch strap at all since the stiffness of the webbing caused me to spend a couple hours with pliers getting it originally setup.
So... I'm assuming that this webbing is going to be softer... is that a safe assumption?
I'm with UP on this one... I much prefer the stiff webbing on the rest of the harness, and found that it does soften a bit with some wear. I like it for the same reason that he does.
Doesn't belong between my legs, though. For that, I want nice-n-soft! :D
I couldn't tell you if FifthD's "off the shelf" 2" webbing is the stiff or medium variety. I do know that it's not the super-soft crotchstrap material, though... That, I understand, is exclusive to the $35 Halcyon crotchstrap...
Spectre
March 17th, 2003, 05:35 PM
Uncle Pug once bubbled...
Jeff when you wet the webbing the lumps should flatten out.
Any water, or salt water more than fresh? I put 8 dives in since the last time I futzed with my harness, and those lumps are still there.
Uncle Pug
March 17th, 2003, 06:09 PM
Spectre once bubbled...
any water, or salt water more than fresh?
....probably only works with PNW saltwater. ;)
Shoot Jeff... come on out here and I will fix it for you with a dive or two....
Alternately you could soak it in fresh water, lay it on the sidewalk and give it good working over with a hammer.
Spectre
March 17th, 2003, 06:19 PM
Uncle Pug once bubbled...
Shoot Jeff... come on out here and I will fix it for you with a dive or two....
Now that's an offer! I'll get out there sometime... unfortunately I think my scuba travelling is going to be pretty limited to June only this year :(
Alternately you could soak it in fresh water, lay it on the sidewalk and give it good working over with a hammer. [/B]
I was thinking about soaking and then using an iron... if I can find one that isn't covered in wax :)
Well, I'll see how the new webbing compares to the old stuff. Since I'll be getting a warm-water BP sometime; I'll need another harness... so no loss... I just put it off longer [I love putting stuff off!].
Thanks.
FredT
March 17th, 2003, 06:29 PM
SeaJay once bubbled...
Someone mentioned that Halcyon is using polypro webbing... That may be true, but isn't the rest of the rig also made of polypro webbing? How can you specify the difference?
Saturated Polypro floats in fresh water, Nylon doesn't.
FT
dmdalton
March 17th, 2003, 08:43 PM
Spectre once bubbled...
I was thinking about soaking and then using an iron... if I can find one that isn't covered in wax :)
Make it a cool iron or you will melt it!
Dave D
SeaJay
March 17th, 2003, 08:46 PM
FredT once bubbled...
Saturated Polypro floats in fresh water, Nylon doesn't.
FT
Wow! Great tip, Fred! I'm gonna go check that out... :D
Spectre
March 17th, 2003, 08:49 PM
dmdalton once bubbled...
Make it a cool iron or you will melt it!
Dahh!! Yea.. good point!
mddolson
March 18th, 2003, 08:43 PM
Really?
I do like the idea of a soft belt for a crotch strap (the car seat belt material is polyester so it won't rot)
But unless you scooter , do you need a crotch strap. I don't. I've been wearing a backplate and wing for 3 years and never found I needed a crotch strap.
I will qualify, I am old school, I was taught in the days of horse collars, and I wear a 25 lb weight belt. I am also of the ahem, HUSKY persuation, so my backplate doesn't ride up.
Mike D
JamieZ
March 19th, 2003, 08:32 AM
Call AUL back and ask them for 5ft of their soft 2" webbing. AUL sells both hard and soft. Cost $2.50 for the webbing and whats a D-ring go for $1.50, buy 2 one for the butt. So $5.50 + $5.00 shipping. You now have a crotch strap that matches Halcyon's $35 one. $35 is this really what you paid. Wow:wacko: Local boat supplie house would cost you about $5.
SeaJay
March 19th, 2003, 09:21 AM
scubanarc once bubbled...
Call AUL back and ask them for 5ft of their soft 2" webbing. AUL sells both hard and soft. Cost $2.50 for the webbing and whats a D-ring go for $1.50, buy 2 one for the butt. So $5.50 + $5.00 shipping. You now have a crotch strap that matches Halcyon's $35 one. $35 is this really what you paid. Wow:wacko: Local boat supplie house would cost you about $5.
I'll bet you that it ain't the same stuff.
MikeS
March 19th, 2003, 09:41 AM
IMHO you can not make the equivalent of a Halcyon crotch strap for $35 if your time has much value at all. Sure you can buy all of the parts for less but then it has to be assembled including sewing that takes a pretty beefy sewing machine. So I think the issues are do you enjoy fabricating your own equipment, are you good enough to trust what you make, and how much is your time worth.
If the parts are $10.50 ($5.50 + $5.00 shipping) and I pay the guy at the shoe repair place in the mall $5 to sew it, the cost is $15.50 but took several hours to construct, go to the mall, excreta. Twenty dollars was saved at a cost of two hours or $10/hour. My time is worth more than that, I bought mine.
Mike
SeaJay
March 19th, 2003, 10:40 AM
I agree, Mike... And even then, you still wouldn't have a Halcyon crotchstrap, and you might have messed up one of the measurements... Not to mention that since you waited to get the strap sewn, you saw a $400 watch that you had to buy...
You know how it goes. :D
I could see the price justification if we were talking about a hundred dollars' difference here... But the whole strap is like $35... Sure, it's a bit pricey, but what are you going to save by doing it yourself... $20?
And I will still argue that the Halcyon material isn't so readily available...
If it was, then FredT would be selling the hell out of it.
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 11:56 AM
SeaJay once bubbled...
....And I will still argue that the Halcyon material isn't so readily available...
That's right, SeaJay! This strap material is specially woven for EE by Galadriel, Lady of Lorien and the other Elves, and the D-Rings are crafted by the Elven-smiths of Elendil, out of mithril, mined by the Dwarfs in the caves of Moria. And the "One D-Ring" was forged by the Dark Lord, Sauron, in the Dark Tower of Mordor and filled with His power. And it is this "One D-Ring" that rules all other DIR D-Rings and those under the spell of DIR.
"One D-Ring to rule them all, One D-ring to find them,
One D-Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them."
(With appologies to J.R.R.Tolkien)
Lets get real guys! There is nothing special about the webbing, or the d-rings, or the stitching or the bicycle innertube.
I fully agree with Mike S that considering the value of your time it doesn't pay to launch out and make one of these yourself. The caveat there would be unless you like to tinker with stuff yourself like I do, in which case you probably have at least a half dozen spare D-rings and various types of webbing to include this type which I found in a sewing and notions shop while standing around bored, waiting for my wife.
I made the the crotch-strap for my SS diverite BP according to the instructions from the Dark Lord Sauron (GI) in Mordor. Even though I have 2 Halcyon BP (which come with the H crotch strap) I was diving my diverite BP last weekend. The crotch strap works just fine and infact it is possible that Sauron might tell you you're an Orc (stroke) for using a sewn crotch strap instead of a bolted one like he uses/used.
I nabbed the whole Halcyon rig, so I got the crotchstrap included.
With that said, if I were looking to buy a new crotchstrap, $35 would be worth it to me to get one with that kind of webbing and have it all built for me.
Like SeaJay said... I've spent more than that on dinner. Hell, I used to blow a couple of hundred dollars in a weekend and not have anything to show for it but an overly full stomach.
Glad those days are over. :P
Doof
March 19th, 2003, 12:02 PM
Why would a bolted crotchstrap be prefferable to a sewn strap?
And no, "because George says so" isn't a good enough answer. I agree with most of what DIR teaches because the reasoning behind it is sound. I never just blindly follow anybody's rules just because they say so.
MikeS
March 19th, 2003, 12:03 PM
dmdalton once bubbled...
... and the D-Rings are crafted by the Elven-smiths of Elendil, out of mithril, mined by the Dwarfs in the caves of Moria.
Ah! It’s starting to make sense now. They’re so expensive because the prospect of the war in Iraq has led to the hording of mithril and wild speculation in the futures market!
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 12:10 PM
Doof once bubbled...
Why would a bolted crotchstrap be prefferable to a sewn strap?
And no, "because George says so" isn't a good enough answer. I agree with most of what DIR teaches because the reasoning behind it is sound. I never just blindly follow anybody's rules just because they say so.
I didn't say it was. I said"
"The crotch strap works just fine and infact it is possible that Sauron might tell you you're an Orc (stroke) for using a sewn crotch strap instead of a bolted one like he uses/used."
You will have to travel to Mordor and ask the "Dark Lord Sauron" that question!
Gandalf the Grey
:D
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 12:12 PM
MikeS once bubbled...
Ah! It’s starting to make sense now. They’re so expensive because the prospect of the war in Iraq has led to the hording of mithril and wild speculation in the futures market!
Now there's a diver who thinks out side of the box!
:D
Gandalf the Grey
Uncle Pug
March 19th, 2003, 12:14 PM
I have an untouched by human hands Halcyon Crotch Strap still in the magik plastic wrapper sitting on the shelf of yet to be used items.
Since Sea Jay won't buy it for twice the price (as he said he would be willing to earlier in this thread) but instead wants me to hold onto it forever in case he decides he needs it...
The HCS is available immediately.
This is neither a solicitation to invest in HCS futures nor an offer to sell same... this offer applies only to the one remaing HCS in my possession.
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 12:59 PM
Uncle Pug once bubbled...
Since Sea Jay won't buy it for twice the price (as he said he would be willing to earlier in this thread) but instead wants me to hold onto it forever in case he decides he needs it...
Yeah, talks cheap! I've got one that has been in fresh water only once and another that has never been wet. I'll sell either for twice retail, infact I'll give you a discount and sell them for 150% of retail!
Seriously, this is one product that I think H is out of line on. $25 at full retail would be about right.
Dave D (AKA: Gandalf the Grey)
JeffAustin
March 19th, 2003, 01:12 PM
[QUOTE]dmdalton once bubbled...
[B]
That's right, SeaJay! This strap material is specially woven for EE by Galadriel, Lady of Lorien and the other Elves, and the D-Rings are crafted by the Elven-smiths of Elendil, out of mithril, mined by the Dwarfs in the caves of Moria. And the "One D-Ring" was forged by the Dark Lord, Sauron, in the Dark Tower of Mordor and filled with His power. And it is this "One D-Ring" that rules all other DIR D-Rings and those under the spell of DIR.
"One D-Ring to rule them all, One D-ring to find them,
One D-Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them."
(With appologies to J.R.R.Tolkien)
that is too funny!!! Did I tell you guys my knife is called "Sting"? It glows blue when Orcs (strokes) are around.
My 2" crotch strap was made out of the woven mithril, it works great in shark waters!! Comfort, and security. PM me if you want the mfgs. address.
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 01:17 PM
JeffAustin once bubbled...
[QUOTE]dmdalton once bubbled...
[B]
Did I tell you guys my knife is called "Sting"? It glows blue when Orcs (strokes) are around.....
"Sting", I love it!
Cave Diver
March 19th, 2003, 01:40 PM
Does that make the Halcyon HID lights the Phial of Galadriel?
Ahhhh, Sauron, and rings, and orcs n trolls! Now that is a DIR I can understand!
Does that make the Wakulla Karst, the Mines of Moria?
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 02:05 PM
Cave Diver once bubbled...
Does that make the Halcyon HID lights the Phial of Galadriel?
Ahhhh, Sauron, and rings, and orcs n trolls! Now that is a DIR I can understand!
Does that make the Wakulla Karst, the Mines of Moria?
Absolutely! And I guess that would make Highsprings, Isengard, EE would be Orthanc and I guess JJ is Saruman!
Strange how it all sort of fits in place!:wacko:
JamieZ
March 19th, 2003, 02:32 PM
You guys missed your calling you should of been born in Waco, Texas. Bow down to David Halcyon Karesh. Material is no different except AUL's doesnt have the gold inlaid thread in the middle. Takes freaking 5 min. to make a crotch strap and I would trust my sons life with it. You think you've heard everything but no, not even close. The amount of time it takes Seajay to right one of his posts I could have one made. So how much do you value your time if your on this board posting? Were talking about a crotch strap right? Some of you guys act like your building the space shuttle.:confused:
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 02:38 PM
scubanarc once bubbled...
You guys missed your calling you should of been born in Waco, Texas. Bow down to David Halcyon Karesh. Material is no different except AUL's doesnt have the gold inlaid thread in the middle. Takes freaking 5 min. to make a crotch strap and I would trust my sons life with it. You think you've heard everything but no, not even close. The amount of time it takes Seajay to right one of his posts I could have one made. So how much do you value your time if your on this board posting? Were talking about a crotch strap right? Some of you guys act like your building the space shuttle.:confused:
Hey Cave Diver, I think we found Wormtongue!:D
Gandalf the Grey (Dave D)
JeffAustin
March 19th, 2003, 02:47 PM
This keeps getting more fun. wormtongue is right, though, a lot of effort for a crotch strap you really don't need unless you are scootering!! Back to the trilogy stuff...
MikeS
March 19th, 2003, 02:52 PM
JeffAustin once bubbled...
This keeps getting more fun. wormtongue is right, though, a lot of effort for a crotch strap you really don't need unless you are scootering!! Back to the trilogy stuff...
If you don’t have a crotch strap with a butt ring, where to you clip your reel without becoming an Orc (A.K.A. troll)?
JamieZ
March 19th, 2003, 04:59 PM
Wormtongue. Women think this is a plus but coming from a guy it doesnt sound so good, could you please just keep your boy toy names to yourself your scaring me.
Spectre
March 19th, 2003, 05:04 PM
Uncle Pug once bubbled...
Jeff when you wet the webbing the lumps should flatten out.
Just played show-n-tell w/ divegary. He's got the halcyon webbing. much softer than mine.
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 05:17 PM
scubanarc once bubbled...
Wormtongue. Women think this is a plus but coming from a guy it doesnt sound so good, could you please just keep your boy toy names to yourself your scaring me.
Now if you were well read you would know that this is not a sexual inuendo!
Gandalf the Grey
O-ring
March 19th, 2003, 05:21 PM
The Lord of the Rings thing has infested the board now??? One of these days we will have to come to your aid as we hear the Horn of Gondor (DiveAlert) sounding as you are slain by orcs (strokes)..
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 05:23 PM
MikeS once bubbled...
If you don’t have a crotch strap with a butt ring, where to you clip your reel without becoming an Orc (A.K.A. troll)?
When "The Dark Lord Sauron" was here to speak to some of us last year he said he doesn't put his on the butt d-ring any more and didn't have a good answer for where you should put it although he didn't say you should not put it there. He suggested sometimes the left waist d-ring, sometimes on stage bottle harness (temporarily), it just depends. As I'm not doing any serious penetration I use a spool clipped off in my pocket. I'll deal with it when I take cave.
Dave D
JeffAustin
March 19th, 2003, 06:35 PM
You deep penetration types hang your reels off your butt rings...
I just get lazy buddies trying to hitch a free ride with mine!!:D :D
SeaJay
March 19th, 2003, 08:39 PM
Holy smokes! Man, I step away from the board for one day and look what happens! :D
Thanks for the backup, Spectre... These guys don't get it. Apparently, they don't see the value in spending $10 to have something comfortable. Whatever, that's their call. No skin off my crotch... Er, "back." :D
Maybe my body physique, with thick thighs, makes me more sensitive to the crotch strap thing. Hey, y'all... If it works for you, then go for it...
Nobody said the stupid thing was magical... I just found the increased comfort worth $10 extra. It "is" funny, though. I think that a "Star Wars" reference, though, would have been more appropriate than a Lord of the Rings reference. :D
And yes, UP, I'll be thrilled to buy that one off of you. Of course, I don't need it until I build my sweetie's bp, which won't be for another two weeks or so... But if you'll hold on, then I'll be happy to buy...
...Or I can buy another from EE... I don't care.
Anyone want the crotchstrap that came with my Gary Hoadley plate? It's made of "soft" webbing... The kind that y'all are talking about. Looks identical to the one that Halcyon sells, but believe me, it just ain't the same. It's "thinner" 2" webbing, like a seat belt... Not quite as stiff as the regular super-stiff Halcyon 2" webbing... But no Halcyon "supersoft" crotchstrap.
UP, if they're all the same, then would you be interested in a trade? :D The Hoadley's bolted on the back and there is a triglide with straight D-ring both front and back...
Ain't no Halcyon, man... At least, I feel a huge difference with my "retired mountain bike racer" thighs...
Let me know if you'll trade and I can save $35.
You guys eat your heart out. I'd have to make three and a half crotchstraps to save THAT kind of money! :D
SeaJay
March 19th, 2003, 08:50 PM
dmdalton once bubbled...
That's right, SeaJay!
<snip>
"One D-Ring to rule them all, One D-ring to find them,
One D-Ring to bring them all and in the darkness bind them."
(With appologies to J.R.R.Tolkien)
<snip> *yawn*
Lets get real guys! There is nothing special about the webbing, or the d-rings, or the stitching or the bicycle innertube.
Nobody said anything about the innertube. The stitching is very different. The D-rings are different, too... Thicker, no welds, more rust-resistant, and they're smaller, too. They don't move as easily when you try to clip off to them, and they don't stick "way out" when they're sitting perpendicular to your body.
But most of all, the crotchstrap is waaaay different than the picture you posted ( http://www.wkpp.org/images/pina_equip/backplate_top_r.jpg )
The Halcyon crotchstrap is not a 1" crotchstrap. It's a 2" one. I could go into why to dive a 2" instead of a 1", but why bother when I can be entertained watching you pick your a** all day? :D
Okay, your Lord of the Rings mention was funny, but you're wrong about the strap... The Halcyon one is quite different. If yours works for you, then great... I'm tellin' ya that I can't do a standard 2" crotchstrap... At least, not for long. A 1" is better, but the Halcyon 2" "supersoft" crotch strap is heads and tails above all others for me.
Dive however you want... Why would I care? Don't bust on my choices, though... And certainly don't lie and tell people they're all the same, 'cause they aren't!
Cave Diver
March 19th, 2003, 09:04 PM
dmdalton once bubbled...
Hey Cave Diver, I think we found Wormtongue!:D
Gandalf the Grey (Dave D)
Does that make DIR TechDiver Bill Ferny?
<wondering who Butterbur is gonna turn out to be>
dmdalton
March 19th, 2003, 11:15 PM
SeaJay once bubbled...
Nobody said anything about the innertube. The stitching is very different. The D-rings are different, too... Thicker, no welds, more rust-resistant, and they're smaller, too. They don't move as easily when you try to clip off to them, and they don't stick "way out" when they're sitting perpendicular to your body.
But most of all, the crotchstrap is waaaay different than the picture you posted ( http://www.wkpp.org/images/pina_equip/backplate_top_r.jpg )
The Halcyon crotchstrap is not a 1" crotchstrap. It's a 2" one. I could go into why to dive a 2" instead of a 1", but why bother when I can be entertained watching you pick your a** all day? :D
Okay, your Lord of the Rings mention was funny, but you're wrong about the strap... The Halcyon one is quite different. If yours works for you, then great... I'm tellin' ya that I can't do a standard 2" crotchstrap... At least, not for long. A 1" is better, but the Halcyon 2" "supersoft" crotch strap is heads and tails above all others for me.
Dive however you want... Why would I care? Don't bust on my choices, though... And certainly don't lie and tell people they're all the same, 'cause they aren't!
Sam (SeaJay), remember this is all in fun
:D
The picture I posted was the Dark Lord Sauron's (GI's - remember this is all in fun) crotch strap not mine.
I would opine that "lie" is a rather strong word to use here especially when we are talking opinions. Opinions are like armpits, everyone has a couple and they all stink!
You CAN find the soft 2" Halcyon webbing at my local sewing & notions store, I know it is the same because I have 2 Halcyon BP and have compared, it is the same. D-rings don't have to be forged in the fires of Mordor, they come in diferent sizes and thicknesses and quality. I didn't stitch the one I made, I followed the example of the Dark Lord Sauron (except I used 2" so you wouldn't get to watch me pick it out of my a$$) and used bolts.
:D
Alas, I have no more my crotch strap woven of mithril with d-rings forged in the fires of Mordor. I sold it this eve! I must now be content to feel the soft caress of the Halcyon crotch strap between my thighs!;)
In closing, other than being a smarta$$, the point I was TRYING to make is not that all crotch straps are the same, but only that the materials from which Halcyon crotch straps are crafted, may be found quite readily.
Gandalf the Grey :)
JeffAustin
March 20th, 2003, 12:35 AM
Cool, who's next??:D :D :D
Cave Diver
March 20th, 2003, 12:46 AM
JeffAustin once bubbled...
Cool, who's next??:D :D :D
Someone just graciously pointed out in a PM that Gollum is still missing...
And does that mean that the dark steeds of the RingWraiths are actually Gavins?
Divesherpa
March 20th, 2003, 01:19 AM
Hey Pug, I need to get a few more of those Victorinox knives. I've only got a couple left. Any suggestions?
Also, are so many people scootering that we need all these crotch straps?
This is a funny thread.
I'll be TreeBeard!!
Cheers
JeffAustin
March 20th, 2003, 03:31 AM
In this episode of "Lord of the D-Rings" I'm guessing they would be very sensitive to things regarding D-Rings. They would hunt down the unfaithful, those believers that have fallen away, that have misused their D-rings or adorned themselves with improper or too many D-rings. They take great joy in trampling over the equipment and techniques of those that use ankle weights and dive in a vertical position. They can be nasty, swooping in and even nipping at believers butt rings without provocation! Once sniffed out, ringwraiths would most likely avoid trolls.:D :D
I was going to say I'd be Frodo, since I have sting, but then I'd be with Sam all the time, I mean I like him, but all those stories... anyone have any pieces of lembas waybread I can stick in my ears!?;)
Fetch
March 23rd, 2003, 04:42 PM
*shrug* Personally, I found the crotch strap helps pull the webbing of the harness into proper position around my hips, and increases stability (for me) for single-tank diving.
But then, I also found that FredT's thick 2" stiff webbing made a fine crotch strap... I'm not what you'd call "beefy" or "muscular" :)
Divesherpa once bubbled...
Also, are so many people scootering that we need all these crotch straps?
