Dive Certs

I just got OW Cert by the YMCA. I hear all this talk about PADI, DIR, SSI, etc .. what is the differance between these and where does the YMCA cert fall in? Thanks...

Brad

Congrats!

I have no idea what the diffrence is, but I did my OW Cert through PADI, and quite liked it.

Kamades

Several years ago, some training agencies go together to figure out what they considered the minimum standards of an entry level diver should be. This group is called the Recreational Scuba Training Council. On this board are YMCA, PADI, SSI, and others, making most certification agencies entry level classes pretty much the same. DIR is not a certification agency, but rather a philosphy and technique in the way to dive. You may wish to check out the GUE website for more information into this technique and philosophy.

Congrats on your certification and don't forget to keep learning

Welcome Brad! I'm so excited to see a fellow YMCA diver! Not the the agency really matters. You'll see from most of the threads here that your instructor will have more impact than the certifying agency. The thing I appreciate about the YMCA program is that it's not a profit making enterprise... Not a dive shop that needs to sell me something.

-kate

Brad,

I'll have to strongly disagree with some of the other comments. While your instructor is more important than your agency, the agency does make a difference. The statement, "making most certification agencies entry level classes pretty much the same" is simply not true. In 1985, 5 agencies (NASDS, NAUI, PADI, SSI & YMCA) got together to set minimum standards for the industry which went into effect with their announcement at DEMA in Orlando in 1986. Their association was formalized in later years by forming RSTC with some agencies refusing to join, later joining, others joining and later dropping out. Additionally, agencies other than the original 5 are now members. SSI & NASDS merged in 1999 or 2000. The bottom line is there are minimum standards all agencies must meet. That is a long way from "making most certification agencies entry level classes pretty much the same." Each agency sets it's own standards, some meet the minimum standards, others exceed them a little, others exceed them a great deal.

IMHO, YMCA standards are the highest of any US based nation wide agency. If you had a good instructor who at least followed minimum YMCA standards, you were better trained than most other divers.

Is the YMCA SCUBA program perfect? No. Would I make changes in it's standards if I had the authority? Yes. Overall, I feel it's your best option unless you live in LA County. You lucked into an excellent program.

WWW™

Originally posted by Walter

IMHO, YMCA standards are the highest of any US based nation wide agency. If you had a good instructor who at least followed minimum YMCA standards, you were better trained than most other divers.
WWW™

Click to expand...

Hi Walt, you said what I _wanted_ to say, but more objectively .

-kate

Declaring YMCA the "best" outside LA county will get you endless argument - wait'll the BSAC lads weigh in... there is a tremendous temptation to equate difficulty with quality ("goodness") in all sorts of training, Scuba included. This is a classic Red Herring!
A YMCA card represents completion of a fine training program, as good as any in the States, and if you had a good instructor then in my opinion better than most.
The program has changed a lot since I took it back thirty years ago - it is much more "user friendly" now, and combined with the advances in equipment since then, probably "better" while certainly "easier."
My own personal preference for the pinnacle of quality OW training? Why *my* course, of course!
Rick

Thanks you for all the great information you have just given me. I was at first thinking that a YMCA C-Card would make me the laughing stock of the boat. Now that I have heard some of your comments I am glad it is the only cert I could get. All this talk about the instructor is good, but in my experance you have better want to learn first. The other think that has helped me out alot is our local SCUBA club where we have at least 3 instructors and a few Dive Masters. My instrutor that did our class doesn't dive with us, but I have got a lot of help from the other instrutors in the club. So I guess before I bore you I would like to say that if there is a SCUBA club near ya and you are not a memeber then you should really think about becomeing one.

Brad

Rick,

That is not what I said. I clearly stated that this was my opinion when I said YMCA's "standards are the highest of any US based nation wide agency." BSAC is not US based and I'm not familiar enough with it to compare. From what I hear, it's standards are similar. CMAS also has high standards and is also not US based, but you can get a CMAS card by having a YMCA card. I'll also get debate from representatives of other agencies whose standards are clearly lower. I expect to see this.

"... there is a tremendous temptation to equate difficulty with quality ("goodness") in all sorts of training, Scuba included."

Not a mistake I'm likely to make. I can take any standards and teach them in a way which make the class difficult. I can also take any standards and teach them in a way which make them easy. Difficult is a sign of a poor instructor, not a good class. Easy can be either the sign of a good instructor or an incomplete class. A good course with a good instructor teaches skills and a great many of them. A poor instructor teaching the same class will not teach, but instead will demand performance. A poor course will eliminate skills to make the class easy. Too many courses are taught with skills eliminated.

Ka,

I'm rarely accused of being objective when it comes to standards. Thanks for the vote of confidence.

Brad,

Those of us with Y cards are definately in the minority, but good things usually are.

WWW™