Uwatec versus Suunto

Looking for some informative feedback on the key differences of the Uwatec versus Suunto computer performances. This thread is NOT for the discussion of costs and with no intent of discussion of pricing, distribution, or where someone's opinion of perceived dollar value is concerned. Anyone can start a thread on that if they'd like.

As a precursor, I'm a dive Instructor who likes the Uwatecs but am willing to see if anyone can shed light upon and benefits the Suunto systems would have over the Uwatecs. This discussion DOES NOT involve any other dive computers or manufacturers. I'm looking to ask my dive center to carry both brands, but some reservations need to be overcome, which prehaps members here can help with?

This thread is looking for responses from people who ARE diving with both or either of these two systems. And please, make your opinions worthwhile and object. Just liking the 'look' or comments made against one or the other without value are unnecessary and unwanted.

Again, if anyone feels they would like to start a seperate discussion with ANY OTHER manufacturers being brought up or pricing, availability, etc, please feel free to do so SOMEWHERE ELSE. I'd like to keep this discussion as concentrated as possible.

**Having been with many divers diving both, and would like to address the value of certain characteristics of why I chose my Uwatecs and see if this has been addressed by Suunto?

**Suuntos AND Uwatecs have been called more concervative, but even the late John Hardy (former head of RSD's Scubalab) agreed that reduced lines of print were unable to point out many misconceptions, including that Uwatec's MOD can be set from 1.20 ppO2 ata to 1.95 (at 1.95ata this is an incredibly aggressive diving model and one that is only useful to extreme risk-takers). Can this range of programming be accomplished for the Suunto?

(Hardy also went on to explain that many manufacturers had not changed their algorythm's since their inceptions (only case and design asthetics) and which were ignorant of today's most recent updates in diver safety and phisilogical research.)

***Uwatec's new Smart series offer the ability to 'suggest' deep stops (unlike 'required' decompression stops) that have been PROVEN by DAN and other research studys to provide a greater benefit and more efficient use of off-gasing. Do the Suunto's offered this? - (Again this is not a suggestion of 'required' decompression stops, this is level stops for more off-gasing proficiency within 'recreational' limits)

***Using the Bulmann Adaptable algorythm for years, Uwatec models calculate real time information from the value of diver's workload, microbubble build-up, and temperature THROUGHOUT the dive. I believe a very important reservation has been the inability for the Suunto computer algorythm to adjust in REAL-TIME continually throughout FOR THE EFFECTS OF TEMPERATURE upon the diver - this is very considerable in places like Galapagos/Cocos, Great Lakes, UK, and anywhere thermoclines are present. Has this been addressed by Suunto?

***A lack of Time and Date present (not considering download potential -as it is available there), is one issue Uwatecs have not seemed to address. I realize that the importance to know what time it is may not be a factor to the serious diver, but are Suunto divers out there using this function often?

***Suunto and Smart Uwatec models have the temperature display (and all models through downloading software), but how often are you using this?

***Batteries, (heres a big one issue) Suunto has user changable batteries which are good if you are a do-it-yourselfer, unless you are out searching for them on your vacation time as you neglected to have spares. But I have seen more than one Suuntos models compartments flooded, corroded, and diabled because of either a poor oring, user error, or lost screws for cover. How are Suunto divers addressing this?

***Uwatec tells you exact battery percentage life left - each set runs for 1000 dives or more and is replaced at NO CHARGE. I used to think that it might be an issue to send the computer in for replacement, but I've been assured that Uwatec/Scubapro does it in one day turnaround. Uwatec TESTS and CALIBRATES your computer for free (battery replacement is free as well) while your battery is being replaced. I see no users of Suunto's being able to tell me the last time their computer was tested and calibrated for accuracy (beyond the purchase date). How are Suunto divers adjusting for this?

***How does the Suunto diver know EXACTLY how much battery life is left? (Not a question of 'low', but EXACT)

***Uwatecs electronics are oil-incased, as oil is incompressble, the continuous ascent/descent atmosphere changes have no affect upon the motherboard. This offers an advantage to long life and accuracy. How does Suunto address concern for circuitry and pressure changes upon the housing and internal workings?

***Uwatec has offered me upgrades to new current computers for any old computer that has a problem that has been shown after testing and calibration. (I had a 1984 model, and was offered a 2002 model for $150). I received the newer algorythm, backlighting, and new features not on my old model. Does Suunto consistantly have anything like this?

***Uwatecs don't default to a preset when using Nitrox mixes but instead stay where you've set them. This offers no 'surprises' when you get in the water after a long surface interval and you haven't changed mixes. How are Suunto's set up? I seem to recall they default to 50% after long interval and if a diver neglects to look at and reset teh computer, their profile tracking can get into some serious trouble.

***Uwatec's upon surface interval, offer an EXACT do not fly time is presented (no 12 or 24 stamps) and that in addition, the EXACT hours and minutes of microbubble desaturation is presented. Do the Suunto's offer EXACT time (6 hrs, 13hrs, 29 hrs, etc)?

As a diver, I want to take charge of my own diving and use the more accuracte tools to keep me safe in the water. I don't wish to blindly follow a divemaster along and hope that my guide isn't having a bad day. Also, my dive guide isn't usually along with me on all my profiles, all my dives throughout the days and weeks on loacation. Sometimes divemasters switch on surface intervals, have days off, arent' doing the 3, 4, 5 dives a day, or night dives. Their profile is different than mine.

I want accurate measures of my profiles, my Uwatecs DO THAT. Now if someone can explain how the Suunto's are in relation with the above questions, that would be great. I always want to broaden my scope of learning. The shop I teach for then can offer more services and I can also explain to fellow divers key differences. Thanks!

Dude, it sounds like you are biased right from the start... I dont understand? Do you want to be carrying Suunto computers in the dive center you work at, or not? Are you just gathering info about Suunto computers so you can go back to your boss and tell him all the little differences between Suunto and Uwatec.

Personally, I did own an Uwatec computer. I bought into the 1000 dives on a battery thing too... Then after only two seasons with it, it was down to 60 something percent (only about 100 dives). What kind of crap are they trying to pull? And then the battery changes are way expensive (yeah, the new ones dont cost you anything... YET!). I just dont trust them. They tell you one thing, but my experience says THEY ARE WRONG!!!

I like my Suunto computers... all three of them. I dont think I would ever buy another Uwatec computer.

But, then again, from your original post, and i might add, your first post on Scubaboard, it sounds like you dont care what people have to say that is positive about Suunto computers. I think you just want more ammo to go back to your dive center and give him some reasons why he shouldnt sell Suunto computers. Well, I think you are afraid that people will tell you that you are wrong, and Uwatecs arent all they are chalked up to be...

Next time, be a little more open to peoples experience and opinions without being so standoffish. Also, you might want to check your facts and try to not to state things that are untrue...

GOod Luck.

SimonN, am I really an instructor? Yes, but where does that rip come from?

Asking questions, is a way to learn, don't be threaten by someone asking for more and in turn being petty in trying to personally attack them. I don't claim to know everything, and I think you are far from DIVING's GOD, so keep personal issues to yourself.

Next you'll be saying that I'm not DIR, so I must be Doing It Wrong?

The batteries of the Uwatecs last considerably longer than userchangeable styles. The more you use any IRDA with a device the more the battery life will be shortened. The more you manipulate the dive planner and backlighting the more you shorten battery life. I've enjoy hundreds of dives on each Uwatec and have considerably more battery life than your example and many others do as well. But I use my Uwatec for recreational diving and the need to see the back lighting and runthe dive planner, and connect with IRDA isn't great.

Perhaps you can explain how the Buhlmann Algorythm is wrong 'crap'? DAN's Project Dive Exploration would appreciate it.

Who is your expert is who says that the dive computer's readout of battery percentage is 'crap'?

Explain how levels starts in recreational diving are PROVEN to be a 'bit crap'. DAN's research would like to know.

How does the 'crap gauge mode' matter for recreational diving?

Please explain your 'crap' responses and absolutes thoroughly for us so we get it right.

And LUBOLD, I do want to learn more about them. But the only experience I have to derive from is what other clients issues have been on dive trips I've been on.

I can't explain more to them why their Suuntos were constantly defaulting when none of the Uwatecs were. I cant explain to them why they had a backlighting as an alarm but didn't know why when we had none.
I can't suggest to them why my Uwatec reads environment temperaure and adjusts the algorythm and their does not?

You make comments that they dont charge for batteries, YET. When their written policy is that they do, but it's because you don't trust their administrative tactics? Come on.
Plus, because it's expensive for battery changes for YOU, that's not an argument for those where it isn't expensive. Perhaps shipping and other factors apply wher you are, I have not idea where you really are? But putting in new batteries all the time on the Suuntos doesn't add up to a cost as well? Okay, say it's equal, at least user changing error isnt a factor.

The store can't afford a full line of BOTH dive computers unless both warrant it. I explained I was biased as an owner of an Uwatec models, but wanted more info. Instead of personal attacks, more information on why Suuntos are more well rounded and better as an option to bring in a new line would be more useful.

My Nitrox X with 450 dives is reading in at 69%
When I bought it new in 1/2000 it read 89%
avg dive time 37 minutes

My AirZ O2 with 42 dives reads 89% it started out at 91%

Uwatecs did charge for battery changes for all older models, just this years design you dont have to pay for battery changes anymore. The average cost to change tha battery on the "older" style Uwatecs is $60. Not including shipping... Whats goin on here??? Just because its oil filled, and there is less chance for it to leak??? Well, my Stinger just cost me only $30 for a battery change and thats not oil filled... What gives here??? Do I not trust it because there is no oil in the battery compartment? I think not... I trust that computer with my life...
Uwatecs read the ambient temp and adjust the algorithm for colder water... Whoop di doo... I am diving in my DRYSUIT, not in my birthday suit. SO, now, my computer is giving me faulty info because it thinks that I am diving in my birthday suit? I never understood that "feature".
Maybe you should get a Suunto computer and actually dive it for a while. Also, if you want to know where I live, look at my profile and right under my handle on al my posts. Also, more intriguing is the fact that we dont know where you are from.... What about your name, occupation.... Nothing like that shows up in your info.... Hmmmm.... can you say sock puppet.... Or maybe TROLL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

I forgot to respond to something else you said:

User changing error with the battery???
Hmmm... yeah... Ok, could happen.. But most of the people bring their computers into the shop to get the battery changed and its a service tech that changes the battery, and most know what they are doing. Also, Oceanic, genesis, and sherwood all have user replaceable batteries. Hmmm??? sounds like alot of companies are going to user replaceable batteries. GOod business move, if you ask me. Batteries actually last a good amount of time, and they are usually less than ten dollars to purchase at any Radio Shack or even Walmart. One little o-ring, thats another .25 cents. WHOA, its all starting to add up... SO, lets say that you have three battery changes for a Suunto computer compared to one for an Uwatec. (your experiences may vary). COst difference? Suunto $30.75. Uwatec $60. Hmmm.... doesnt look even to me. It would have to be six changes for a SUunto to one for an Uwatec for it to start to make sense. Another thing, I have seen one Suunto computer flood in the battery compartment... ANd that was because the guy forgot to put the oring back in... Not much validation for that argument either. I have changed probably hundreds of batteries in Suunto, Genesis, and Oceanic computers... No flooding in the battery compartment... except for that one error (no oring). I have seen Uwatecs come back from battery changes that have had polarity reversed or something, and that act all weird and give innacurate readings... They have to go back.... Not to mention all the down time to ship it back to Uwatec... One day turnaround? I have seen four to six weeks... I am in Massachusetts. Yeah, UPS ground takes five business days to get to CALI and five to get back I know.... SO, why does it take two to three weeks at the factory???

Oh, then not to mention when Uwatec changes designs and then says, oh I'm sorry we cant change the battery in your computer anymore. You will have to upgrade to the new design. That will be $150.

Yeah... I love Uwatec computers...


They work good, their algorithms are cool, they have top of the line engineering and all that stuff.. Then they kick you in the nuts. I dont like that...

downtoolong once bubbled...
SimonN, am I really an instructor? Yes, but where does that rip come from?

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Sorry, the questions sounded more like some kind of marketing thing and/or what a new diver would ask. I do not mean any offence.

I'm not DIR btw either (although moving in that direction).

The batteries of the Uwatecs last considerably longer than userchangeable styles.

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Like 41% in one year/150 dives?

The more you use any IRDA with a device the more the battery life will be shortened.

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Still a problem with the product. It has an IRDA port! This is how you download and up load to it. If is uses a disproportionate amout of battery power it is bad design or they should have included more powerful batteries.

The more you manipulate the dive planner and backlighting the more you shorten battery life.

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True. However, I use neither.

I've enjoy hundreds of dives on each Uwatec and have considerably more battery life than your example and many others do as well.

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Ditto with my old Air-X nitrox and Pro Ultra.

But I use my Uwatec for recreational diving and the need to see the back lighting and runthe dive planner, and connect with IRDA isn't great.

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I agree.

Perhaps you can explain how the Buhlmann Algorythm is wrong 'crap'? DAN's Project Dive Exploration would appreciate it.

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For a start, people still get bent diving it, therefore, it is not an accurate decompression model. It works most of the time though.

Secondly, it doesn't allow for deep stops. Deep stops appear to be important for the prevention of subclinical DCS (and possibly more serious forms of DCS), therefore it is probably not right, at best.

I don't know anyone who would still do serious deco on straight Buhlmann.

Who is your expert is who says that the dive computer's readout of battery percentage is 'crap'?

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A bloke I know who works on satellites and the like. As far as I understand, you cannot query most batterys as to their strength. You have to estimate it from the batteries voltage (depending on the type of battery). This is not a reliable method, apparently.

Explain how levels starts in recreational diving are PROVEN to be a 'bit crap'. DAN's research would like to know.

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They appear to be just a fudge factor to extend bottom time and/or depth, therefore causing stops to start deeper and earlier. If you skip level stops, it is OK, but skipping a deco stop is bad????

Since both kind of stops are theoretical it's all a bit wierd.

If you want to be conservative use your brain. Do what you are taught in PADI OW - don't go right to the edge of NDLs, do long slow ascents. What could be simpler?

How does the 'crap gauge mode' matter for recreational diving?

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It doesn't. It matters for some of the diving I do though. And, it is a feature of products you were talking about.

If you want to play that game, how are deco stops relevent to recreational diving?

Please explain your 'crap' responses and absolutes thoroughly for us so we get it right.

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I think I have, but feel free to seek clairification of individual points.

SimonN once bubbled...


(Chill dude. I am neither DIR or anti-DIR. Just like winding people up!)

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LOL. You are doing a fine job of it.