DIR Poll

[RoyalAquaMaster]

I'm just curious - I'd like to know the percentage of DIR divers on this message board. True 100% DIR subscribers...

[roturner]

RoyalAquaMaster once bubbled...
I'm just curious - I'd like to know the percentage of DIR divers on this message board. True 100% DIR subscribers...

Nobody can every be 100% DIR because nobody is perfect.

R..

[DIR Tec Diver]

Yep, one hardcore true believer right here!! Of course I was not always this way and you always have more to learn, but DIR has not only been a God send but saved my life and countless other lives for a long time now.

DIR is so much more than equipment or brand. The heart of it rests in you attitude, willingness to admit that you are wrong and the ability to set aside pride to do things the right way. All of us were what we call strokes at one point in time. (I am talking about myself not anyone in particular so don't edit my post =) I was just like most other divers at one point, oblivious to right way to do things, invincible and a complete victim of the recreational dive industry (I even had a jacket style BCD and split fins ) God forgive me.....

Now I can not tell you enough how much DIR has changed my life, and my ability to not only be a good diver and diving instructor, but the family and welcomness you receive as a DIR diver. Of course there are a lot of people that insist that they are the experts and they know best, and there are only a few of those (George Irvine, Jarrod Jablonski) etc. They have the data, experience and proof to back up what they say and do.

Don't reinvent the wheel, it has already been refined and build for you, just take it into use and welcome to the real world of diving.

David

[crazyc]

I believe that no one can ever really become 100% DIR the way it is defined by George. Even George himself by his own admittance isn't 100% by the book. How can anyone be? If the true goal of DIR is to always look for a better/safer way to do something, then one may "stray" from the established norm of equipment/fitness/nutrition/attitude in order to find another way to do something right/better.

I look at being DIR as a journey instead of a destination.

CrazyC

[DIR Tec Diver]

You are correct, it is a journey, and hopefully a never ending one. The core foundation is laid, and those are the key building blocks. Of course there are very few people if any that can say they are 100% DIR, the poll is a bit misleading in that way. However (for me personally) I strive to be 100% DIR for those things that have been put in place. When people like George tal about "Real life diving" and how he does or does not do certain things, I modify myself or equipment to match, and incorporate his knowledge the best I can.

He is a direct to the point and sometimes ruthless person, but he is one of the people I respect and admire the most, and I am proud to call him my friend. Yes he has slammed me, and yes I was a super stroke at one time (so was he also by his own admission). You should read his article "My 77th Cave Dive" You will see just how mortal George was, is and how much he himself has grown.

That's the beauty of it. We don't have to reinvent the wheel. All the mistakes and tests have already been done, and we don't have to die or hurt ourselves or others in a struggle to hash it out by ourselves. Of course the world of diving and DIR is not written in stone, but since none of us have done that they do, I feel confident in saying that we can rely on, trust and incorporate their knowledge and abilities to help us towards where they are. By the time we get there if anytime actually they will be on to the next step, and then we can continue the journey as you already pointed out.

Take care and it's nice to see a good post starting. I hope it stays this way.

[NetDoc]

All the mistakes and tests have already been done,

Not even close. And there is a lot out there that many assume as fact, which is in reality only conjecture. Really!

[DIR Tec Diver]

What I meant and should have communicated more clearly was the core areas such as the need for canister lights, wings/harness, isolator manifolds etc. These core or foundation areas have been well covered. We will all have much to learn about decompression, gas mixes where and when etc, but the majority of these areas are in good grasp, and we can build from them.

I should write down a little bit more of what I am thinking to not seem to be misleading or assuming something, you are completely correct that all the mistakes have not happened yet, but we can utilize the knowledge experience and results of these trials and tribulations to help us not repeat or encounter the same mistakes of others

[NetDoc]

you might not be the best spokesperson for DIR. Go seek some advice from Uncle Pug so that you can be a better one. He has spent quite a bit of effort and time on this board to debunk some of the myths that you seem determined to prove true. I give this advice not only to you, but to all those determined to save those who feel no need for scuba salvation. Yes, I believe in diversity in diving. Go figure!

[Big-t-2538]

DIR Tec Diver once bubbled...

DIR is so much more than equipment or brand. The heart of it rests in you attitude, willingness to admit that you are wrong and the ability to set aside pride to do things the right way... <<snip>> ...invincible and a complete victim of the recreational dive industry (I even had a jacket style BCD and split fins )


Dude...how close minded can you be. I was under the impression that DIR was a philosiphy of being open minded and taking into account factors X, Y, and Z to come up with the best formula you have available for the dive you are planning.

If that means I don't have the $$ to drop on a BP and wings, Drysuit, and whatever else, you are saying I shouldn't be diving? I don;t consider myself a victim, but a student of the diving industry...no one should consider themself a victim, but if you want to, go ahead.

I plan on learning as much as I can and going from there. If I'm not comfortable with set-up XYZ, I'm not going to dive that rig. I am going to dive following the protocols that makes sense to me, and use what methods I feel are best.

[nickjb]

NetDoc once bubbled...
you might not be the best spokesperson for DIR. Go seek some advice from Uncle Pug so that you can be a better one. He has spent quite a bit of effort and time on this board to debunk some of the myths that you seem determined to prove true. ....

Well said

[diveski01]

wb416 once bubbled...
Perhaps a glimpse into why certain people act the way they do and make certain demands...

1991 Indian Springs Incident by GI3 (http://www.bayareadivers.net/wb416/downloads/Diving%20Accident%20at%20Indian%20Springs%201991%2 0written%20by%20GI3%2077th%20dive.txt)

1991 Indians Springs Incident by Bill Gavin (http://www.bayareadivers.net/wb416/downloads/diving%20accident%20at%20indian%20springs%201991%2 0written%20by%20bill%20g.txt)

Some lessons learned from 1991 Incident (http://www.bayareadivers.net/wb416/downloads/77th%20Dive%20Lessons%20learned.txt)

Perspective is everything...

I don't think these links can be shared enough.

[roturner]

DIR Tec Diver once bubbled...
What I meant and should have communicated more clearly was the core areas such as the need for canister lights, wings/harness, isolator manifolds etc. These core or foundation areas have been well covered. We will all have much to learn about decompression, gas mixes where and when etc, but the majority of these areas are in good grasp, and we can build from them.

I should write down a little bit more of what I am thinking to not seem to be misleading or assuming something, you are completely correct that all the mistakes have not happened yet, but we can utilize the knowledge experience and results of these trials and tribulations to help us not repeat or encounter the same mistakes of others

Configuration items as core areas? The configuration offers (arguably) "best-practices" or solutions to needs/problems. The configuration is not a goal in and of itself although on the internet you might get this impression. In fact you might get the impression that DIR is "just" a set of gear.....

What "need(s)" or "problem(s)" is a canister light addressing? The core knowledge is in understanding the problem you're solving. I think the reason that discussions about DIR get so bogged down in the "one true way" fights is that people understand the solutions but they don't understand how the masters of the system arrived at these solutions. You see exactly the same thing in martial-arts where people have great "faith" in their style and consider it the best without being able to show you how they got to that conclusion.

Ignorance demands faith. Knowledge is power and all that.....

R..

[DIR Tec Diver]

Me closed minded - No Way.

I was a super stroke 2 years ago, everyone was at one point, but people took the time to teach me the right way and they made me promise to do the same for others.

The things that are DIR approved or DIR decided - whaterer should be taken into use. THere is a reason why for EVERYTHING this is not just taken blindly. This is one of the beauties of DIR. If you want to twist things and turn it around to fit some agenda, go ahead, I won't be part of it, but you won't get me or others to just quit or walk away just because you want to stir up trouble.

Give it a rest. If you want to argue with me, do it but do it with facts. If I am wrong, I will say so, but don't whine and cry about it

[Big-t-2538]

DIR Tec Diver once bubbled...

I was a super stroke 2 years ago
Is it super stroke to go solo ice diving?

[HarleyDiver]

If being a stroke means believing that :
1. Diving is a sport not a religion
2. I am not going to die just because I wear the "wrong" equipment.
3. Diving is supposed to be FUN.

Then I guess I am a stroke, and I do not take it as an insult.

Get a life...

[Charlie99]

HarleyDiver once bubbled...
If being a stroke means believing that :
1. Diving is a sport not a religion
2. I am not going to die just because I wear the "wrong" equipment.
3. Diving is supposed to be FUN.

Then I guess I am a stroke, and I do not take it as an insult.


I must be a super-stroke, because diving for me is recreation, not even a sport -- since that implies it is some sort of competition.

I notice that there a lots of divers for whom the attraction is the challenge of doing a difficult dive -- i.e. the sport of diving. For others of us, diving is a way to get underwater and have a good time looking at the reef, or whatever.

Many on this board seem to think that recreational diving is merely a steppingstone to tech diving. Wrong.


Charlie

[DIR Tec Diver]

Nope, not in any way

[Tekkie]

Well,
I would say I am 2/3 the way there. The only thing I have too work on is my reg setup. My dad won't let me put my backup under my neck because he thinks it is going to choke me or something or it might get caught on something. But everything else I am DIR BP and Wings, no comp ect....
Tekkie

[bwerb]

I have a little history question here...care to answer anyone?

Perhaps I'm mistake but wasn't the origin of the term "stroke" in reference to all the tech divers who used to show-up and suck-up to George and would "stroke" his ego but in his opinion they really had no clue what they were doing and their gear was wrong etc. etc. So the real definition of a "stroke" was someone who spent their time sucking up to George but who didn't really have a clue themselves. People who were just into the "image" and "name dropping" and "tech talk" but who were themselves far from really having any true idea of what they were talking about...hangers on if you will. Therefore, it would seem to me that the current batch of "DIR lemmings" :;): who have shown up here would actually be strokes by definition.

Me, DIR? Well, putting my gear together piece by piece to the DIR set-up, like the dive planning and team work portions. Big check mark for the fitness portion. A big negatory to the bow down to the church of George portion...which I actually don't think is DIR anyway but seems to be lost on some of the diciples argueing as to who gets to sit at his right hand.:out:

[KilgoreTrout]

Recreational Diving is not a stepping stone, it is a requirement.

If you don't have decent experience doing recreational diving, you will put yourself at too much risk when doing "tech" diving.

I don't have a problem with the idea of Tech diving being a personal goal. I do however have a problem with people that rush into it b/c they can take the class. A class will only teach you a fraction of what you learn in the water!

The rest is the idea of recreational diving with backplate/wing.

DIR is hogarthian tweaked. I like the concepts of hogarthian alot and I like the way it performs in the water. I dive almost exclusively recreationally (i.e. no tech) and DIR would not work well.

I won't refuse to dive with someone that may fall under the category of "stroke". If they're a dumbass, I won't dive with them. If the their gear is crap and will most likely fail, I won't dive with them. I have a hard enough time finding someone to dive with in the first place.

Certain DIR principles do not work when you start diving w/ non-DIR divers. I.e. I have my octo around my neck, but I will not put the bungie through my mouthpiece zip-tie. I don't know which reg a non-DIR diver will grab (may not even be my buddy, cattle-boat anyone?).

I like the long hose because if I have to share gas, it makes my life easier. If I need gas, I won't care how long the hose is!

I am very happy to see people pushing common-sense skills. I am very tired of diving with people that have no concept of keeping silt where it belongs. This is not only courtesy, but increases safety. The idea that most people couldn't reach their tank valve disturbs me! I am most interested in how I can be a better diver (not based on gear) based on the skill I have in the water.

Think about what's going to make you a better diver, and do it!

[100days-a-year]

I believe this is the "technical diving section"in which we discuss "tech diving"no need to discuss recreatioal diving preferences here.DIR is best suited to technically challenging dives.Those doubles and drysuit will look silly at Looe Key.The man asked a simple question .My answer would be as DIR as I need to be.The closer I get to dives that DIR evolved from the closer my equipment and practices get to it.A great deal is said by critics about how fervent the DIR "Koolaid kids" are yet the most vitriolic and near religious fanatacism I see comes from the critics who normally wouldn't seem to have ever even been 1000' back in a cave or 200' deep yet insist in telling people who do it as a matter of course how"wrong" DIR is.I applaud Pete as I have seen him acknowledge points and remain civil (altho cynical;)).If you don't actually have any technical diving expertise and run off at the mouth about it either for or against you run the risk of appearing foolish.It's not that big a deal either way it's just a choice of diving style.

[roturner]

Tekkie once bubbled...
Well,
I would say I am 2/3 the way there. The only thing I have too work on is my reg setup. My dad won't let me put my backup under my neck because he thinks it is going to choke me or something or it might get caught on something. But everything else I am DIR BP and Wings, no comp ect....
Tekkie

The only time I really needed my octopus I couldn't find it and it very nearly ended badly.

I was playing rescue victim and the 'rescuer" knocked my reg out of my mouth when he was trying to lift me off the bottom. Only he didn't notice this and he had my arms in a sort of weird grip (yes, he did it all wrong). I reached for my reg but I couldn't find it while I was being held like that. I had no idea where my octopus was either because it was in the days that dangling octos were the norm..... so I obviously couldn't find it either. At that point I wanted out of his grip but the more I tried the tighter he held on. I made it most of the way to the surface (10m/30ft) before the need for a plan got very urgent (actually it was urgent as soon as it happened but I was inexperienced and immortal at the time and I should have stopped him immediately. I thought I could handle it, which obviously I couldn't). I'm afraid my solution wasn't very elegant, it involved hitting him and spinning him around to get him off of me and then I signalled OOA, of course the only natural way that came to me at the time -- by opening my mouth and pointing in :) and he gave me his primary. I took it and only gave it back again when he started tugging on it. I'm not making myself look very " indiana-jones" like here but it's the truth and it *was* like 18 years ago so I've learned a few things since then :) . We finished the ascent buddy breathing because even though we had 3 other perfectly functioning regs dangling around somewhere we were both focussed on the one we knew how to find. It just goes to show you how easy getting in trouble can be from something as simple as not knowing where your octopus is.

Shortly thereafter I put an AIRII on my inflater so I my octopus would always be *exactly* where I left it! In 1986 we didn't have DIR so that seemed like the best solution at the time but the first time I got a good look at how tech divers were doing it I changed it.

The moral of my story is, of course when the REALLY NEED your octopus you REALLY NEED to know where it is. You probably know that but maybe you need some stories like this to convince your father.

Anyone else got a good story? Stick to true stories, no scenarios.

R..

P.S. I don't know if you know this but something like a half of all active divers have had some kind of panic situation at some point. It would be interesting to know how many of these (and indeed how many incidents) are caused by not being able to find the octopus when you need it. Anybody have any info about this?

[knives]

crazyc once bubbled...
I believe that no one can ever really become 100% DIR the way it is defined by George. Even George himself by his own admittance isn't 100% by the book. How can anyone be? If the true goal of DIR is to always look for a better/safer way to do something, then one may "stray" from the established norm of equipment/fitness/nutrition/attitude in order to find another way to do something right/better.

I look at being DIR as a journey instead of a destination.

CrazyC


Yes ...I that is how I feel too....I like the attitude of improving the whole package ...body , mind, skills...it is constant improvement.

:)

[Tekkie]

I had a similar experience in my OW checkout dives Roturner,
I had a really bad rental Bc and it didn't have one of the backup holders. I showed it to my dive con because I didn't want my reg bouncing all over the quarry bottom, so he put a bungie around it. I didn't notice it until I was in the water. Well at about 30 ft the head instructor made the out of air sign to me and so I gave him my primary. When I reached for my backup and jurked it, it didn't come loose and I almost had to take my primary back from the instructor. but luckaly I got it off after pulling half of my bc to my mouth. That wasn't much fun. Right now I have one of those ball backup holders on my backplate and wings. It looks kind of funny but it works. It sure will be intresting when I take my Stress and Rescue course in 2 weeks.
Tekkie

[Braunbehrens]

All these backup horror stories just illustrate why it's so much easier to dive with a long hose, and a backup on a necklace. The backup is always there when you need it, and I mean RIGHT there.

Also, the long hose makes it really easy to share air. In fact, it's so easy, I've been on rec. dives where I've shared air just because my buddy was getting a bit low and we didn't feel like turning the dive yet. I just handed him my primary, went to my backup, and we continued for a while longer. Of course we didn't wait for him to be dangerously low, he had plenty of gas so that at any time we could still both easily get out on what was in his tanks.

I'm telling you guys, part of the reason the DIR divers push the system so hard is that it's just way more fun, and way less stress. Everything works beautifully, everything has been tested by many many divers, and the system has proved itself on very serious dives, far more serious than I'll EVER do.

There may be another system out there that works, but how can you be sure? When everyone dives a completely different setup, you end up with no way of veryfying that any of these setups stand the test. The time you find out is usually when you really can't afford to do so.

I love to tinker and figure things out for myself an be different etc. But when it comes to life support, tried and true is better. If you want to tinker, buy a boat. You can mess with that till the cows come home, pour all your money into it, and if everything goes to hell call the coast guard. You don't want to "tinker" with life support. Just look at all the people who've lost thier life in this sport, countless ones were "tinkerers". Just off the top of my head, there was a guy in San Diego diving a modified breather. Then there was the guy diving that huge contraption with 7 different tanks strapped to his back (tony maffatone I think). It's not worth it to do that.

By all means, make sure that DIR makes sense. Ask questions, like I did, argue everything down to where you are convinced one way or another. That's exactly what I did. But in the end, if it all makes sense, then any reasonable person must come to the conclusion that it's safer to follow this sytem than reinventing the wheel.

Please excuse the long diatribe.

[KilgoreTrout]

I have my reg around my neck, but using the older surgical tubing method. If jerked, it will come loose! It is still exactly where I want it, around my neck. This method used to be DIR but is now not "technically" DIR anymore.

I agree with the fact that both regs should be in a completely obvious location. I just can't guarantee which reg will get grabbed. I can say that if I dive with someone without a long hose or a second around their neck, I will more than likely grab their primary and make them deal with finding their second.

To me, this is a situation where DIR had it right but took a wrong turn for the worst. I understand why they changed it. The surgical tubing can be a pain if not done correctly. The reg can fall out during the middle of the dive (very seldom happens). I have learned to deal with this to the point that I can't remember the last time it happened (2-3yr ago maybe). Now that I have a shorter second hose (DIR...) I see it being even less likely.

If you are diving with other DIR divers, go with the bungie attached to the mouthpiece method [it IS better]. Since my buddies aren't DIR, I have to make allowances for their safety. That is part of my job as a dive buddy.

[Purcell]

As usual with DIR, newbies in their flush of enthusiasm, can cause more damage than help. There are one or maybe two ppl here can guide/help anyone along the learning curve, one is Mike Kane, patient and accessible. I am not 100% DIR. I dont excercise often enough and my fitness could be improved generally.
DIR is not solely about kit. IMHO it is also a mindset . I`ll let other more suited ppl expand on this last statement.
Jack.

[Doof]

I picked up a bungie necklace from EE. I figure, what could be more DIR approved than that?

This bungie is so thick I don't see how it can go through the mouthpiece ziptie and still guarantee that the mouthpiece stays in place. Unless I'm misunderstanding that part.

So I left it so that it's possible the reg can be pulled out. Personally, I can see pros and cons doing it either way.

[diveski01]

Doof once bubbled...
This bungie is so thick I don't see how it can go through the mouthpiece ziptie and still guarantee that the mouthpiece stays in place. Unless I'm misunderstanding that part.


The bungie is tied such that it forms an opening which surrounds the mouthpiece. Snug up each end to secure it. I've quickly tried to find a clear image and have this but will try to find a better shot.

[NetDoc]

and are tasty during long decos too! :tease:

[Doof]

diveski01 once bubbled...


The bungie is tied such that it forms an opening which surrounds the mouthpiece. Snug up each end to secure it. I've quickly tried to find a clear image and have this but will try to find a better shot.

That's how mine is. So why do I keep reading that it should go through the ziptie?

Or am I misreading this?

From wkpp.org:


We hang it around the neck on surgical tubing or bungee which is held on by the tie wrap that holds the mouthpiece to the regulator.

[Braunbehrens]

This is probably splitting hairs, but I think the reasoning is that the current method is more secure. There is some concern that with the "slip over the mouthpiece" method the reg could easily come out.

I have experienced this myself on a few occasions, and have gone to the zip tie method. I do like it better. I've also switched to bungee because it doesn't deteriorate as fast.

[Pez de Diablo]

Doof once bubbled...


That's how mine is. So why do I keep reading that it should go through the ziptie?

Or am I misreading this?

From wkpp.org:



I have not (yet) come across someone with the bungee necklace under the zip tie. Using a fishermans knot (slip knot on both sides) I just stretch the knots apart and pull over the mouth piece and then pull on each side of the necklace until it is tight around the mouth piece. This has worked for me.

Edit to add:

I may have to check into doing it this way, it might be better.

[runvus4]

My equipment is set up to be DIR or at least close to DIR "book" specs, I already have lifestyle/dietary plan/exercise regimine that fits their recomendations (from doing other sports, not from any DIR relevation), and I like their emphasis on Diver knowledge and Diver skills, but I am not DIR nor am I striving to be 100% DIR. I would say I'm diving a (fairly standardized) Hogarthian rig.

I'm not 100% DIR nor striving to such a standard simply because while I can understand the reasoning behind some decisions, I personally have made other decisions because it suits me and my diving better currently. Eg. While I dive plans/alternates, I also wear and use a computer as a computer. I have a fourth keeper/d-ring on my right hip, I put it on as a stay for the cannister instead of the buckle, but since it is there, I have been known to clip off my reel there instead of rear buttring, especially when out of water. There are other small differences as well.

Having a well thought out and standardized dive practices/rigs/gasses as DIR promotes is a very good system. If you can get past the wannabes who cite the "book standard" and try to beat you over the head with it, but have no understanding as to the reasoning behind the standard, you will find that many of the reasons are well hashed out and have good foundation.

IMHO, you can tell how close to 100% "DIR" someone is (and there are a few of them on scubaboard) compared to a newb "DIR wannabe" (and boy did we get a few of those....)because the ALL the ones closer to 100% DIR are able to explain the DIR choices/gear setup and back it up with solid reasons, though not all of them are pleasent about it.

The wannabies are laughable in that when looking at any ideas other than "book DIR" just say "It's not DIR, DIR says that it's this way or you are a low life stroke, going to die, die, DIE!!! Oh, and you are going to take out 20 of your stroke buddies in the process" because they don't understand the why's behind what they are parroting. While the wannabies are similar in tone to the less pleasant DIR rolemodels, there is a decided difference in the substantiveness behind the arguments of the two. It's even funnier when the DIR wannabe lambasts you in one thread about how much of a stupid stroke you are, also in another thread expouses non-DIR practices/gearsetups/lifestyles (some of them fairly core ideal violations at that), yet still claims to be Paladins of 100% DIR.

There is a lot to be learned from the DIR ideals and GUE, and their standards/ideals are good to strive to, just don't turn into bleating sheep with no brains to understand the reasoning behind the practices/guidelines.

I and my buddies do have our secondary bungied under zip-ties.

[Braunbehrens]

runvus4 once bubbled...
I'm not 100% DIR nor striving to such a standard simply because while I can understand the reasoning behind some decisions, I personally have made other decisions because it suits me and my diving better currently. Eg. While I dive plans/alternates, I also wear and use a computer as a computer. I have a fourth keeper/d-ring on my right hip, I put it on as a stay for the cannister instead of the buckle, but since it is there, I have been known to clip off my reel there instead of rear buttring, especially when out of water. There are other small differences as well.

IMHO, you can tell how close to 100% "DIR" someone is (and there are a few of them on scubaboard) compared to a newb "DIR wannabe" (and boy did we get a few of those....)because the ALL the ones closer to 100% DIR are able to explain the DIR choices/gear setup and back it up with solid reasons, though not all of them are pleasent about it.

Hi Runvus4. I found your post very interesting reading, and I do agree with you about some of the problems with DIR newbies. It's amazing to me that some people will actually change something about their SCUBA setup without being convinced of it's validity. I guess this is where the "religion" aspect comes in.

There are a few instances where I can understand it. For example, when chosing a drysuit, it's not so easy to figure out what works, and going by an experienced persons recommendation makes sense.

However, for most aspects of the DIR system, knowing the reasons behind it are (IMO) essential to using it properly.

I have a couple of questions about your setup. You mention that you use a D-ring to keep the light canister in place. Since we are talking about reasons...the reason that there is no D-ring in that spot on a DIR system, is that the light may need to be removed if you get keyed, and also functions as a small droppable weight for many people. I realize that this is less of an issue in open water and if you have a small weight belt which you can drop. However, if you use the D-ring to attach a reel, I could see this interfering with long hose deployment, which is obviously not a good thing.

As for using a computer, we do not dive "plan/alternates". I typically plan the dive based on available gasses, depth, conditions, etc. If we dive the plan, great. If for some reason we did something else, which does happen, we simply do our deep stops and figure out the deco at the first major stop (usually 70 ft).

The reason for not using a computer, is that if you do use a computer you run into several problems. First of all, you won't remember your profiles as well, because you an always rely on the computer. It's kind of like the difference between someone telling you something and having to look it up. Once you've gone through the trouble of lookign it up, you'll remember. If there is no effort, it's in one ear out the other. At least this is my experience.

Second, the computer will usually keep you in the water longer, because it will penalize you for doing your deep stops. It may also keep you in the water longer because it's too conservative.

There has been a lot of talk recently about computers and how unrelieable they are. Check out the Uwatec thread.

I think there is nothing wrong with throwing a computer in your pocket and having it there for peace of mind, at least at first. You'll probably end up bending the computer, because it's so conservative and so punishing for any deep stops.

The most important aspects of DIR can't really be explored without in water training anyway. "rigging" DIR, is less than half the story. Situational awareness, team awareness, etc. etc. are all much more important.

I hope you don't feel I'm a laughable DIR wannabe parroting the less than pleasant role models...

[runvus4]

PM'd a reply since it its going off off topic on a fairly wide tangent.

[Wyno]

When I first started to read this board I thought DIR people were crazy. Now that I have some more experience and have learned more about diving and why DIR does it the way they do, I now am working toward that goal, will I be 100% DIR… Don’t know time will tell.

[Braunbehrens]

Come ... to the dark side, ... joung Jedi.

;-)

[padiscubapro]

for me DIR means Doing it Rebreather!

[Fetch]

Reading Quest archives... GI attachs his shock cord (bungee) with the zip tie.

From personal experience, Dave Sweetin and Tyler Moon do it the EE way, tying a knot around the mouth piece.

Mine, personally, is surgical tubing attached to the zip tie. Basically the only comment I received was that my chosen tubing was too thin (and on further questioning, found that tubing had fallen out of use).

Er, all that is to say: if you can get the bungee under the zip tie, that is a perfectly fine way to do it. If you tie it around very tight so that it doesn't pull off the mouthpiece, that's fine too.

jeff


Doof once bubbled...


That's how mine is. So why do I keep reading that it should go through the ziptie?

Or am I misreading this?

From wkpp.org:

[RavenC]

padiscubapro once bubbled...
for me DIR means Doing it Rebreather!

DIR is Doing it Raven'sway. R

[gbrandon]

DIR Tec Diver once bubbled...
Yep, one hardcore true believer right here!! Of course I was not always this way and you always have more to learn, but DIR has not only been a God send but saved my life and countless other lives for a long time now.

DIR is so much more than equipment or brand. The heart of it rests in you attitude, willingness to admit that you are wrong and the ability to set aside pride to do things the right way. All of us were what we call strokes at one point in time. (I am talking about myself not anyone in particular so don't edit my post =) I was just like most other divers at one point, oblivious to right way to do things, invincible and a complete victim of the recreational dive industry (I even had a jacket style BCD and split fins ) God forgive me.....

David

I have no problem with DIR and will take a DIR-F class sometime this year. But you my friend, have been brainwashed by DIR. I have yet to come across anything in my 35 years of life that is as great as what you describe, and Ive got quite a few hobbies and experiences. There is nothing wrong with someone thats a REC diver wanting a jacket bc and split fins. Get over it. If they have good buoyancy and trim skills, that is far more important than what their bc or fins are.

[crazyc]

gbrandon once bubbled...

There is nothing wrong with someone thats a REC diver wanting a jacket bc and split fins. Get over it. If they have good buoyancy and trim skills, that is far more important than what their bc or fins are.

Bwaahahaha
:D

[gbrandon]

crazyc once bubbled...


Bwaahahaha
:D


And your point?:confused:

[crazyc]

Sorry gbrandon,

You struck my funny bone! I don't want to rehash what has already been hashed through in previous threads, more in particular the split fin threads. First you talked about taking a DIR-F course then you talked about brainwashing by DIR, then you offered up that a REC diver with good trim and buoyancy was perfectly fine diving a jacket BC and split fins. It just didn't all seem to belong in the same message. So I was laughing my butt off. I had to share that.

Didn't mean to offend anyone.

Have a great day!

CrazyC

[gbrandon]

Not offended at all. Maybe I was just being too snippy. Sorry..

[crazyc]

Glad you weren't offended,

Sometimes I just need to laugh after a long day at work. Otherwise life gets too serious.

Have a great day

CrazyC

[Doof]

My buoyancy and trim were better when I was diving a jacket BC.

I'm sure it'll get better once I get the bugs worked out of the BP\Wing, but for now... I sometimes really miss my jacket BC, much like I really missed my wetsuit when I first started diving dry.

It's not impossible to have good buoyancy and trim in a jacket BC. It's not even particularly difficult to obtain. The only reason I switched was for doubles and cave diving. There are definite advantages I see to diving BP\Wing, but I still see nothing wrong with a jacket BC for the average Rec diver.