Some questions on SMB usage

Hi all, I'm hoping some of the more experienced divers can give me some SMB advice and answer some of my questions. There was a good thread on this not long ago but for the life of me I can't find it now (searching for TLA's doesn't work). Sorry for starting a new thread.

At any rate, I remember there was a nice youtube vid showing a diver deploy his SMB. I've managed to find the video again:


This weekend I shot my first SMB and it was quite fun actually. Everything went nice and smooth but watching the video again now I think I may have skipped some parts (like looking up before shooting the SMB) and I did one or two things differently also (like using my octo as opposed to my primary or my mouth).

So, if you don't mind, I'd like to ask these questions:
1. Is there a preference for which air source (primary, octo, mouth) to use for inflating the SMB?

2. What is the typical depth from where divers shoot SMB's? Safety stop? From what depth should I practice doing it?

3. The video is great for pointing out the steps but how long should it really take a diver to shoot an SMB? If you find yourself in a semi emergency for instance. Let's say you have an OOA diver sharing your air and now you want to shoot a SMB before you surface. Surely you'd want to do it as quick as possible. How quick is that?

4. If you're not wearing gloves I can imagine that running the reel between your fingers as in the video clip can hurt if it runs particularly fast. Any ideas?

5. Any tips on maintaining good buoyancy while inflating the SMB and before sending it to the surface?

6. Is there a good/efficient way to wind the line back on to the spool as you make your ascent? I bought a Mares compact reel (image below), thinking it would make it easier but it doesn't. It's not such a great design and now I'm thinking of removing the handle and everything so I'm left with only the reel. My question then is, how do you conveniently reel in the line again?

Hi, am no expert of SMB but I shot mine a couple of times and asked around what would the best practice be, so I will try give you the answers from my little experience

Deefstes:

1. Is there a preference for which air source (primary, octo, mouth) to use for inflating the SMB?

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I usually use my octo, you have to take care that the air you pump in the SMB will increase in volume getting up so if you have your primary in your mouth and you keep filling with the octo you might overinflate the SMB, if the line is attached to you, you might end up pulled to the surface... may be thats why in the video they used the primary, so you don't put much air?

Deefstes:

2. What is the typical depth from where divers shoot SMB's? Safety stop? From what depth should I practice doing it?

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I did the practice from the depth it should be deployed... the safety stop depth, but did the practice in a couple of easy dives where there were no real need for the SMB just to make sure all is ok. It would be nice if you add a small knot to your reel as a safety stop depth marker.

Deefstes:

3. The video is great for pointing out the steps but how long should it really take a diver to shoot an SMB? If you find yourself in a semi emergency for instance. Let's say you have an OOA diver sharing your air and now you want to shoot a SMB before you surface. Surely you'd want to do it as quick as possible. How quick is that?

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it would take no more than 15-30 seconds if you practice well.

Deefstes:

4. If you're not wearing gloves I can imagine that running the reel between your fingers as in the video clip can hurt if it runs particularly fast. Any ideas?

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either you unreel the reel till the marker knot, block the reel from rotating then add air to the SMB, you will not need your hands OR take care
My first time I was using a SMB with its own 6m line hence all I had to do is to unfold all the line and just grasp the end of it. Then I used a reel and I didn't support the line with my hand, just left it to flow as the SMB started to go up but again, need to take care not to fill the SMB fully at 5m, I usually half fill it...

Deefstes:

5. Any tips on maintaining good buoyancy while inflating the SMB and before sending it to the surface?

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just relax while doing it and fix your buoyancy well before starting to unfold the SMB and watch your depth meter to make sure you are still in place, I did nothing more to maintain buoyancy.

Deefstes:

6. Is there a good/efficient way to wind the line back on to the spool as you make your ascent? I bought a Mares compact reel (image below), thinking it would make it easier but it doesn't. It's not such a great design and now I'm thinking of removing the handle and everything so I'm left with only the reel. My question then is, how do you conveniently reel in the line again?

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while on surface waiting for the zodiac come pick us up I would rewind the line back...

my 2 cents

First I am not a DIR diver, but here are my comments......

1. I use my octo purge to get air into my DSMB - fast and easy, comes back to maintaining buoyancy, I tried the fill off the exhaust bubbles and I would only get a partially inflated DSMB........

2. I have a finger spool with 40 feet of line attached so I launch mine form less than 40 feet.....but more than 15 feet........I have 5 foot increments marked off in black with 15 feet in red........

3. I never timed it, but even with a OOA diver, I think you have time a minute or two to launch a DSMB, rather do it slow and correct than fast and have it pull you up to the surface........

4. Never been a problem, it just spools off as you hold it lightly between your fingers.....another poster, talked about dropping the reel and letting the line extend below you and just letting the DSMB pull the reel up to you, with the line going through a circle formed by your fingers (like following cave line) I think this would work well in open water........

5. See point #1, I get neutral set up the DSMB, look up and then.......purge the octo and let it fly.......no issues at all the buoyancy........at least not so far........

6. Since I just use a simple finger spool, I just reel it back on as I ascend.........after using it, when it is dry, I unwind the spool and very carefully rewind the line to have it be ready for the next time............with only 40 ft it is easy to do...............

Hope this helps................M

Is all that clipping and looping necessary?

For most divers, a pre-rigged SMB & Line is enough.

For a great percentage of that group, you could easily stow 40' of line, rolled-up inside of the stowed SMB. The reel is over-kill in most cases.

Just because technology is available, doesn't make it applicable in all occasions.

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/ad...s/285018-how-use-surface-marker-buoy-smb.html

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/advanced-scuba-discussions/277914-deploying-smb.html

http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/advanced-scuba-discussions/254718-shooting-bag-aow.html

2. What is the typical depth from where divers shoot SMB's? Safety stop? From what depth should I practice doing it?

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That's my point right there. It all depends upon at what depth you would need it on a particular dive.

Again- for most people who read SB, they would likely deploy it (upon the boat captain's briefing) when they were reaching the end of their drift dive. Usually you are instructed to do this and hang at 15' awaiting the appearance of the pick-up boat.

Then, approach the ladder safely from below and ascend.

So, for most readers here, I would suggest learning to shoot it from 20~25fsw, and then ascend to a pre-marked 15' point, doing your safety stop.

MARK YOUR SMB with your initial and show it to the boatsmen. There are a lot of SMB's floating around out there!

Some things that have helped me ...

Puffer Fish:

.... my smb has over 50 lbs of lift.. so half full is a lot.

Even if you use your octo to fill the bag (I do about half the time).. exhale, and wait till you start to drop... then fill quickly.. I usually count for two counts... and release.

If you do it right... you drop a bit, then the pull of the bag starts to pull you up and you release it... then take a breath.

Done right, you end up in the same spot.

And I keep mine smb in a mesh pouch attached to the bottom of my plate.. and my reel on my side.... not connected.

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D_B:

Puff ... thanks for the exhale first tip, it think it will help me the next time I try

One thing I discovered that made holding my depth much easier while unstowing and rigging my SMB was not to look at it while doing it .. rig it out of the corner of your eye while watching the particulate matter in the water .. it gives you immediate direct feedback on whether your rising or dropping a bit

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D_B:

.... one suggestion made to me for the first time is to do it after your safety stop .. that way if you find that you floated way up after you've fudged up filling/releasing it properly, at least it was at the end of your dive ... yes I did fudge the first one

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Reel it in by holding the spool by the edges then clipping the double ender to the line and use it as a handle to wind the line around the spool using a "stirring the pot" motion

OH, and mine is marked DB in large letters

Thanks, some good advice there folks. D_B, I'm not sure I quite understand your "stirring the pot" technique. Do you clip the double ender around the line and then twirl the double ender around the circumference of the reel? if so, I guess you'd have to twist your grip on the double ender once for every "stir" so as not to have the line twist around the double ender. Or am I misunderstanding you?

Shooting a bag is a quick process, once you have practiced it a lot. And even if you are bringing up an OOA diver, you should have enough gas reserves to do it. The key is practicing enough to be facile.

Where to shoot it? Depends on where you need it. If you are doing a direct ascent from a site without a reference line (eg. drift dive) you may want to shoot it from the bottom, to give you a visual reference throughout your ascent. If you simply want to signal the boat where you are, you may want to shoot it shallower, just so you don't have to manage the spool for so long. You do need to make sure you have enough line on your spool to make the surface . . .

I like to inflate mine orally, because it's easy and inflating it with my reg is a multi-step process. You can do that with the small bags you use for signaling. Larger bags pretty much have to be inflated with an LP hose or a purged reg.

Winding the line on the spool isn't difficult -- as DB said, you open the gate of the double-ender and put the line through it, and then you hold the spool in one hand and use the double-ender as a guide to wrap the line around the spool. Try it on land -- it isn't difficult, and you don't end up with the line wrapped around the double-ender. But especially if you are shooting the bag fairly shallow, you don't HAVE to spool the line up during ascent. You can let the spool hang and simply hold the line between two fingers, or "okay" it, and spool the line up once you are on the surface. It reduces task loading.

Maintaining buoyancy with a small bag is not difficult. Keep your breathing slow and regular while you are pulling out the bag (and make sure, if you keep it in your left pocket, that you don't roll up on your side and vent your drysuit while you get it out!). When you go to inflate the bag, go slightly head down and fin a little; it's not hard to fin against the lift in a one meter bag. Fill the bag as much as is needed for the depth where you are deploying it, check above you, okay the team, and let it go, and relax back into normal trim.

Like air-sharing and other task-loading things in diving, it does take practice to get smooth and fast at it, and to master controlling your buoyancy.

A lot of good advice already. Just a couple of minor additions.

Regarding winding up with a double ender - hold the double ender steady, and only rotate/wind the spool.

As for shooting a bag while OOA - remember there is no rush. The diver who was OOA now has gas, and you don't have to speed through everything. Think slow, and you'll be smooth and efficient.

RoatanMan:

Is all that clipping and looping necessary?

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Rigging the SMB and spool is just a little extra task loading practice commonly done in GUE-F. (Since the diver didn't check his left pocket after removing the spool, he might find that mysterious blue gloves have removed whatever else was in there later in the dive!)

I deploy an SMB near the end of every dive I do, so I've got quite a lot of practice in it. I'm happy to share some tips that I find useful.

1) I use a finger spool similar to the one in the vid. I prefer it over the kind with the line stowed right in the rolled up SMB because there's virtually no chance of entanglement if there's no line hanging down around my fins.

2) Any filling method is okay as long as it's comfortable. I use an open-circuit SMB, so I have a hard time inflating it with my exhalation. I usually just use my primary second stage, but sometimes I use the octo. It's usually easier for me to simply take my primary out of my mouth, purge some air into the neck of the SMB and pop the reg back into my mouth than it is to restow my octo after using it to fill the SMB. I personally don't like the closed-circuit kind you fill with an LP hose since it's a hassle to uncouple the hose and reconnect it afterwards. There is a kind of closed-circuit one that you can fill orally.

3) I typically deploy my SMB from a slightly greater depth than the safety stop (I usually do it at about 7 meters). By doing this, I take advantage of the expansion of the air as it rises to fill the sausage enough in order to stand tall above the water, and since I don't have to put as much air in initially as I would if I did it at 5 meters, there is less risk of riding the thing to the surface as I hold on to it to get enough air in.

4) I rarely wear gloves (the water here is *warm*), and I never get rope burns while letting the line unwind. My spool has a center hole, and I simply stick a finger and my thumb into each side of the hole to hold the spool.

5) I let the line play out with a little bit of tension to slow the ascent of the SMB slightly. If I don't do this, it tends to shoot out of the water at the surface like a rocket, and in doing so it deflates. A marker that lies flat on the surface is no good to anyone.

6) I stay a bit negative while holding the SMB on the stop. This helps keep it standing up above the water.

7) I never mark off (with a knot or a colored ink, etc.) different depths on the line. If you are in a situation with a surface current, the line will rise at an angle, and even if you are holding on at the 5 meter safety stop depth you could very well be at 3.5 meters instead. I watch my gauge/comp to know what depth to hold the line at.

8) I clip off the spool with a double ender, and I adjust the position of the clip if needed as I watch my depth.

9) I wind the line up by holding the spool steady and winding the line around it by holding the double ender in the other hand with the line inside one end, then I use the double ender to guide the line around the spool.

Hope these tips for deploying an SMB for recreational diving are useful to you.