Please read the threads by Frank Wasson on...

the Rodale message board. Can we discuss this here on this board. I think I understand what his point is and would like to hear what others have to say.

And I don't understand why in the world this man was even on this boat to begin with.

My condolences go out to his family.

I have never been to FG and from what I have read on this board and other boards, Rinn boats is a good ops but also that FG is for "advanced" divers. How can a person with only 2 dives since being certified in 1999 been aloowed to even go on this trip? It sounds as though the crews of both boats are responsible people with their briefing, but don't they check logbooks prior to departure to see if someone is qualified to dive certain locations?

Until it is determined what the cause of death was I will not speculate.

I only question why this guy was there to begin with.

Can you post a link to the thread?

Here is the link for others who wish to read the posts

http://www.scubadiving.com/talk/read.php?f=1&i=342383&t=342383

it is indeed a most unfortunate occurance. How these things happen is beyond me. I would tend to agree with socaldiver, what was this guy doing on that trip in the first place.

It's hard to say without all of the "facts"...

I simply can not imagine the pain his family is feeling...

It's the policy of Rinn to book their trips through dive shops only. I think they should require the dive shop(s)to screen the divers so they meet minimum experience requirement. Just requiring AOW or above wouldn't work necessarily because most of the divers I know who have just completed AOW aren't ready for Gulf diving. Plus there are lots of divers that have the experience and not the card.

Requirements such as X no. dives to 80+ft, and dives in currents (dive locations as well as logbook notations could verify this) should be mandatory. Maybe even dives in rough seas, too. These requirement need to be told to the divers before singing up for the trip and double checked. Then when the diver shows up on the dock, his exp. level should have been verified but if not, he was aware of it and the boat Capt. has every right to refuse him/her space on the boat.

This makes more work for everyone, and has the potential for someone along the way to lose money but for the divers safety, I think it's necessary. I've been on the Rinn boats several times and they run one of the safest operations I've ever been on. No one realizes more than they do what can happen in the Gulf and what it takes to get help out there. We all talk about not diving beyond our capabilities, and most of us don't but what about those who don't realize how challenging the dive is going to be and truly thinks they can do it? 110 miles offshore is not the place to find out you are wrong.

I think it's time for Rinn to ask for proof of experience and stick to their guns about it. This won't be a problem for divers who keep logbooks. And yes, there are those who will compile a fake logbook, and I don't know how to prevent that. I know can you can't prevent everything...

Just my 2¢
Dee

jbd,

I did read most of the Frank Wasson threads -- for perspective, can you provide general descriptions of the types of diving that goes on during these Flower Garden trips (perhaps a recount of the "intimidating" pre-trip briefing would help).

I do have some reactions, I'd just like to hear more about the "scenario" we are discussing first.

Great idea to get the discussion going over here on scubaboard.

Frank Wasson posted a followup thread, after the main accident description, in which he raises the issue of inadequate training. That certainly produced a spate of responses, mostly agreeing that certification was getting lax. But it appears to me that divers are like car drivers, i.e. in the same way that 99% of drivers think that they're good drivers, there's probably a lot of that in diving too.

I, of course, happen to think I'm a good driver -- I constantly monitor my mirrors, they're adjusted to properly minimize my blind spot, I drive defensively, I don't look at my passenger when I talk to them, I don't pick up cassette tapes from the floor while going 60mph, I don't drive with my knee, etc. Am I a good driver?

What makes a good diver?

-Simon

I cannot and will not attempt to draw any kind of conclusions from this unfortunate tragedy. As far as Mr Wesson's second thread, I hate to sound calous (from what I have read Mr Wesson and crew are very nice people) but it almost seems as though he started the thread to detract people from the real issue here. THE DIVER HAD NO BUSINESS ON THAT BOAT, imho.

We have talked about it before, being responsible for your actions. This diver unfortunately was not being responsible, the boat operators were not being responsible for letting this man go and also maybe the LDS that signed this man up is also at fault.

People need to think. Nature is a beautiful place that most people like to explore, but Mother Nature is also non forgiving when you blow it.

Meant Mr Wasson.

I have been told repeatedly the Flower Gardens are NOT a novice diver trip. Yet the dive shops who book the trips will sell a trip to any one who can pay. The currents are unpredictable and so is the weather. I have been told if the conditions are not favorable out there the Rinn Capts will not put divers in the water. I don't doubt its true.

On the flip side....

We can not protect people from themselves. He could have been able to meet all the requirements to make the trip, and have still had the same thing happen. Many people will never understand diving in some cases, as in the Flower gardens, is a physical sport. There is alot of physical exertion which will lead to elevated heart rates. There are plenty of other dives which are much more relaxed.

I agree the dive shops need to screen people and so does Rinn, and be prepared to refund peoples money.

My prayers to the family on its tragic loss.

Tom