Today's OW Course

There has been much discussion on other threads about OW course training standards. Over the years, I have seen many training agencies lower their standards. Although I find this very disappointing, it has been pointed-out that these changes have had little affect on the safety of new divers. The accident rates apparently haven't increased.

There is concern that some Instructors tend to certify divers without insuring that even the minimums have been met. It would seem that some LDS push through their students as a form of revenue generation and try to get them back to "complete their training," by offering Advanced courses.

How do you see the current situation when it comes to diver OW certification?

The same thing goes for Instructor standards, many Agencies have decreased these standards over the years. How would increased standards for Instructor certification affect the industry?

First, since we have no way to measure the number of dives made in a given time period or even of knowing the number of divers, there's no way to know the accident rate. We certainly don't know if the accident rate is rising, falling or remaining the same.

Second, even if we did know the accident rate, that would merely be one factor in evaluating quality of training.

We don't have hard data at hand as Walter points out but it isn't difficult to see the results of crappy instruction.

When you show up on a charter boat they treat you as retarded drooling idiot, unless they know you. This didn't happen overnight, I would show up by myself in boats in different places and do my dives, then little by little silly rules started to creep up.
Why do they do that? it would be easier for them to let divers do their thing, but only if said divers KNOW how to do their thing.

In Panama City, FL it is normal for the boat hand (DM or whatever) to have to chase after a diver getting lost between 2 and 3 times a week. I could not believe it when I heard that.
Diving here could not be easier from a charter if you can overcome the fact that is usually cold and gray. Boat ties up, you go down the line, dive and then up the line. The dive from a typical charter is either a bridge span or a wannabe wreck.
So what is so difficult about going down a line explore 100 yards or so of a bridge span and then locate the same line to come up?

Churning divers with lack of skills may not create more deaths, but sure makes dealing with them highly annoying.

I agree with your assessment that many OW courses are taught so as to "just get your feet wet" with the implication that your instruction should be completed in subsequent courses. Since fewer than 30% of divers train beyond their basic OWD certification, the implications are startling.

While more recent data may be available, the following is taken from DAN's "ANNUAL DIVING REPORT", 2007, and is based on 2005 data and pertains to dive fatalities, not diver injuries:

1. Eighty-two percent of males and of females were 40 years or older;
2. The median age at fatality was 50 years for males and 43 years for females;
3. BMI data indicates that 26% were classified as normal weight, 37% were
overweight, 28% were obese; and nine percent were morbidly obese;
4. Fifty-two percent had been diving 10 years or more, and 26% one year or less. More years of diving did not seem to improve your odds of survival;
5. Sixty-four percent of fatal dives involved pleasure or sightseeing, 14% involved
spearfishing, hunting or collecting game, and 10% involved training;
6. The median reported depth of underwater accidents was 60 fsw. Twenty-five percent of cases occurred in 20 fsw or less and 25% in 100 fsw or deeper;
7. 87% of deaths occurred on the first day of diving and 13% on the second to fourth day of diving.

I would like to highlight two important observations:
1. 87% of deaths occurred on the first day of diving, and most of these dives were from a charter boat. If we want to decrease fatality rates we need to make sure that divers keep up their training and don't overdo it on their first dives. Save the Blue Hole or a strong current dive for day 3 of your trip;
2. Poor training would be reflected in both dive fatalities and dive injuries. Poor health would tend to manifest more in dive fatalities.

I'd LOVE to see dive injury and fatality reports broken down by certification agency. I suggested this to Alert Diver several months ago, but that is one study that people may be intimidated to undertake.

A couple of observations:

It's not uncommon for newly "certified" divers to complete their training and never really moved off the training platform.

Many divers go months.... even years between dives. A large number of the Tune-up students I get got certified, dove maybe once or twice, then have not been in the water since.

Perhaps the dive industry needs to police itself by demanding a signed and up-to-date dive log before the diver even gets on the boat. Although it's a pain, I don't blame the resorts that require a skills test before one is allowed to dive.

At times it appears as if we are our own worst enemy.

mpetryk:

I'd LOVE to see dive injury and fatality reports broken down by certification agency. I suggested this to Alert Diver several months ago, but that is one study that people may be intimidated to undertake.

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I think many of us have a good idea how that would turn out...

Dr Neil:

A couple of observations:

It's not uncommon for newly "certified" divers to complete their training and never really moved off the training platform.

Many divers go months.... even years between dives. A large number of the Tune-up students I get got certified, dove maybe once or twice, then have not been in the water since.

Perhaps the dive industry needs to police itself by demanding a signed and up-to-date dive log before the diver even gets on the boat. Although it's a pain, I don't blame the resorts that require a skills test before one is allowed to dive.

At times it appears as if we are our own worst enemy.

Click to expand...

So regular divers have to endure even more BS? geeee thanks.

If there is going to be any dive-police action, aim that action to the actual problem. A diver signs up with a charter, the operator logs the name of the diver and the name of the instructor of said diver. If the diver screws up both names are turned in to the dive-police. Then figure a fair number of crappy students and the instructor is out.
After a few instructors loos their ticket I'm sure the changes will happen pretty fast.

Meanwhile divers that just want to dive in peace can go on with their life, and so are the instructors that do decent work helping people to learn how to dive.

I think it is dangerous to make statements in public that instructors are not meeting standards or that the standards are too low to be safe. of course it is possible for some instructors to attempt to make money training divers, however every instructor I have ever met or talked to was not in it for the house in hollywood, every single instructor I have met loves to dive, loves to teach diving. Just like parents they do their best.

people are all different, teach the same thing to 10 people and you will have 10 interpretations of what was taught. teach something physical and all bets are off on what was learned. The standards have been worked on for many years, they are designed to give the basic diver the basics of what is more or less safe to attempt. how a specific diver behaves in open water on their first unsupervised dive is up to them and their comfort level with what they were taught. They can ask as many questions in class as they might want till they understand.

to look back at an accident and say they were not taught enough to be safe is BS. they were taught the same thing 100% of divers were taught. Their failure was theirs alone. we would like to think "get perfect training and be perfectly safe" that is a pipe dream. diving is not safe, do it at your own risk, after you sign the release form.

if you do not feel you can handle the risks, stay off the sidewalk.

DCBC:

I think many of us have a good idea how that would turn out...

Click to expand...

I did by Basic OWD with ACUC and I can't say enough about how thorough the training was. One participant in the course was having great difficulty completing the 75 foot underwater swim (with fins) followed by (without taking a breath) diving to the bottom and putting on his scuba gear. He complained bitterly that his girlfriend got certified in only a weekend and "didn't have to do any of this $h!+." Needless to say, the girlfriend wasn't certified through ACUC.

I dunno. More requirements, restrictions is what we don't want. Diving is maybe one of the last areas where it is basically unregulated. Divers must take responsibility, as they know it is an activity which can lead to death if not careful. But hey, I've seen people swimming on the panhandle in the Gulf of Mexico in conditions where even I wouldn't venture in-- and their young kids, too. People must use reason as to whether to make the dive or not.