Descending too fast

[salub2007]

HI,
Just completed my SSI night diving specialty course, and I have been noticing,
especially due to darkness, that I am descending a bit too fast initially.
I am a new diver with only 40 dives, and I guess that buoyancy is still an issue. I attempt to descend feet first but after a few minutes of having trouble getting down, I dive face first and find that usually gets be to the bottom very easily, but sometimes a bit too fast. Is there a happy medium? I am properly weighted and find that adding or subtracting weight makes the problem worse. Any clever insights? My instructor has given me advice, 1. watch your guages on descent, 2. feet first descent 3. Inflate BC if descent is uncontrolled. Some good advice, could use other opinions though.
Thanks,
Salub

[Cave Diver]

HI,
Just completed my SSI night diving specialty course, and I have been noticing,
especially due to darkness, that I am descending a bit too fast initially.
I am a new diver with only 40 dives, and I guess that buoyancy is still an issue. I attempt to descend feet first but after a few minutes of having trouble getting down, I dive face first and find that usually gets be to the bottom very easily, but sometimes a bit too fast. Is there a happy medium? I am properly weighted and find that adding or subtracting weight makes the problem worse. Any clever insights? My instructor has given me advice, 1. watch your guages on descent, 2. feet first descent 3. Inflate BC if descent is uncontrolled. Some good advice, could use other opinions though.
Thanks,
Salub

Try a horizontal descent.

[ScubaSteve]

If you are dscending too fast, I would question whether you are properly weighted. But really what is the problem? Are you finding yourself lightheaded or anything when you get to the bottom? Are you bouncing off the bottom from the speed? Obviously there must be something that has cuased you to believe this to be an issue. More information will be helpful I think.

Also, start adding a bit of air to your BC as you descend....don't wait as long as you likely are. This will control your descent better.

[Web Monkey]

HI,
Just completed my SSI night diving specialty course, and I have been noticing,
especially due to darkness, that I am descending a bit too fast initially.
I am a new diver with only 40 dives, and I guess that buoyancy is still an issue.

Descend a few feet then adjust your buoyancy and stop. Descend a little more, adjust your buoyancy, then stop. Repeat as necessary.

As you descend your wetsuit compresses as does any air in your BC, which makes you increasingly negative. You need to add air to your BC as you descend to counteract this. Stopping periodically during your descent ensures that you actually have full control of your descent speed. Once you get a feel for how much air to add, you can descend at any speed you want.

The trick is to get a feel for your descent rate and how much air you need to add to your BC. Once you can control yourself and can come to a complete stop at any time, doing a continuous under-control descent will be much easier.

Descending horizontally also helps a lot, but you still need to gain full control over your buoyancy.

Terry

[fisheater]

Try descending like a skydiver. Horizontal and flared. I find that that gives me the most control.

[Michael_Lambert]

I too would be interested in hearing what sort of gear / weighting you are using and to what depths.

Until i hit the 40-60 foot mark i don't have an issue with my decent.. Deflate my wing exhale my breath and i get started usually dropping around 30 feet per min, Chasing after a troubled buddy or for kicks I can drop my head and kick and get done as fast as my ears can clear and never had an issue.

[Michael_Lambert]

Try descending like a skydiver. Horizontal and flared. I find that that gives me the most control.

My personal preference is this position minus the flared part from start to finish on the dive. Gives you the best decent/accent control and the least resistance when in forward or backwards motions.

[FishDiver]

Are you able to equalize on the way down? Do you hit the bottom at the end of the descent?

Starting about halfway down, start adding a bit of air to your BC to slow and control your descent.

[TSandM]

Unlike with ascents, there is no prescribed descent rate. You can descend as fast as you can clear your ears (and add gas to your drysuit). Sometimes, with scooters, we just turn head down and hit the trigger! What you care about is being able to arrest your descent before hitting the bottom. This is easier to do if the descent is slow, but with practice, you get a sense of how much air you need to add and how fast.

[Peter Guy]

My instructor has given me advice, 1. watch your guages [sic] on descent, 2. feet first descent 3. Inflate BC if descent is uncontrolled. I know not what others may think, but I find this more than a bit disconcerting -- in particular #'s 2 & 3.

Yes, one SHOULD be watching their gauges on descent -- that's what they are there for -- to give you information about where you are in the water column! (And another great example of why wrist mounted depth/time gauges are a good thing.)

But descend feet first? I know that is often taught but, c'mon, that is just an invitation to first stir up the bottom (you are finning to slow your descent and thus forcing water straight down) and then crash into it (you can't see the bottom to know where it is). Yes, I descend feet first -- but only for the first 2 or 3 feet and then I flare out, slow down, make sure everything is working (including my ears!) and then continue floating down.

Inflate my BC if my descent is uncontrolled? It is, after all, a BUOYANCY compensator and if I'm diving wet, then it is my primary BUOYANCY compensator. Don't we want to be just slightly negative as we descend so that we sink while under control? Now IF the OP is diving dry, then yes, you may want to use the suit as your primary BUOYANCY compensation device. (Query, IF you are diving dry, why in the world would you want to descend feet first and force the air out your neck seal and/or vent?) But the idea is YOU NEED TO COMPENSATE FOR LOSS OF BUOYANCY of your suit and BC as you descend. Of course you need to add air to your BUOYANCY compensation device.

OP -- this is NOT a dig at you. It is just that the information you've been given indicates a lack of thoughtfulness about your situation and just happens to hit one of my buttons.

As others have said, flare out early, add little bits of air to your BC (drysuit) early and often which will keep you SLIGHTLY negative and floating down. If done properly, a big inhale will then stop you and give you the time to add air so that you are neutral at your depth with a normal breath.

[Bubbletrubble]

Along the same lines as Web Monkey's recommendations, turn it into a game. Can you halt your descent and hover at a depth of 10 ft.? OK. What about 15 ft. and 20 ft.? Now try to hover at 30 ft. Breaking up your descent like this will guarantee that you are descending under control. At any point during a dive (descent, ascent, finning along the bottom), you should be able to establish neutral buoyancy. That's critical to diving under control.

If you are properly weighted, you should be able to descend very easily (provided that you aren't trapping any air in your wetsuit or BCD). The way I weight myself, I'm negatively buoyant by the weight of my gas at the beginning of the dive -- that's between 6 and 7.5 pounds depending on the tank used. With a deep exhale, I descend very easily regardless of body position (feet-first, head-first, horizontal). That being said, adopting a horizontal position will create more drag and should make it easier to slow down descents/ascents. That's what many of us do.

Assuming that you don't have any air-trapping issues (wetsuit or BCD) and that you're properly weighted, I can see one of two things complicating your initial descent:

Unintentional finning -- If you are trying to descend feet-first and you're kicking a little, it's no surprise that you won't sink! For this reason, many instructors recommend that you cross your ankles/feet at the beginning of descent. This is a very common problem among novice divers.
Inappropriate breathing patterns -- I've gone diving with newer divers who hold their breath while they dump air from their BCD. By the time their BCD is empty, they have to breathe again so they inhale deeply. Then they hold their breath again. They aren't sinking, so they get nervous. They start to breathe more rapidly and shallow. It's no wonder they can't sink! (I think TSandM mentioned this in a recent SB thread.) Try this. Inhale deeply while you dump air from your BCD. Once your BCD is completely empty, you should still be at the surface since your lungs are now full. Now exhale slowly and fully. You'll be surprised how easily you descend.

It can be more difficult to manage your descent while night diving. There's more task-loading involved. You're futzing with a light, monitoring your gauges, and trying to keep tabs on your buddy. That's a lot to deal with. I'd recommend practicing buoyancy control during the day first. Being able to juggle it all will get easier with practice.

As Peter Guy advised, add little puffs of air early and often to moderate your descent. The deeper you go, the larger (or more frequent) those puffs will get. This becomes abundantly clear if you dive to 100+ fsw while wearing a thick wetsuit. I've done my fair share of diving with novices who can't control their descent. (Heck, I had the same issue when I first picked up the sport.) They transform into odd-looking dirt darts...creating impressive silt clouds at the bottom. The secret is small puffs...early and often. Remember that.

Have fun out there...

[SteveR1952]

The OP was asking about descending too fast at night. Night dives can be "interesting" for buoyancy control since your view of the bottom and/or surface and other references is greatly diminished. Judging descent speeds can be tough unless you watch your gauges and keep at a reasonably rate (one that you can control). Descending feet first allows you some safety margin for crashing into stuff on the way to the bottom or near the bottom and gives you a bit more warning time to arrest your descent before crashing into the bottom. A horizontal descent is great if you are already under control or to get control but gives you little reaction time if you are about to crash into an object obscured by darkness (like the bottom or rocks, reefs, airplanes, etc.) along your descent path.

Go slow and be sure you shine your light down as much as possible while checking your gauges as you descend. As the others have said...keep it slow and keep it under control and eventually you won't have the bottom crashing issues at night or during restricted visibility dives. Good buoyancy control is good diving no matter what the conditions.

[LeadTurn_SD]

Hi Salub,

I find it easier day or night, to control my descent in a horizontal, flared position. At night, I keep my light pointed at the bottom. The "sky diver" position provides the most "drag" for both ascents and descents, thus making control easier. Like Peter mentioned, I start vertical, but rotate almost immediately into a horizontal position as I descend. I've found this makes it MUCH easier to control (and stop if needed) the descent.

Best wishes.

[fisheater]

And don't forget that your ears will be a very good depth gauge during your first 20 feet or so of descent.

[JimLap]

The OP was asking about descending too fast at night. Night dives can be "interesting" for buoyancy control since your view of the bottom and/or surface and other references is greatly diminished. Judging descent speeds can be tough unless you watch your gauges and keep at a reasonably rate (one that you can control). Descending feet first allows you some safety margin for crashing into stuff on the way to the bottom or near the bottom and gives you a bit more warning time to arrest your descent before crashing into the bottom. A horizontal descent is great if you are already under control or to get control but gives you little reaction time if you are about to crash into an object obscured by darkness (like the bottom or rocks, reefs, airplanes, etc.) along your descent path.

Go slow and be sure you shine your light down as much as possible while checking your gauges as you descend. As the others have said...keep it slow and keep it under control and eventually you won't have the bottom crashing issues at night or during restricted visibility dives. Good buoyancy control is good diving no matter what the conditions.

This is obviously what you were taught in your OW class. Let me say this. It;s a load of BS. A horizontal descent gives you much more control over your rate, is infinitely easier to adjust, and is one helluva lot safer with regards to objects below. A feet first descent is used by divers who have not been taught proper buoyancy control and trim in OW class. Unfortunately that is too many people out there today.

Especially at night. Horizontal you are able to look down and shine your light and see the sharp rock, piece of jagged metal that will punch right thru the bottom of your boot or suit leg, the stonefish (This was on one of my dives in the keys), or the ray buried in the sand and give you time to react. If you cannot do horizontal ascents and descents stick with using a line and diving during the day.

Vertical descents and ascents for that matter are much harder to control if they start getting out of hand. Why do you think the advice if things do go screwy is to flare the body. It gives you more control! Flare in the first place and it's a non issue. I teach my students to be vertical for the first 5-8 feet of a descent then get horizontal to the bottom. On ascent it's horizontal til 10-15 feet, get NEUTRAL, get vertical enough to look up and around for boats, docks, other divers, etc. Then do your stop HORIZONTAL, followed by a nice slow ascent to the surface. If on a line yeah they can get upright, if no line and no overhead hazards- come up horizontal till that last few feet.

It is also easier to monitor rates and use your gauges if you are laying out flat. Even with a line at night a horizontal descent is preferred. But this is assuming your buoyancy is good to start with. If you are still having issues with buoyancy then work on that before doing any night or low vis dives. There is no trick to descending at night. You just use different references- gauges, lights, other divers, line if there is one, even marine life. Look like a diver, act like a diver, soon you will think like one. The longer it takes to do that the longer it takes to learn.

[dseiden]

How do you start your descent? Try not letting quite as much air out of your BC to begin with, and remember there is often a delay in what you do with the BC to you rising/sinking. Let out a few little puffs of air, give it a few seconds to let you start descending, and if you want to go further then let more air out. If you feel you're going too fast then add some air back in small puffs.

[dumpsterDiver]

Wow, you guys make it sound so hard. I often just flip over and swim toward the bottom. After I get going, I will descend faster and faster and I can stop swimming. As I approach the bottom, I flare and add air;.... or sometimes I just crash into the bottom, stand up, add air, equalize my ears a final time, clear my mask, take a piss, and then try to figure out where the hell my buddy is.

[JimLap]

DAMN I NEEDED THAT! :rofl3:That's why you are a dumpster diver! :shocked2:The hell with form all that matters is getting down and getting funky!!!:cool2::fro:

[DwayneJ]

First, I don't now if you are renting or you own your gear - Dive regularly with gear you are familiar with - adding air to your wing is while equalizing descending becomes instinctive. Practice horizontal descent and arriving 3-4ft above the bottom with correct buoyancy.

My buddy and I night dive for lobsters 2-3 times a week. We establish a course we are going to swim and set our compasses on the boat before we jump in. Once we a descending, the assumption is its "game on" as soon as we can see the bottom. No time to be playing with buoyancy.

As long as you have buoyancy control as you arrive 4ft above the bottom and you are staying close to your buddy, you are not descending too fast.

[fnfalman]

If you're properly weighted then you wouldn't drop like a rock.

But like others said, descend with a horizontal body trim and flare your legs and arms out (starfish) to slow your descend rate even more. Inflate BC slightly as you go down. A small squirt here and there.

[Peter Guy]

If you're properly weighted then you wouldn't drop like a rock. Why do you write this? Although we may disagree on what "dropping like a rock" is, if I'm "properly weighted" at the beginning of a dive here in Puget Sound, using an HP 130 (perhaps slightly overfilled, ahem) and a drysuit, I'm going to be at least 10 pounds negative at the beginning of my dive. IF I let all the air out of my BC and I don't have any air in my drysuit, you bet I'll drop like a rock!

Why do I think I'm properly weighted and 10 pounds negative? Well, I have about 8+ pounds of gas in my tank which I'm going to use up (well, use most of it up); and I want to be "neutral" at the very end of my dive at 20 FSW or so BUT also warm, which means I'll have some air in my drysuit. Thus at the start of my dive I'll need enough lead to offset the 8+ pounds of air I might use plus enough lead to offset the "warmth air" in my drysuit at the end of the dive -- that means I'll be AT LEAST 10 pounds negative at the beginning of my dive.

We need to be very careful about declaring what is "proper weighting" because it varies a lot depending on the circumstances.

[neopluredon]

day or night, i have noticed that what kept me descend faster was feet first on the ground and had struggle 2 or 3 minutes just to figure out that i would feel most comfortable with a sky diver's position. during the 3 or 4 dives when i was struggling onwards to 120ft, i was feeling that i am being drowned by the air i am breathing. i stopped and breathed slowly** until i felt my lungs are relaxed. then descended further to look for my buddy.

**perhaps, so far, one of my nightmares-came-true that i have experienced in diving: the worst visibility with the most unmindful buddy (he can't hear the tank noises i was making), feeling being drowned, can't equalise with my right ear (... i figured out equalising by diving deeper and leaned on my left until the right ear pain went away and blew my nose once i felt pressure on my left ear... [i hope you can imaging how stupid i looked at that time]. strangely though, i am having this struggling at 40-60 ft and by 90, my right ear would then pop. i will be consulting an ent specialist soon. )

[salub2007]

No no other problem other than descending too fast. No light-headedness, no other issues,
other than seeing the depth and descent rate, and saying, "Wow I descended too fast, Or I should slow my descent down.". But honestly there has been no other problem other than my noticing this problem.

[TMHeimer]

As long as you're properly weighted and can equalize OK speed doesn't matter. In the Gulf of Mex. there is usually some current, so it's go down pulling yourself on the anchor line. The faster one got down there the more air one had. Of course (especially at night) you should monitor your depth and get neutrally buoyant prior to the bottom--don't want Project Aware police after you.

[scubadada]

You can't descend too fast assuming you can equalize. Best not to crash land, become neutral before the bottom.

Good diving, Craig

[akmike907]

I'm surprised I haven't seen this yet, but here's what I do. I tend to descend feet first (when with the nazi'esque girlfriend) and just give a slight kick or two to keep pace with her usually very slow descents.

[Walter]

Unlike with ascents, there is no prescribed descent rate.

The US Navy disagrees with you. Their maximum recommended descent rate is 75 feet/minute. A rapid descent rate allows little time to adjust to increased narcosis. When narcosis hits me rapidly, as in a fast descent, I find it more difficult to effectively deal with it.

[TSandM]

Yes, I have read that narcosis is a bigger issue with rapid descents, but that's only an issue with descents to depths where narcosis is prominent. On a 60 foot dive, I think you can really go down as fast as you want.

[Walter]

Not according to the US Navy Dive Manual.

[walke121]

I've basically "rode the anchor" down to 180' when bounce diving while spearing. Its been said on here but as long as there is no issue equalizing I've never had a problem. The faster I can get to the bottom the more dives I can do in a day. Just be careful doing something like this because you can "out run" your computer and have seen a few people get slightly bent doing this.