I wanted to post my experience on what happened to my HID yesterday during my mini class on Doubles.
I purchased my Halcyon HID, last year in April 09. I haven't dove it the year when tragedy struck.
We entered Break Water to start our mini-'s double class, all went well for our first dive, complete use of the light for signaling and drills; approx 30 ft max dive.
With a surface interval of approx 45 mins we got ready to enter the water, gear was not disassembled just inspected that all was ready for dive two.
Entered the water, dive goes exceptionally well, with HID fully deployed and communication a plus with the assistance of the light.
As our instructor and my team captain ascend for our deco stop, the light has performed flawless.
As I get to the surface, I shut off my light through the switch. Our instructor wants us to descend again to perform a 500 psi weight check.
I reach over to the switch, and flip it, and notice my light doesn't come on. I pause and repeat while looking at the light, the light comes on then right off. I repeat this three more times with the same results, and think the light needs maybe to cool down, so I leave it off.
I descend, and my team captain, signals over to me to strike my light. I try again and nothing, I let him know the light is non operational and I deploy my Halcyon Scout and finish the dive.
As we exit the water and head back to unload our equipment, I look at my light and notice that the blue o-ring is bubbling, OH Know!!!
How can this occur, why did my light work flawless during both dives but at the end of dive two, fail me? Was this user caused? Is this a flaw design of the switch?
I was REALLY UPSET, we are talking about $1,400 dollar investment I made last April, and I like all other divers, I double check all equipment and keep it in top shape condition, after all dives.
I dry the light with just a clean towel. I get home and immediately check the Halcyon website for my warranty information.
They honor a one year warranty against failure of design, but don't cover accident flooding; which they list as forgetting to place O-ring during a dive or altering the unit in any way.
The good news is that my class was fully videoed by my instructor since it was a training class; Halcyon can see that the light was operational during both dives, but failed at the end of the second dive, when I shut it off by the switch.
I know there are other Halcyon owners of this particular light, and would want to know what happened to mine.
On Monday I will be contacting Halcyon along with my authorized dive shop that sold me the unit, I will place all feed back on this thread and keep you all informed of the outcome. I am lucky the light is still under the one year warranty, if this is design flaw.
Thanks,
Michael Guerrero
scubafanatic
February 21st, 2010, 07:12 PM
doesn't this light have a sealed/isolated battery compartment where you can't flood the battery ? Sounds like a defective switch, should be easy for Halcyon to see it wasn't your fault and make things right, especially as you have your selling dealer pulling for you to.
Gombessa
February 21st, 2010, 08:56 PM
Hi Mike,
Sorry to hear this happened! From the description, it's hard to tell what the cause may be, but if you can see the o-ring bubbling out of the water, chances are that's a byproduct of having the canister flood. The actual cause may be a number of things, including a hair breaking the o-ring seal, a nick in the cord or the switch boot, something causing the battery pack to build up and release gas, or a number of other things.
The best thing to do is get in touch with Corey at Halcyon tech service and arrange to send the light back in for troubleshooting and repair. They do a great job and will be sure to take care of you.
mikeguerrero
February 21st, 2010, 09:57 PM
Hey Kenn,
Thanks for the feedback. At this point you are right, I don't know why she took in water, Halcyon will have to decide that. I already know about Corey from their website and he will be getting a phone call from me tomorrow.
They also want you to contact the LDS and present the original sales receipt and that it be within the year warranty. Luck is on my side here, because I fall within the first year, the light was purchased in the middle of April.
Kenn I was getting ready to send in my light for it's first annual service, Halcyon offer two packages, I was going to do the deluxe:
Standard Package Includes:
Complete battery test & detailed graph of burn time
Bulb & socket inspection
Canister & sealing surface inspection
Replacement of all O-rings
Pressure test to 300 ft (90 m)
Deluxe Package Includes:
Cord and switchboot replacement
Complete battery test & detailed graph of burn time
Bulb & socket inspection
Canister & sealing surface inspection
Replacement of all O-rings
Pressure test to 300 ft (90 m)
Kenn, I am hoping it is a weak switch or something irregular with the switch, as it's the only thing I touched on the dive.
Just so odd that after a full second dive, at the end of the dive the light went, why didn't she flood in the beginning, was the leak that slow?
Well, I will keep all posted.
MG
Gombessa
February 21st, 2010, 10:04 PM
Just so odd that after a full second dive, at the end of the dive the light went, why didn't she flood in the beginning, was the leak that slow?
There are a lot of possibilities. It could be a slow leak. The switch boot (or some other part) may have come loose or torn during or after the second dive or when you swtiched the light off, maybe something jostled then. Can't say without seeing it, but I don't think it's a particularly odd occurrence to have a failure near the end of the dive.
I'm sure Halcyon will tell you what they find happened.
a22shady
February 21st, 2010, 10:54 PM
Hey Mike,
I have just had a simillar situation not with the bubbling O-ring but the on/off flicker. I purchase the same light Back in December just used it for the 1st time in a pool as I have never used a can light. Actually It was my girlfriends light as we both bought one Mine worked hers well turned on for about 2 min then shut off. we surfaced waited a few minuted and turned it back on it then came on and died with in 20 seconds. So we got home did a little trouble shooting. I put my light head on her battery to check the battery it worked perfectly. I then put her light head on my battery same issue. So we figured out some part of the light head was bad.
Even though very dissapointed I contacted Halcyon and sent in my light. Corey was great I had my light back and fixed with in a week. The troubled part was the ballast. If you call ask to speak to corey let him know of your displeasment. He is very nice and never gave me one once of a hard time. I must say I have never had a Manufacturer do something so easy before.
Rainer
February 21st, 2010, 11:05 PM
A flooded/flooding light can still burn for quite some time. Turn it off, though, and it might not re-strike. It could have been something that occurred on the first dive...
Best to just pack it up and send it to Halcyon. They can give you more info at that point.
Hopefully it wasn't user error (which of course isn't covered by warranty).
Good luck.
mikemill
February 21st, 2010, 11:26 PM
It is his light's way of getting back at him for not being able to reach all his valves :D
mikeguerrero
February 22nd, 2010, 12:57 AM
A flooded/flooding light can still burn for quite some time. Turn it off, though, and it might not re-strike. It could have been something that occurred on the first dive...
Best to just pack it up and send it to Halcyon. They can give you more info at that point.
Hopefully it wasn't user error (which of course isn't covered by warranty).
Good luck.
Rainer,
At this point it is all up to Halcyon and what they say happened. I have clearly explained, how the light was used for both dives. I am completely baffled as to how it died on the last dive at the end.
User error, I did everything the same as I have done since I first got the light, last April 2009. I don't want this thread to become a pointed blame at user or Halcyon.
I just want users to be aware that this happened to me based on these events. It's a very expensive light and, users of these lights deserve to know good and bad practices.
If I had jumped in the ocean with the o-ring off, I would be the first to have posted about my error or had I seen a nick on the cable, that's me.
Having said that, I have been treated by Halcyon with just A-1 service. A while back, I had a problem with my Evolve 40 lb wing, and they took care of me immediately without hesitation, I felt great.
kathydee
February 22nd, 2010, 01:04 AM
Mike,
Sorry to hear about your light. Good luck getting it fixed. I know it's your baby ;-).
Anti-Hero
February 22nd, 2010, 03:52 AM
Rainer,
At this point it is all up to Halcyon and what they say happened. I have clearly explained, how the light was used for both dives. I am completely baffled as to how it died on the last dive at the end.
User error, I did everything the same as I have done since I first got the light, last April 2009. I don't want this thread to become a pointed blame at user or Halcyon.
I just want users to be aware that this happened to me based on these events. It's a very expensive light and, users of these lights deserve to know good and bad practices.
If I had jumped in the ocean with the o-ring off, I would be the first to have posted about my error or had I seen a nick on the cable, that's me.
Having said that, I have been treated by Halcyon with just A-1 service. A while back, I had a problem with my Evolve 40 lb wing, and they took care of me immediately without hesitation, I felt great.
That's an awful lot of problems with basically brand new gear.
Peter_C
February 22nd, 2010, 01:52 PM
Two of us have had "H" pressure gauges fail and both were warranted with no issues. One of my other friends had a can light fail and he only had to pay shipping. Flooding a light? Ouch!
mikeguerrero
February 22nd, 2010, 04:24 PM
Update,
I got off the phone with Correy at Halycon. He was very attentive to my explanation of what occured. He felt my concern to the event and very nicely told me to package the unit and send it to them.
He told me it could be a number of things: o-ring on the cannister nicked, 0-ring being lubed and traps dirt or hair and even suggested the battery could have short circuited, thus causing the rupture of pressure from within forcing the 0-ring to give way.
Also mentioned they will do a full analysis of the light and let me know from there the cause. He knows I'm a Halcyon addict, I love there selection of equipment, not to mention it makes me feel good about me.
As I write this post, the light has been shipped.
kathydee
February 22nd, 2010, 04:31 PM
Good luck Mike!
bbianchi
February 25th, 2010, 08:37 PM
Mike,
Out of curiosity how did you treat your o-ring? I know personally I clean and re silicone the o-ring after each time I open the canister. You have to pay special attention to sand and salt crystals depending on how long/well you soak it. Also if you have pets you gotta look out for the pet hair, etc. Also you dont want TOO much silicone but enough to make the o-ring look wet.
If you already know all this, then never mind me. I just have to be extra cautious these days thanks to Halcyon for pushing Salvo out of business. I don't have a service department anymore :(.
mikeguerrero
February 26th, 2010, 12:17 AM
Mike,
Out of curiosity how did you treat your o-ring? I know personally I clean and re silicone the o-ring after each time I open the canister. You have to pay special attention to sand and salt crystals depending on how long/well you soak it. Also if you have pets you gotta look out for the pet hair, etc. Also you dont want TOO much silicone but enough to make the o-ring look wet.
If you already know all this, then never mind me. I just have to be extra cautious these days thanks to Halcyon for pushing Salvo out of business. I don't have a service department anymore :(.
Brandon,
Halcyon instructions are very clear about not using silicone at all on the O-ring. You are to clean it and maintain it through simple inspection.
The use of silicone can attract dirt/fibers to break the seal. I have never used silicone as per their instructions.
MG
a22shady
February 26th, 2010, 12:58 AM
Mike,
As i said earlier I also had an Issue with one of the 2 lights I Purchased but rest assure they will do everything they can to fix the problem and make you happy. I am very pleased with there service. I also had my light back to me with in a week. Much much faster then expected
TSandM
February 26th, 2010, 01:21 AM
Halcyon in general has a pretty good reputation for standing behind their lights, and for quick and effective service on them. I'm sure this will turn out just fine.
mikeguerrero
February 26th, 2010, 05:11 AM
Halcyon in general has a pretty good reputation for standing behind their lights, and for quick and effective service on them. I'm sure this will turn out just fine.
Lynn,
So far, all has been good from Halcyon. I have worked with them in the past and they are stellar.
I can't believe this happened during my doubles class with Don, everything was videoed up to the light not working.
Don even annotates in the video, the phrase, poor primary light, when he sees me deploy the Halcyon Scout.
I was so sad, but rest assured I learned how to deploy the backup, couldn't imagine that light going out in some, deep, dark cave, oh my. :shocked2:
mobeeno
February 27th, 2010, 10:36 AM
I was so sad, but rest assured I learned how to deploy the backup, couldn't imagine that light going out in some, deep, dark cave, oh my. :shocked2:
Mike,
Check out the lights used by the Cousteau team while cave diving.
YouTube - Sipadan: tropical temptation - Sipadan : tentation tropicale. (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KYVprQ_bJVA)
mikeguerrero
February 27th, 2010, 08:17 PM
Mobeeno,
Thanks for the video, I was captivated by the eeire feeling of those caves when the turtle skeleton appeared, and later the fresh death of yet another turtle.
The lights appear to be tethored onto a line from the boat, I guess a generator supplies the immense lighting required of all those bulbs.
Just amazing what the Calypso crew had back in the day. I wonder what type of equipment they use today, as they continue their exploration of our oceans.
keithdiver
February 27th, 2010, 08:31 PM
Lynn,
So far, all has been good from Halcyon. I have worked with them in the past and they are stellar.
I can't believe this happened during my doubles class with Don, everything was videoed up to the light not working.
Don even annotates in the video, the phrase, poor primary light, when he sees me deploy the Halcyon Scout.
I was so sad, but rest assured I learned how to deploy the backup, couldn't imagine that light going out in some, deep, dark cave, oh my. :shocked2:
Mike did you use any lube on the light at all? I believe that you have to use a drop, but not a lot to keep all flowing with it. you do not want to glob on the lube, it will attract dirt, hairs etc... What do you think they are going to do for you ? Brand new light or replace the one that you have? Heck!! they have the new LED out now, tell them you want one of those and credit for the extra$$:D
mikeguerrero
February 27th, 2010, 11:48 PM
Mike did you use any lube on the light at all? I believe that you have to use a drop, but not a lot to keep all flowing with it. you do not want to glob on the lube, it will attract dirt, hairs etc... What do you think they are going to do for you ? Brand new light or replace the one that you have? Heck!! they have the new LED out now, tell them you want one of those and credit for the extra$$:D
According to Halcyon instructions, you are not to use lube on the O-ring. I always kept an inspection prior to diving.
I dove the light the same in all my dives since purchasing it last April 09. I didn't deviate from that type of diving.
Keith, I don't know what will happen, all I know is Halcyon has it now.
What is so bizzare is that I was able to complete two one hour dives back to back with one hour surface interval, before it gave up on the end of the second dive.
The light is super robust and very well designed from my point of view.
mikeguerrero
March 1st, 2010, 06:19 PM
Just got an email back from Corey Smith, Tech for Halcyon...
My light is in route back to it's owner, all was covered under warranty... I didn't pay anything :)
Now I know why I drink and dive Halcyon.... They seriouly rock.... :cool2:
Nuff said....
MG
mikemill
March 1st, 2010, 06:30 PM
Did they say what the problem was?
kathydee
March 1st, 2010, 06:41 PM
That's great to hear Mike!!
mikeguerrero
March 1st, 2010, 07:37 PM
Did they say what the problem was?
One of the cannister latches wouldn't lock properly.
Anti-Hero
March 1st, 2010, 10:21 PM
Now I know why I drink and dive Halcyon.... They seriouly rock.... :cool2:
Nuff said....
MG
One of the cannister latches wouldn't lock properly.
Don't these two statements sort of contradict one another? Regardless, I'm glad to hear you're getting your light back without any drama.
mikeguerrero
March 1st, 2010, 11:52 PM
Don't these two statements sort of contradict one another? Regardless, I'm glad to hear you're getting your light back without any drama.
Casey,
You know Murphy's law will apply to the best of engineering parts.... I'm sensationalizing their CUSTOMER SERVICE!!! ;)
I have seen too many divers on this board post about rotten customer service from other dealers, wouldn't want to ever be on that side of the coin.
That's twice Halcyon has satisfied concerns that I had, and guess what, I came out not having to pay anything, could have gone really sour and it didn't!!
Casey, people on this board deserve to know defects in crafstmanship and customer service.
Will I continue with Halcyon? Absolutely.... :D
MG
Anti-Hero
March 2nd, 2010, 12:41 AM
Casey,
You know Murphy's law will apply to the best of engineering parts.... I'm sensationalizing their CUSTOMER SERVICE!!! ;)
I have seen too many divers on this board post about rotten customer service from other dealers, wouldn't want to ever be on that side of the coin.
That's twice Halcyon has satisfied concerns that I had, and guess what, I came out not having to pay anything, could have gone really sour and it didn't!!
Casey, people on this board deserve to know defects in crafstmanship and customer service.
