when breathing technique turns into headaches

I read really interesting posts about breathing on the board, and could summarize the do's and dont's as follow:

- Be relax, feel confortable
- Dive a lot
- Exercice (fitness level)
- Streamline your equipment

- Don't skip breathe
- Don't make frequent change of depth
- Don't make unuseful efforts

(Tell me if you disagree)

Well, this is my story... or how to turn the pleasure of diving into headaches:

when i started diving i was consuming more air as (almost) everyone does, then i got confident and more relaxed and my air consumption went down to a "normal" level if can say so.

After 25 dives or so, I was breathing on a slow rythm, whitout thinking much of it. And everything was fine with my dives.

But since I am a very competitive person (i can't help), i started to analyse my breathing technique, willing to lower my air consumption.

I noticed that between inhaling and exhaling, i made an unvoluntary stop of 2 to 3 seconds, leaving the airways open.

> Is that also "skip breathing" ??

The thing is that, stupidly willing to be the one with the lowest air consumption, I started to rethink my breathing. What I did, is counting up to five between inhaling and exhaling which is definitely skip breathing, isn't it? Well, on my last 2 dives, I ended up being effectively the 'cheapest' on gas, but i had also headaches after these dives. And I was wondering why!! I was C02 intoxicated ! That's what i understood thanks to this forum.

I promise that I'll stop this stupid behavior and keep on just enjoying the dives as I was doing after a few dives! Right?

> I just want to know how dangerous this kind of skip breathing is?
> Was there a lung expansion risk although I left the airways open?

Thanks for your answers!!

Lung expansion is not an issue assuming the airway is left open and it is even better if depth is constant.

Good air milage has a lot to do with breathing pattern and inhale, pause, exhale is the approved method. The lenght of the pause varies. I consider skip breathign to be holding your breathe for longer than a few seconds.

But more important to reducing air consumption is to relax and eliminate all extraneous movement. If you eliminate the movement and relax, less CO2 is generated and consequnetly less needs to be expelled making a longer pause possible.

Also holding the pause longer when your body tells you to breathe is a sure way to get ecessive CO2 levels. It also does not really save on air. You are better off relaxing, breathing as needed and catching your breath if you have exerted yourself. In the long run you use less air than if you prolong the problem by maintining an artificially low breathing rate.

I addressed issues I felt needed addressing with two astarisks (ie **)

TurtleBubble once bubbled...
I read really interesting posts about breathing on the board, and could summarize the do's and dont's as follow:

- Be relax, feel confortable
- Dive a lot
- Exercice (fitness level)
- Streamline your equipment

** Good so far. Diving frequently is great excersize for diver fitness.

- Don't skip breathe
- Don't make frequent change of depth
- Don't make unuseful efforts

**Good here to except "unuseful efforts" Define "Usefull efforts"?
Unless you are diving a square profile, you ARE going to change depth often. The ocean floor is NOT flat and level (except in some places, marginally flat, but STILL slope)

(Tell me if you disagree)

Well, this is my story... or how to turn the pleasure of diving into headaches:

when i started diving i was consuming more air as (almost) everyone does, then i got confident and more relaxed and my air consumption went down to a "normal" level if can say so.

After 25 dives or so, I was breathing on a slow rythm, whitout thinking much of it. And everything was fine with my dives.

But since I am a very competitive person (i can't help), i started to analyse my breathing technique, willing to lower my air consumption.

I noticed that between inhaling and exhaling, i made an unvoluntary stop of 2 to 3 seconds, leaving the airways open.

> Is that also "skip breathing" ??

**Sure is! DONT DO THAT. Your RMV will improve the MORE you dive. Do not think about breathing, just breathe normally. You suck down what you suck down. If you need to suck down MORE gas, your body will let you know by increasing respirations.

The thing is that, stupidly willing to be the one with the lowest air consumption, I started to rethink my breathing. What I did, is counting up to five between inhaling and exhaling which is definitely skip breathing, isn't it? Well, on my last 2 dives, I ended up being effectively the 'cheapest' on gas, but i had also headaches after these dives. And I was wondering why!! I was C02 intoxicated ! That's what i understood thanks to this forum.

**Hey, glad you promised to stop. Don't think of it as "stupid", it's more inexperience. You will learn alot more as you go along. No worries. As far as the cheapest on air, don't worry, air is cheap anyway. If the cost of air is something you think about, try paying for a nitrox fill! *smirk*

I promise that I'll stop this stupid behavior and keep on just enjoying the dives as I was doing after a few dives! Right?

> I just want to know how dangerous this kind of skip breathing is?
> Was there a lung expansion risk although I left the airways open?

**Sure was! If you were pausing between breaths, the airway was CLOSED for that duration.

**Breathe on scuba! Breathe on scuba! *Subliminal message* BREATHE ON SCUBA!


**Your head is in the right place and you're talking about it. Keep blowing bubbles!

Click to expand...

TurtleBubble once bubbled...

I noticed that between inhaling and exhaling, i made an unvoluntary stop of 2 to 3 seconds, leaving the airways open.

> Is that also "skip breathing" ??

The thing is that, stupidly willing to be the one with the lowest air consumption, I started to rethink my breathing. What I did, is counting up to five between inhaling and exhaling which is definitely skip breathing, isn't it? Well, on my last 2 dives, I ended up being effectively the 'cheapest' on gas, but i had also headaches after these dives. And I was wondering why!! I was C02 intoxicated ! That's what i understood thanks to this forum.

Click to expand...

There can actually be confusion on which. That is:

(1) Some divers will exhale, pause (with empty lungs), then inhale - not taking a breath until they have to. This is called "ship breathing" if I understand correctl. DON'T!

(2) DA Aquamaster suggests the correct approach: inhale, pause (with pretty full lungs), exhale. This is a different "between" side, which gives your body more time to unload CO2 and load O2 from the same volume of air drawn from your tank. Safe as long as:
(a) the airway is kept open, like DAA suggested - as compared to "holding" a breath, as one would do on free diving.
(b) even better if depth is kept constant, as suggested.
(c) but counting to 5 might be a lttle long?

I know, it can seem a waste to go back with 1,000 to 1,500 lbs, unless you notice that it's time to ascend and do a 5 minute safety, and you then learn that your buddy is low or out, and needs a significant amount from you! Been there, done that, saved his butt.

One more thing.

Check your weighting and your trim in the water. Fine tuning both of these will greatly decrease your air consumption if they are off.

GQMedic answered Turtlebubble's qeustions thusly..

> I just want to know how dangerous this kind of skip breathing is?
> Was there a lung expansion risk although I left the airways open?

**Sure was! If you were pausing between breaths, the airway was CLOSED for that duration.

Click to expand...

Please explain the lung expansion risk. Turtlebubble clearly said that he is leaving his airway open. I can very easily pause between breaths WITHOUT closing my airway.

:box: One of my pet peeves is the often repeated warning of "never stop breathing" or "never hold your breath", when the real warning is to "Never close your airway .... never close your epiglottis".

I've found a great system that conserves air and doesn't give me headachs,breath in slowly for 5 seconds and exhale slowly for 10 seconds.
It requires you to be relaxed but it works for me quite well and has no skip breathing or pausing. Air is always comming or going.

A lot of energy is being expended in an effort to change one of your body rythms. Quit thinking about it and just beathe! Your body knows what to do.

Dave

Easy, if he's pausing, he's closed it. This pause is concious effort. Which means, he's controling his musculature of his diaphragm. Hence, he's not blowing buddles, this not TRAPPED air expands when ambient pressure is reduced through change of depth that can and does occur in as little as two seconds, the air in his lungs will expand, It must go somewhere. Since effort is imposed with this pause, the path of least resistance is now the lung tissues. The pressure inside of the pleural space is negative. This is ripe pickings, the air has no place to go, the risk is pneumothorax.

A very painfull tru life threatening condition, marked by subcutaneus emphasema, jugular vein distension, tracheal deviation, collapse of the first lung, compression of the heart and the fun list goes on and on and on.

It's a long winded way of saying, if there's a pause, it's STILL a breath hold. Unless he's the only mammal capable of completely deflating his lungs with an exhale, there will always be gases in the the lungs remaining with when taken in at depth and given pressure will certainy expand with reduction in depth that can (as mentioned above) and will happen.


I know, I know, I'm long winded...

Charlie99 once bubbled...
Please explain the lung expansion risk. Turtlebubble clearly said that he is leaving his airway open. I can very easily pause between breaths WITHOUT closing my airway.

:box: One of my pet peeves is the often repeated warning of "never stop breathing" or "never hold your breath", when the real warning is to "Never close your airway .... never close your epiglottis".

Click to expand...

GQMedic once bubbled...
Easy, if he's pausing, he's closed it. This pause is concious effort. Which means, he's controling his musculature of his diaphragm. Hence, he's not blowing buddles, this not TRAPPED air expands when ambient pressure is reduced through change of depth that can and does occur in as little as two seconds, the air in his lungs will expand, It must go somewhere. Since effort is imposed with this pause, the path of least resistance is now the lung tissues.

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Since the epiglottis and the rest of my airway is open, the path of least resistance is to bubble out of my mouth. Please explain why it won't just go out through the mouth.

It's a long winded way of saying, if there's a pause, it's STILL a breath hold. Unless he's the only mammal capable of completely deflating his lungs with an exhale, there will always be gases in the the lungs remaining with when taken in at depth and given pressure will certainy expand with reduction in depth that can (as mentioned above) and will happen.

Click to expand...

The pause is not necessarily at the exhale end. You can do it at either end. I have found that having the pause at or near full inhale works better for me.

Yes, there is gas in the lungs. If you go up, the air expands, and bubbles out through your mouth and reg exhaust port, provided you haven't closed your epiglottis.

I know, I know, I'm long winded...

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And wrong. Your profile says you are both a Naui instructor and a paramedic. I shouldn't be surprised that a lot of divers have misconceptions in this area if this is what their instructors think.

You can easily verify whether or not your airway is open. Suck in a full breath, then go lean over a chair putting pressure on your bellybutton. If your airway is open, air will be forced out. You can also get a feel for voluntarily controlling your epiglottis by repeatedly open and closing it like you would while coughing.