Backscatter Frustration

[ndboi]

Ok...I have a simple point and shoot Olympus 14 meg camera...the new "Tough" underwater one waterproof up to 30 feet. I dive with it in an Ikelite housing with a basic filter. I have the Ikelite AF35 flash attachment and the standard mounting arm. Not a pro outfit but I still shelled out almost $1500 for the whole set up and I'm getting horrible pics.

The guys with the disposables are getting better shots than me. I keep getting tons of backscatter, even with the filter on the camera and the attached flash at almost 90 degrees to the shot.

Here are my settings

ISO 200
Camera flash and AF35 both at -2.0
WB Auto
Macro Off
Flash On
Image Size 14M
Compression Normal
AF Mode Face
ESP
Fine Zoom Off
Digital Zoom On
Image Stabilizer On

Can somebody figure this out...This is probably simple but I'm a rookie at this and just super frustrated.

Thanks

[halemanō]

you get less backscatter as you move the strobe farther away from the lens, think of a triangle from camera and strobe to the subject, the strobe angle can not physically be "almost 90 degrees" unless the subject is only 2 cm away from the lens (macro).

unless shooting into a hole, my strobes are nearly as far away from the lens as the arms allow.


http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/data/500/FullSet.jpg (http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/84766)

http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/data/500/TimeToGo.jpg (http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/99095)

http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/data/500/P10100763.jpg (http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/103236)

[weitodive]

Your backscatter problem might be caused by the internal flash. Is the external strobe triggered by your camera flash? If so, what you could possibly do is turn the internal flash on your camera all the way down. Or you could use some electrical tape and cover the area of your internal flash(inside of course) leaving just enough area open to trigger your external.

[beautybelow]

Are you using the internal flash "cover" that came with the Ikelite housing? It looks like a diffuser but actually blocks the flash of the camera itself while directing it towards the slave sensor of the AF-35. At the very least you need to diffuse the internal flash or you will get backscatter from that alone.

[ndboi]

you get less backscatter as you move the strobe farther away from the lens, think of a triangle from camera and strobe to the subject, the strobe angle can not physically be "almost 90 degrees" unless the subject is only 2 cm away from the lens (macro).

unless shooting into a hole, my strobes are nearly as far away from the lens as the arms allow.


http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/data/500/FullSet.jpg (http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/84766)

http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/data/500/TimeToGo.jpg (http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/99095)

http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/data/500/P10100763.jpg (http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/103236)
Where do you get those long flexible arms??? Mine is barely half that long...

[ndboi]

Are you using the internal flash "cover" that came with the Ikelite housing? It looks like a diffuser but actually blocks the flash of the camera itself while directing it towards the slave sensor of the AF-35. At the very least you need to diffuse the internal flash or you will get backscatter from that alone.
I'm using the filter on the camera housing, not the one that blocks out the flash. If I use that one, the shots are too dark.

[ndboi]

Your backscatter problem might be caused by the internal flash. Is the external strobe triggered by your camera flash? If so, what you could possibly do is turn the internal flash on your camera all the way down. Or you could use some electrical tape and cover the area of your internal flash(inside of course) leaving just enough area open to trigger your external.
The camera flash is filtered and is already as low as possible...I believe the backscatter is coming from the external flash. Maybe I need to filter it too???

[Doubler]

http://i561.photobucket.com/albums/ss58/Doubler_photos/P9030017JPG.jpg

This photo was taken with a Olympus Stylus 710 6 MP camera set on Underwater Wide mode about 2 feet from subject, in an Ikelite housing, W20 wide angle lens, Ikelite DS 51 and Olympus UFL 1 strobes about 18" on each side.

1. Get longer strobe arms and another strobe if at all possible. Set strobes to the side. Look at your image underwater and adjust the strobes until you get it just right.
2. Get a Wide Angle Lens.
3 Get as close to your subject as you can.
4. Mask the internal strobe. It is illuminating all the particulates in the water right in front of the lens. Did I mention get closer.
5. When all else fails.....Photoshop elements will remove backscatter.

[Larry C]

How far are you from the subject? What is the background? You can take macro shots, with a solid background even using the built in flash. If you're taking wide pictures, which it sounds like from the lack of macro setting, you want the edge of the flash to light your subject and as little light in the water column between camera and subject as possible. When the background is water, it's even more difficult. You say you have your flash and your strobe set at -2, but with the flash covered the pictures are too dark. Have you tried turning up the strobe with the flash covered? Your built in flash will not light a shot beyond about 3 feet, and will cause backscatter due to closeness to the lens. If you post a sample picture, it would help.

[Kukuisa]

I'm using the filter on the camera housing, not the one that blocks out the flash. If I use that one, the shots are too dark.
When using the external flash, the internal one must be blocked.
Next the amount of light is set by the knob on the AF35; the -2 may be to low. Remember that the Guide number of that flash is relative small, so keep the distance to the subject within 4 feet.

[herman]

Why don't you take a photo of your camera set up as you use it for us to look at. Odds are your major problems are strobe placement and/or your internal flash.

[halemanō]

Where do you get those long flexible arms??? Mine is barely half that long...

ScubaBoard members are notorious in my mind for extreme laziness. If you do a yahoo search for "flexible dive strobe arms" the first hit is an old page from Dive Magazine (UK - May 31, '06).


Bendy strobe arms are nothing new, but until now there haven't been any available to fit the Ikelite range of underwater camera housings. With the introduction of the 40cm quick-release flexible arm, manufactured by ManFishPhoto and distributed by BigBlueSquid, Ikelite housings are now being catered for. Designed to be easy to fit and release, the arms also allow the strobe to be positioned in any position, which is useful for creative lighting techniques, especially in macro photography.

Replacing "flexible dive" with "bendy" and yahoo searching again, there are more pages and pictures of Bendy arms but nothing officially Bendy on the first search page, but now you have a real Q for the SB sages. :)

Not coincidentally, those arms came with a full camera rig bought off eBay from a seller in the UK! :eyebrow:

[slowhands]

The Loc Line flex hose is available online here:

ModularHose.com - Loc-Line Modular Hose System (http://www.modularhose.com/)

The mount to a tray is available. Hose is available by length. There is one component that you may have to make, the strobe mount for your particular strobe. I had to fab one for Sea&Sea. It may be that competing brands of hose offer the strobe mount.

ScubaBoard Gallery - Olympus 7070 with PT-027, YS90, HW conv, LocLine (http://www.scubaboard.com/gallery/showphoto.php/photo/40412)