Sapper
August 21st, 2003, 07:26 PM
What kind of cost am I looking at to get set up with a Halcyon Rig?
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View Full Version : Halcyon Back Plate w/ Wings
Sapper August 21st, 2003, 07:26 PM What kind of cost am I looking at to get set up with a Halcyon Rig? Northeastwrecks August 21st, 2003, 08:29 PM Without knowing more, its a little difficult to estimate. However, plan on between US$500.00 - US$700.00. The difference reflects the precise wing you buy and whether you include extras such as a pocket and a single tank adapter. I believe that Halcyon list the MSRP of their gear on their website. Check out www.Halcyon.net and look for fair trade pricing. In addition, check out www.extreme-exposure.com for pricing. EE is particularly good if there is no stocking dealer in your area or if the dealer can't get what you want. roturner August 22nd, 2003, 12:16 AM Northeastwrecks once bubbled... Without knowing more, its a little difficult to estimate. However, plan on between US$500.00 - US$700.00. The difference reflects the precise wing you buy and whether you include extras such as a pocket and a single tank adapter. I believe that Halcyon list the MSRP of their gear on their website. Check out www.Halcyon.net and look for fair trade pricing. In addition, check out www.extreme-exposure.com for pricing. EE is particularly good if there is no stocking dealer in your area or if the dealer can't get what you want. It also makes a pretty big difference in the price if you buy a Halcyon backplate or get a copy. R.. WaterDawg August 22nd, 2003, 05:50 AM I recomend getting a Halcyon wing w/ maybe another back plate just meake sure it matche, I know the newer 27# pioneer wings dont need single tank adaptors ck around. Northeastwrecks August 22nd, 2003, 06:42 AM WaterDawg once bubbled... I recomend getting a Halcyon wing w/ maybe another back plate just meake sure it matche, I know the newer 27# pioneer wings dont need single tank adaptors ck around. That's a good point. You don't actually need a STA with the newer Pioneers. On the other hand, they take a between 2 - 6 lbs off your belt, depending on whether you buy the regular or the weighted STA. In addition, we've found that the additional distance between the tank and the diver imparted by the STA makes it somewhat easier for the diver to perform a valve drill. YMMV. sasdasdaf August 22nd, 2003, 08:37 AM You could save a considerable sum of money by buying on Ebay. If you have some patience, check out Ebay every day and look for good deals. Sometimes brand new equipment goes for a fraction of the MSRP. lragsac August 22nd, 2003, 03:42 PM Northeastwrecks once bubbled... You don't actually need a STA with the newer Pioneers. ... In addition, we've found that the additional distance between the tank and the diver imparted by the STA makes it somewhat easier for the diver to perform a valve drill. YMMV. I thought the additional distance between the tank and diver imparted by the STA would make it *harder* to perform the valve drill. :confused: WaterDawg August 22nd, 2003, 03:57 PM Ive only dove w/o the sta so I dont know for sure but yeah it seems like it would make it a bit harder to do valve drills. Harder or not Its wasy easier the w/ my zeagle! MASS-Diver August 25th, 2003, 02:54 PM halycon no longer makes an STA, right? jonnythan August 25th, 2003, 03:16 PM lragsac once bubbled... I thought the additional distance between the tank and diver imparted by the STA would make it *harder* to perform the valve drill. :confused: Actually I think it would make it easier. Without the STA, the tank is very close to your back. Move it away from your back by about half an inch and the tank can sit significantly higher on your back without it hitting your head in the water. Reaching a bit farther back seens easier than a bit farther down in my recent desk chair research. Northeastwrecks August 25th, 2003, 03:21 PM jonnythan once bubbled... Actually I think it would make it easier. Without the STA, the tank is very close to your back. Move it away from your back by about half an inch and the tank can sit significantly higher on your back without it hitting your head in the water. Reaching a bit farther back seens easier than a bit farther down in my recent desk chair research. What he said. I can hit the valve without a STA. However, we've noticed that students can hit the valve easier when it has a STA. Moreover, they seem to prefer the more positive alignment of the tank. I've tried it and it is easier. HammerNoMore August 25th, 2003, 03:21 PM MASS-Diver once bubbled... halycon no longer makes an STA, right? http://www.halcyon.net/mc/harness.shtml About 2/3's down the page. Sapper August 25th, 2003, 07:41 PM How do you determin which Wing, the Pioneer 27 or 38 is the right one for a guy who is 6'2" 200lbs dives with Aluminum 80s? Genesis August 25th, 2003, 07:51 PM the Oxycheq, either the 30 or 45 :) WaterDawg August 25th, 2003, 07:59 PM Sapper once bubbled... How do you determin which Wing, the Pioneer 27 or 38 is the right one for a guy who is 6'2" 200lbs dives with Aluminum 80s? Well, Im 5'8" 215lbs and Use the #27. It is definetly enough lift for me. HammerNoMore August 25th, 2003, 09:30 PM Sapper once bubbled... How do you determin which Wing, the Pioneer 27 or 38 is the right one for a guy who is 6'2" 200lbs dives with Aluminum 80s? You want to make sure your wing has enough lift to float your rig if you take it off. Figure how much weight you carry in the coldest conditions i.e. thickest wetsuit. If that starts getting close to 27 you should go with the 36. If you are a warm water diver only, the 27 will probably be plenty. James Genesis August 25th, 2003, 09:53 PM to count the negative buoyancy of the BP+STA system in the "how much weight do you carry" computation, along with the MAXIMUM negative buoyancy of the tank(s) (full of gas.) For example, I dive a SS BP + STA (-8), and use 2lbs of lead with a single HP steel (-1 empty.) This is with a 3 mil wetsuit and fairly heavy (5 mil) booties. This makes me neutral with an empty tank at the surface. FULL, that tank is -7.5 (assuming a HP120.) So my minimum lift requirement is 17.5lbs. I must assume that at depth my exposure suit may have zero buoyancy (it won't, but you won't go wrong that way!) Now if I try to dive dry, I use the same SS BP+STA, same tank, but now I need 16lbs of lead. Virtually all of that is required due to the suit. So now I need 31.5lbs of lift at a minimum. The 36lb pioneer is ok - but just barely. This assumes that I flood the drysuit at depth and it has zero buoyancy. The Halcyon wings larger than 27lbs have expanding panels at the BOTTOM, which affects some divers (myself included) trim adversely. The Oxycheq wings do not have these panels; I have found no trim difference between their 30 and 45lb lift wings, making the 45 fantastic for me as I can dive it both dry and wet. HammerNoMore August 26th, 2003, 07:50 AM Genesis once bubbled... to count the negative buoyancy of the BP+STA system in the "how much weight do you carry" computation, along with the MAXIMUM negative buoyancy of the tank(s) (full of gas.) Thanks for makeing that more clear. I was assuming he is currently in a stab jacket so using his current weight should cover the BP/STA and probably a few extra pounds. I should definatly have mentioned the tank weight though. James bridgediver August 26th, 2003, 12:46 PM Genesis once bubbled... The Halcyon wings larger than 27lbs have expanding panels at the BOTTOM, which affects some divers (myself included) trim adversely. The Oxycheq wings do not have these panels; I have found no trim difference between their 30 and 45lb lift wings, making the 45 fantastic for me as I can dive it both dry and wet. It is the 36# pinoneer that has the gussets (panels) not the 27#. Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the oxycheq wing have the same sort of gusset design? The difference being that they expand beside the tank on the inside of the wing as opposed to the outside? jonnythan August 26th, 2003, 02:15 PM bridgediver once bubbled... It is the 36# pinoneer that has the gussets (panels) not the 27#. Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the oxycheq wing have the same sort of gusset design? The difference being that they expand beside the tank on the inside of the wing as opposed to the outside? The 45 lb Oxycheq wing has the gusset all along the inside next to the tank. The idea is that when inflated, the Halcyon wing gets bigger at the bottom than normal, whereas the Oxycheq gets bigger all around the center, thus affecting trim less. Genesis August 26th, 2003, 02:33 PM The Halcyon 36 and 45 wings both have the expanding panels at the bottom of the wing on the OUTSIDE. The 27 does not. The Oxycheq 30 does not have the panels at all, and the 45 has them on the INSIDE, centered on the wing near the tank mounting area. As such the Oxycheq expands closer to the center of mass and buoyancy, and as a consequence the trim does not materially change. It DOES with the Halcyon wings (speaking from ~100 dives worth of experience with the Halcyon Pioneer 36 here.) bridgediver August 26th, 2003, 02:38 PM Thanks guys, thats what I thought MASS-Diver August 26th, 2003, 08:26 PM James Goddard once bubbled... http://www.halcyon.net/mc/harness.shtml About 2/3's down the page. I think that's out of date. I could not find an STA on Extreme Exposure and my local halycon retailer told me that w/ the new wing, halycon had stopped making one. ???????? Genesis August 26th, 2003, 08:28 PM and LP carries them. FredT August 26th, 2003, 08:44 PM I'm one of them. There are at least 4 different designs on the market. shoot me your e-mail address in a PM and I'll route you the details on mine. 8buck August 27th, 2003, 06:07 AM Hey, i am wanting to set me up a bp/wing. but would like the wing to float single or doubles will the trex work. i do not want to buy to sep wings... and who has the best prices on bp/wings Genesis August 27th, 2003, 07:38 AM The profile of doubles is different enough tnan a single tank that a wing designed for one will not work well with the other at all. I know people who have tried this, and none of them have been happy. In some cases it can even be unsafe, as doubles typically require more lift due to their greater buoyancy shift (more gas = more buioyancy shift.) jbb August 29th, 2003, 10:24 AM I just got into this stuff myself and have ordered the Oxycheq 45# single tank wing and recently redesigned Dive Rite back plate which also does not require a STA. Jason jonnythan August 29th, 2003, 10:39 AM jbb once bubbled... I just got into this stuff myself and have ordered the Oxycheq 45# single tank wing and recently redesigned Dive Rite back plate which also does not require a STA. Jason What plate is this? I don't see anything about it on their web site. bgbill September 19th, 2003, 09:44 AM Halcyon still makes a BC with a STA. This is one that I won in a spearfishing tournament last month. rjchandler September 21st, 2003, 10:36 PM why doesn' someone simply design a plate fer singles so we could dispense with this STA/rods in the wing nonsense:) kaliban October 1st, 2003, 10:22 PM WaterDawg once bubbled... I know the newer 27# pioneer wings dont need single tank adaptors ck around. Actually, the guys at EE told me that the new-new pioneer that's due to be released soon will nolonger have the integrated STA. -k nyresq October 2nd, 2003, 03:39 AM http://www.omsdive.com/ad-harness.html or http://www.diveriteexpress.com/bcs/backplates.shtml and scroll down to the polished stainless plate. The new OMS and DR stainless plates have slots for cam bands. I have an OMS and it works great with a single tank and a wing. the new oms and dive rite wings have slots for the bands. loose the STA unless you need the extra weight. one less thing to loosen up or shift. cam bands are about $15-$20 each Don Burke October 2nd, 2003, 11:41 AM rjchandler once bubbled... why doesn' someone simply design a plate fer singles so we could dispense with this STA/rods in the wing nonsense:) That would mean plates that could only be used for single tanks unless you could form a couple of vertical ridges in the backplate to steady a single tank, yet not interfere with doubles or v-weights. Halcyon, DiveRite and OMS plates already have the slots for cam bands, so altering the dies for stamping the plates would be the way to go if those ridges can be figured out. I'll take a look at mine and see if there is room to put them. Welding ridges to existing backplates as a production method would be quite a bit more expensive in the long run. reubencahn October 4th, 2003, 09:23 AM Actually, the guys at EE told me that the new-new pioneer that's due to be released soon will nolonger have the integrated STA. I rented one (an Eclipse) at Brownie's Southport last Sunday. It has no integrated STA and uses a normal one. Seems very nicely made.
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