I've got questions!

I dive single HP 130's or double HP 100's with a SS BP/W config with a hog harness. I dive dry with thick ass dry suit underwear on. I have a DR Classic wing and a DR Rec wing and some little 30# wing for singles.

For trips to the Bahamas or Florida, I break down my doubles.

I've found that I really like my 100's as both doubles and singles. An easy answer is to simply buy a second set of 100's, but I'd rather not do that.

Is there something out there that I can buy, that won't break the bank is isn't a POS, to turn most of my existing setup to SM?

My logic is I have enough hoses, regs and gauges to make the right configuration for SM. I can simply get one of the appropriate valves for one of my HP100's. I will never have to break down and set up my 100's again. I figure I can easily dive tank where the shut off is reverse, or for that matter SM a single tank.

For instance OMS make the BP-SMS which looks like I could use my BP and hog harness and my Rec Wing. Is the OMS BP-SMS worth looking at, or is it a POS?

My buddy as recently made the transition to SM. He got the whole Razor harness, new AL 80 tanks, so on so forth. I get it.

Any specific equipment suggestions will be greatly appreciated!

Oh yeah, diving in my local quarries and NC wrecks.

paddler3d:

I dive single HP 130's or double HP 100's with a SS BP/W config with a hog harness. I dive dry with thick ass dry suit underwear on. I have a DR Classic wing and a DR Rec wing and some little 30# wing for singles.

For trips to the Bahamas or Florida, I break down my doubles.

I've found that I really like my 100's as both doubles and singles. An easy answer is to simply buy a second set of 100's, but I'd rather not do that.

Is there something out there that I can buy, that won't break the bank is isn't a POS, to turn most of my existing setup to SM?

My logic is I have enough hoses, regs and gauges to make the right configuration for SM. I can simply get one of the appropriate valves for one of my HP100's. I will never have to break down and set up my 100's again. I figure I can easily dive tank where the shut off is reverse, or for that matter SM a single tank.

For instance OMS make the BP-SMS which looks like I could use my BP and hog harness and my Rec Wing. Is the OMS BP-SMS worth looking at, or is it a POS?

My buddy as recently made the transition to SM. He got the whole Razor harness, new AL 80 tanks, so on so forth. I get it.

Any specific equipment suggestions will be greatly appreciated!

Oh yeah, diving in my local quarries and NC wrecks.

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I recommend you check out http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/side-mount-divers/348900-my-venture-into-sidemount.html and http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/side-mount-divers/359563-sm-take-2-a.html. A lot of your questions have been cussed and discussed in them.

Edd Sorenson of Cave Adventures has dived just about all of them, and is testing the Hollis SMS-100 now.

Dive-aholic is a sidemount instructor who has given some very reasoned arguments for and against various configurations / rigs.

My $.02, from my research and myriad questioning:

The razor is too light and works well if you are Steve Bogart sized with aluminum 80s. I don't see it for cave or technical diving in its current configuration. You just don't have enough 'umpf'

I discarded the idea of the Nomad EXP and SMS-100 and armadillo because they weren't modular, and because of specific comments by others. YMMV.

I wanted something that could be fixed if it got torn up, to not replace the whole rig if something went wrong. It helped that the great majority of those who dive sidemount regularly dive Nomad XTs. I am a great believer in learning from others.

Good luck!

I started off in SM with the OMS SM system, a HOG harness, and a Recwing. It worked rather well. I only went to a Nomad because a good friend who owns my LDS gave me a price I couldn't refuse. In fact I still have the OMS SM system I'd be willing to part with for a decent price if you're interested.

paddler3d:

I dive single HP 130's or double HP 100's with a SS BP/W config with a hog harness. I dive dry with thick ass dry suit underwear on. I have a DR Classic wing and a DR Rec wing and some little 30# wing for singles.

For trips to the Bahamas or Florida, I break down my doubles.

I've found that I really like my 100's as both doubles and singles. An easy answer is to simply buy a second set of 100's, but I'd rather not do that.

Is there something out there that I can buy, that won't break the bank is isn't a POS, to turn most of my existing setup to SM?

My logic is I have enough hoses, regs and gauges to make the right configuration for SM. I can simply get one of the appropriate valves for one of my HP100's. I will never have to break down and set up my 100's again. I figure I can easily dive tank where the shut off is reverse, or for that matter SM a single tank.

Click to expand...

If you have the regs and gauges, then you'll likely only need to buy appropriate length hoses. Typical lengths for sidemount are 32-34 inches for the short reg hose, 15 inches for the LP inflator hoses, and 6 inches for the HP hoses. If you have the 2 or 2.5 inch SPGs, you may want to consider 1.5 inch SPGs. The larger ones are a bit heavy and tend to drag.

If your HP100s are already doubled, then all you need is plugs for the valves you already have.

For instance OMS make the BP-SMS which looks like I could use my BP and hog harness and my Rec Wing. Is the OMS BP-SMS worth looking at, or is it a POS?

Click to expand...

The BP-SMS is poorly designed. The top portion on it is very high profile. It works for OW diving, but if you are interested in SM to get through low passages in caves or wrecks, there are better systems on the market. Also, the Rec wing isn't really a great choice for a sidemount wing. It doesn't have the tabs along the sides to keep it from tacoing up.

My buddy as recently made the transition to SM. He got the whole Razor harness, new AL 80 tanks, so on so forth. I get it.

Click to expand...

Jax already said it. The Razor is fine for specific applications, but if you plan on ever diving heavy steel cylinders, it's a poor choice.

Any specific equipment suggestions will be greatly appreciated!

Oh yeah, diving in my local quarries and NC wrecks.

Click to expand...

paddler3d:

I've found that I really like my 100's as both doubles and singles. An easy answer is to simply buy a second set of 100's, but I'd rather not do that. ... For instance OMS make the BP-SMS which looks like I could use my BP and hog harness and my Rec Wing. Is the OMS BP-SMS worth looking at, or is it a POS?

Click to expand...

Two comments: an inexpensive option for tanks would be to pick up a couple of used AL80s. They trim reasonably well in SM, although become a bit bottom light as they empty, and can usually be picked up for modest cost (obvious caveats about avoiding older tanks / less stable alloys apply, of course). Another option is to look for some used LP tanks - my dive buddy picked up a couple of used LP tanks (112s, I think) and loves them for SM. HP100s are nice for single tank dives and for doubles, either SM or BM (I am looking for a second set of used 100s for SM, so I can put my current set back together for BM), but are going to run you ~$400 (or more) for a used set. Not a bad price, but more than a couple of AL80s.

Regarding the rig, specifically, the OMS BP-SMS - the 'Profile'. I have a couple of them, and my dive buddy also has one, in addition to our Nomads. I like them, as an easy way to use my BP/W with SM, and to introduce BP/W divers to OW SM, without the expense of a whole new rig. For diving wet in warmer waters, the Profile is quite useful, and I don't think it is a 'POS'. The Profile feels a little light but nonetheless works for SM. I have successfully used mine with a Rec Wing, BUT - you get a major taco with something like a Rec Wing, even with bungees in place, unless you stabilize the lower corners of the wing to your harness. Dive-aholic's comments are spot on. The top of the rig is a bit high profile, and I wouldn't use it in confined spaces. The tabs on the bottom corners of the Nomad are a great idea, and would be a nice addition to a lot of wings used for SM to avoid the taco when using a Profile.

Thank you for all the replies so far!

Jax, I read through like 30 pages of your side mount ventures. Very interesting, and funny.

Currently I'm not interested in SM for getting through cozy, tight, confined spaces. If I couldn't get through a space with doubles and a slung bottle, then I wasn't going through the space.

So, Dive-aholic, when you mention that the SMS is high profile on the top portion, are you suggesting these are high profile compared to other SM systems or to doubles? Hydro dynamics is important, but fitting through tight spaces isn't.

I swear I have some odd one off rec wing. It is a gusseted controlled wing. it has tabs on its outside seam where a bungee runs to keep it from tacoing on singles. I speculate I can use the tabs to secure the wing to keep it from tacoing.

Thanks for the pointer on the 1.5 vs. 2.5 inch gauges. Fortunately I have 1.5 already.

I'm also hearing that it may not be necessary, nice, but not necessary, to get left right valves, but just plugs for my doubles valves? Never thought of that one. Thank you.

I've looked at e-Bay, members have PM'd me, and looked on Amazon, the SMS from OMS is $70 new.

Am I to understand that it may be a descent, not perfect option, for going to SM, OW diving with limited wreck penetration, without busting the bank?

I've watched the guys, and been that guy myself, hump their doubles out of the water. I've watched the SM divers leave their tanks at waters edge and carry them one by one back to their area. They wholistically on land, look a lot more relaxed. I think was is a dead give away is how they then don't race to take their gear off. I do like the thought of that!

Now, off to work, so sad.

Thanks for the info!

The profile is high profile compared to other sidemount rigs, but compared to doubles it is lower profile. The sms is good open water rig, but I wouldn't suggest it for overhead environments.

paddler3d:

I swear I have some odd one off rec wing. It is a gusseted controlled wing. it has tabs on its outside seam where a bungee runs to keep it from tacoing on singles. I speculate I can use the tabs to secure the wing to keep it from tacoing.

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Your wing is probably the 'usual and customary', gusseted Rec Wing. It isn't a matter of having gussets. There is simply nothing on the outside / backside of the wing (except for the lightweight, and narrow, OMS BP-SMS) to prevent the lobes of the wing from tacoing when inflated. There are no double tanks, there isn't even a single tank. Yes, you can use the gusset tabs to reduce the tacoing. But, what Dive-aholic and I are saying is that where the Rec Wing doesn't have a tab is right at the base on each side of the wing, where it needs them the most. If you have a chance to look at a Nomad, note the tabs sewn into the base of the wing case on each side, which are then attached to the waist strap of the harness. (Or, if your Rec Wing has tabs there, then I am wrong and you have a 'one off'.) You can anchor the bases to your waist strap on the harness, you just have to rig it properly to do it. I am not saying it is not possible - you just need to recognize in advance that you have to do it.

paddler3d:

I'm also hearing that it may not be necessary, nice, but not necessary, to get left right valves, but just plugs for my doubles valves?

Click to expand...

That's what I did with a set of double 80s that I broke down to use as SM tanks. But, you can use two standard valves if that is what you have. Yes, you have to have one valve opening facing down, and one valve opening facing up, OR have both handles oriented the same way, so that both valve openings face down. But, either option works just fine.

paddler3d:

the SMS from OMS is $70 new.

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Yep. Reasonable price - don't pay more than that for it. You take your existing BP/W, add a Profile to it, and you have a SM rig.

paddler3d:

Am I to understand that it may be a descent, not perfect option, for going to SM, OW diving with limited wreck penetration, without busting the bank?

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Absolutely.

Thank you everyone!

I guess this I have another question...

I'm understanding that the SMS has little physical rigidity to it, leading to part of the tacoing problem.

So, what if you to took an ABS, or plastic, BP and sandwiched your wing between the two plates, got the DR beaver tail, or butt plate, which I believe easily attaches to a BP. You could easily attach bungees to the plastic plate. This would in essence fix some of the challenges of the SMS from OMS. It would be a matter of securing bottom corners of the wing so they don't taco.

Am I getting it?

There's a Swiss DIR guy that sandwhiched his wing between two plates so he could have a open water sidemount rig: Hogarthian-DIR Sidemount.pdf