Trying Tec

Thought this might interest some of you out there if you are wanting to try some tec or even just do something a little different - there is a way you can have a go without committing to the full course initially....

Discover Technical Diving

Great way to introduce divers to a tec dive. Best of luck and it will cut down on so many ?'s of rec divers.

Ah I see in you website it is an padi discover tec.

Sometimes, when I grumble about having spent the morning watching 'trained' 'tec' 'divers' stumbling through a perfectly simple dive, my partner points out, with impeccable logic, that if I'm so unhappy with what I'm seeing I should become a tec instructor and try to make it better.

Every now and then, I come close to succumbing to the idea, and I have been recently.

And then I see something like 'Discover Tec Diving', and I remember all the reasons why I swore to myself that I would never become a tec instructor.

Do we really have to make EVERYTHING available to everyone at zero effort to themselves?

Oh, and I'm stuck in the office all day when I'd rather be diving, the weather's not great, and I haven't had lunch, so I'm probably being needlessly grumpy, but seriously - when did you last see a bull shark around Kho Tao?

ayeshacantrell:

Thought this might interest some of you out there if you are wanting to try some tec or even just do something a little different - there is a way you can have a go without committing to the full course initially....

Discover Technical Diving

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I like how the second video shows the preview screen of one person kneeling in doubles on the sand and the other standing. That's sending the right message...

GrimSleeper:

Sometimes, when I grumble about having spent the morning watching 'trained' 'tec' 'divers' stumbling through a perfectly simple dive, my partner points out, with impeccable logic, that if I'm so unhappy with what I'm seeing I should become a tec instructor and try to make it better.

Every now and then, I come close to succumbing to the idea, and I have been recently.

And then I see something like 'Discover Tec Diving', and I remember all the reasons why I swore to myself that I would never become a tec instructor.

Do we really have to make EVERYTHING available to everyone at zero effort to themselves?

Oh, and I'm stuck in the office all day when I'd rather be diving, the weather's not great, and I haven't had lunch, so I'm probably being needlessly grumpy, but seriously - when did you last see a bull shark around Kho Tao?

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A Discover Tech class makes a diver no more a tech diver than a discover scuba class makes a non- diver a diver. It is just a way to introduce them to the equipment & a few skills used in tech diving, very much like the discover scuba sessions do. If a diver decides then to go the tech route, & if the tech instructor is a good one, there will be plenty of work to be done & effort put out by the student. I know it took me 1-1/2yrs to complete my Adv. Nitrox/ Deco course & 2 yrs to complete my full cave course, with plenty of practice in between sessions.

tstormdiver:

A Discover Tech class makes a diver no more a tech diver than a discover scuba class makes a non- diver a diver. It is just a way to introduce them to the equipment & a few skills used in tech diving, very much like the discover scuba sessions do. If a diver decides then to go the tech route, & if the tech instructor is a good one, there will be plenty of work to be done & effort put out by the student. I know it took me 1-1/2yrs to complete my Adv. Nitrox/ Deco course & 2 yrs to complete my full cave course, with plenty of practice in between sessions.

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I do get that, Tammy, but the difference is that DSD is aimed at introducing people who might otherwise never have tried it to SCUBA. It allows people to find out whether being underwater is frightening or fun, easy or hard....

By the time anyone is ready to be thinking about moving into tec diving, in my opinion, they should have enough diving experience to know what it is and enough self knowledge to know whether it's for them. Putting someone into doubles and then sitting them on the bottom to do a valve shutdown does nothing to teach them anything about tec diving. The drills are, really, pretty straightforward, and the equipment really isn't so very different - just more cumbersome on land. The big step up in going into tec diving is in the mental side of the game, and being ready to make that step comes from hours and hours and hours underwater...

It seems to me that putting a twinset on someone, running through a couple of drills and calling it a Discover Tec Experience is likely to encourage the idea that technical diving is just recreational diving + equipment, and that it's easy. And that really isn't the mindset to take on into tec training or diving.

GrimSleeper:

I do get that, Tammy, but the difference is that DSD is aimed at introducing people who might otherwise never have tried it to SCUBA. It allows people to find out whether being underwater is frightening or fun, easy or hard....

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As does a Discover Tec for technical diving....

...aimed at introducing people who might otherwise never have tried it to TECH. It allows people to find out whether TECH is frightening or fun, easy or hard....

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GrimSleeper:

By the time anyone is ready to be thinking about moving into tec diving, in my opinion, they should have enough diving experience to know what it is and enough self knowledge to know whether it's for them.

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How do thy get that knowledge? .... oh, that's right... they can do a Discover Tec...

..either that or they can learn about it online by trawling forums..

What's best? A hands on, in the water, experience... or sitting in their bedroom in front of their laptop fantasising?

GrimSleeper:

Putting someone into doubles and then sitting them on the bottom to do a valve shutdown does nothing to teach them anything about tec diving.

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Well, it teaches them them about valve shutdowns at least..!?!

Again... what's the alternative?

It's not a qualification, so what's the issue?

GrimSleeper:

It seems to me that putting a twinset on someone, running through a couple of drills and calling it a Discover Tec Experience is likely to encourage the idea that technical diving is just recreational diving + equipment, and that it's easy.

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No more so that putting on a single and calling it Discover Scuba is likely to encourage the idea that scuba diving is just equipment.

GrimSleeper:

And that really isn't the mindset to take on into tec training or diving.

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I do partially agree with you. I can't work out why PADI allow the Discover Tec at such an early stage - there really isn't any benefit to letting OW divers (10 dives) undertake this 'experience'.

If someone is interested in tech, even at a very early stage of diving experience, then it is better to 'plant a seed' for the correct mindset to grow, rather than just pander to elitism and blank their interest ("you're not ready yet" etc).

That said, PADI really are pumping their tec programs at the moment.... applying their 'unique business model' towards the mass popularisation of technical diving. Tech Instructor trainers seem to be created as a dime a dozen at the moment... who are themselves creating Tech Instructors with typical sausage factory efficiency. It's the new PADI 'must have' marketing bonanza. All of this being done purely for financial gain.

Instructors and dive centres are getting 'into tec' for the wrong reasons ($$$)... can only lead to degradation of the community, standards and safety. I would predict that the PADI TecRec program will have a bad name soon enough (hence I am considering a cross over now).

Caveat - none of my response is directly in reference to the OP. I know Ayesha as a committed and highly capable tech diver/instructor for many years (much more experience than many of the tech instructor trainers now flouting their shiny new cert cards).

DevonDiver, I really agree with you. I am not a tech diver myself, but it doesn´t take much to understand the basics of what Tec diving implies. I think one of the main flaws of the PADI TecRec program is that it comes from an agency who thrives from the fact that there is no concise rejection policy, and very little student criticism. The whole idea of positive reinforcement and basically no criticism on the student does not bode well with Tec diving INMHO. Rec diving has enough "padding" (no pun intended) that statistics work in favor of a system that encourages EVERYONE diving. Tec diving does not share the same padding. The sales pitch agenda of the "perfect pyramid scheme" that PADI really is has now turned into Tec as the solution to sell all those Instructors, MSDTs or fresh DMs somewhere else to go to. I have personally seen this is the new money making machine for Utila, Koh Tao, and every place that sells the "PADI dream".

If you just watch PADI´s TecRec intro video (it´s called Equipment Considerations or something like that) it is really sad. Two "technical" divers kneeling in a swimming pool throughout the whole thing, one of them with split fins, using deco stages with Yoke valves, showing PISS POOR buoyancy control. I understand not everything has to be GUE and UTD (those agencies actually exist because there was a NEED of that kind of "quality" control), but the example PADI sets from their own videos is REALLY low. The materials are really not that bad, but as is usual with PADI literature, it is really designed for you to pass their exams. It´s all about making it easy to even the most retarded person. I am sorry, but this is the truth. They promote you to learn the answers to the quizzes, not so much to actually understand the concepts. And this goes from OW all the way to Instructor levels, and now, with TecRec.

In the end, as usual, it is the instructor, not the agency. But what can you expect from an agency that promotes no one should ever fail, because failing some one really could hurt the pyramid scheme concept behind it. Everyone is invited into PADI´s party, and TecRec is just their latest offering. It´s not so much that PADI´s program itself is flawed, because from what I have seen, it is not inherently flawed. I think it´s the whole PADI philosophy in itself what´s unable to offer a serious and respectable Tec program. I truly do not like PADI that much, but do believe that their OW course/scheme is really something to admire. They can get even the stupidiest person diving, no doubt about it. That´s (I am really not being sarcastic) really an achievement in itself. But I just don´t think that´s the idea behind a Tec program, and this will just hurt the reputation of the program. It is more about the agency and it´s philosophy than it is about the course and the materiales themselves.

ElGaucho:

DevonDiver, I really agree with you. I am not a tech diver myself, but it doesn´t take much to understand the basics of what Tec diving implies. I think one of the main flaws of the PADI TecRec program is that it comes from an agency who thrives from the fact that there is no concise rejection policy, and very little student criticism.

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To be fair, that doesn't really translate to the TecRec program. There is a system of assessments in place that the instructor should use to ensure that the divers 'passes' rather than just attends.

This used to work fine, as for a long time the only folks teaching tech for PADI were already experienced instructors who had crossed-over from other agencies..and/or were a minority of well experienced tech divers in their own right.

Will this work fine in the future? Hmmm.... I can't see that same standard being applied by 'Mr. Joe Average', MSDT, who never was interested in doing a tech dive for the duration of their diving experience and spent the last XX years on his knees doing OW courses... but now rushed into a tech instructor qualification because it is a profitable trend for his dive centre...

ElGaucho:

The whole idea of positive reinforcement and basically no criticism on the student does not bode well with Tec diving INMHO.

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It hasn't, and it shouldn't, been like that. Constructive criticism is key for any tech program. It's dependant on the instructor though - and recent trends in the tech community may impact on the quality of instructors being produced. That's not just PADI - some of the other tech agencies are also guilty of 'mass import' fast-track to tech status instructor drives...

ElGaucho:

Rec diving has enough "padding" (no pun intended) that statistics work in favor of a system that encourages EVERYONE diving. Tec diving does not share the same padding. The sales pitch agenda of the "perfect pyramid scheme" that PADI really is has now turned into Tec as the solution to sell all those Instructors, MSDTs or fresh DMs somewhere else to go to. I have personally seen this is the new money making machine for Utila, Koh Tao, and every place that sells the "PADI dream".

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Yep. Resorts can now apply for 'TecRec Centre' status. There'll be a big drive to up sales into tec diving for sure.

ElGaucho:

If you just watch PADI´s TecRec intro video (it´s called Equipment Considerations or something like that) it is really sad. Two "technical" divers kneeling in a swimming pool throughout the whole thing, one of them with split fins, using deco stages with Yoke valves, showing PISS POOR buoyancy control.

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Agreed 100%. PADI should start to develop a better awareness of that issue - especially as the issue of neutral buoyancy in training has been raised at a recreational level. It'd be an odd situation to have that standard filter upwards from rec to tec.

That said, I never knew a TecRec instructor who actually did teach on their knees. Again... that may change as more tec instructors are manufactured (er... I mean qualified).

ElGaucho:

The materials are really not that bad, but as is usual with PADI literature, it is really designed for you to pass their exams. It´s all about making it easy to even the most retarded person. I am sorry, but this is the truth. They promote you to learn the answers to the quizzes, not so much to actually understand the concepts.

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Yes and no. The real 'learning' comes when the tec students have to apply that knowledge practically - in planning and conducting their dives. The exam can be aced... but the student shouldn't get the cert unless the knowledge is appropriately applied in the diving segment of the course.

ElGaucho:

what can you expect from an agency that promotes no one should ever fail,

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Again, to be fair... PADI doesn't promote, or even encourage this mentality. In fact, they even give a number of effective options that enable 'failing' with a semi-respectable outcome; referrals and the 'Scuba Diver' qualification. It's individual business pressures that drive this motivation to 'pass regardless'.

ElGaucho:

Everyone is invited into PADI´s party, and TecRec is just their latest offering. It´s not so much that PADI´s program itself is flawed, because from what I have seen, it is not inherently flawed.

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The program is fine. The application of the program is what matters. My concern is that PADI are doing to the tec instructor rating what they did to the IDC program. Zero to hero never creates a good instructor. That is most applicable to tech.

ElGaucho:

I just don´t think that´s the idea behind a Tec program, and this will just hurt the reputation of the program. It is more about the agency and it´s philosophy than it is about the course and the materiales themselves.

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Yep... that's my concern too. I'm quite concerned that my tec instructor status will be very devalued by the mass marketing of the PADI tec program. I also see that my quality operation will be damaged by a mass influx of tec providers, who will undercut the costs of properly run tec programmes by adhering to only the most basic enforced standards (as they do with rec training).

I'm a fairly new diver so whatever I say may not make any sense but it is only my observations after all.

What I have come to realize is that it appears that just about everyone's opinion regarding this sport/hobby/profession is different. Whether it's recreational diving or tech diving. It's apparent that there is very little common ground in any aspect SCUBA and really is too bad. Personally I have done a little "tech intro" and am not sure if I will go down that road solely or just take what I learn and adapt it to my style of diving. i do prefer the Halcyon BP to a standard BC. I dont use a console, I use an SPG. My snorkel is in my pocket just in case. Now does this mean that I am a tech diver, nope. Just personal preference. Do I dive with my hands in a "prayer" position....sometimes, sometimes not. Is my buoyancy perfect...nope. Might be one day hopefully.

Is there anything wrong with taking bits and pieces from all the different schools and creating your own style? If so too bad, that's what I am doing.

Did I mention that I love to dive?