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Agathorn
May 28th, 2012, 10:28 PM
Hey everyone, this is my first post here. I finished my certification about a month ago and i'm SLOWLY buying my equipment as I go, and doing a lot of research along the way.

I had a question about the regulator that I was hoping everyone here could help with. Currently i'm looking at something like the Scubapro G250V 2nd stage with the MK17 first stage. People i've spoken with and research i've done online indicates this is a nice middle of the road SB setup but one that is pretty much bullet proof reliable for years and years. I like the sound of that, but i'm guessing that for regs like these to last "years and years" there is probably regular or semi regular service that I would need to have done on it.

What i'm trying to find out is what i'm looking at for that service and how much it costs. I mean if its something that is going to be like $200 a year for servicing, i'd be better off just replacing it every few years!

Anyway sorry if this is a pretty stupid question, but its been bothering me lately. All this gear can get expensive, which is fine, but it makes me want to be darned sure on an equipment choice before spending the money. I'm still at the early research stage on the 1st/2nd stage anyway, as i'll probably get a BCD next, but just trying to line my ducks up :)

LeadTurn_SD
May 28th, 2012, 10:41 PM
Hi Agathorn,

1. There is nothing "middle of the road" about the Mk-17/G250V. That setup will last you your entire dive career, and take you anywhere you want to dive.

2. Cost of service varies by locale, but a "ballpark" average is $25 per stage. So, a reg with 1st, 2nd and Octo would be $75.

I will not fully open the "annual service" can of worms, but will say that learning to inspect your own gear (see the sticky link at the top of this forum regarding inspecting your own regulator) is well worth the effort.

Many of us have taken the next step and learned to service out own gear too.... but one step at a time ;).

Have fun with your new gear!

Best wishes.

chrpai
May 28th, 2012, 10:50 PM
I'll go there...

I purchased a Mares MR12 set back around 2000. I dove it hundreds of times until 2005 and never serviced it once. I would inspect it before dives and check the IP for signs of trouble. I then retired from diving and gave the reg set away to a local tech instructor. As I understand it, he serviced the set himself and then passed it on to a diver who needed a reg.

The money I saved on not servicing paid for my new Hog set. I'm pretty sure I'm going to follow the same strategy again. YMMV but personally I feel that if it ain't broke, don't let a shop monkey break it.

elan
May 28th, 2012, 11:19 PM
Hey everyone, this is my first post here. I finished my certification about a month ago and i'm SLOWLY buying my equipment as I go, and doing a lot of research along the way.

I had a question about the regulator that I was hoping everyone here could help with. Currently i'm looking at something like the Scubapro G250V 2nd stage with the MK17 first stage. People i've spoken with and research i've done online indicates this is a nice middle of the road SB setup but one that is pretty much bullet proof reliable for years and years. I like the sound of that, but i'm guessing that for regs like these to last "years and years" there is probably regular or semi regular service that I would need to have done on it.

What i'm trying to find out is what i'm looking at for that service and how much it costs. I mean if its something that is going to be like $200 a year for servicing, i'd be better off just replacing it every few years!

Anyway sorry if this is a pretty stupid question, but its been bothering me lately. All this gear can get expensive, which is fine, but it makes me want to be darned sure on an equipment choice before spending the money. I'm still at the early research stage on the 1st/2nd stage anyway, as i'll probably get a BCD next, but just trying to line my ducks up :)


MK17/G250V is an ultimate diving machine, I have yet to see one that grow out of it :)

Check this link http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/regulators/346813-regulator-inspection-checklist-rev-7-a.html it shows how to do a "health check" of your regulator.

Cannot speak for the SP but I notice that my Zeagles FHVI start showing wear of the balance chamber o-ring after about 100+ dives, one of the regs I rebuilt this winter was serviced 2 years back then and still was locking ok. So if you regularly monitor the reg you might go away with every 2-3 years service depending on how much you dive.

---------- Post added ----------


Hi Agathorn,

2. Cost of service varies by locale, but a "ballpark" average is $25 per stage. So, a reg with 1st, 2nd and Octo would be $75.

.
Is it excluding the parts cost ? otherwise $25 is an outstanding super deal :) I have never seen those...
SP does not give the parts for free anymore unless you buy a dive trailer full of their equipment :)

halocline
May 28th, 2012, 11:56 PM
The $25/stage is a good labor charge; the repair kits are probably close to that as well. So a guess would be around $100 for a 1st/2nd stage rebuild.

The MK17/G250V can probably go around 150-200 dives (that's really just an arbitrary guess on my part) before 'needing' a rebuild. That's assuming that it's stored properly, with the 2nd stage knob all the way out, and soaked-not just rinsed off- in fresh water after every salt water dive. It also assumes that your air fills are nice and dry and that there's no problem with the tanks you use.

So, unless you're diving a lot, like 4-5 dives/week, year round, you won't need annual service if you take care of your gear. I have a friend who's MK25/D400 is still in perfect shape 5 years after being expertly serviced, but he doesn't dive much.

If you're money-conscious, and you're diving in FL (not very cold water) you might consider finding a used G250 (virtually identical to the G250V) on a MK10 or 15 or 20. (Or MK25 for that matter, but they tend to be more expensive) With some patience you'll find one in good shape for under $200. You will have to get it rebuilt initially unless you're sure it's been well serviced when you buy it, so that adds some cost.

Kunundrum
May 29th, 2012, 12:23 AM
MK17/G250V is a very nice setup, works well and in any environment.

Rincing your gear properly (especially when diving in salt water) is key to ensuring it continues to operate in tip top shape for years to come.

the S600 is also an excellent 2nd stage, and it is available with a metal air barrel, and is considerably smaller than the G250.

You should also look at Atomic regulators, the service interval is every 2 years/300 dives, or Apeks/Aqualung one of the few that still offer free parts bi-annual service to the original owners of the regulators.

elan
May 29th, 2012, 12:32 AM
BTW the 250v has a nice feature on the purge button that allows to lock the purge half way thus releasing the pressure from the seat and increasing the seat lf live. I guess unscrewing the cranking pressure knob is not even necessary

eelnoraa
May 29th, 2012, 12:54 AM
It seems the labor for service is pretty consistent, $25/stage, so $75 for a set of single reg. Ball part number for part is like $25 for 1st, $15 for 2nd, so total part is $55. Together, a service will cost $120 give or take. Now, do you really need follow scubapro recommendation, to have your reg service every year? You have to decide on your own.

Agathorn
May 29th, 2012, 08:11 AM
Hi Agathorn,

1. There is nothing "middle of the road" about the Mk-17/G250V. That setup will last you your entire dive career, and take you anywhere you want to dive.

Well when I said "middle of the road" I meant price. It isn't their most expensive combo, not their least. But like you say, all my research points to it being a very solid combo that will last quite a long time.


MK17/G250V is an ultimate diving machine, I have yet to see one that grow out of it :)

Check this link http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/regulators/346813-regulator-inspection-checklist-rev-7-a.html it shows how to do a "health check" of your regulator.


I saw, and read, that link prior to posting. Some of that makes sense to me, some of it doesn't :) I will definitely do what I can to maintain and inspect it myself as long as I'm comfortable doing it. I'm a handy person (Just this weekend I ripped open my DLP TV to replace the color wheel myself) but we're talking about a complicated and precision piece of equipment that I depend on for my life underwater and that I don't even understand how it works :)



The $25/stage is a good labor charge; the repair kits are probably close to that as well. So a guess would be around $100 for a 1st/2nd stage rebuild.

The MK17/G250V can probably go around 150-200 dives (that's really just an arbitrary guess on my part) before 'needing' a rebuild. That's assuming that it's stored properly, with the 2nd stage knob all the way out, and soaked-not just rinsed off- in fresh water after every salt water dive. It also assumes that your air fills are nice and dry and that there's no problem with the tanks you use.

So, unless you're diving a lot, like 4-5 dives/week, year round, you won't need annual service if you take care of your gear. I have a friend who's MK25/D400 is still in perfect shape 5 years after being expertly serviced, but he doesn't dive much.


At a guess right now, probably 20-30 dives a year at first, maybe a tad more once I start owning more gear and renting less.



If you're money-conscious, and you're diving in FL (not very cold water) you might consider finding a used G250 (virtually identical to the G250V) on a MK10 or 15 or 20. (Or MK25 for that matter, but they tend to be more expensive) With some patience you'll find one in good shape for under $200. You will have to get it rebuilt initially unless you're sure it's been well serviced when you buy it, so that adds some cost.

I won't say "money is not an issue", but I also don't mind paying the money for a solid piece of equipment that I can depend on. Considering how important the 1st and 2nd stages are, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with used equipment.


BTW the 250v has a nice feature on the purge button that allows to lock the purge half way thus releasing the pressure from the seat and increasing the seat lf live. I guess unscrewing the cranking pressure knob is not even necessary

Are you saying this lets you crack it open while stored? What is the benefit of that? I mean while stored it isn't under pressure anyway right?

Anyone have a link to a thread, guide, or anything that covers how to properly clean and store the reg?

Thanks for everyone's replies!

nfarrar
May 29th, 2012, 08:17 AM
Is it excluding the parts cost ? otherwise $25 is an outstanding super deal :) I have never seen those...
SP does not give the parts for free anymore unless you buy a dive trailer full of their equipment :)

Most good SP dealer are giving not charging for parts on annual service to make up for SP pulling PFL. That is is you buy instore. My advice is pay in cash ;-) . Also look at a HOG D1. Great regulator at a KILLER price. 1st and 2nd stage for $260! Lifetime warranty.

Later Mon,
Nick

elan
May 29th, 2012, 09:31 AM
I won't say "money is not an issue", but I also don't mind paying the money for a solid piece of equipment that I can depend on. Considering how important the 1st and 2nd stages are, I'm not sure I'd be comfortable with used equipment.



Are you saying this lets you crack it open while stored? What is the benefit of that? I mean while stored it isn't under pressure anyway right?


IMHo you put to much emphasis on the importance of the regulator. The emphasis should be more on the thaining. Theregulator is not your life support. Your training is. Buying used poses little risk if you know what to buy or have someone who can insure tjereg istuned correctly.

As for the feature of the 250v. Inside the second stage there are 2 important pieces a soft seat and a metal oriffice. The soft seat is normally pressed to the oriffice witha spring. When you inhale or purge the diaphragm acts on a lever that moves away the soft seat and lets the air in. When the seat is pressed into the oriffice all the time ittakes a set ang a groove is formed. Too much of a groove and the performance ofthe reg degrades. Sothe feature allows to releave the pressure on the seat so it does not take the set and that prolongs the life.

Agathorn
May 29th, 2012, 11:22 AM
IMHo you put to much emphasis on the importance of the regulator. The emphasis should be more on the thaining. Theregulator is not your life support. Your training is. Buying used poses little risk if you know what to buy or have someone who can insure tjereg istuned correctly.

You are 100% correct, but on the flip side that doesn't mean you would intentionally dive with bad equipment either :) I do see your point though. As a new diver though i'm still scared of having to deal with equipment failures like a free flowing reg. Or running otu of air because my SPG isn't reading properly.


As for the feature of the 250v. Inside the second stage there are 2 important pieces a soft seat and a metal oriffice. The soft seat is normally pressed to the oriffice witha spring. When you inhale or purge the diaphragm acts on a lever that moves away the soft seat and lets the air in. When the seat is pressed into the oriffice all the time ittakes a set ang a groove is formed. Too much of a groove and the performance ofthe reg degrades. Sothe feature allows to releave the pressure on the seat so it does not take the set and that prolongs the life.

Thanks for explaining that to me. Makes perfect sense. I wish I understood better how these things work.

elan
May 29th, 2012, 12:48 PM
You are 100% correct, but on the flip side that doesn't mean you would intentionally dive with bad equipment either :) I do see your point though. As a new diver though i'm still scared of having to deal with equipment failures like a free flowing reg. Or running otu of air because my SPG isn't reading properly.
In your case I would not hesitate to go with MK17/G250V , it will not save you from the problems mentioned but it is a very solid and dependable combo and for what it does it's quite under priced compared to other SP options :)

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