Refusing to dive with a dodgy buddy

[faze]

I recently refused to drop in the water when I was buddied up with an individual who was, in my opinion, to cocky for his (or anyone else's) good.

Although I'll admit I had not warmed to him, the final straw for me was when he started bragging about only having 170 bar in his tank (a full tank is 200 bar) as if this was something to be proud of. When I suggested he grabbed a full tank (there were plenty) he refused saying it wasn't necessary as he routinely breathed his air down to 10 bar.

I explained that only an idiot would willingly dive on a depleted tank, told him a couple of home truths and advised the DM that there was no way I was getting in the water with him as he was an accident that simply hadn't happened yet (figured I'd rather have my dive wrecked at the surface rather than at depth).

On the dive he apparently succeeded in executing an inverted buoyant ascent when he ditched his weights on the way down the line, before lying to the DM about his air usage and having to be assisted back to the line, cutting his and his buddies dive short by about 10 mins.

Has anyone else had a situation where they have refused to dive because their elected buddy was a concern... and if so, how did the dive school deal with it when that person reappeared the very next day booked to dive again?

[boulderjohn]

Good choice not to dive with him--remember that part of the reserve air in his tank belongs to you. He was in essence telling you before the dive that he planned to breathe up all the air that you would need in case of an emergency.

My wife doesn't dive, so I rarely have a preplanned buddy when on vacation. Although I have had a number of less than stellar experiences with the many "insta-buddy" episodes of my life, I have never had one that I have ever refused to dive with, and I have never seen it happen to anyone else, either.

[djtimmy77]

I rather not dive than dive with a dodgy buddy. I won't even consider planning to go diving without having a trustworthy buddy first. Thankfully I've got some great buddies who like to dive a lot!

[Searcaigh]

I have refused to dive with an insta buddy many years ago when he ran out of air after 25 mins on the first dive. Since then I have been very choosy about who I dive with and frequently dive solo with a pony as back up if conditions allow me to do that.

Learning who NOT to dive with is just as important as learning who to dive with.

[Scuba_Noob]

You made the best choice, by your judgment and by what actually happened on the dive. I'm impressed that you had the self-control to cancel your dive because of some guy's attitude.

I've had one really dodgy insta-buddy who had a really shady attitude. We had gone through the entire dive plan, all the signals, and all the buddy issues/checks very very thoroughly before we got in, as I wanted to avoid any communication issues. In the water, the guy's buoyancy was horrid. Although we agreed that I'd lead (which I did very slowly), he constantly went the opposite direction for camera shots in mediocre visibility (losing me twice by going the other way). The cherry on top was when he didn't look at his air for a while and got low on air (I had asked him his air a few times already). He didn't bother informing his buddy or asking for my octo but shot straight up (something we discussed NOT to do). Funny part was that his tank was 40 cu ft larger than mine, and I still had 1300psi. Then he blamed me for everything in the end.

There were plenty of other issues with the guy. But I wish I had done what you did and not gone with such a horrid buddy. I just wanted to dive.

[NWGratefulDiver]

Good call. I'll dive with almost anyone ... but will find ways to avoid people who make me nervous about their attitude.

I normally travel with people I know, and so rarely have to deal with the dodgy types. But a few years back I encountered one in Bonaire who asked if we could buddy up ... being the only two on the boat who didn't have dive buddies. He was a German fellow, who seemed rather nice, so I said OK. I told him this was my third dive of the day, so I wanted to keep it relatively shallow ... 20 meters or less. He said "yah" and off we went. He immediately proceeded straight down the reef. At 20 meters, I signaled to level off. He signalled back OK and proceeded deeper. At 25 meters I tapped his arm and signaled to go back up a bit. He returned an OK, turned and continued downslope. At 30 meters I tapped him, pointed to myself, pointed up, waved good-bye, and proceeded back up to a shallower depth. As I watched, he turned and kept going down ... I think he eventually levelled out at about 40 meters. Meanwhile, I swam over to where the DM was showing some other divers a frogfish (at around 15 meters), and signaled that I was joining their group. The DM acknowledged and I proceeded to have a nice dive. About halfway through the dive, my erstwhile buddy joined us.

Back on the boat I told the DM I would not dive with that gentleman again. On a subsequent dive, when he asked me to buddy with him again I said "no" ... with no other explanation offered. None needed, to my concern. I'll happily dive with people who have poor skills and a good attitude ... but a buddy who willfully breaks a dive plan isn't someone I want to be in the the water with ...

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[knotical]

Once. In Cayman Brac. While my wife and I were kitting up for a boat dive, another diver was trying to put his BC on the cylinder upside down! I helped him. Also showed him how to check his pressure. During our brief conversation he claimed to be experienced, but just seemed flaky. Later the DM asked us to let him buddy with us, and I refused. Another couple volunteered. After the dive, we heard they chased him to 150 feet and pulled him up. He sat out the rest of the week, claiming ear issues, but I think the DMs refused to let him dive again.

[Laurie S.]

I did one time. On the first dive, my instabuddy ran out of air within 5 minutes of being in the water. I'm not kidding. He had on a 7 mil and couldn't descend. I don't know what he did with his air, but he must have breathing it on the boat. I had had a chance to dive with another group of three divers and had waited for this guy instead. He had to go back to the boat and I was sitting there alone in less than 10 feet of visibility with about 2500 psi. I couldn't see the other group because they were long gone. It was only my 13th dive and so I told the crew that I would be down below the stern practicing skills.

On the next dive, he did better, but he never would dive with me. I was down about 25 feet exploring a small canyon (crack) and he consistently stayed 10 feet above me and behind me. I constantly was looking for him. Again, he ran out of air early, but at least he lasted about 20 minutes this time. Because visibility was better there, I watched him go back to the boat (surface swim) and continued solo.

We had two more dives the next day. The other problem was that he never would gear up, or even suit up, until the DMs would say the pool was open. The rest of us would be standing at the stern ready to jump. The first dive I waited for him, probably 10 minutes, before he got his butt in the water. Again, he wouldn't stay by me and left me early. I was able to hook up with that other group.

On the final dive that day, the other group and I were in the water and looked up on the boat to see him just starting to put his wetsuit on. I said I was tired of "diving" with him and the others said, he's not being a buddy to you, come with us. So, we left him on the boat and I had the best dive of that weekend.

[jmneill]

I never refused a buddy, but I have surfaced on more than one dive wishing I had. The real problems often times don't become evident until the dive is in progress.

[JamesK]

I have refused buddies before. I will pretty much dive with anyone on simple dives. However, on one dive I had someone who tried to change the plan underwater, lead the dive, take fresh out of OW divers down below 60 feet, and then simply forgot about all of us and split from us. This person surfaced with another diver both having 500psi left. They were approx 600 meters from shore. The idiot submerged, and ended up 700 meters away from their buddy who was surface swiming back to the shore. They had less then 200 psi remaining and were now down current from the exit. After the dive I informed them to not waste any precious air asking me to dive with them again as it would never happen.

[mala]

I never refused a buddy, but I have surfaced on more than one dive wishing I had. The real problems often times don't become evident until the dive is in progress.

you can get a good idea by how they kit up and what they are wearing.

[Jeff Pack]

Poor Buddy skills top my list of DND's (Do Not Dive).

One guy I got paired up with, every damned time I turned around, he was jetting off in yet another different direction on his own. I've never dove with that guy again since. Nor even that group anymore, for similar poor buddy skills reasons. Birds of a feather I guess.

[boulderjohn]

I just remembered that I have had dive buddies taken away (mercifully) by dive operators.

In one case, I signed up for a dive at a dive shop in South Florida, having an amiable chat with the shop owner when I did. I got to the boat as a single diver, as usual, and since solo diving was not allowed, the DM had to find a buddy for me. Without asking me a question, the DM went over to a father/son team and asked them if I could join them. The father was setting up the gear and didn't look up. "I don't know," he growled. "Does he have any idea what he's doing?" The DM turned to me and asked me if I had any idea what I was doing. I nodded. (I was an instructor.) They reluctantly agreed to go with me, provided I didn't hold them back. At that moment the owner, who was diving that day, came on board and started talking with me again. He asked who I was diving with, and when I told him, his eyes got wide and he looked quickly around the boat. In a minute I was put with a different group and had a great dive with those skilled divers. I never saw the father/son team in the water, but when I got back on the boat, it looked like they had been on the boat for a very, very long time. I'm glad I didn't hold them back from getting out of the water.

In the second case, I was on a liveaboard in Thailand, again as a single diver. As it turned out, there was only one other single diver in the group, so we were naturally paired. He had good skills, but he made the stereotype of the self-absorbed marine photographer seem like an ideal buddy. Every dive was focused on him and his photography needs. If he saw something that caught his eye, we could spend 20 minutes on that spot, making sure none of the other photographers could get a decent turn. (The terror of digital photography is that a photographer can take hundreds of shots of the same thing in search of the perfect exposure.) I suffered with that, with him ignoring every hint and direct statement until one dive when the situation demanded we dive as a group with a DM leading us so that we could end the dive in a very special, hard-to-find place, one of the highlights of the trip. Our group never got there because my buddy spent so long photographing one critter hiding in the coral, with the timid rookie DM afraid to push him along. Everyone ran out of air and had to surface before we got to the intended location. After the dive, I told him it would have been nice to get to that special location, and he (not recognizing my point one bit) said it didn't bother him that he didn't get there because he got so many great shots where he was. That incident apparently got the boat crew's attention. Just before the next dive, the skipper, an excellent photographer himself, offered to buddy with him the rest of the trip so that he could give him some marine photography tips. It was obviously a ploy to free me (and everyone else) from his obsessive focus on his own personal needs. I admit that I should have spoken up sooner myself--I'm just not the kind of guy to whine.

[denisegg]

Oh Me Me!! Is this the Insta-buddy rant thread?...I have sooo many... Which one to choose? I also have a non-diving spouse who is glad to sit at the resort and read while I dive. Hmm...hard to say which was the worst. Maybe the guy who had no other buddy. I knew two other people on the boat but the DM said vis wasn't great and they were concerned about keeping up with a 3 buddy crew. All along this one guy had no one. I am thinking NO NO!
Guess what? I wound up with him. After about 10 minutes on the wreck he was waving at me with the reg barely in his mouth. His tank had slipped down to the point it was barely in the cam strap and he could barely hold the reg in his mouth. I gave him the OK sign and literally..although I hate to actually admit it, I got on his back, straddled him and undid the cam strap, pushed his tank up and refastened the strap so that he could once again breathe through the regulator. But at this point, I assume he is virtually horrified ;) , he bolts to the surface, off the anchor line, and surfaces somewhere away from the boat. I watch his ascent and think, oh hell, no...So I finished my dive and went up the line and he was sitting there on the boat all innocent like nothing had ever happened...

[JamesK]

well to his defense you did crawl all over his back. maybe his wetsuit got a little snug all of a sudden and to avoid further embarrassment he booted to the surface.

[Guba]

As for declining to dive with an individual.....well, sorta. I paired with a friendly, knowlegable fellow for a three day liveaboard. The entire first day of diving (5 dives) went well, and we were a good match. The next morning we listened to the dive briefing, but I noticed that he seemed a bit distracted and a little haggard. He was unusually quiet as we began gearing up. Before getting into our BCs, I asked, "Hey, bud...is everything okay? You don't seem too excited to be hitting the water." He replied, "Oh, I may just be tired. Didn't sleep too well. I think I'll be okay."
Alarm bells went off for me. "Hey, it's a big ocean and we'll be on this site for a second dive. How about we sit this one out and go have some coffee?"
My buddy actually looked relieved. Later, he confided that "things just didn't feel right" and that since I asked and then suggested we sit it out, he felt better about thumbing the dive. Turns out, at my buddy's insistance, I was able to join up with another diver and make the dive. My buddy popped some Dramamine (he realized he was feeling a bit seasick as well) took a nap and we finished the rest of the trip as partners.
I definitely think it pays to observe your partner closely, but it also is beneficial to monitor your own feelings concerning a dive. If things don't feel right, it makes sense to say something and even abort.

[Jim Lapenta]

One time on my first keys trip. Learned a valuable lesson. Pick ops that will let me dive solo or with another same ocean buddy (splash together then go our own ways and maybe meet up at the trail line) just in case. That is if I'm not traveling with one or have not found one I trust.

[jmneill]

you can get a good idea by how they kit up and what they are wearing.

Do you mean if they have their wetsuit on backwards? My only two bad experiences were with guys that looked and acted the part. (until we were at depth) Maybe you know to look for something I don't?

[TSandM]

I've had a couple of "unknown to me previously" buddies where the dive didn't go well, but I never had to do anything about avoiding diving with them again, because the dive day was over.

I have, however, been the beneficiary of somebody ELSE's decision to jettison a buddy. I was on the Spectre in Southern California with two friends, and we had planned to dive together. I was sitting and talking to another couple on the boat, when one of the crew brought over a fellow who was on the boat alone, and asked if he could join the couple as an "instabuddy". They hemmed and hawed and were clearly very reluctant, so I said I'd buddy up with him, and went to tell my friends that they would be just a pair for the first dive.

I think it was the GUE T-shirt he had on that was the clue. (He was an excellent buddy, and we had a great time.)

[soltari675]

I once buddied with a girl who was on the boat alone. We made a solid plan. We knew our planned depth, what pressure to turn back, what pressure to begin our ascent, where to do a safety stop and for how long, etc. Great plan. The dive itself went fine. A little far apart for my tastes, but more than close enough to get to in an emergency. So no big deal. I see that my pressure is at the turn around pressure and motion to her, who I learn has less than the planned pressure. Not too much less, but I was less amused. We get back to the anchor line and I still have about 1300 or so, so I was going to ask her her pressure, and if enough, we'd explore the corals close to the anchor line for a little bit. I turn around to ask and..... she's gone. I get nervous and look around a little, and when I look up I realize she is already at the safety stop and passing it to the boat. Odd. So I ascend. Get on the boat and ask her and she says she was just done and wanted to go back. Ok..... communication would be nice. I try once more with her later, and again the dive goes great. She stays with me this time until we ascend. This dive we had went to almost 100ft for a decent amount of time. So I am stopping at our safety stop and she just passes me and heads up. I grab her fin and motion to level off for a few minutes. She jerks free, frowns at me and surfaces. I finish my safety stop and get on the boat. Ask her what's up and she tells me she ascended slow enough and she was fine. Safety stop was my problem. For the rest of the week I refused to dive with her again.

[Jim Lapenta]

You do know that even though it is highly recommended a safety stop is optional and not a required deco stop. That said any dive near or over 100 feet and I'm doing deep stops as well.

[jmneill]

You do know that even though it is highly recommended a safety stop is optional and not a required deco stop. That said any dive near or over 100 feet and I'm doing deep stops as well.

Some people have forgotten this. I was buddied up with an experienced diver on a wreck @ 90' boat was in a srong current up top when the ancor broke loose and shot out of sight like a stingray. Our other two guys up top on the boat didn't realise they were leaving without us. The sun was sinking low, the boat was leaving without us and my buddy wanted to do the safety stop. lol (didn't happen)

[Skydiver1]

I'm a dodgy buddy. But my regular buddy is even dodgier than me.

Blind leading the blind.

[Bratface]

As others have said, I will dive with almost anyone too. I did refuse to dive with one young woman. She looked extremely nervous, and looked like someone who wants to hold their buddy's hand on the entire dive. Sometimes I don't mind helping someone like that, but on that day I wanted to enjoy my dive and look for little creatures. Sure enough, 15 minutes into the dive, I see the DM taking her back to the boat. She didn't do the second dive.

[RonFrank]

I treat insta-buddies as if I am solo. If we stick together great, but many times they swim around like they are in a race and I refuse to chase them. I've had some wonderful insta-buddies, one woman who was new but had the buddy thing down until she thought we were not where we needed to be and insisted we ascend one ball shy of our exit. No problem, the boat had to motor over one ball and she was embarrassed but I told her no worries. Easy to make that mistake on a big ship. We had a great dive. That was a Largo Scubaboard Invasion trip diving with Brent and Capt Marval!

If you have no buddy expectations its difficult to be disappointed. Be ready to dive solo. I carry a 19CF pony and have my ocean kit (SMB, reel).

[boulderjohn]

If you have no buddy expectations its difficult to be disappointed.

No kidding. I've even dived with you.:D

[DivemasterDennis]

RonFrank, I can't endorse what you posted. To me buddy diving means diving with a buddy, not just hoping they stay around. I take time for a thorough pre-dive discussion on profile, safety check, equipment familiarization, and communication (signs, etc.), and expectations and goals for the dive (photos, movement, what to see, etc. That creates a contract between us, and if my buddy doesn't follow the contract, then our buddy relationship ends when that dive ends, not during the dive. Maybe it's my years of being a DM as well as working with students, but if I agree to buddy up, I will stay buddies until the dive ends. However, I will enforce the "contract." I can be a bit forceful in the water if I have to be, and with insta-buddy I always clip on a slate, something I do not need when diving with an established dive partner. That's how I roll. I understand not everyone will agree.
DivemasterDennis

[denisegg]

Ok, so I have another story with a DM. I am on a boat alone and the DM is alone so I am "Yeah"!! I get to buddy with the DM. We were drift diving in palm beach, florida and she would be carrying the smb and since I was a fairly new diver at that time I liked the idea of being close to what the captain on the boat had his eye on at the surface. :D
Everything was great until 3 sharks came out of no where and passed us. My buddy then decided to go against the current and get away from the sharks. She flung herself to the bottom and started trying to propel herself against the current by holding on to coral on the bottom, however, this plan didn't work to well because she was pulling up coral everywhere. I'm thinking.. geez..."I was taught you weren't suppose to touch this stuff...conservation and all".. Well, she finally found something that she could not pull up by the roots and she planted herself on it, holding it with one hand and the tow line with the other. At this point I ask if she needs help and she declines but then her mask starts flooding and she is about to lose it. I finally ring the tow line from her hand so that she can right herself and fix her mask and by this time I thumb the dive. Ok! She is all good and we ascend and do our safety stop and then get back on the boat like everything is good. :D

---------- Post added ----------

I should start my own thread called "The Shameful things I have done to get in a boat dive" :D

[Jeff Pack]

If an insta buddy is so poor he/she dives as if they are solo, then they can go off and just do so, and are on their own as far as I'm concerned. A contract requires two interested parties, not just one.

[soltari675]

You do know that even though it is highly recommended a safety stop is optional and not a required deco stop. That said any dive near or over 100 feet and I'm doing deep stops as well.

Oh I know, and on the way back to the boat we were at around 35ft the whole way. I'd say about 10 minutes or so. So no worries. And yes, I know it is optional, however we had talked on the boat and agreed to do the safety stop, so I didn't have doubts about it. I was confused when she continued to surface. I understand she was probably ok, and like she said, she ascended slowly. But she left me, when she agreed to do the stop with her only excuse being, "I ascended slow enough. I'm fine." No care about deviating from our plan. That was my issue. :)

[Darnold9999]

I treat insta-buddies as if I am solo. If we stick together great, but many times they swim around like they are in a race and I refuse to chase them. I've had some wonderful insta-buddies, one woman who was new but had the buddy thing down until she thought we were not where we needed to be and insisted we ascend one ball shy of our exit. No problem, the boat had to motor over one ball and she was embarrassed but I told her no worries. Easy to make that mistake on a big ship. We had a great dive. That was a Largo Scubaboard Invasion trip diving with Brent and Capt Marval!

If you have no buddy expectations its difficult to be disappointed. Be ready to dive solo. I carry a 19CF pony and have my ocean kit (SMB, reel).

I'm with Ron on this one. Have done far too many dives with divers that believe that when I say I want to dive slowly that I don't mean it. I have ended up swimming as fast as I can to just keep up with them. In the beginning I was a good buddy and kept swimming, then I moved to just waving goodby to their fins, now I dive solo whenever possible. Have had lots of dives where my buddy was interested in diving slowly, but by far the majority of instabuddies - not on a liveaboard - were of the jet around the reef variety and I am just not interested. Instabuddies on a liveaboard have universally been the other way. Can't remember one that was a problem at all. Still dive solo if at all possible now however - that way if I spend 20 minutes sitting looking at something nobody cares :D

Have only had one buddy I wished I had passed on. Told me he was an experienced cold water diver - turns out he hadn't been cold water diving for years. Ended up putting my camera back on the boat half way through the dive so I could keep an eye on him - should have put it on the boat sooner. Was the dive that convinced me I needed to dive solo. Not interested in being responsible for some stranger's safety, and figured out that really I was the only one I could rely on to be responsible for me. Having such an instabuddy added nothing to my margin of safety so I better be sure I was completely self reliant.

[dumpsterDiver]

I just thought of one... I was paired up with this new guy who was apparently a very experienced scuba dive and spearfisherman. He was also an active local judge. He appeared to be in excellent shape, maybe 58 yrs old , and looked like an amateur body builder. He had all the right gear, nothing too new or too old and he set everything up efficiently and correctly. I had no worries.

He and I are diving alone on a drift dive into an artificial reef in 80 feet or so. The current is running strong on the surface, maybe 2 kts and maybe 1-1.5 on the bottom, nothing unusual really... So we get to the bottom, no problem (well maybe he was alittle heavy and was flailing around) but then he almost immediately gets the floatline wrapped around his tank valve.

The line is thin, very strong cord and once he is wrapped, the pull from the float flips him over and his big heavy tank, kinda holds him on his back. He is now flailing around, waving his loaded gun around with no regard for pointing it at me, and the float is pulling him hard head first, on his back, as he makes a long deep drag mark in the sand. The line is very tight and he is begin drug faster than me, because he is being hauled by the surface float that is in a much faster current.

He is also sreaming wildly as he is drug over the sand. I am pretty much laughing my ass off, but quickly realize that once this float drags into the wreckage and he starts impacting the rocks with the back of his head, we might have a real problem...LOL..


So I quickly jump on his back and pop the line off the valve and free him. He is obviously very shaken up, but we have been down all of 3 minutes and he gives me the Ok sign.

We move/drift into our intended area, and I think I shoot a small fish and i am busy dealing with that and managing the floatline and hook and reel for a minute or so... when I get back to him.. he has shot a 25-30 lb grouper and is struggling with it. trying to grab it and control it. It is fatally shot behind the gills, but still is kicking butt. I grab it for him and quicklly realize that it is a goliath grouper (a protected species). I grab my knife, scamble the brain to reduce its suffering and hand it to him. Then I guess he realizes it was a jewfish and we let it drift off, dead,,... The rest of the dive was uneventful.

When we are safely back on board he says to me: "Not one word"....

I dive with him on the next dive.

[olphart]

My experience kinda goes in the other direction. Some years back I was teamed up with a guy who told me he had only 7 dives. I said we'd be fine, but was thinking, "Oh boy here goes a short dive. I hope his skills aren't too bad." As it turned out he was an excellent buddy, staying close and we enjoyed the dive. He was having a little bit of bouyancy issue, waving his arms around to hold position. I demoed using breathing to control position and he got it right away, improving dramatically.
The prick in my bubble of self importance came when I asked how his air was and he signalled 1700lb. I felt a little chagrinned to have signal back 1500. So much for the big shot AOW diver!:dork2:
Back on the boat he thanked me for the tip on bouyancy and I thanked him for being an excellent dive buddy.
Sometimes instabuddies are pretty darn good

[irishsquid]

...I got on his back, straddled him ... he was sitting there on the boat all innocent like nothing had ever happened...
His plan worked. http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/images/smilies/Standard%20Smiles/04.gif

[Belmont]

I don't look the part and my gear setup (DIR-Hogarthian) is mostly unfamiliar to most divers in the Caribbean where I dive. I usually get a reluctant look. Once in the water my cave diving skills confuses them.

It happened once in the Bahamas where the best part of the group stuck with me and left the DM buzzing around the reef

I usually choose photographers to buddy with. I like to observe small marine life, and I also like to point interesting things to my buddy.

They repeatedly ask me to dive with them.

This way I get a bunch of photos and videos I return for my services.

[TNRonin]

His plan worked. http://www.scubaboard.com/forums/images/smilies/Standard%20Smiles/04.gif

don't say one word! :p

Sent from my DROID X2

[Rogersea]

RonFrank, I can't endorse what you posted. To me buddy diving means diving with a buddy, not just hoping they stay around. I take time for a thorough pre-dive discussion on profile, safety check, equipment familiarization, and communication (signs, etc.), and expectations and goals for the dive (photos, movement, what to see, etc. That creates a contract between us, and if my buddy doesn't follow the contract, then our buddy relationship ends when that dive ends, not during the dive. Maybe it's my years of being a DM as well as working with students, but if I agree to buddy up, I will stay buddies until the dive ends. However, I will enforce the "contract." I can be a bit forceful in the water if I have to be, and with insta-buddy I always clip on a slate, something I do not need when diving with an established dive partner. That's how I roll. I understand not everyone will agree.
DivemasterDennis


How are you forceful in the water????????

Cheers,
Roger

[NWGratefulDiver]

I don't look the part and my gear setup (DIR-Hogarthian) is mostly unfamiliar to most divers in the Caribbean where I dive. I usually get a reluctant look. Once in the water my cave diving skills confuses them.

This reminds me of my first dive in the Maldives. When I'm doing macro photography on a reef I like to swim inverted ... fins up and head down where I can find the small stuff. After the dive the DM asked me if I needed more weight. I said no ... why? He said he noticed I was "swimming down" the whole dive ... :dontknow:

... Bob (Grateful Diver)

[DivemasterDennis]

To respond to outereefadventure's question on "how am I forceful in the water?", by that phrase I men I will contact the buddy, get their attention, write a clear note about staying close, and remain in physical contact until there is some observable agreement. If conduct is repeated and is dangerous ( exceeding dive profile depth more than incidentally, penetrating an unsafe overhead environment not planned for the dive, etc) I will establish contact, note that the dive is over and ascend with the buddy. Then we can have a discussion to remediate or to separate our ways. Such actions are rarely needed- I recall 2 in nearly 1000 recreational dives. Most straying buddies are just inattentive, oblivious. They aren't evil. A good friend of ours and his wife got certified a few years back, and both of them had a new diver tendency to swim off rapidly after some interesting thing. Firm correction got them past that in short order, without any real tension between us. Now each is an excellent dive buddy if Debbie is not diving. with me. But that's just me. Others don't want to be bothered, and that's their business, I suppose. It just runs contrary to my training and personality to kiss off a supposed buddy during a dive. I won't endanger myself, but hey, there will be more dives. I love our sport, I love teaching, I love leading and I love diving for fun. I guess I am to the point where I never totally turn off being an insured and current dive pro.
DivemasterDennis

[Scubadam]

That was smart of you to tell the DM and not dive with him. I myself have been very lucky to this point in terms of dive buddies. I have always had very well trained buddies, and I always get the max. bottom time. One day, I may very well be in your situation, and I hope I would be able to do the same thing you did. :cool2:

[drdaddy]

I always dive with a chosen buddy. My son is my favorite. However, on a boat dive in Hood Canal, my son (Instructor trained in warm Red Sea, Israel) started to "freeze" and we decided that he would stay on the boat for the 3rd dive and warm up on so we could do our night dive later. I frequently solo and always carry a 19cft pony, but in unfamiliar water I want a buddy. So the skipper asked an experienced diver with a rebreather if he wanted to buddy with me. Sure, but as soon as we got in the water he plunged down so fast in the murky top 25 feet and lost me. I went down and looked for him - no where to be found. I worried about him and finally surfaced. Skipper said, "You want to solo - "yep" and I had a great dive. When I came up he (and the others) were on the boat. When I asked him what happened, he could not say. He did sincerely enough apologize, but to this day I have not figured out what happened. I guess he had changed his mind about a buddy, but let no one else know. Instant buddy - well my only one was an experience/advanced diver - but a bit unstable? I would definitely refuse him again and go with another pair.

I'd rather dive with a bad buddy or inexperience diver who I know than an "wild card". Of course since then I make sure I've got a buddy.

[Rhone Man]

Getting back to the OP, it seems to me that there were two issues intertwined: (i) the proposed buddy was potentially unsafe, and (ii) the proposed buddy was a dick.

I remember in St Lucia being insta-buddied up with a girl who simply had woeful skills, but she was very charming and I happily took it on myself that as a more experienced diver I should help keep less experienced divers safe.

Contrast that with another situation where I was insta-buddied up with an obnoxious loudmouth and I simply advised him before we splashed that as far as I was concerned we were both diving solo; if he didn't like that, he didn't have to go. He took that in stride and we both largely ignored each other from then and both had an enjoyable dive.

Skills and personality are not the same thing.

[JamesK]

I remember in St Lucia being insta-buddied up with a girl who simply had woeful skills, but she was very charming and looked good in a wetsuit, so I happily took it on myself that as a more experienced diver I should help keep less experienced divers safe.


There. I fixed it for you. :)

[Searcaigh]

I came across another one yesterday, fortunately I was not buddied with him. He is a real "motor mouth" and I could not wait to get into the water so that I could be out of earshot. Unfortunately the only other non photographer that was on the boat ended up with him, and they had a 20 minute dive to 22M before he hit 50 bar and they had to ascend, his buddy had 150 bar.

Later I discovered that he is a PADI instructor, but has not taught in several years. As he is somebody within my group of off roading "friends" the chances are he will be on one of the drive and dive trips again I will be informing him that when he is low on air he should ascend on his own and let his buddy carry on and join another group.

[Dive Cylinder]

Nightmare situation. It's your life though at the end of the day so definitely the right decision. Some crazy people out there, if they want to get closer to the edge why not take up base jumping

Visit my amateur attempt at a blog - Dive Cylinder (http://www.divecylinder.com)

[DeeperOut]

I got the "agency recognized solo diver" rating as soon as I could. I take last minute vacations often, and the last thing I want is to be paired up with someone with questionable practices. Now all I have to do is coordinate with the operator in advance, making sure they will let me follow the group alone, or however they want it... provided me and my doubles/sidemount/pony setup dont have to dive with someone whos skills I did not evaluate myself. Now there are some dives - poor vis, challenging currents, wrecks, penetration, deep, etc, that I will only do with a reliable team member. Finding the right operator and the right dive conditions is crucial...

[Searcaigh]

The problem I find is when going on dive trips overseas on my own;

A) I do not carry a pony bottle with me nor have I ever seen one for rent in SE Asia where I do most of my overseas trips

B) Photographer instabuddies are few and far between.

On the plus side I have been lucky on a few trips where the DM / Dive Guide has stayed with me after all other divers have ascended allowing me to carry on taking photographs.

Locally I have no issues and am currently arranging certification as a self sufficient diver however on travel trips A above is a limitation unless Pony bottles are made available

[JamesK]

B) Photographer instabuddies are few and far between.


I prefer to dive with photographers, even if I am not shooting. I know they are going to take there time and that allows me time to just lazily kick around near them and look at every square inch of reef.

[Dr. Lecter]

It just runs contrary to my training and personality to kiss off a supposed buddy during a dive.

I have to agree with Dennis here -- I kiss off my supposed buddy before the dive, thereby preventing any potential confusion.

[drbill]

One reason I dive solo... when I'm allowed to.

Was a guest of Jean-Michel's at the Cousteau Fiji resort back in 2001 when I was buddied up with a diver from Oz. During the briefing he boasted and said he refused to follow the guidelines the DM was giving. We descended together, but he was motoring down without so much as a look back at me. When we hit what I thought was 75-100 ft, he was 25 feet below me. I looked at my depth gauge and we were at 125 ft if I remember correctly. I looked back up at the DM (about 45 ft above us, signed that I was heading back to join the group and the DM descended to rein in the cowboy. I have nothing against deep diving (although I did little of it back then), but with all that beauty I wanted to optimize my bottom time.

The DM paired me up with another buddy. That buddy was apologetic before we even entered the water. He said he was an air hog and would cut my dive time short. I think he lasted 25 minutes, and apologized profusely when we surfaced. I told him there was no problem... he had warned me before hand and I accepted that. Hmmm... come to think of it, the first "buddy" warned me too... but I wasn't all right with him!

[James R]

It's always interesting diving with people I haven't met. Sometimes they act all weird like I must be some total newbie and avoid eye contact at all costs. It's like they are trying to avoid getting their dive ruined by some guy they don't know. I have had to rescue one of those guys on a dive and have heard 100% more apologies than I've had to give for a messed up or ridiculously short dive.

Moral of this post: Leave your ego on shore. Don't assume your insta-buddy is going to be the problem. You very well could be paired up with someone with much more experience and skills than you have.

Like a few others, I would prefer to dive solo. This isn't always an option.

[ktkt]

I prefer to dive with photographers, even if I am not shooting. I know they are going to take there time and that allows me time to just lazily kick around near them and look at every square inch of reef.

Ohhhh, me too. I have predive chats with new buddies in which I say, "Okay, I like to go really, really, really slow and stop to look at things," but repeated more times. They almost always say "Oh good, me too!" But the dive almost never goes that way! (No matter how many "really"s I insert into the sentence.) We start out sort of slow, but it often turns into swimming and more swimming, and I have to signal multiple times to slow down. I can rarely stop too look at stuff because too much attention is directed to making sure my buddy doesn't escape.

So photographers, I'm in the market for buddies - I will stay in the same spot as long as you like!

[JamesK]

Ohhhh, me too. I have predive chats with new buddies in which I say, "Okay, I like to go really, really, really slow and stop to look at things," but repeated more times. They almost always say "Oh good, me too!" But the dive almost never goes that way! (No matter how many "really"s I insert into the sentence.) We start out sort of slow, but it often turns into swimming and more swimming, and I have to signal multiple times to slow down. I can rarely stop too look at stuff because too much attention is directed to making sure my buddy doesn't escape.

So photographers, I'm in the market for buddies - I will stay in the same spot as long as you like!

Sounds like you and I would make a perfect buddy team. I did an 80 minute dive on Saturday and only made it about 200 meters.

[ktkt]

Sounds like you and I would make a perfect buddy team. I did an 80 minute dive on Saturday and only made it about 200 meters.

Great, now we just need to figure out where to meet up!

[JamesK]

Great, now we just need to figure out where to meet up!

Cali is too cold. brrrr. You're going to have to come to Florida. :) lol....

[DeeperOut]

The problem I find is when going on dive trips overseas on my own;

A) I do not carry a pony bottle with me nor have I ever seen one for rent in SE Asia where I do most of my overseas trips

B) Photographer instabuddies are few and far between.

Sidemount diving is one of the options.

[drbill]

Cali is too cold. brrrr. You're going to have to come to Florida. :) lol....

Warm water wussie... tee hee!

[Clammy]

Warm water wussie... tee hee!

I'm not sure who looks sillier when I'm standing next to Dr Bill in a drysuit while he is in his 3/2, both going into the same water.

[JamesK]

Warm water wussie... tee hee!

150% I admit it. I hate cold water. I hate cold period. That is why I moved from Wisconsin to Georgia, and now to Naples Florida, and quite possibly the Keys soon. :)


I'm not sure who looks sillier when I'm standing next to Dr Bill in a drysuit while he is in his 3/2, both going into the same water.

He does.

[Tropicalwolf]

Always go with your gut. If it tells you not to dive with someone, dont do it. Simple as that. Good call.

[CT-Rich]

I know this thread is a little old but here is the dive that made me decide that I would solo. I was buddied with a guy for a shore dive at a popular RI site. He was a novice, maybe around 10 dives (good to know in advance). the plan was to enter one beach, circle around the point and exit at the second beach, keep the depth to under 40'. He was diving with a 100 cfu and I had an 80. When we went down I carried my float, which is a tiretube with a flag. After a couple of minutes I noticed that he was over weighted and was using the float to control his bounancy. He was hanging on it like he was dangling from a helicopter. I decided not to say anything until we went up to get bearings and he apologized but kept doing it. Needless to say, the going was pretty slow. Eventually we went up to see if we were past the point of no-reurn. Amazingly, we had managed to make it 2/3 of the way.

So I said we should head in and on the surface once I was down to 500, ( I was at 1000 and he had about 1300). We went down again and when I proceeded to on course. For a change he was not getting a free ride. I looked over my shoulder and he wasn't there. I settled on a rock figuring he might be fiddling with his gear or his ears but would catch up by following the line down.when he didn't show up I waited another couple of minutes and then went up, figuring he was having a problem and had aborted. He was no where to be seen. I figured he must have gone off on his own, he should still have air, so I waited.... and waited....

There was a good rolling swell that day and I was just going up and down on the surface waiting.... And getting slowly seasick... I thought about what too do. It is a popular and easy dive site, but he wasn't tangled in my lines and I didn't see another flag he could mistake for mine. I kept waiting and debated about whether I should blow my emergency whistle to attract attention to help look for him. finally I swam over to a gap in the rocks and saw him exiting at the start point, alone, with out his buddy.

I realized that relying on a stranger as my safety back-up was a one sided affair. I might be able to help them, but more often than not they were of no use to me.

[Diesel00]

I have never refused a dive buddy but should have at time. Now I have my bailout buddy. A 19 cu. ft. pony bottle. He never says no and is always there for me. I haven't needed him yet but he is my favorite dive buddy.