Reel Backlash:

[Norm]

Has anyone ever shot a bag from depth, (for whatever reason), and had their reel to backlash and/or lockup? (Just wondering) I would like to hear of some experiences if anyone would care to share. Thanks.
Norm

[Rick Murchison]

Unless you're using a spool (totally open-faced) there's always a possibility of backlash.
If I am going to shoot a lift bag I usually use a spool - but if I'm going to use a reel for some reason, then I pull the line off the reel first, lock the reel and drop it below before shooting the bag, which just brings the reel back up to me.
Rick

[Uncle Pug]

What are you using the bag for and how deep are you shooting it?

[reefraff]

I wrapped the line on my Manta reel around the rewind knob when shooting a bag from 70fsw once - fortunately I had a backup spool and bag or it would have been a free floating hang.

Spools are kind of a pain though - have to hang on or tie off the line, neither of which seem like a great solution - so I still use the reel pretty regularly.

[Rick Murchison]

Originally posted by reefraff
Spools are kind of a pain though - have to hang on or tie off the line, neither of which seem like a great solution - so I still use the reel pretty regularly.
The spools I make have holes around the outer edge that will accomodate a bolt snap - just capture the line in the snap and snap it through the hole - just like locking down a reel.
Rick

[msjones]

When I use a reel with a lift bag, I become slightly negative, and allow the bag to rise slowly to 1.reduce the possibility of backlash and,2. to reduce the possibility of the bag (open circuit) turning over at surface and coming back down. I hope this helps, and Safe diving.










0

[Norm]

Interesting experiences/input. Thanks guys.
Reasons for shooting a bag, "for whatever reason", can include, but not be limited to: Making an object or location for you/someone else to return to later, Preparing a downline for others to come to/find your specific location, Preparing yourself an upline for deco and/or Marking your ascent for pickup by surface support, among other things.
(Sorry about the slow reply Uncle Pug)
Norm

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by Norm
(Sorry about the slow reply Uncle Pug)


No problem.... the reason I ask is because maybe for some reason you would need to shoot a bag with a reel.... but I never do.... I always use a spool and it just sits there in the water spinning as the line races upward with the bag...

Have you tried using a spool???

As long as you are not shooting from a great depth (and I see no reason to) then the spool is perfect and does not backlash.

[Se7en]

Originally posted by Uncle Pug

As long as you are not shooting from a great depth (and I see no reason to) then the spool is perfect and does not backlash.

How does everyone go about winding all the line back onto a spool as you ascend?

The times I've sent up a bag have generally been when diving in current with a live boat, sending up the bag from around 20 m. Sending the bag up works fine, but hanging off the bag, trying to wind the spool up by hand is a bit annoying while you are being towed along in a decent current - esp if the current is greater on the surface.

Any tips? I'm tempted to change to a reel for ease of line winding, but really like the simplicity and the size of the spool - I can leave it in a BC pocket with no thought. And I like not thinking about this stuff until I decide to use it...

Mike

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by Se7en
How does everyone go about winding all the line back onto a spool as you ascend?
Mike

The bolt snap the is used to clip off the line to the holes around the spool is unclipped at the end of a deco stop but left around the line. Us the bolt snap to wind the line around the spool as you ascend 10' and then clip it off again. Repeat at each stop. If you are in a current and or wind at the surface is pulling the line and spool away fom you...jerk it do every so often.

[Rick Murchison]

Someone - and now I can't remember who [ol'-timer's disease don'tchaknow] - posted a link to a video clip of a diver shooting a lift bag with a spool not too long ago - it was a good clip. Anybody remember who or save the link?
Rick

[Uncle Pug]

http://www.fifthd.com/divestore/classes/video/sbag.htm

There are several videos out there but I think this one is the best. However it does not show how to wind the spool back up. We'll have to get Andrew to do another video.

[Se7en]

Originally posted by Uncle Pug


Us the bolt snap to wind the line around the spool as you ascend 10' and then clip it off again.

Aah - that's an idea. I've currently got the boltsnap tied into the spool - I'll untie it and try. As I'm generally only doing a single stop, it's still a fair wind from 20m to 5m...
Or I guess I can practice deploying a bag mid water in current.

Mike

[Uncle Pug]

Mike,
I didn't think to mention it but we use double ended bolt snaps.

If you tie a foot long loop at the end of your line and then tie a small loop at the end of that you can hook your bolt snap into the small loop and clip it into one of the holes in the edge of the spool. You can then use the other end of the bolt snap to clip the spool off in your pocket. When it is time to shoot the bag you unclip the bolt snap from the spool but leave it in the small loop. Pass the small loop through the eye on the bag and then pass the spool through the large loop of line. Unclip the bolt snap from the small loop and clip it off on a D ring for later. Shoot the bag and let the spool unwind in front of you.... don't hold it. When it stops spinning take your bolt snap and clip it over the line and then through a hole on the spool. When it is time to ascend unclip the bolt snap from the spool but keeping the line captured start to wind. I prefer to rotate the spool than to use the bolt snap as a *winder* but you experiment. When you reach your stop clip the line through a hole in the spool and back away and watch it. If it is moving with the wind or current grab it and give it a yank every so often.

Did you watch the video of Andrew???

[Se7en]

U Pug - thanks for the ideas - It's pretty much exactly how I do it, except -

I've currently just got a single ended bolt snap tied into the centre of the spool... simply because it was the first snap I found in the junk box when setting up a spool. I'll swap for a double ender and have a play.

I've not see a video of anyone sending up a bag... but I'm fairly familiar with the concept of being able to release the spool and watch it spin in front of you - was a bit sceptical when it was first suggested, but pleasantly surprised when I tried it.

Most of the times I've deployed a bag there has been a combination of current and wind - if I tried locking off the spool and letting it go like you suggest, it would vanish in seconds. The drag from the bag on the surface is often enough so that my buddy has to hang on to my BC so that we stay together...

The place I dive most often is at the mouth of a large bay, diving along the walls of what was a river bed some 10 000 years ago, but is now submerged to 20 - 50 m. The bay is probably 50 km's diameter, so there is a lot of water running through with the tides. A lot of dives can only be done on slack water - which actully means descend at slack, and the tide is running by the time we ascend.
Makes life interesting at dusk on an outgoing tide, with 8 or so buddy pairs being rounded up over a large area and time by a live boat....

Mike

[Divesherpa]

You are probably already aware of this, but the first thing you should do if you get a lined reel is cut about 10%-15% of the line off. It also helps if you put a slightly buoyant object (top of a Grolsch bottle) in the loop at the end of your line to keep from accidentally winding the loop to the reel.