Camera Upgrade

I have a C5050, PT-015 and a DS-125. I want to upgrade ... specifically I would like sharper auto-focus, no shutter lag, larger display, easier aperture control and more zoom...what would I want.

A second mortgage . Sounds like you're ready for a DSLR and lots of room on your credit cards. Others will pipe in with suggestions.

That's what I did, 5050 to a 300D.

What's your budget?

FOr a 300D/D70, figure:

Camera - $1000 (300D) - 1200 (D70)
Housing - $1200-2000 depending on manuf.
Port - $200-300
Sync cord - $50

That's just for the kit lens, which is good for a limited range. To add a macro and WA lens, add at least one additional port and $300-400 or so each (or more, maybe much more, depending on the lens) for the lenses.

300D and D70 are the current entry level DSLRs.

Chris

My budget is around 5K...how much of a zoom lens can I get for a D70 and still be able to fit into, say, a nexus housing...what kind of port do I need... and can I get a TTL cable for my DS-125 that connects...also is the shutter lag negligible.

Were you satisfied or dissappointed with your upgrade. Was it worth it.

lindner514:

My budget is around 5K...how much of a zoom lens can I get for a D70 and still be able to fit into, say, a nexus housing...what kind of port do I need... and can I get a TTL cable for my DS-125 that connects...also is the shutter lag negligible.

Were you satisfied or dissappointed with your upgrade. Was it worth it.

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With 5K you are good to go.... Don't know much about Nikon lenses. Check the Nexus housing facts, the manufacturers usually set forth which ports are required for which lenses. Like cameras and housings, before getting a lens you need to determine that the manufacturer makes a port for it.

AS far as how much of a zoom, my take on it is that longer prime lenses (i.e., 100 mm) are better than telephotos. At least that's my understanding, better glass, and it's more unlikely that the manufacturer will make a port and zoom gear for a big telephoto lens. Outside of diopters and such, I believe most people go no further than the Nikon 105 (remember 1.5 the crop factor makes that lens actually a 152 or so). Of course, Chris Bangs goes further than anyone I've seen in that (macro) regard).

Ports can be used somewhat interchangeably. For example, I can use the Canon 100 mm macro in the same flat port as the 18-55 kit lens with a short port extension. Again, the manufacturer website (at least with Ike and Aquatica) list the port/lens combos.

I've only seen the Ikelite D70 housing in person. Warning - it is HUGE. Aquatica's would, i think, be more compact, which is what I use for the 300D (and check out the specs on that puppy, negligibly larger than the 5050). Of course, an 8" dome adds some heft. (Ike has 6" domes only), Nexus and Subal 8" I believe.

TTL? The only DSLR right now that does TTL is the Fuji S2, and likely the S3. However, most people I know shoot manual. Heard a story that everyone that attended a Stephen Frink workshop were using manual by the second day, even S2 users.

I am sure the 125 will take a sync cord, you'll have to check with Ike on that one.

SHutter lag is not only negligible, it's virtually non-existent.

Check out digitaldiver.net or wetpixel.com's forums. Lots of folks have recently made the change to DSLRs, most to the D70, the smart ones to the 300D (OK, just kidding). But the Canon/Nikon debate gets heated at times.........

Worth it? WIthout a doubt, 90% of the time. The other 10% is re learning the curve, the lighting is somewhat different, I had the 5050 fairly well dialed in, so it's been a bit of an adjustment, but the fast AF and no shutter lag will have you wondering why you didn't do it sooner.

Chris

Chris is right, from what I've seen of housed digicams you'll be a bit shocked by the size of the housings. I've used housed cameras from day one, so I'm pleasantly surprised at how they have shrunk over time.

Although you'll be holding this big thing and saying "This is small??? Sheesh!"

The Ike D125 will sync by cord, but don't expect TTL unless there's an Ikelite housing on the other end (specifically a Canon 300D). Or an S2. So, welcome to manual strobe; your image quality will thank you. Although TTL certainly is a nice crutch for macro.

Some of the global issues:

Zoom vs Prime lenses: If quality of the image is a big deal for you, stick with primes. If you want to have more flexibility on each dive, get a zoom. Also, in the short run, zooms are less dollars.

Housing make. European and Japanese housings are pretty well made, a bit more expensive, and made abroad (so that's where they go to be fixed). Expect to have them gone for a looong time if they need fixing. Housings made in the Americas are pretty much as good, quality-wise, and turnarounds are dependant on the manufacturer; Ike=fast, Aquatica=beg.

Dome size. Nexus, Seacam and Subal all try to shoehorn you into a small dome. Why this is, is beyond me. I've seen more complaints about bad optics, soft in the corners, huge diopters and barrel/pincushion from this. Use a big dome and most of this goes away. Subal and Seacam, at least, will sell you a decent (8"-9") dome, and with Aquatica that's all you can get. Ike doesn't have a dome that's that big, but at least it has a large radius so it avoids some of the problems.

Canon vs Nikon. Whooooeee, more than a few verbal barfights over this one. Disclaimer: the author is a NPS member...

With that said, Canon jumped into the digital arena very fast, and built a big lead. The price is a "split" in formats; both cropped sensors and 35mm sized sensors. Canon is running a chance of having to eventually kill off a line that becomes nonprofitable, and it will probabally be the 35mm size sensors. In the meantime, corporate R&D, and production, resources are losing ground because of the effort to keep two lines at a cutting edge. This is good for now, but would make me think twice about long-term investment in a line.

Nikon had me dissapointed for the longest time. There was nothing that was really worth switching to digital for; the pixel count was way down, slow performance, etc. However, they did a very smart thing: unshackled themselves from the 35mm "sacred" format. The DX size was chosen for engineering reasons, and since then, it's been standardized. The line has filled out nicely in both bodies and lenses, and suddenly it's not "Nikon who?" anymore. Plus, my investments in equipment now are looking to have a long lifespan.

Take the plunge to DSLR, you will never look back. Hopefully this has been a different point of view that's helped you a bit!

All the best, James

fdog:

Nikon had me dissapointed for the longest time. There was nothing that was really worth switching to digital for; the pixel count was way down, slow performance, etc. However, they did a very smart thing: unshackled themselves from the 35mm "sacred" format. The DX size was chosen for engineering reasons, and since then, it's been standardized. The line has filled out nicely in both bodies and lenses, and suddenly it's not "Nikon who?" anymore. Plus, my investments in equipment now are looking to have a long lifespan.

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James:

As you know I still shoot film with ancient Nikonos equipment but one of these days I may house my 300D when I eventually move up to a better body. I have a big investment in EF lenses. I am curious about the Nikon DX format. I know the 300D uses the 35mm 2:3 aspect ratio with 1.6x "digital magnification" because of the smaller sensor. Upper end Canons are true 35 @ 1:1. Standard 35 mm is 24x36mm if I remember correctly. What is the DX? I am also wondering if there is any way to adapt 35mm glass to a larger format. Nikon has a pretty heavy investment in their 35mm lense system.

I don't want to distract too much from the original post. Considering the expense of a housed DSLR rig should anyone buy 35mm now, or see how DX takes hold and wait for the next technological developments?

Thanks as always,

---Bob

lindner514:

My budget is around 5K...how much of a zoom lens can I get for a D70 and still be able to fit into, say, a nexus housing...what kind of port do I need... and can I get a TTL cable for my DS-125 that connects...also is the shutter lag negligible.

Were you satisfied or dissappointed with your upgrade. Was it worth it.

Click to expand...

Well, I went the D70 route from Oly C5050 and I am very happy with my choice even though I way underestimate my initial budget. A few things that you will have to get used to is the housing is quite a bit bigger (actually not too bad, I went from Ikelite housing for C5050 to Sea and Sea housing for D70) especially if you are used to Oly housing. Using view finder instead of LCD monitoring for composing is not as big change as I thought it might. In fact, I would prefer to use the viewfinder over LCD monitor now under most circumstances.

The only way to get TTL with D70 right now is to house Nikon SB800 with either Subal or Sealux. Subal housing for the SB800 is about $500. A friend of mine is using that with a lot of success.

As far as budget goes, I paid for everything here in Thailand so the price may be a bit different than in the US but probably would give you a rough idea:
Camera $1000, Sea and Sea housing $1800, Lens: 12-24mm, 60mm macro and 70-180mm macro - about $2400, ports for the 3 lenses are about $1500. So not including strobe, it is already quite a bit more than your 5K budget.
However this will give significantly better range of what the D70 can do in comparison to C5050. However, you can also start with the kit lens, the 18-70mm which will have the same zoom range as the C5050. However it does not focus very close so it is not very good for macro. Then you can slowly add more lenses and ports later.
Ikelite housing is a bit cheaper and its port system is significantly cheaper than Sea and Sea but it does not support the 70-180mm macro lens so I did not go for it.
Nexus housing is about the same price as the Sea and Sea over here but I am not sure about the cost of the ports but probably would be similar to Sea and Sea.
On land, the D70/Sea and Sea with the 70-180mm lens/ports and dual Ikelite DS125 weigh a ton but not a problem underwater so get your biceps well exercise before any long dive trip

Hey Bob!

The Nikon DX sensor is 16 x 24mm I believe. The image crop is 1.5x.

I think you're asking about uses for "old" 35mm SLR lenses.

As far as large format goes, my very limited experience is from watching a colleague, who schlepped tons of gear for only a couple shots. The lenses had shutters and aperture built in. I've never heard of mainstream large format using 35mm lenses, FWIW.

Right now all my old AI-S lenses snap right onto the D100. They don't meter, but work fine in manual, and the glass is still as good as ever. The D1's and D2's have retained the aperture ring on the body, and will meter easily with these lenses. So for now, there's pretty good backwards-compatability.

Nikon has a history of keeping new lenses or bodies backwards-compatabile one generation, so the next big change past AF-D will probabally lose the use of the old manual focus AI-S lenses.

As far as jumping into a housed film camera, of course the cost will be way less, because most of the equipment will be used! Even new, prices are depressed because of low demand. However, one must balance price against the swing of the industry. If $ are the sole arbiter, yes; if you still love film, yes! Digital is more open ended, though, and that is the direction I would steer you with your 300D. Or, someone with film Nikon lenses and equipment.

All the best, James

Thanks for all the help everyone.

Do you like your 70-180 zoom. Would you get it again if you had it all to do over again. Are you happy with the focus and detail. Is it easy to zoom and fast to focus.
What gotchas come along with this lens. Given the 70-180 Zoom why did you get the 60mm lens.