2nd Deco Bottle

[WreckWriter]

Hi all,

Tomorrow I'm getting a second deco bottle, an aluminum 40 cf like my current one. I have 2 questions regarding this as I have never carried 2 before.

First, when carrying two 40s on the left side (Halcyon BP/wings setup) do most folks simply hook the individual clips to your D-rings or do you hook the individual clips to a larger clip which then hooks to the D-ring? This method is shown at http://www.dive-rite.com/resource/stage/10.htm about the middle of the page. The site is basically a Dive-Rite ad but that particular idea looks pretty good to me. Anyone using it?

Secondly, my current deco bottle is dedicated to 100%. Conventional wisdom would say I should dedicate my second one to 50%. EANx 50 can be a little tough to get sometimes. I was thinking of dedicating it to standard NN-II 36% which can always be had.

I ran tables on various dives in my usual range and this gets me out of the water approx 2 minutes after 50% would and still gives me plenty gas to do all my bad time on my stages. Anyone see any reasons this is not a good idea?

Thanks much,

Tom

[Friggincold]

Most of your deco stops for a 150 -230 ft dive will start in the 70-100ft range so in order to make better use of the high PO2 at 70' I would use the 50 vs the 36 even though you could get on the 36 @ 100'. The 50 will increase the gradient, allowing better inert gas offgassing. It only takes 1100 psi of O2 and an air top to 3000 for 50% seems if you can get 100% to 3000 psi 50% should be as easy.
I carry both bottles on the left and clip each one separately to my Dring more than 2 bottles will require a set up similiar to which you are referring.
Just my $.02....Friggincold

[WreckWriter]

Originally posted by Friggincold
if you can get 100% to 3000 psi 50% should be as easy.

Normally true obviously. My thinking was that there may be times when I can't get anything beyond 36 at any pressure.

Tom

[Friggincold]

I'm still in favor of the 50% over 36%.Give me an example where you couldn't get anything but 36% .You may wish to check the NAUI RGBM tables as I believe they use 36 eanx...but they usually require an 80 Cuft tank to carry enough gas to do the deco.
Friggincold

[maddiver]

I second the use of 50% and for some dives the use of two 40s as you have set up ~32-36 ish and 100% will give you a very slim deco advantage in the 20-25 min dive range at ~200+ (about 2 mins...really nothing over using 1 bottle of 50%). An example for S FL would be the Lowerance. Run some tables and see. You might have to 'get creative' with your local fill station. So if you are married to the idea of a two deco gas dive for this stuff then run 50 in the place of 36 and gain a slight advantage plus be in a better position to go to contingency tables if you lose either bottle (ie you don't have to hang forever...even if the gas would last and your buddy didn't help you out).

Clip direct to Dring do this for both 40s and/or 80s. No extentions.




Originally posted by Friggincold
I'm still in favor of the 50% over 36%.Give me an example where you couldn't get anything but 36% .You may wish to check the NAUI RGBM tables as I believe they use 36 eanx...but they usually require an 80 Cuft tank to carry enough gas to do the deco.
Friggincold

[WreckWriter]

Originally posted by maddiver
So if you are married to the idea of a two deco gas dive for this stuff then run 50 in the place of 36 and gain a slight advantage

You guys are convincing me. It seemed like a good idea when I had it :upset:

As for using 2 bottles, no, not married to that but definately engaged to the idea of not slinging an 80. 2 40s will be much easier for me to deal with and just trying to get the most benefit out of what I have (and can get cheaply).

Your advice is greatly appreciated.

Tom

[Divesherpa]

I concur with 50 instead of 36 for dives in the specified depths. I was a big fan of 36 and 80, but through the assistance of LY and others, I have changed my ways.
We clip our bottles differently, though.
I use suicide clips on both ends of my 100%, a suicide clip on the neck of the 50%, and regular clips everywhere else, including bottom and travel. This won't work if you are carrying the 100% and 50% with you the whole time, but is great if you can drop them.
Reasoning being that if you can't see, you can feel by clips which is which, for what it's worth.

[dlarbale]

Ok I don't do the type of diving that you guys are talking about but I've read alot about it and almost always suicide clips are referenced as a definate no no!

Just wondering if what I'm reading is out of date or not in touch with the real world?

Regards - Dave.

[maddiver]

Suicide clips are still out.

They still remain a good line snagger on anything you would use them for on your rig (stage bottle rigging, pressure gauge clip, backup light attachment, etc.) Also these are the single cheapest item in many respects to replace. If cost is an object (albeit it isn't that much, you could go with brass snaps....although eventually you will end up buying the good quality SS ones). This goes for cave, wreck, and ow environments



Originally posted by dlarbale
Ok I don't do the type of diving that you guys are talking about but I've read alot about it and almost always suicide clips are referenced as a definate no no!

Just wondering if what I'm reading is out of date or not in touch with the real world?

Regards - Dave.

[padiscubapro]

I wouldn't carry 36% as a deco mix its a waste of time(but is a choice for a travel bottle albeit usually using an 80cf).. If carrying 2 bottles I sling 1 on each side.. If I don't need a travel mix(and decide to carry 2 bottles) I'll carry 50% on left, 100% on right or just 50% for many profiles the advange of 02 is that much over 50% and I can go on 50% at 70fsw and keep my o2 clock much lower. If I'm not using trimix I rarely use 100% if I'm on mix I'll switch to 100% unless something prevents me from doing so.

If I need a travel gas, I'll use either 32% or 36% slung on the left, 50% on the right and I'll leave o2 hanging on the line.. I'll build my tables to deco on 50% and a second set switching to o2 at 20 ft.


When I'm using my CCR I always carry 2 bottles(for planned deco dives), 1 with bottom gas Air or a trimix acceptable for the planned depth, and 50% for deco and as a source for an enriched gas mixture for the loop(in event of 02 failure)... 50% is not optimal for maintaing the loop, but it works adequately. If I have another CCR diver with me we both carry bottom gas, 1 carries o2 the other caries 50%.

[maddiver]

I realize that we have a 'stylistic variance' in tank placement. That being said, I do not understand why any wreck or ow deco diver would clip off any 'planned' breathing gas to the anchor line. If the boat breaks loose so does your gas. I also am aware that you carry 'contingency' tables, however, two problems are now created by your placement of the bottle where there would be only one (boat braking loose) had the gas not been clipped to the anchor line.


Originally posted by padiscubapro

If I need a travel gas, I'll use either 32% or 36% slung on the left, 50% on the right and I'll leave o2 hanging on the line..

[WreckWriter]

I went with the 50% based on recommendations received here and elsewhere.

As to suicide clips, I would not dive with one anywhere on my body or my gear. They are called that for a reason....

Tom

[maddiver]

I do nothing by feel, color, taste or postion (I can just see the posts about colored regs and cherry flavored mouthpieces). All equipment including the clips are similiar to facilitate muscle memory and reaction time..etc. Each time you switch gas you verify the MOD on the tank and follow the reg on the tank you just verified up to your mouth. With hand on the tank crack the valve and then turn off quickly. Place reg in mouth suck down a small breath and watch the gauge drop and then crank the knob open wide...you are on the right bottle....no colors, no different snaps...no wondering..am I on the right bottle...period, end of story. ALWAYS verify mod and the reg in your mouth and park unused regs on the stage or deco bottle where they belong....this time 'house keeping' will save your life.



Originally posted by Divesherpa

We clip our bottles differently, though.
I use suicide clips on both ends of my 100%, a suicide clip on the neck of the 50%, and regular clips everywhere else, including bottom and travel. This won't work if you are carrying the 100% and 50% with you the whole time, but is great if you can drop them.
Reasoning being that if you can't see, you can feel by clips which is which, for what it's worth.

[aue-mike]

As Tom mentioned, suicide clips earned their moniker for a reason. They easily clip onto other things, in many cases unintentionally and at very unexpected times. This includes mandatory gear as well as extraneous gear such as cameras, etc.

We had a guy with a video camera with one suicide clip on it, along with a regular bolt snap on the other side. We told him that should be replaced. He said he wanted the ability to clip the camera off fast if needed. On one dive we had to drift into our shotline due to the current. When he hit the line it slipped into his clip and ended up flipping him up over the line and the current pinned him in position almost upside down. Not good. He was unable to free himself due to the strength of the current and the position of the camera/clip close to his body, and had to wait for one of his buddies to work him loose. Hopefully, use of a suicide clip will simply lead to an annoying situation that can be resolved and not a potentially life-threatening situation, which can very easily happen in short order. Don't try to fix a most-likely very unrealistic situation (unable to identify bottles by sight?) by creating another potential problem.

I have never really understood the need for a designated "travel gas." That is just another layer of complexity that is totally unecessary.

If you need to avoid breathing backgas directly from the surface (if you are diving much past 300fsw and you need to work to get to the anchor line), simply use your decompression gas -- you should have plenty to go around. Other than that, it really is not a realistic problem. Technical diving is not about taking as much gear with you as possible, it is about using technology to your benefit to reduce risks, etc. That said, take as little gear as you need and use it to its maximum benefit. Why take an extra bottle for only a minute or two of use, when you can use your decompression gas to get to a "safe" depth if need be? All this being said, it is my humble, but personal opinion that too many people are too paranoid about hypoxic mixes. How long does it take you to get to 10-20fsw?? Many times this is accomplished just by falling off the boat. Just don't sit on the boat huffing on your regulator.

Never, ever leave your deco gas on the surface or the boat. That can lead to many more problems than solutions. Don't make this harder than it needs to be.

Regards,
Mike

[WreckWriter]

Originally posted by aue-mike
As Tom mentioned, suicide clips earned their moniker for a reason. They easily clip onto other things, in many cases unintentionally and at very unexpected times.

As I recall the death of John Ormsby in Gimbel's Hole on the Doria is generally attributed to a suicide clip catching a cable. That alone is reason enough for me to stay away from them!

As for travel mix, I've always heard that 16% O2 is the lowest that will sustain you at the surface. Is this accurate?

Tom

ps- Thanks for the recommendation the other day. I heard back from Mike R. today.

[padiscubapro]

Originally posted by maddiver
I realize that we have a 'stylistic variance' in tank placement. That being said, I do not understand why any wreck or ow deco diver would clip off any 'planned' breathing gas to the anchor line. If the boat breaks loose so does your gas. I also am aware that you carry 'contingency' tables, however, two problems are now created by your placement of the bottle where there would be only one (boat braking loose) had the gas not been clipped to the anchor line.


I dont usually carry the o2 with me because its useless at depth.. at least in an emergency I can hit the 50% at 100fsw assuming I am ascending.. SInce my tables are built PRIMARILY for 50% the o2 is not a needed gas, My second tables are there if everything goes fine andI'll switch to o2 at 20fsw. I have been diving wrecks about 14 years now and only once was I unable to go up the anchor line(when planned)... The method primarily used in the NE its unlikely the boat will break free since the mate generally CHAINS into the wreck but I'll admit it can happen. If I'm diving in a location where it is likely (or planned) that no anchorline or moring will be available then I'll carry all my gasses. I believe in evaluating my rigging based on the circumstances. SInce I don't rig my light DIR style I like having a cylinder on each side when diving with 2 sling bottles or more.. Mike your point about deco gas on decent is well taken and I cant disagree with it..
My main reason for a travel gas (on dives where it is reasonable)is that I don't use tanks larger than steel 95s (so I rather preserve my bottom gas- its available if a problems occurs on ascent, but I don't want to have it limit me for normal dive planning or if I have difficulties equalizing, I occasionally have problems with 1 ear that I injured several years ago due to stupdity..)mainly because of my back,plus I dislike the longer tanks. Carrying stages makes life easier I can remove or attach them while I'm in the water instead of dealing with the greater weight all the time.

My back is the main reason I switched to a RB for most dives, its only 65 lbs and I'll usually carry 1 or 2 40s as bailout..
Much lighter than twin 95s plus sling bottles..

[Scubaroo]

WreckWriter,

Here's a table (http://www.dep.state.pa.us/dep/deputate/minres/dms/website/training/inventory/minegases.htm) showing different oxygen percentages and the corresponding physiological responses.

21 %
Breathing easiest

19.5 %
Minimum required by law

17 %
Breathing faster and deeper, possible impaired judgement

16 %
First signs of anoxia or hypoxia occur

15 %
Dizziness, buzzing in ears, headache, blurred vision, rapid breathing

12 % to 16 %
Rapid breathing and pulse, impaired muscular coordination

10 % to 12 %
Emotional upset and abnormal fatigue on exertion

6 % to 10 %
Nausea and vomiting, inability to move, unconsciousness

< 6 %
Convulsive movements, gasping respiration, breathing ceases, cardiac arrest occurs

Not sure where the "Minimum required by law" comes from - probably refers to minimum oxygen content for a mine, as I think this is what the context of the table is in.

[Divesherpa]

As Uncle Pug would say, I let the bait dangle and the crowd took the hook.

The best way to drive a point home is to take the opposite view and watch from a distance.
Who would dive with a clip known as "suicide"?

[Divesherpa]

Who would dive with a "suicide" clip on a wreck? That was supposed to be the question. I use them in caves often, but not in OW.

[maddiver]

Man this is starting to look bipolar to me:

DS:
Who would dive with a clip known as "suicide"?
Then
DS:
Who would dive with a "suicide" clip on a wreck? That was supposed to be the question. I use them in caves often, but not in OW.

DS: As Uncle Pug would say, I let the bait dangle and the crowd took the hook.

So what's the point? Are we stupid for trying to help you out? Slightly annoyed with the assertion that you were 'baiting' us but then mention that you use and that it is ok to have those clips in a cave. What kind of logic is that...not good enough for wreck so I'll use em in the cave? Do you have two separate o2 bottles rigged differently? Does the inconsistency in gear ever make you wonder why the performance curve is so steep as you transition environments? BTW the bipolar thing was a joke.

More to the point you either have a logical and defensible system or you don't. By no means am I a believer that you will surely 'die' if you do things such as use suicide clips but mike already outlined one instance for you that a different approach would have fended off.

[aue-mike]

Hi Tom-
As far as O2 content, yes, hypoxia begins to develop at .16 after *sustained* breathing. Around .13 and lower is when it gets a bit more interesting. It should also be remembered, that for this PO2 ballpark, one breath doesn't mean instant blackout/death as everyone might think. However, tempting fate by breathing a hypoxic mix for any duration is not really a prudent exercise. Also, as with O2 toxicity, this varies from person to person and some individuals may be more sensitive than others.

The point I was trying to make is, you are not (or should not) breathing your backgas at the surface, especially not for extended periods of time. If, as is typical in the NE, you must jump in off the stern and work your way to the bow to descend down the anchor line, you can use your deco gas if choppy and/or a current; if not, take your time and fin/pull along the suface on your back, etc. However, many boats use a hang bar under the midships/stern, so you can jump off expecting to hit 10fsw and then pull up on the granny line leading from the hang bar to the anchor line submerged (i.e., at a great ambient pressure than the surface).

If doing a freedrop or using a shotline (as in Florida), a travel gas is entirely pointless. Put it this way, we have done several +/- 300fsw dives and our O2 may be 13% or less, and we do not worry about "travel gas" or other silliness. You have your reg half in your mouth (and breathing regular air or diesel fumes out the side of your mouth) and when it is time to dive, you insert (wait to breath) and drop. In a couple nanoseconds, you are 10-20fsw below the surface (where the PO2 is not a concern anymore) and *rapidly* descending so the gas is plenty safe to breath.

The only time we have *ever* had a premeditated gas switch was for a dive to 420fsw, where we had a third deco gas anyway and the PO2 was pretty darn low.

For the majority of tech/trimix diving, we are probably talking about depths less than 300fsw, with +/- 250fsw perhaps a good median depth. In these depths, any travel gas is really unecessary and adds to task loading, extraneous gear and potential failure points, etc. It is basically pointless and should be dropped from agency teaching, in lieu of efficiency, common sense, and logic.

Just my thoughts,
Mike

[roakey]

Originally posted by aue-mike
Hi Tom-
As far as O2 content, yes, hypoxia begins to develop at .16 after *sustained* breathing
Mike, I don't disagree with your statement, but I always find it amusing to point out that at the altitude I live at (about 8k feet) I'm breathing about .16 ATA O2 :)

I'm sure a number of people in here might take this as an explanation for my behavior sometimes.

Roak

[padiscubapro]

Originally posted by aue-mike
Hi Tom-
As far as O2 content, yes, hypoxia begins to develop at .16 after *sustained* breathing. Around .13 and lower is when it gets a bit more interesting. It should also be remembered, that for this PO2 ballpark, one breath doesn't mean instant blackout/death as everyone might think. However, tempting fate by breathing a hypoxic mix for any duration is not really a prudent exercise. Also, as with O2 toxicity, this varies from person to person and some individuals may be more sensitive than others.

The point I was trying to make is, you are not (or should not) breathing your backgas at the surface, especially not for extended periods of time. If, as is typical in the NE, you must jump in off the stern and work your way to the bow to descend down the anchor line, you can use your deco gas if choppy and/or a current; if not, take your time and fin/pull along the suface on your back, etc. However, many boats use a hang bar under the midships/stern, so you can jump off expecting to hit 10fsw and then pull up on the granny line leading from the hang bar to the anchor line submerged (i.e., at a great ambient pressure than the surface).

If doing a freedrop or using a shotline (as in Florida), a travel gas is entirely pointless. Put it this way, we have done several +/- 300fsw dives and our O2 may be 13% or less, and we do not worry about "travel gas" or other silliness. You have your reg half in your mouth (and breathing regular air or diesel fumes out the side of your mouth) and when it is time to dive, you insert (wait to breath) and drop. In a couple nanoseconds, you are 10-20fsw below the surface (where the PO2 is not a concern anymore) and *rapidly* descending so the gas is plenty safe to breath.

The only time we have *ever* had a premeditated gas switch was for a dive to 420fsw, where we had a third deco gas anyway and the PO2 was pretty darn low.

For the majority of tech/trimix diving, we are probably talking about depths less than 300fsw, with +/- 250fsw perhaps a good median depth. In these depths, any travel gas is really unecessary and adds to task loading, extraneous gear and potential failure points, etc. It is basically pointless and should be dropped from agency teaching, in lieu of efficiency, common sense, and logic.

Just my thoughts,
Mike

I tend to error on the side of caution and don't deny your assessment its quite valid.. You seem to be one of the few people someone can debate with without having a hissy fit...
Have you ever tried a hypoxic excercise(just curious)?? its pretty interesting.. During my CCR class breathing a 14% o2/ helium mix was/is used, You may get some warning signs (I didn't see any).. all I remember was that everything was fine (I was sitting on the floor) then looking up at everyone with a 100% o2 mask on my face.. The excercise is done with a reg(holding ones nose), so if a person passes out a higher % of o2 will be inhaled followed by having the person put on 100% for safety.. its a real eye opener... I definately would not wan't it to happen to me underwater..
I guess Roakey being at a higher altitude would probably cope with a lower o2 level longer than us sea level folk...

[Divesherpa]

Mad Diver,
In a cave I do thing slightly different. I started wreck diving in Alaska (where most of my dives are) in 5 mill gauntlets. In caves (warm water) you don't always have the luxury of being able to see, especially if noone has ever been where you are. If you can't do things by feel, they don't get done. Dropping bottles at the proper depth is the only way to fly. This is an option in a lot of caves.
Bipolar?
Yes, in the modern world we believe that there is a north pole and a south pole. We also believe that the world is more or less round.

My apologies to anyone that I offend by leading in one way. Lighten up, stop being mad, and go blow bubbles (unless you are a CCR guy)!

[maddiver]

Warm water caves not being able to see the mod on your tank must be pretty silty stuff....clay base? Where (don't have to give exact location, maybe geographical reference FL, Mexico, Mo, Brasil, Bahamas, etc where there is warm water and the virgin cave passage that has really bad vis). My (limited) experience in both Mexico (where the ceiling rains like hell on you) and Florida where it a) clears through flow or b) even in clay based areas with no detectable flow you can see 'enough to make out mod's'.

I have never experienced a 'total sustained blackout' that I could not either move forward or back to remedy the situation or just wait a little bit. Not saying it isn't there but I just don't understand the operational parameters in a realistic cave setting where you would be forced to look for another method than visually verifying and remaining in touch contact with that verified mix before breathing it.

Would those same clips not also act as serious operational hazzards in the same no vis conditions (your line, buddy, other gear etc)?

I won't stay mad forever, just until my next fix...Friday morning



Originally posted by Divesherpa
Mad Diver,
In a cave I do thing slightly different. In caves (warm water) you don't always have the luxury of being able to see, especially if noone has ever been where you are. If you can't do things by feel, they don't get done. Dropping bottles at the proper depth is the only way to fly. This is an option in a lot of caves.

[WreckWriter]

I dived with the second bottle yesterday. I configured it as most of you suggested. I did notice a few things I hadn't anticipated.

First, adding a second stage bottle makes a lot more difference than I had expected. I expected a PITA (pain in the a$$) factor of 1, basically double the trouble, but found it was actually increased by much more.

First, it was very difficult to get the second bottle clipped on before the dive because the first bottle was in the way. I should have expected this but I didn't.

While doing the dive the second bottle wasn't very noticable but doing the deco it got to be a bit more trouble.

First gas change (to 50%) was easy enough. No trouble checking MOD, deploying reg or turning on gas.

At the second change (to 100%) I found that the two bottle configuration made it extremely difficult to re-stuff the reg on the 50% bottle. (The Halcyon hose retainer contributed to this and I will be replacing it with bungee so I can get ahold of it with gloves on). I ended up just leaving the 50% reg around my neck which wasn't a problem until time to get on the boat. My local GUE guy says "just don't wear gloves, but that's a poor option on wrecks to my mind.

On my next dive with both bottles I will do 2 things. First, replace the flat hose retainer with bungee (leaving a grab tail too). I also think I will try the thing with clipping the front clips to a third clip. A guy on the boat was diving his that way and he said it help a lot. If I don't like it it's simple to undo.

Tom

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by WreckWriter
At the second change (to 100%) I found that the two bottle configuration made it extremely difficult to re-stuff the reg on the 50% bottle. (The Halcyon hose retainer contributed to this and I will be replacing it with bungee so I can get ahold of it with gloves on). I ended up just leaving the 50% reg around my neck which wasn't a problem until time to get on the boat. My local GUE guy says "just don't wear gloves, but that's a poor option on wrecks to my mind.
Hi Tom,
Not wearing gloves doesn't work in the PNW either...
We use flat rubber bands (called crab trap bands in the fishing industry) to secure the deco reg hose. The bands when slipped over the top of the stage strap are actually very easy to get a hold of at the point where they cross over the strap tubing.

Are you putting your *Halcyon hose retainer* over the top of the stage strap???

[aue-mike]

Hi Tom-
Some things that may help:

Make sure you have a decent "tail" on the bottom of your bottles to make clipping off easier. Once you do it a couple of times, clipping off becomes easier. For practice, you could try moving your hip D-ring up forward a little more, until you get used to the motions and it becomes a snap (bad pun). Then move the d-ring back (progressively if necessary) until it is in the right position; then the bottles will "ride" correctly and be streamlined.

Get the longer stage hose for the regs. This will make sure your jaw, etc. does not get tired and hose routing is not a problem.

I use surgical tubing for a retainer for the reasons you mentioned. I try to configure my gear to make it useable in any condition. I don't get the smallest clips, nor do I get the largest. I don't use inner tube as if I am in cold water I don't have to fight it to stow a reg (I get frustrated easily). The drawback of flat inner tube is it is hard to grab and stow. The drawback of surgical tubing is that it may roll. If you have a good knot you can avoid some of the rolling. Just make sure the tubing is tight enough to secure the reg and it is not flopping in the breeze.

Cheers,
Mike

[WreckWriter]

Originally posted by Uncle Pug

Hi Tom,
Not wearing gloves doesn't work in the PNW either...
We use flat rubber bands (called crab trap bands in the fishing industry) to secure the deco reg hose. The bands when slipped over the top of the stage strap are actually very easy to get a hold of at the point where they cross over the strap tubing.

Are you putting your *Halcyon hose retainer* over the top of the stage strap???

Sounds like my retainer is same as yours. Yea, it's over the rigging strap. Maybe it will loosen a bit with use? Also I may need to move it forward a bit. It was difficult to even catch hold of it while wearing the 2 bottles. The back end of the bottles was on the D-ring of my ACB pocket which also pushed it further out, increasing the difficulty of getting a good hold of it.

Tom

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by WreckWriter
Sounds like my retainer is same as yours. Yea, it's over the rigging strap. Maybe it will loosen a bit with use?
I have some of the *inner tube* retainers that Halcyon supplies but we use the thick crab trap bands... they fit the tank a little looser but still hold the reg and hose in place... I don't think the Halcyon bands will loosen up but you can cut them a little narrower so they aren't as tight. Right where they hump up over the strap tubing is a great place to grab them and lift them up.

You are diving ACBs with doubles?????

[Divesherpa]

I'm almost out of the crab bands. We used them to keep raingear wrapped around our Xtra Tuffs to keep from getting wet. Can I order them online, or do I need to have a friend pick some up?
They work well except for the occasional frustration AUE mike mentioned.

[WreckWriter]

Originally posted by Uncle Pug
You are diving ACBs with doubles?????

Yep. 4 pounds per side with aluminum doubles. Why not?

Tom

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by Divesherpa
I'm almost out of the crab bands.

Can I order them online, or do I need to have a friend pick some up?

Sherp... we get them from a fisheries outlet in Seattle... but here is an online link provided by Ericfine...

Found them at www.go2marine.com - "Crab Bands". 7.78 for 50.

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by WreckWriter
Yep. 4 pounds per side with aluminum doubles. Why not?

Gotcha...

We don't need anything but a drysuit with the 104s. :D

[Divesherpa]

That sounds like the ones.
Thanks UNcle

[WreckWriter]

Originally posted by Uncle Pug

Gotcha...

We don't need anything but a drysuit with the 104s. :D

My 104s, as well as my new drysuit, are on order.

Tom

[Uncle Pug]

Originally posted by WreckWriter
My 104s, as well as my new drysuit, are on order.

?!?!!?

How do you keep from over-heating in the warm water wearing a drysuit?

[WreckWriter]

Originally posted by Uncle Pug

?!?!!?

How do you keep from over-heating in the warm water wearing a drysuit?

It's not so warm when you get some depth and it's certainly not so warm in the winter (to you it would be but not to me!) temp at 200' 2 days ago was reported as 68.

The only real problem is it's damn hot on the boat. Of course I won't wear polarfreeze underwear either!

Tom