DUI Rock boots and DIR

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vbcoachchris

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Scuba Instructor
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Location
Kenmore, WA
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I'm a Fish!
The inflator valve on my DUI TLS 350 is making a hissing noise; my wife's TLS 350 does this as well? Is it supposed to or is this a bad batch of valves? When I purchased this signature series a year ago, I received bad advice. I was told to get rock boots, zip seals, a neoprene knife pocket on the left leg and a large zipper pocket on the right leg. So I am going to send it back to DUI for repairs. I am going to have them make the suit DIR Compatible. Can some one please tell me the PROPER way to have the suit setep, so that I do not have to go through this again? Most of my diving is done in the Pacific Northwest.
 
vbcoachchris:
The inflator valve on my DUI TLS 350 is making a hissing noise; my wife's TLS 350 does this as well? Is it supposed to or is this a bad batch of valves? When I purchased this signature series a year ago, I received bad advice. I was told to get rock boots, zip seals, a neoprene knife pocket on the left leg and a large zipper pocket on the right leg. So I am going to send it back to DUI for repairs. I am going to have them make the suit DIR Compatible. Can some one please tell me the PROPER way to have the suit setep, so that I do not have to go through this again? Most of my diving is done in the Pacific Northwest.

Left leg, large bellows, right leg, large utility. Turbo soles, no rock boots. No, zip seals. Dump valve on right arm rather than left if you will ever scooter. Non-low profile apex (or some use si-tech). P-valve on inner right leg. For new builds, old style zipper and overlay.
 
That is exactly what I will do when I buy my next suit. Are there any changes I can make this suit DIR compatible? I know the zipper pocket must be replaced. Is a low profile Apex exhaust valve on the left bicep OK? Are rock boots OK or are the strictly a DIR "No No"? Are zip seals OK or are the strictly a DIR "No No"? Is a relief zipper OK? I now know these things are not ideal, but are they acceptable?
 
vbcoachchris:
That is exactly what I will do when I buy my next suit. Are there any changes I can make this suit DIR compatible? I know the zipper pocket must be replaced. Is a low profile Apex exhaust valve on the left bicep OK? Are rock boots OK or are the strictly a DIR "No No"? Are zip seals OK or are the strictly a DIR "No No"? Is a relief zipper OK? I now know these things are not ideal, but are they acceptable?


I personally chose an old style Apeks valve on my left arm. same as GI's style. see pic.
http://www.wkpp.org/images/wakulla042800/george2.jpg
http://www.wkpp.org/images/wakulla042800/george.jpg

P-Valve location doesn't matter which leg, left or right. personal preference, depending on which way you point your "member" :11:

The jury is still out on zip seals. some people swear by them, some go against it. You have to think for yourselves and assess your own risks. if the zip seals "go" and you flood your suit, can you survive your dive without getting bent? If you just dive open water with no deco obligations and can theoretically abort the dive at any time then it's an acceptable risk that you may be comfortable with so, there is no harsh answer. they are neither DIR nor really against it either, the way I understand it.

your definitely do not want a relieve zipper. just get a P-valve, you will be much happier!

Right pocket, by the way, is recommended to have a small profile. but I chose a regular one on both legs. it's a minor point and comes critical when you scooter, which I don't.

Turbo soles is what I have and I like them. seems to be a general consensus that this is the way to go.
 
this is good info from Dave Sweetin on ordering your TLS 350 suit.

> >
> >The basic specifications are as follows, with some minor additional
> >improvements;
> >
> >DUI Signature Series TLS-350 " WKPP" styled CAVECUT
> >
> >VALVES
> >Apeks LP swiveling inlet valve sitting @4.00.The Apeks fixed inlet
> valve
> >is no longer available.
> >Apeks Old style "High profile" auto exhaust dump valve (left shoulder)
> >
> >SEALS
> >WRIST- Heavy duty Latex wrist seals.
> >.Specify if you want the latex seals to be undercut by the arm length
> of
> >the suit, like GI recommends.
> >
> >NECK-Standard Latex seal.
> >
> >BODY
> >Warm neck collar for abrasion resistance from the harness wear.
> >CF200 material - for a crotch reinforcement panel, to stop harness
> >crotch strap wear.
> >
> >*Request the old style design pattern, where the accent colour on the
> >torso extends right down to the wrists.
> >This gives a double layer TLS material coverage over the high wear
> >areas, right through the shoulders/elbows down to the forearms/wrists.
> >
> >This negates the need of elbow pads needed for the new design pattern
> >which offers no durability in the high wear areas as the accent colour
> >is restricted to the chest area only..
> >
> >I also chose a simple double layer TLS trilaminate on the Knees in suit
> >body colour for extra durability.
> >Alternatively you could also order the smallest Kevlar knee pads
> >(29.7cm x 12.1cm)
> >
> >It is absolutely imperative to order the old style self donning
> diagonal
> >front zip .NO quick zip!!!
> >Standard Telescoping torso.
> >
> >WKPP - DUI Standard Bellows pocket/Velcro flap on side of left thigh.
> >The bellows pocket needs modifying with the stainless d-ring removed
> and
> >two small holes burnt with new recommended longer length bungee loops
> >added.
> >
> >WKPP - DUI Standard Flat neoprene pocket/Velcro flap on side of right
> >thigh.
> >One bungee loop needs adding
> >
> >BOOTS
> >Standard CF200 Turbo soles with Velcro ankle ties.
> >Supply an accurate bare foot tracing is the best idea. .
> >Imagine placing your foot on an ink pad and measuring the length
> >actually in contact with the ground is the best way then allow for 400G
> >booties.
> >It is extremely important to have an exact fitting sole for the turbo
> >boot.
> >Request DUI supply the two closest sole sizes available to the
> >measurements of your foot outline so you can decide on which size fits
> >best.
> >
> >If you have the luxury of being able to try different sized soles with
> >the correct booties take the opportunity.
> >
> >The Turbo sole needs to seriously undercut your actual foot, as this
> >ensures a super tight fitting bootie which is firm to walk in, as
> >opposed to the standard fare from DUI, which requires all sorts of
> >silliness such as gators and fin keepers to manage.
> >
> >UNDERGARMENTS
> >DUI 400G Type B Thinsulate undergarment (Cave cut is best, same as
> suit,
> >although DUI refused to taper the legs which necessitated a trip to the
> >local tailor.)
> >DUI 400G Type B Thinsulate booties, go for medium unless your feet are
> >huge so as to keep it tight and slick.
> >
> >HOOD
> >Rubatex-Wetwear Nitrogen blown neoprene custom hood. (Get the plush
> >lining if it is available)
> >http://www.wetwear.com/index.htm
> >G231SN Short neck hood 7mm (NO ZIP!)
> >
> >Their customer service is horrendous, as was the fit, I had to take it
> >in to a local manufacturer and have 15mm cut out of all main seams and
> >shorten the neck length by 50mm to get the correct fit.
> >However the suit is now perfect and well worth the hassle of ordering
> >blind from 10,000 miles away ;-)
> >
> >DRYGLOVES
> >Nordic Blue Delrin Ro-Lock dry-gloves with Quallofill lining for
> extreme
> >cold, or normal lining for moderate temperatures. (If required) .or
> >simply neoprene seals like Peter Steinhoff favors (both are excellent)
> >I have found the Nordic Blue superior to other brands but this is only
> >from my personal experience.
> >
> >OVERBOARD DISCHARGE
> >Halcyon Balanced pee valve
> >
> >Measurement tips
> >
> >With regard to measurement I was extremely cautious and was very
> >conscious of correctly sizing the suit, I went over every measurement
> >several times and guided my girlfriend in the process as I am fairly
> >experienced in drysuit measuring as all the suits I provide are MTM..
> >After having focused on bodyfat loss for the last year I am now well
> >into an intense muscle gain phase with my trainer at the gym.
> >With this in mind I fudged some measurements such as biceps, chest etc
> >while flexed to allow for additional muscle growth, whilst ever so
> >slightly fudging the shoulders and back/lats to allow for growth while
> >shaving the waist/hips.
> >
> >The resulting suit is truly a work of art.
> >
> >
> >Copied below is some additional information Dave Sweetin kindly
> supplied
> >me with;
> >
> >"The biggest issue is that the dealers just don't comprehend the
> >instructions, or measure enough to be competent. I'm sure that
> >experience with this sort of thing plays some role in the proper
> >fitting, but alas, experience doesn't translate well to e mail.
> >
> >I recommend using a dealer that measures a great deal. Personally, read
> >the measuring instructions. I read them aloud to ensure my accuracy,
> and
> >to ensure the customer understands fully what I'm doing, as I measure
> >every suit.
> >
> >Stand at all times with your feet at a comfortable shoulder width, and
> >look straight ahead...do not look at the measurer.
> >
> >Wear no shoes.
> >Have the dealer trace and measure your foot tracing. Measure and write
> >that measurement on the tracing. Send it with your measurements. Note
> >your shoe size on this tracing.
> >
> >Wear form fitting clothes, perhaps something you normally wear at the
> >gym, or to run.
> >DUI will require a signed non-standard suit waiver.
> >
> >Try on a stock suit and undergarments. Make notes as to how it fits (or
> >does not fit) and pass those along to DUI.
> >If a facility does not have stock rental suits on hand, I would not
> >consider them as "experienced" DUI dealers. The measurements you get
> >from such a dealer (of limited experience) will be highly suspect.
> >
> >Always tell them that 400G Thinsulate is the thickest undergarment you
> >will use, unless you plan to use something thicker.
> >
> >DUI handles the rest, and relies 100% on the accuracy of the
> >measurements. I make no modifications to the measurements, they do it
> >all. Again, the problem with fit usually stems from the measurer and
> >their abilities.
> >
> >Dave"
 
vbcoachchris:
Is a low profile Apex exhaust valve on the left bicep OK? Are rock boots OK or are the strictly a DIR "No No"? Are zip seals OK or are the strictly a DIR "No No"? Is a relief zipper OK? I now know these things are not ideal, but are they acceptable?

AFAIK, left bicep would be fine as long as you aren't scootering.

As far as Rock Boots and Zip Seals-

We as DIR divers ask ourselves two questions:
1. How does this piece of equipment enhance the dive?
2. How does it impact the rest of the system?

1 - Rock Boots and Zip Seals do nothing to enhance the dive themselves. They are more of the "on land" logic that the scuba industry dreams up to sell more equipment. Would a diver need to have boots during a dive? We fin, not walk. I also have yet to hear of a diver replacing a seal in the middle of a dive as well. :wink:

2 - Rock Boots have laces, which can become an entanglement issue. The Zip Seals are reported to be less durable than regular seals, so why have the added failure point?

I'm not sure about the relief zipper. A P-valve is obviously much more desireable, but I'm unsure if a relief zipper is or is not DIR.
 
Derek S:
I'm not sure about the relief zipper. A P-valve is obviously much more desireable, but I'm unsure if a relief zipper is or is not DIR.

I don't understand why would anybody want relief zipper. It's useles if your're under water. If you're out of water than you can open your suit and do whatever you want. IMHO it's useles and it's one point of failure more, so you don't need it. Haveing this in mind I would conclude that it's not DIR.
 
Kinda curious on the scootering idea...
I have just begun getting into scootering a bit. Usually, we hold it only with the right hand, when the scooter cord is properly anchored to the crotch ring. In this case, the vent on the right arm would not be useful. What is the reasoning on the right arm for scootering?

JAG
 
MonkSeal:
I don't understand why would anybody want relief zipper. It's useles if your're under water. If you're out of water than you can open your suit and do whatever you want. IMHO it's useles and it's one point of failure more, so you don't need it. Haveing this in mind I would conclude that it's not DIR.

That's what I was figuring.
 
It's not that I want a relief zipper, but when I bought the suit; I had it installed because I was told by a DM in my class that it was great to have. DUI will remove it and patch the hole for $33. My question is simply can I leave it there and still be DIR compatible or must I pay to have it removed? I am also still a little confused about the rock boots. I replaced the long laces with bungee so I don't think they are an entanglement hazard anymore and some of the shore dives I do have a long walk to the entry point, so the boot is great for the walk down. I have turtle fins now, if I had the turbo soles installed; the turtle would not fit anymore and I would need to by jets. I know DIR divers prefer turbo soles, but my question is; are rock boots acceptable?
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/
http://cavediveflorida.com/Rum_House.htm

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