I screw up in the water, I know, and I appreciate all the help

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DandyDon

Colonoscopy Advocate
ScubaBoard Supporter
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Location
One kilometer high on the Texas Central Plains
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I do not expect anyone to endanger themselves, tho, in trying to save my butt!!

I've also helped others with problems in the water, as we are supposed to do. I carry a pony bottle, and the few times I have had to use it, it was usually assisting another diver who mismanaged his, ran low, then started drawing mine down quickly when I handed him my Octo. All this is fine. I look forward to helping others when I can, and I hope I can get the help I need the next time I need it.

I DO NOT EXPECT ANYONE TO ENDANGER THEMSELVES, THO, trying to help me with my mistake or accident. I believe this is a common standard among professionals, but then I am sure it would be difficult to just let me go if I did a panicked ascent for example, or something else that would require the other to endanger him/herself in coming to my aid.
 
I seem to be missing your point here?????
 
Wildcard:
I seem to be missing your point here?????
Ok, maybe it was a good point. Only...

I DO NOT EXPECT ANYONE TO ENDANGER THEMSELVES, trying to help me with my mistake or accident.
 
DandyDon:
Ok, maybe it was a good point. Only...

I DO NOT EXPECT ANYONE TO ENDANGER THEMSELVES, trying to help me with my mistake or accident.
OK, Don, but in your first post it was BOLD AND CAPS. Obviously more than just a casual observation. What brought this on?

--Marek
 
Yeah...I agree...
What brought this on? What made you confess to this?
Did something happen...
Fill us in or is this just a rumination on thoughts.
K
 
Sorry - I guess I was overtaken by the threads on the DM that died the other day, but trying to avoid mentioning that here. I'm not going to speculate on that tragedy, but it got me to thinking: I try to be as safe as I can for a fumbling diver, yet if I screw up - I appreciate the help.

But if my screw up is going to endanger anyone in trying to save me from my mistake, DON'T!! I know it would be hard, but just don't do it.

I hope I've made more sense with my thoughts on this here - whether it's worthy of discussion or not. Thank you...
 
I belive that's one of the first things they teach you in stress and rescue. Do not put yourself in jeopardy to save someone else. One life lost is better that two.

jafo
 
Though you may not EXPECT someone to try to save your butt if you screw up, if you are diving with others, it's unlikely they will just "let you go." If you have a decent buddy (or the DM "leading" your dive), most likely they will feel an obligation to come to your aid, no matter what you say pre-dive.

In fact, if a buddy told me something like this, it would put me on alert that I have an insta-buddy who knows he's likely to do something to get himself in trouble and I would spend the dive watching for trouble....
 
Jafo123:
I belive that's one of the first things they teach you in stress and rescue. Do not put yourself in jeopardy to save someone else. One life lost is better that two.

jafo

We do teach it ... in fact, it's worth repeating over and over at various points during the class.

But we're all human, and humans have a conscience. The decision to assist or not is usually made with about a split-second to think about it, and for most folks the gut response is to try to help someone in trouble ... only afterward to we typically stop to think about how we might have endangered ourselves doing so.

Here's a scenario for ya ... you're diving a deep wall, let's say at about 100 fsw or so, and a diver who's not even your buddy swims up to you giving the out of air signal. You hand off your safe second and as soon as the diver accepts it he bolts for the surface ... taking you and your regulator with him.

What do you do? The obvious answer is you try to slow him down and calm him down ... but that doesn't always work. A diver on the verge of panic isn't thinking rationally, and adrenaline is on his side ... not yours. To complicate things, you've got your own buddy to think about. Maybe he had his head stuck under a ledge looking at something for a moment and doesn't even know this situation has developed yet.

So you're faced with a choice ... either act to retrieve your reg, leaving this diver with no way to breathe - or you go up with him, putting yourself at risk and maybe losing your own buddy in the process.

There is no "correct" answer in a lot of cases ... it depends on circumstances, and on what your conscience tells you is the right thing to do. Often the choice is to put yourself in harms way, even though your training told you otherwise ... you still have to live with yourself afterward, and no matter what you do you'll be second-guessing if things don't turn out well.

That's the reality of it. Diving accidents seldom leave us with clean choices ... usually you have seconds (if that) to think about the alternatives and weigh out possible consequences of two or three less-than-optimal actions.

What we teach is an "idealized" version of reality ... because there's just no way to anticipate all the variables that go into a diving accident. Ultimately, what you do will depend as much on your conscience, and on the circumstances at the time, as it will your training ... what we hope to achieve in Stress and Rescue classes is to give you enough information that, whatever you choose, you will be able to act rationally to minimize any possibility of damage to yourself and the person you're trying to help.

... Bob (Grateful Diver)
 
Don.
I know that your post is well intended, but, in the real world, your request would be given scant attention.
Even if your divemaster knew of your wishes as stated above, to any divemaster worthy of the name you are his diver, his responsibility. We have repeated the mantra "do not endanger yourself" endlessly, but when an event actually occurs, all that our minds tell us is that "my diver is in trouble". We don't have time to do a careful assessment of the risks. We go to your aid, because that is what we do. Usually, all ends well, but on rare occasions, it does not.
 

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