AOW too soon??

[ScubaThor]

Let me beging by saying that the staff and instructors at my local dive center are nothing short of awesome - both from an ability as well as judgment standpoint. I've done all my training through them and could not be happier.
Now, this brings me to my real point: I've been diving for about 2 years and have just now completed my AOW. I feel very comfortable in the water but have always thought "the more training, the better". I was incredibly surprised to find out that I was the most experienced diver in my AOW class, with 30 logged dives. Many of the divers had come straight from OW training, without any other diving experience (issues with navigation, buoyance, etc).
Does this cheapen the value of AOW? How does everyone else feel about the timing of training?
Again, not blaming the dive center - they are fantastic...
Just making an observation.

 

[jeckyll]

This type of thread comes up about once every 2 weeks or so

Nothing 'Advanced' about AOW unless it's taught well above the minimum required standards...

 

[loosebits]

Don't be shy about blaming your LDS, if they were fantastic they wouldn't have OW graduates with buoyancy issues (assuming these divers weren't trained elsewhere). Of course the standards for what is considered decent OW training have plummeted almost to the point that if no one died during class, it can be called fantastic (please see the thread linked to in my signature).

Anyway there is nothing advanced about AOW and it's often used to augment lacking open water training and allow a newly carded diver more time in the water with an instructor before being sent our on their own.

Well, despite all of this, congrats anyway.

 

[jbd]

As I have posted here several times in the past I believe that a person should have 25 to 30 dives before taking the AOW course. The main reason is the experience and the familiarity with how the scuba gear works even if its rented gear.

I just completed a couple of assessment dives with a person wanting to take my AOW course and he had 37 logged dives prior to the assessment dives. He is very comfortable and familiar with his gear and we will therefore be able to focus more on AOW skills performed to a higher standard.

The typical newly minted OW diver just doesn't have enough experience to to be held to a higher standard. This by nature dilutes the quality of the course that can be achieved.

 

[fire_diver]

I think that the majority of dive shops cheapen the AOW course by ram-rodding brand new students into it. Then, they dilute the course so that it is nearly impossible to fail, just like most OW courses.

To make matters worse, too many dive ops require AOW in order to dive with them. They don't care that most of these AOW divers can't dive thier way out of a swimming pool.

FD

 

[K Mejean]

I am not AOW certified yet but my LDS told me that NAUI has no real requirments for advanced as far as pool and class go. They told me as long as you could do the required dives that is all that matters. Now that being said I had a friend take it a couple of weeks ago and he said it was a tuff class. That there was a lot of things he had to do in the water this time that he never had to even think about in OW. I would like some clarification on this as well so I know to sign up or not. If anyone knows I would like to know the differences in NAUI and SSI and if I can swap from one to the other for the advanced.

 

[TSandM]

Then, they dilute the course so that it is nearly impossible to fail, just like most OW courses.

Interesting you should say that . . . We were just talking to some friends last night about this. I realized, looking back on it, that I have no idea what the standard was I had to meet to pass any of the AOW dives, except to do them. I certainly have no idea what it would have taken to fail.

I also agree that a number of people (myself among them) simply go straight into AOW because they don't feel competent to dive outside of instruction after their OW class. There is, therefore, very little that one can get out of AOW, other than time underwater. Someone who waits has the potential to get some actual additional training out of the class, but then you need a class which isn't geared to the scared new OW diver.

 

[jbd]

I am not AOW certified yet but my LDS told me that NAUI has no real requirments for advanced as far as pool and class go. They told me as long as you could do the required dives that is all that matters. Now that being said I had a friend take it a couple of weeks ago and he said it was a tuff class. That there was a lot of things he had to do in the water this time that he never had to even think about in OW. I would like some clarification on this as well so I know to sign up or not. If anyone knows I would like to know the differences in NAUI and SSI and if I can swap from one to the other for the advanced.

For NAUI there is no "required" formal classroom time or pool time for the AOW course. What is noted is that the nature of the course will require at minimum extended surface briefings of the dives that will be done. There is the suggesion that the instructor may consider doing some pool training sessions to introduce new skills in preparation for actual OW dives.

As for doing the required dives, well I guess thats up to the instructor. NAUI requires a minimum of six dives for AOW. Each dive segment is to be held to a higher standard of performance that would be expected of an OW diver at certification. I plan on at least the six and tell the students to be prepared for eight. As the instructor I reserve the right to allow the student to NOT succeed on any given dive, which means the dive will be re-done until the success has been achieved.

I don't know what he had to do in the water that he never had to think of before so I can't clarify that.

I'm not familiar with SSI's AOW course. There are several SSI instructors that are members of scubaboard--maybe they could describe the program to you.

 

[amascuba]

After observing a couple PADI AOW classes and skimming through the standards it seems to me that the PADI AOW class is nothing more than some dives with an instructor and/or a divemaster/assistant instructor with varying experience in deep, navigation, etc. The PADI AOW video (adventures in diving, or what ever it's called) is pretty decent. I haven't read the book, but I would think it covers the same material as the video.

Don't take this as bashing PADI. It's not that at all. It does differ greatly from the SSI AOW standards, which I'm more familiar with.

 

[jbd]

.....but then you need a class which isn't geared to the scared new OW diver.

this is the value of doing a set of assessment dives prior to accepting someone for the AOW. If the assessment indicates they need more experience before taking the class then help the person make arrangements to get the experience needed to take a real AOW course. This would be a good time fo mentoring.