Padi/Dsat gear configuration

[rusky4u]

the Undersea Journal, second quarter 2001, is dedicated to Padi/DSAT Tec-Rec.

i was not a Padi Pro back in 2001 so I`ve just seen this 2001 edition yesterday while waiting for a marine biology course to start.

i was surprised to find this Padi edition 100% dedicated to Tec Rec Diving.
Mainly due to gear configuration!

i`ve already seen some info on the Tec Rec courses (Padi`s web) but never seen “deeper” info on the subject!

after reading so much about Tec gear configuration and how Padi is way out of this, I was surprised to see the photos illustrating this Undersea Journal edition.

this photos clearly show: no jacket bcd, just wings, no octopus, two main regulators with piston bolts, one with a long hose, proper d-rings, mask in the back of the head, dry suits, jet fins, deco diving, twins, gas, deco stage tanks, deep wreck diving, cave penetration, lift bags, etc, etc,…

so, my questions are:

- does any one in the board experienced any of the Padi`s/DSAT Tec Rec programs?
- If yes, any comments?
- If Padi/Dsat use and supports the above-mentioned gear what’s the fuzz on the use of such gear in OWD training, both by students and instructors?
- Is Padi going en route for what seems to be a Tec boom???

i hope that this doesn’t turns out to be another DIR thread!
regulators, feel free to move this thread to the Tec area, I thought it makes sense here but its your call!

 

[salty]

IMHO

P put
A another
D dollar
I in


Im sure most of us rember when PADI (and most other agencys for that matter) was anti nitrox. OH how things have changed.

 

[MikeFerrara]

salty once bubbled...
IMHO

P put
A another
D dollar
I in


Im sure most of us rember when PADI (and most other agencys for that matter) was anti nitrox. OH how things have changed.

Me too. Your comment seems to lacks content. Perhaps your experience in teaching tech courses might provide some insight here. Yes things change. A few years ago they were against the use of nitrox and so was everyone else. Agencies like IANTD, GUE and TDI didn't exist. Go figure. Actually I teach the DSAT gas blender program and when we're finished my student are able to bleng gas. I of course add in a few things like the use of the blending software that I wrote and some math tricks that make it a little easier without software. I also have a collection of mixing softwares some of which are very good.

I don't teach the DSAT TecRec deep diver course because I haven't decided if I want to teach below 130 ft especially with air/nitrox. I also don't know that I care to openly market deep diving. I happen to believe that at least 99% of the population are not suited for it. If I decide to teach it all I need do is go take a test. I have all other qualifications including teaching and assisting equivilant programs.

The DSAT course has by far the most complete and well written standards of any tech class I have ever seen. The only thing I didn't care for is all the acronyms they use in the text. BTW aside from that the text book is also the best I've seen. Well...I think they should have a little more phisiology but that's me.

I have a copy of the text and standards and can answer questions if anyone has them.

 

[rusky4u]

thanks mike!

yet, the gear question is still on my mind…
is the tec gear mandatory for the student to take the courses?
why is the tec gear good for tec and not applicable to owd courses?
after all dsat is padi, right?
i`ve seen many posts where instructors complain about not allowed to teach owd using wings and long hoses…
if dsat (padi) supports this gear and configuration why the fuzz? hhhuuummm, ok, LDS need to sell the jacket bcds…

another thing I found interesting in the magazine (and your comments just remind me about it) is Padi saying that tec rec is NOT FOR ALL !!!
which is not common in Padi, based on the “everyone can dive” concept.
So I assume that they also seem to take this subject very carefully…sounds reasonable...

so far as the standards are concerned is there anything related with how experienced should the instructor be to teach tec rec?
i mean is it ok for an instructor to teach out-of-the-course or is it mandatory to have some “experience” (I know this is a ambiguous concept) say what ever number of non-air deep dives?

Cheers!

 

[MikeFerrara]

rusky4u once bubbled...
thanks mike!

yet, the gear question is still on my mind…
is the tec gear mandatory for the student to take the courses?
why is the tec gear good for tec and not applicable to owd courses?
after all dsat is padi, right?
i`ve seen many posts where instructors complain about not allowed to teach owd using wings and long hoses…
if dsat (padi) supports this gear and configuration why the fuzz? hhhuuummm, ok, LDS need to sell the jacket bcds…

Certain aspects of the configuration are manditory like breathing the long hose with a bungied backup and manifolded isolated doubles. There isn't anything in the standards that says you can't teach OW in a bp/wing. In fact that's what I do. I even put students in them. This is strictly a shop/instructor thing.

rusky4u once bubbled...

another thing I found interesting in the magazine (and your comments just remind me about it) is Padi saying that tec rec is NOT FOR ALL !!!
which is not common in Padi, based on the “everyone can dive” concept.
So I assume that they also seem to take this subject very carefully…sounds reasonable...

The stance that PADI has taken in public is that technical diving isn't for all. The TecRec course are not a continuation of the existing educational system but a totally seperate system. In other words Apprentice Tec Deep does not come next after Master Scuba Diver. Now in practice how will shops , market the program? My giess is they will be fairly aggressive and put people out there tech diving who shouldn't be. But it's not like the other agencies don't.

rusky4u once bubbled...
so far as the standards are concerned is there anything related with how experienced should the instructor be to teach tec rec?
i mean is it ok for an instructor to teach out-of-the-course or is it mandatory to have some “experience” (I know this is a ambiguous concept) say what ever number of non-air deep dives?

Cheers! [/B]

From memory...To be a TecRec instructor one needs to hold an equivelant or higher cert. They need to be a Master Scuba Diver Trainer or higher. They must have certified at least 10 (I think it was 10) Nitrox and/or Deep Diver students. They must teach or assist with at least two TecRec or equivelant courses. They must have at least 25 Staged decompression dives below 130 ft. These dives are intended to be tech dives so a recreational dive that pisses off your computer doesn't count. They must have an Instructor with tech cert sign a skill review form. They must take a standards test and a theory test.

I think thats about all. I don't remember what changes if you do a class with a course director I could look it up (I'm not at the shop now).

The part I don't care for is taking divers to 165 on air. Especially with an instructor with only 25 tech dives. The last dive (dive 12) must be to at least 145 with a max depth of 165. Dive 11 must be to at least 130 with a max of (I think) 150 and so on.

I would have been just as easy to through in normoxic trimix. Then I think it would (COULD) be a good class.

I don't know anyone who is currently teaching the course or how well they are doing.

 

[MechDiver]

MikeFerrara once bubbled...
The stance that PADI has taken in public is that technical diving isn't for all. The TecRec course are not a continuation of the existing educational system but a totally seperate system

It would seem the title would help to defeat the "separate" stance, because of the "Rec" part. PADI sure has a problem with course titles

I would not consider anything to 165 as being any part "rec", but I can see alot of potential students thinking "ahh, its just rec diving, can't be too hard". And I agree, air to that depth is stupid.

Phil

 

[rusky4u]

don`t bother to look for how it would be with a Course Director.
thanks for your replies, it really gives me perspective and very good info!!!

Thank u very much Mike!!!

best!

 

[roakey]

PADI teaches air to 165'

You need look no further that that to realize that this is NOT what you want to do. They may have some stuff right, but in an overhead you need to have EVERYTHING right.

Look to GUE for training if you want to get into this stuff.

http://www.gue.com/

Roak

 

[MikeFerrara]

I won't go so far as to say that GUE is the only way to go but I will agree that if one can use Helium they should. The IANTD Normoxic Trimix can be done without ever going below 130 on air.

 

[scuberd]

I am not a tech diver, but I am wondering one thing. I would like to know how deep one can go on air alone. I promise I will not go that deep (I enjoy being alive), its only for my personal info.