Laziness, complacency or is it just me?

[txtroop07]

I am (or in my mind) pretty thorough when it comes to assembling and checking my gear before I enter the water. This is why I always travel with my own gear, I know what kind of shape it is in. I believe that if I find and address the small problems that it will prevent larger problems from happening at a critical moment, ie snowballing. I know it has saved me more than once.

That said, I will not enter the water with an O-ring leaking from a tank. That's how I was trained. I have noticed on several dive trips many divers do not check this. It becomes obvious from the trail of bubbles flowing from behind their heads. I have also noticed that when I ask for a new O-ring, the DM's always seem to be annoyed, even when I offer to replace it myself if they provide the ring and pick. On a recent trip, I had to have the rings replaced on both of my tanks and well as my wife's. They were all visibly damaged and you could hear the air leaking. No one else asked for a new O-ring so it seems likely that my wife in I got lucky and picked the only 4 tanks with bad o-rings (sarcasm).

Now my question(s) is this. Was my instructor one of the only ones who teaches this or was he wrong? Are divers just getting lazy and complacent about small things? Or is it just me being overly attentive and anal?

 

[Texasguy]

It was also my observation that leaky o-rings were not a major problems in the eyes of the DMs.

I might be wrong but I think that some companies "rent" tanks from a big supplier (like a bigger plant that has 10,000 tanks, fills them and leases out to scuba ops). Each day the op gets some tanks. If a tank has a bad o-ring, then it is the op's money to fix it. It also may mean they fix the o-ring today but in the evening they will turn the tank in and they may never see that tank again in the near future. Thus, replacing o-rings for them might be an "unnecessary" expense.

I was also told that amount of air is lost is minimal, equal to a few full breaths... I am annoyed with the extra bubbling noise, nevertheless.

 

[T.C.]

Now my question(s) is this. Was my instructor one of the only ones who teaches this or was he wrong?

No, and no. It (should) be taught in all OW courses, and your instructor is right

Are divers just getting lazy and complacent about small things?

Yes. Most of them only dive once or twice a year. They probably don't even notice this.

Or is it just me being overly attentive and anal?

No, not you.

The problem is that most people think it isn't a big deal. You really won't lose that much air...but you are at a much greater risk for a blown O-ring. And that will get their attention. And while that isn't a serious problem, as your reg will still work just fine, the huge noise and bubbles will probably cause them to panic; even though they easily will have enough air to make a safe ascent to the surface. How many do you think will do that, if they're not attentive enough to notice the hissing from their regulator at the start of the dive?

 

[djtimmy77]

The high pitched buzzing/squealing is annoying on the dive. I generally bring my own extra O-rings for this on the rare occurrence I am using someone else's tanks, but wouldn't hesitate asking a DM for another one pre-dive as it is pretty obvious if it is leaking.

In Bonaire we would look for tanks with good O-rings before analyzing/loading them in the truck. If one got by us and we had a leaky o-ring, we'd remove it after the dive, forcing its replacement before being filled, as a courtesy to the next diver to use the tank.

 

[rx7diver]

I have also noticed that when I ask for a new O-ring, the DM's always seem to be annoyed, even when I offer to replace it myself if they provide the ring and pick.

txtroop,

You might consider putting a few new O-rings in one of those small ziplock bags, and keeping the bag in your BC pocket. Then an O-ring will be available when you might need it. I don't think you'll need a pick; your fingernail should work.

And if you need to, you can force the O-ring out of its groove by using your finger and the air pressure in the tank (which is similar to what happens when a first stage isn't tightened sufficiently on the tank valve and the O-ring blows out when the air is turned on).

Safe Diving,

rx7diver

 

[iluvtheocean]

I am (or in my mind) pretty thorough when it comes to assembling and checking my gear before I enter the water. This is why I always travel with my own gear, I know what kind of shape it is in. I believe that if I find and address the small problems that it will prevent larger problems from happening at a critical moment, ie snowballing. I know it has saved me more than once.

That said, I will not enter the water with an O-ring leaking from a tank. That's how I was trained. I have noticed on several dive trips many divers do not check this. It becomes obvious from the trail of bubbles flowing from behind their heads. I have also noticed that when I ask for a new O-ring, the DM's always seem to be annoyed, even when I offer to replace it myself if they provide the ring and pick. On a recent trip, I had to have the rings replaced on both of my tanks and well as my wife's. They were all visibly damaged and you could hear the air leaking. No one else asked for a new O-ring so it seems likely that my wife in I got lucky and picked the only 4 tanks with bad o-rings (sarcasm).

Now my question(s) is this. Was my instructor one of the only ones who teaches this or was he wrong? Are divers just getting lazy and complacent about small things? Or is it just me being overly attentive and anal?

yes

but seriously... it should be taught if it isn't --and people are inherently lazy

leaking gas is gas that you don't get to use either during the dive or as backup.--- i know what i would choose...

 

[mike.chuanshi]

I have had some similar issues recently with o-rings, both on charters and when renting tanks for shore dives. On two consecutive charters I had one tank which was leaking. One I caught before getting in the water, and the DM said it was "no big deal." I wasn't at all thrilled about this response so I did a little repair job myself. The other didn't appear to be leaking at first (although it probably was), but halfway through the dive my buddy informed me that there was a small leak. Unfortunately there is only so much that can be done while underwater, and this screwed up our dive plan - very frustrating. The very next weekend I rented eight tanks so my buddy and I could spend a day at the beach, and we both had an issue with o-rings being in poor condition. We had to replace three of them, and when we took the old ones out they pretty much just disintegrated in our fingertips.

Unlike the DM who said it was "no big deal," my instructor and the shop manager were not at all thrilled about the issue when I told them. They assured me that they would immediately replace every o-ring and look into why these tanks were not being properly maintained.

In lieu of these experiences, I agree with what another poster said about carrying spare o-rings just in case. I don't see how having the air that your life depends on leaking out of your tank can ever be "no big deal," and it's not hard to see that this is a clear sign of a disaster in the making. I was pretty disappointed in the DM, especially given that my buddy and I are fairly new divers and we caught these problems instead of someone who is supposed to be a professional. Beyond that, I didn't feel it was very professional to say "no big deal" when informed of the problem.

 

[knotical]

If you paid for a fill, you are entitled to a fill, but the real world is such that this is going to continue to happen.
Usually it’s no big deal, with the operant word being “usually”.

The amount of air lost past a typical leaky o-ring probably amounts to a breath or two during the course of an average dive. From that aspect it is similar to a slightly less than complete fill.

BUT. as T.C. and others have pointed out, it occasionally becomes a bigger deal if the o-ring blows.

When confronted with this, my choices in preferred sequence are:
- Whoever provided the cylinder should replace the o-ring.
- The diver can provide a spare o-ring (be aware there are some valves with different size o-rings.)
- Sometimes turning the o-ring over to expose a new surface stops the leak.
- Dive with the slow leak, being a bit more alert for a possible blow-out.

 

[diver 85]

" It becomes obvious from the trail of bubbles flowing from behind their heads.".....Maybe you trailing a Sherwood?????............

 

[TMHeimer]

It was also my observation that leaky o-rings were not a major problems in the eyes of the DMs.

I might be wrong but I think that some companies "rent" tanks from a big supplier (like a bigger plant that has 10,000 tanks, fills them and leases out to scuba ops). Each day the op gets some tanks. If a tank has a bad o-ring, then it is the op's money to fix it. It also may mean they fix the o-ring today but in the evening they will turn the tank in and they may never see that tank again in the near future. Thus, replacing o-rings for them might be an "unnecessary" expense.

I was also told that amount of air is lost is minimal, equal to a few full breaths... I am annoyed with the extra bubbling noise, nevertheless.

An employee at a very well known and highly regarded shop (not ours) told me that they have so many tanks coming in and out for rentals/classes etc. (this is in FL) that checking each o ring is not practical. I had two o ring leaks there recently (noticed when attaching 1st stage). I replaced them with the spare ones they have attached to the tank valve. I think our shop is in the same situation. I always listen closely to the valve after attaching the first stage. A leak is not hard to hear. Not doing this is either due to inexperience or laziness. O rings were the first things that went in my spare kit.