Buddies kept grabbing/pulling me to ascend faster than computer said was safe

[alicia5272000]

I was on a dive where the depth was 90ft and this was only my second time going deep. I was certified PADI in April 2014 and AOW August 2014. I have a Galileo Luna dive computer. For those who don't have one, it has a bar on the right side that lets you know if you are ascending too fast. You are not supposed to go much further than halfway on the bar. I would also like to preface this story with the fact that I used 2474 psi during the dive and started with about 3100-3200 so when I surfaced I had between 626-726 psi so I would have had time to take a slower ascent. In addition, my computer said the dive lasted for 17 minutes.

I was partnered with someone who had been diving for 30 years. When we went down we were separated from the group and descended and were just roaming the bottom when another diver joined us. The dive master had said that we would be headed North along the reef. We were headed south, so I used my buddies slate to say "They were headed North should we go that way" but I couldn't get a response from him and he was just looking around and started swimming again south. I figured we were separated from the group anyway, so we could just dive and head up when we were low on air. A few minutes later, he comes to me with his slate which read something about going North. I was trying to point that we should go north and which direction it was but he kept pointing south and I couldn't get him to turn around. So when I got to 1100 psi I told him we needed to head up.

We started to ascend and at first I was having trouble going up because I had emptied all my air (found out I shouldn't do that later in the day) and was only ascending as fast as my computer told me too. He kept motioning for me to go faster but i listened to my computer. Because he kept motioning I started going up faster until my computer started beeping at me. So I slowed down within my computers range. He then grabbed my hand and started pulling me up. It really freaked my out because my computer beeped and said "ascent too fast". I pulled my hand out of his grasp. He then started gesturing for me to go faster and I kept pointing at my computer. He grabbed my hand 2-3 times more and I kept pulling my arm out of his grasp. By this time I am really freaking out because the other guy is starting to get close and keeps motioning for me to go faster. Finally they back off and I try to do a safety stop. Within about a minute they are motioning for me to come up. I then sense someone behind me and could feel him grabbing my gear because I felt a pull. After that it's hazy because I was so freaked out, but I remember that they did back off. But when they kept grabbing on to me I just went up because I was really panicking. My ears were killing me because I had not had a chance to clear them.

After we got back on the boat my original buddy said something about he thought I was narcing out. They both said I was ascending way too slow and that I didn't need a safety stop because we had only been down there about 15 minutes. The diver who had joined us, who I will mention is learning to tech dive, came up to me later and said that when a group of "advanced" divers agree about something that you should listen i.e. I was ascending too slow and I should have listened to them and come up faster. And that computers sometimes fail and he never uses his. I will add that when the dive shop owner looked at my computer he said that by looking at it I ascended too fast.

I am wanting to get people's opinion on what I should have done. What would you have done in that situation. Is it ever ok for someone to grab you if you are conscious? And at only 30-40 feet? If the computer says I am ascending too fast and I have enough air to make it to the surface is there any reason I should speed up. Am I wrong for being utterly enraged? When I came up I tried to explain to the dive master but was so upset I didn't know how much air I had when I was ascending and just shut up because I was on the verge of bawling. I let it go and just buddied up with someone else for the rest of the trip. It wasn't until I spoke with the owner and he looked at my computer that I knew (after surfacing) I had had enough air to slowly ascend.

I have one other question. I was skeptical about my buddies abilities b/c before we got in the water he didn't even know how we were supposed to descend and I had to tell him what the dive master had said, he didn't know which way was north (with a compass), and kept staying in front of me and never looking back. I had to chase him to tell him I was low on air. Does the length of time a person has been diving have any bearing on their abilities and safety skills? Can someone be diving a long time and just cheated death? I ask b/c I have a tendency to be highly critical and don't know if I'm just being nit picky.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

The only reason I could imagine for a good diver to act like that would be that he was super low on air and wanted you along, but didn't want to share air. Well maybe another reason, you were going ridiculously slow.

Either way, the guy is a dick. If he needed air, he should let you know and if your computer was beeping the ascent was faster than it should be, so I really can't imagine a reason for a diver to do something like that.

If a diver were to ascend "too" slow, I might ask them to speed up a little, but once you are above 50 feet or so, you can hardly come up too slow (within reason of course). People should not be physically interfering with you, especially after you signaled you did not want the help. Coming up a little slow from 90 feet is not going to hurt anyone, and to stress someone out like that is really unfortunate.

I have to wonder if it is because you are a women? I think most men would have slapped them in the balls after the second attempt.

Lastly, if your instructional background was to dump all air from your BC before you begin your ascent- your instructor sucked- not just your dive buddies.

 

[hroark2112]

90' and no safety stop is a bad plan, for future dives.

Ascending within the parameters of your computer is smart and you weren't doing anything wrong. I would make a mental note to never dive with them again.

 

[doctormike]

Can someone be diving a long time and just cheated death?

I will let Mr. Chatterton answer that question: Accomplished Bad Divers

I don't know what the abilities of the people you were diving with were, or from their point of view, what seemed to be going on with you. I wasn't there. But based on what you posted, it seems like you got some bad instabuddies, my friend...

I sure hope that the guy in tech training doesn't try to pull someone up from a deco stop!

 

[DogDiver]

You and you alone are responsible for your actions and safety. It's not their ass that will end up in a chamber if you decide not to pay attention to your computer.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[drbill]

Were you at the maximum depth of 90' for 15 minutes, or was that the total dive time? In either case I would opt for a slow ascent as long as you have the air (which you did). Just because someone has been diving "for 30 years" does not necessarily mean they are a good, safe diver. I've seen a few real bozos who make claims like that (good thing I don't have to watch me!)

 

[boulderjohn]

I was on a dive where the depth was 90ft and this was only my second time going deep. I was certified PADI in April 2014 and AOW August 2014. I have a Galileo Luna dive computer. For those who don't have one, it has a bar on the right side that lets you know if you are ascending too fast. You are not supposed to go much further than halfway on the bar. I would also like to preface this story with the fact that I used 2474 psi during the dive and started with about 3100-3200 so when I surfaced I had between 626-726 psi so I would have had time to take a slower ascent. In addition, my computer said the dive lasted for 17 minutes.

OK, let's assume you were diving an aluminum 80 tank on this dive. You went to a maximum depth of 90 feet and used almost all your gas on that dive with a total time of 17 minutes. Let's say that on this dive you averaged 66 feet, which is a reasonable assumption based on what you wrote. That means you used 147 PSI per minute on that dive. Since you were at three atmospheres of pressure on average, your PSI Surface Air Consumption Rate would have been about 50 PSI per minute. That is an extremely high breathing rate. I have to believe there was more going on than your description indicates. My suspicion is that you were far closer to going through your total air supply than you realize, and your buddies realized that and were trying to get you to the surface faster because you needed to get to the surface faster.

 

[bradells]

OK, let's assume you were diving an aluminum 80 tank on this dive. You went to a maximum depth of 90 feet and used almost all your gas on that dive with a total time of 17 minutes. Let's say that on this dive you averaged 66 feet, which is a reasonable assumption based on what you wrote. That means you used 147 PSI per minute on that dive. Since you were at three atmospheres of pressure on average, your PSI Surface Air Consumption Rate would have been about 50 PSI per minute. That is an extremely high breathing rate. I have to believe there was more going on than your description indicates. My suspicion is that you were far closer to going through your total air supply than you realize, and your buddies realized that and were trying to get you to the surface faster because you needed to get to the surface faster.

I wouldn't doubt it, also with the higher SCR due to a not so good instabuddy from the rest of the post for the entire dive!

Also add more 'pressure' from 'random divers' during an ascent staring from negative from 90ft....


If they were better 'buddies' a quick question of what's your SPG? would have sufficed rather than assuming not and 'pulling' a faster ascent.


BRad

 

[doctormike]

OK, let's assume you were diving an aluminum 80 tank on this dive. You went to a maximum depth of 90 feet and used almost all your gas on that dive with a total time of 17 minutes. Let's say that on this dive you averaged 66 feet, which is a reasonable assumption based on what you wrote. That means you used 147 PSI per minute on that dive. Since you were at three atmospheres of pressure on average, your PSI Surface Air Consumption Rate would have been about 50 PSI per minute. That is an extremely high breathing rate. I have to believe there was more going on than your description indicates. My suspicion is that you were far closer to going through your total air supply than you realize, and your buddies realized that and were trying to get you to the surface faster because you needed to get to the surface faster.

I dunno, that's giving these guys (the buddy and the other diver) a big benefit of the doubt. I mean, we only have the OPs side of the story, but given the numbers that I ran for this, it would make a lot more sense to just make a slow ascent with the new diver, being ready to donate air if he went OOG. Doesn't seem likely that would have happened, but of course, we weren't there and we don't know.

The OP says it was a 90 foot depth dive, and then he talks about an ascent at 1100 PSI. Nothing to suggest a multi level dive. Rounding things off, that means that he used about 53 CUF on the bottom (tank baseline of 0.0266 x 2000). At 3.7 ATA, assuming 14 minutes of bottom time (3 minute ascent), that gives you a SAC of 1.0 CUF/min (pretty high but not off the bell curve for a new diver). So for the ascent portion, that diver would have needed 1.0 x 2.4 ATA (average depth) x 6 min (ascent plus safety stop) = 14 CUF, out of the 30 CUF left in the tank. Of course, being assaulted underwater might raise his SAC a bit...

Bottom line is that there are VERY few scenarios where I would think it would be OK to physically drag another diver up to the point of an ascent rate violation - someone unconscious, someone who truly seemed narced (unlikely at 90 feet), etc...

 

[kr2y5]

I sympathize with the OP... someone repeatedly grabbing me in the water and nagging me to go up would have been unacceptable, and I would not allow myself to be bullied by the self-proclaimed "advanced" divers who need to rush out of the water because they did not properly calculate or monitor their gas reserves.

I do not see a slow ascent here... the OP reported that she started going up with 1100 psi, and ended with somewhere around 700, that's 400 psi for the ascent. Suppose boulderjohn's 50 psi/minute SAC is accurate, the safety stop for 1 minute at 20 feet would have cost her about 80psi, leaving 320psi for the moving part of the ascent, with average depth 45 feet, or at about 120 psi/minute. To consume 320psi at this rate, the ascent would have to take only 2 minutes and 40 seconds, that's over the recommended 30 feet/min., and that's not even counting the need to slow down to 10 feet/min. near the surface. For all we know, the OP ascended too fast, not too slow.

Perhaps the OP can cut these speculations by posting the dive profile printout from her computer.

Also, blowing 2300psi in 17 min. during OP's second deep dive doesn't surprise me that much... I've consumed more than this on my first deep dive (first dive of my AOW), with a very similar profile, breathing at a very fast pace due to anxiety (got the recording, so I know that was the case, my breathing was way out of whack).