Removing and Replacing BC underwater with weight pouches

[UserNameBella]

Hello all,

I am working on some of my skills in my local lake this summer in preparation for doing my dive master course this coming winter.

The one skill that has me stumped is the removal and replacement of the BC while underwater. Being that my BC has weight pouches as soon as I take it off I am buoyant in my 7mm wet suit and I am gone. Right now a 7mm is necessary as I live in Canada and my lake is a chilly 69 degrees. Ouch.

Obviously I did it in my ow course, but it was pretty sad. Two instructors had to hold me down and I flooded my mask laughing each time. I can do it if I take out a weight pouch and stuff it down my wetsuit, but I would eventually like to do my instructors course and I hardly think that is demonstration quality.

So, how do I remove and replace my BC underwater with weight pouches? Or do I just wear a weight belt that day. I know if i ever needed to really remove it for a real reason stuffing the weight pouch down my wetsuit kind of works, although I feel like I should practice that some more because it's a little difficult to pull off.

Any advice is appreciated. Links to videos are even more appreciated. I'd prefer not to switch to a weight belt. I can never weight them right and I think this is a pretty important skill. I'd like to be able to do it horizontal like I would if I was in the middle of a dive and discovered my air was off or I was caught in kelp, but one thing at a time , right?

Thanks

 

[Nemrod]

You have just discovered why so many old time divers eschew weight integration. My only weight integrated rig is for warm water use where I am in light or no exposure protection and therefore carry but a few pounds in the lightweight rig. Yeah, I am still overly buoyant in a doff and don but I can handle it. But, in heavier exposure protection, I switch back to a weight belt so I can split the required weight between me and my possibly "weighted" rig and maintain ditchable weight as well. N

 

[TMHeimer]

Others more experienced with this weight pocket-only set up may have some ideas. All I can figure is to use a belt. How much weight do you have in the pockets?--a total of 20 pounds (that's all you need with 7 mil suit?)? One philosophy is it's a good idea to use both pockets and belt so you can ditch one or the other without risking buoyant ascent. Also, stringing and properly weighting belts is something a DM does fairly frequently for students. I use a pocket belt myself, which is more comfortable. Have to admit I have only demonstrated this in the pool wearing a shorty and 12 lb. belt--no pocket weights. It also was the skill that held up my DM cert. Are you planning to assist with classes that may do the skill learning days in "confined" salt water as opposed to a pool? The only time I've demonstrated anything (or heard of a DM doing so) was when the students were first learning the skills in the pool. You will have to demonstrate removal/replacement of belt there anyway. Hope that helps a little.

Oh, 69F water? That's shorty for me. Everyone's different of course, but do you really need a 7 mil for that?
I lost a 10 pound weight pocket recently and of course had to grab rocks to stay down and hunt for it. Would not have wanted to try demonstrating unit removal in that situation.
I do also use suspenders for the belt, so removing weight in a real emergency basically means the pockets only, which is probably what you'd want unless you wanted a buoyant ascent on purpose.

 

[Patoux01]

Interesting.

My view on this non-issue is that a diver without bcd should be neutral. So you're basically doing it wrong from the start (don't get offended, it's my view, not the one of your instructor or whoever, I'm not the one telling you you'll pass or fail).

Now, let's think about this skill.
Is it a demonstration of your ability to do various tasks without changing depth? Then grab a weight off your BCD and put it in your hand/suit when you remove the bcd, that's still demonstrating ability to be taskloaded right?
Do you consider is a potential life safer? Do you then really believe that in an emergency, you'd be fine taking a weight out of a pouch, stuffing that down your wetsuit? Or would you go up, ask someone to hand you a weight belt, give them your pouches, go down again, put yourself in the same ****ty situation and then remove your bcd? (in case the reader is wondering, this is impossible)


When you say "I can never weight them right", I don't see how that's possible. If you know the weight you need, then you put that on a belt and it's fine. To avoid the "back-breaker" you can use a weight harness to secure part of your weights. You (often) don't want to be stuck with all your weights, and you don't want to be able to drop all of them either. So (again, my view), if I needed eg 7kg of weight, I'd use about 5 on a harness and 2 on a belt. In real life I have 9 pounds in a harness and 6 on the belt, simply because I only have weights of 3 pounds. If your bcd + tank + regs float with an empty tank, then you'd have to move a bit of weight from yourself to your bcd.

 

[Nemrod]

Y'all realize he is using a weight integrated BC? Nobody (I have ever seen) uses a weight belt with a weight integration BC.

N

 

[Patoux01]

Yes I do realize, and I explained why they're crap, without actually saying "they're crap", rather having the person think about her setup, which is the way it should work if someone is wanting to become a DM/instructor, you have to constantly think "am I the best I could be?", or you shouldn't be teaching if that is not your view. (once more, my opinion). And also be willing to get your setup questionned when someone thinks it is not the best solution.

I did suggest using some weight in the BCD if the rig was positive at the end of the dive, but else, there's no reason to use those pouches, and there's reasons to put the weights somewhere else.
Simply because you can stuff all the weights in your BCD doesn't mean you should.

 

[dumpsterDiver]

The whole reason this skill exists is so that a diver who is entangled can remove the scuba unit and untangle themselves.. Right?

To me, this is an absolutely essential skill and I must be rather clumsy underwater, but I have had to do it dozens of times while diving solo.

So why in the world, are people wearing scuba rigs that prevent them from safely doing this? Why is it acceptable to do all kinds of crazy accommodations to be able to marginally complete a class requirement? Shouldn't everyone be able to do it without much trouble in the gear they dive in every day?

 

[CWC]

Check this video out. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iZTNo6rbEwQ&list=PL2F7896605274DDFF&index=18
Notice how he keeps the whole scuba unit on his right knee when it is off, without ever setting it down. Yes, I know he is wearing a weight belt, but the same technique would work with integrated weights. Keep the BC close to you, and on top of your right leg to prevent yourself from floating away from it.

 

[Patoux01]

please, do not follow what happens in that video. Grossly overweighting yourself and sinking to the bottom is not a solution.

That kind of videos should be removed, the skills are normally to be done while neutrally buoyant. (now, not back then, but that still shows a poor example)

 

[blatter]

Well it is possible to do a ditch and recovery with a weight integrated BC, but it can be a bit of a challenge with a 7 mm wetsuit or a drysuit even with a good technique. I have done a ditch and recovery with a drysuit andall weights on a BP/Wing as a training excersise and that weight distribution made it much more difficult.

An alternative to putting all weight on a belt is to split weights between the BC and either a belt or weight harness, which is what I do when I use a drysuit or 7 mm wetsuit. I must say I do this more from the point of view of making it easier to move stuff around on land (BP/Wing + doubles or rebreather starts to get very heavy if all weights are integrated) and comfort underwater. I don't really expect to have to take gear off to get out of entanglements and have not had to do it in 3500+ dives including many in low viz and around wrecks, nets and fishing line - but it is good to be prepared), but it also makes it easier to take off and replace underwater.

For 3 or 5 mm suit it is not an issue for me if all the weights are in the BC, although I guess strength and coordination makes a difference. In my experience a weight harnes is much more comfortable than a belt.