Be a fan of ScubaBoard.com

Welcome to ScubaBoard, an online scuba diving forum community where you can join over 205,000 divers from around the world discussing all things related to Scuba Diving. To gain full access to ScubaBoard (and make this large box go away) you must register for a free account. As a registered member you will be able to:

  • Participate in over 500 dive topic forums and browse from over 5,500,000 posts.
  • Communicate privately with other divers from around the world.
  • Post your own photos or view from well over 100,000 user submitted images.
  • Gain access to our free classifieds marketplace to buy, sell and trade gear, travel and services.
  • Use the calendar to organize your events and enroll in other members' events.
All this and much more is available to you absolutely free when you register for an account, so sign up today!

If you have any problems with the registration process or your account login, please contact the ScubaBoard Support Team.
View RSS Feed

Crowley

Crowley's Blog - The Business of Diving

Rating: 2 votes, 5.00 average.
by , February 13th, 2012 at 11:46 AM (1169 Views)
Something that rears is ugly head on an almost daily basis in the dive world - both on these forums and in real life, is the assumption that because people actually have to pay to go diving, every dive centre, instructor or LDS is out to fleece the customer for as much of their hard-earned cash as is possible.

One of the most stomach-churningly wince-inducingly nauseating things we hear, with alarming regularity, is "let's talk about a good price" or "I want to come diving with you, what discount do I get if I bring along my buddy" or "I have my own mask, how about you charge me half price on equipment rental". And of course, from time to time: "do you sell phone cards?"

My stock response to these kind of questions is "no, we don't sell phone cards, this is a dive centre", but when the question of discounts arises, I usually respond with "Go to McDonalds and order a Big Mac. Ask if they will give you a discount if you also purchase a Big Mac for your buddy and if you can bring me a printed till receipt with the evidence, then I will give you a discount on your dive"

My former Course Director had a more caustic reply which was: "As soon as I get a phone call from your employer in which you have agreed to work for 20% less wages, then I will give you a discount on your diving", but my all time favourite was from a former employer at a really tiny dive shop who - so frustrated with the question had he become - that when a potential customer asked for a discount, he took a rental BCD and unscrewed the inflator mechanism, removed the octopus from the regulator, opened a full tank and as it was hissing in the background, handed this equipment, together with a single fin and a broken mask to the customer who then asked "What the [heck] is this all about?" to which my boss replied: "well, you asked for a 25% discount, so I am giving you 25% less equipment!" True Story!

In my experience as both a customer and a professional diver, I do not feel that I have ever been ripped off, and certainly that has never been the philosophy anywhere I've worked - quite the opposite, in fact. I do appreciate that many divers are on a limited budget, but actually, so are most dive instructors, resorts and dive shops. The margins are often so thin that in some cases, if you're not careful, teaching a single-person Open Water course operates at a loss.

Look at what's involved in terms of overheads: You have to pay rent on your shop space. You have to pay the instructor, there are insurance costs involved and in certain locations, if you want to have an unpaid DM assisting, you have to pay for their insurance as well. If people stopped claiming for stupid whiplash injuries after gently tapping the bumper of their car against a signpost that the local council had failed to paint in fluorescent orange with an accompanying signpost pointing out that there was a signpost to beware of, then insurance costs would be much lower but sadly, they are not. There might be costs involved for professional dive medicals, work permit fees in foreign countries, agency renewal fees and for me personally, if I add up insurance, renewal and work permit costs, it rolls in at approximately one month's wages.

There are materials and training aids to be purchased, certification fees which are paid to the agency up-front and then re-sold to the customer, licenses to visit certain areas, monies to be paid to government agencies to ensure the men in black are not constantly snooping around, lightbulbs that need to be replaced, benches that need to be repaired, paperwork to be completed and pens to be bought - and customers keep stealing our pens! - computers, TVs, DVD players to be installed and maintained, all the stuff that any regular business has to contend with, and they don't always work so well if your dive centre is in a hot, tropical and above all sandy location.

You might have to pay for boat rental, or maintenance thereof, and with gasoline prices in Europe and America on a par with diamond-encrusted liquid platinum, boat rides themselves do not come cheaply. Air fills cost money for tank and compressor maintenance, and in high volume enterprises you might have to pay two or three people to do this, and nitrox fills for a small dive centre require a premium. Back in Thailand I could mix (accurately) 20 tanks per day on a three-whip mixing panel and ja, for sure I wanted to be paid for that, as did the medical supply people from whom we purchased our oxygen.

Unless you have gone to great expense to build your own training pool, then you have to pay somebody else to rent one, maybe provide food and drinks (water should be free, they all say!); who has to pay for the vehicle to transport all that stuff and the clients to the pool or jetty? And we haven't even started on the cost of purchasing, maintaining and replacing rental equipment which is used and abused by students, divers, (and occasionally instructors) alike. As an instructor or guide making - in my case - between 600 and 700 dives (or at least "immersions" if you don't want to count confined water training as a dive) per year, you have significant costs in replacing your own equipment which yes, we often get at "staff discount" prices (ah the irony!) but still costs a packet and the price of a regulator in Egpyt or Thailand or Mexico is pretty much the same as buying a regulator in Europe or America, but you can bet your bottom dollar that the dive staff are not at the top end of the pay scale.

On the subject of equipment purchases - there may actually be some room here for negotiation with your dive centre of choice, because equipment sales are often what keep the dive centres in business. The margins on courses and guided dives are rather thin, but mark-up on equipment sales can be anything from 20 - 100%, depending on local regulations and manufacturer recommended retail prices. It's unlikely you'll get a discount on a single mask purchase, however buying a full set of gear is likely to knock a few dollars of the total price. That's where some dive centres get a bit pushy, in my opinion, and try to force equipment sales onto students who have no idea if they actually need it or not, however a balanced approach to this can yield a positive outcome for both dive centre and diver alike and yes, there is a drive to push equipment sales and further education courses because otherwise you get a one-off customer who never needs to come back and well - the whole point of running a business is ensuring that your customers keep coming back, regardless of what profession you're in. McDonald's would not be such a huge multinational coorporation if everybody only ever bought one burger from them and then never returned, would it?

Building a relationship with your dive centre will help - for example, our customers automatically get a 10% repeat discount, we give them a superb service, they like us, and they come back and spend more money, so it works out rather well for everybody concerned.

Yes, sadly, there are cowboy operators out there, interested only in making a quick buck, so as I always say, shop around, talk to different outfits, get personal recommendations before you decide to invest your money in learning to dive, or that shiny new regulator you've been drooling over for the past year. That way, the businesses that shouldn't be there go out of business very very quickly, which is a good thing.

So, when somebody walks into a dive centre and automatically assumes they are being ripped off and want a discount, because - haha - the dive industry is all about - haha - Putting Another Dollar In - haha, not heard that before, and we refuse to make ourselves poorer just because they're bringing a whole extra person with them and the person says "fine, then I shall take my business elsewhere", rest assured, most of us really couldn't give a - ahem - flying fish - where they go, and it's entirely possible we'll telephone every other dive centre on the island (true story) to let them know in advance that the discount people are on their way to visit.

Don't get me wrong, diving may not be an inexpensive sport, but it is eminently possible to dive on a budget, and a good dive centre will be able to cater for exactly that, and will do so happily, without pushing and shoving you into something you don't want, and without the need for anybody to ask for a discount.

On the other hand, if you want really cheap diving, you can get that too - just let me know in advance where the funeral will be held. And if you bring a buddy along and they don't make it either, maybe I'll get a discount if I order two bunches of flowers...!

Safe diving (at a respectable price, of course!),

C.

Updated February 13th, 2012 at 05:32 PM by Crowley

Tags: None Add / Edit Tags
Categories
Uncategorized

Comments

  1. divebunnie's Avatar
    So true.
  2. Doubler's Avatar
    In any business there is equipment and places for that business to be purchased. As a customer of that business I shouldn't be expected to pay for all that equipment and storefront rental each and every time my shadow crosses your door. Believe what you want but dive shops do rip off people everyday. What is wrong with asking for a discount? You don't know if you don't ask. You even stated that your shop offers a 10 percent discount for repeat customers. So is that a 10 percent discount on two days of two tankers or a 10percent discount next year when I return? Don't know unless I ask. Many shops here offer a military discount which is not advertised you have to ask. Telling me "no" does not mean I walk it means I asked and was told your business model does not allow it. If I were to walk into your business dragging ten divers with me, wanting a week of two tankers, paid in advance but with the caveat you give us a ten percent discount you are really going to say "No" well I'm throwing to BS flag on that one. Business is business and in many cases the price of doing business is discounts. Diving and dive shops don't compare to McDonalds. Your blogs always entertain this one just hit a nerve.
  3. Crowley's Avatar
    At least I know people read them, Doubler! I don't expect everybody to agree and that's fine! :-)

    It's a 10% discount on a "second holiday", not two days' diving - remember I work at a high volume resort, so people don't come along for a day here or a day there, they come for a week or two weeks at a time, fly home, come back at a later date, and you would never need to ask, it's in the computer, automatically discounted and we always tell people when they check out.

    If somebody brought 10 divers with them and asked for a discount for the group, we would indeed say "no", however the person who organised the trip may get some money off - but we are a big high volume resort so it doesn't matter.

    My beef is not the application of discounts, it is the assumption people make that they are somehow automatically entitled to them just by turning up. Where appropriate, such as a reward for customer loyalty, then I have no problem with the concept, but believe me, it does get aggravating after a while.

    Thanks for the comment - and if you're ever passing by then I'll buy you a beer (100% discount!) to steady those jangling nerves!

    Cheers

    C.
  4. LaMissJude's Avatar
    Quote Originally Posted by Doubler
    As a customer of that business I shouldn't be expected to pay for all that equipment and storefront rental each and every time my shadow crosses your door. Believe what you want but dive shops do rip off people everyday. What is wrong with asking for a discount?
    Believe it or not, many dive shop don't rip off people every day!
    Why you shouldn't be expected to pay the full price the first time your enter a dive shop? or any other shop? there is a logic there I don't understand...

    There is nothing wrong to ask for a discount, it's your right. But there is also nothing wrong with the answer "no", specially for 2 days diving for 2 persons, who have never been is the dive center where they asked for a discount.

    That said, depending of the place and the country, some places give happily discount on prebooked and prepaid packages, even if you never been there.