Help me makeup my mind. Zeagle express techdeluxe vs nighthawk vs mares Hybrid

[highflier]

Sorry for the long long post

I have read so much on this my head is ready to explode, The LDS have not been able to show me a express tech or any BP/W for that matter.

This BC will NOT be used for travel,
This BC WILL be used 100% in warm water. tshirt to 3mm wetsuite. Nothing more
It will be my first BC and maybe my last.

I hate weight belts so integrating the weights is a must.
I have a bad shoulder so I will need to have shoulder harness quick release clips
I will be boat diving off my personal boat, This means that I will remove my BC and tie it off to boat before boarding the boat.

I want this bc to grow with me. My dives will start off being shallow reef dives in 80 degree water and grow to wreck, and hunting dives.

My WU needs a BC also, She likes both the mares and the scubapro, has no idea of that to think about the express tech or another BP/W.

Does it make sense to get the same model so we are familar with the maintence etc...


If I got the Zeagle express tech, it would be the deluxe, shoulder pads, zip touch, 30# donut bladder. ( I don't like the idea of a horse shoe bladder)

FWIW our regs will be set up with a primary on a long hose and a necklace for the octo.

Cost is a concern, but the wrong BC will obviously cost me more.

In my limited diving I feel that my Bouyency control is pretty good, My WU has struggled but I think that is partially due to lack of weight, Often had to struggle to stay down especially near end of tank.

Other recommendations are OK.. No jacket style ones though.


I have read so much and can see so little, I feel like just saying f&*^-it and just buying something cheap and used.

Highflier

PS. A BP/W would be OK for me also.... just can not see, touch or feel it so I am not sure what to even think of it.

[RTee]

I can only talk about the Express tech (and the basic model). I purchased mine (30 lbs donut bladder) two years ago and purchased one for my GF (35 lbs horseshoe bladder) last summer, both from Zeagle Express based in Florida. Right off the bat, I also purchased four D rings and keepers for both system as well as a crotch strap. Later on, I added a front pouch on each, dead center on the waist belt with the attachment buckle offset to the right.

In terms of weight integration, I use the ripcord system on mine while my GF opted for the zip touch. We used ours both locally in Cold water with thick thermal protection/drysuits as well as travel system when we go warm diving. I transfered the shoulder pads I initially purchased for my doubles to my GF BP. We are both very happy with our BP system.

[evad]

What's a WU?

[beaverdivers]

Both the KnightHawk & LadyHawk for your wife ( WU? ) are excellent choices w/ balanced auto-inflators.

PM, me for a quote. We have a Jan. sale going. Please include sizes for both you & your wife.

[highflier]

WU = Wife unit

Wife Unit = Dive Buddy

Dive Buddy = DB


therefore we can conclude WU=DB

Highflier

[highflier]

I can only talk about the Express tech (and the basic model). I purchased mine (30 lbs donut bladder) two years ago and purchased one for my GF (35 lbs horseshoe bladder) last summer, both from Zeagle Express based in Florida. Right off the bat, I also purchased four D rings and keepers for both system as well as a crotch strap. Later on, I added a front pouch on each, dead center on the waist belt with the attachment buckle offset to the right.

In terms of weight integration, I use the ripcord system on mine while my GF opted for the zip touch. We used ours both locally in Cold water with thick thermal protection/drysuits as well as travel system when we go warm diving. I transfered the shoulder pads I initially purchased for my doubles to my GF BP. We are both very happy with our BP system.

Few question for you.

Which weight system do you think would better for removinng weights and setting on a swim deck before boarding the a small boat?

Do you like the donut bladder better then the Horse shoe one? The rear dump is on the right hip correct?

Highflier

[evad]

Wife Unit= RW or SW?

[Jim Lapenta]

You do not want the rip cord for removing weights and putting them on the deck. Cause when you pull the cord you'll have to follow the weights to the bottom to grab them. Zip touch better option and IMO a weight belt is still the best one with this BC. There has to be a shop in the keys that has an Express Tech in stock for you to look at. You'll see that the way it adjusts there is no need for a quick release of an ykind since once you undo the buckle the straps move freely. Adding shoulder pads is also unnecessary. I dive mine in the pool and OW with no shirt and have zero issues with rubbing. Diving from your own boat means that you want to be able to get in and out quickly and easily. The Basic Express Tech accommodates that just fine. I'll post another link to my review of the BC and how I set mine up.
Zeagle Express Tech Buoyancy Compensator Review

With no inherent buoyancy they way it comes you will not be needing much weight. I put 3lbs in each camband pouch and with a 3 mil 4 on the belt in freshwater with an al80. I'm 5'7" 160 or so. With a steel tank like a 72 I use none on the belt. And with a steel 95 no extra weight at all. In saltwater I'd then have to add roughly 6lbs or so. That is easy to carry on a belt set up with individual pockets like the one XS Scuba sells. I added my own to a basic weight belt and can dump the front two easily if need be by just unvelcroing and pulling the weights out. Usually though I use these pockets when teaching to carry a few extra pounds should it be needed by a student.

The Express tech has rear dumps on both sides. I switched out the 24 lb bladder for a 35 since I seem to be using those steel 95's the most for singles dives.

And maybe it's just me but I have no issues with a horseshoe or donut bladder and I have both on my plate and wing set ups of which I now have three. And for what you are going to spend outfitting the Express Tech even with the ziptouch weights you can put you and your wife in one for less than $700 and that's if you really trick them out.

I have a local dealer that I work with and he put a friend in an Express Tech with the bigger bladder, d rings, zip touch weights, and crotch strap for under 350. Zeagle dealers are not restricted from making great deals. I'd offer to hook you up but frankly the distance makes it tough to work out. Especially with a newer diver since I'd like to actually put you in the pool with one. Closer to you is Capt Gene from here on the board at Zeagle Express. I have dealt with him and he is close enough if you are in the Keys that it would be worth it for you to take a weekend road trip. He will not steer you wrong or try to oversell you.

The other two BCs recommended to you in this thread would run you over 600 each going by Leisure Pro's prices and compared to the Express Tech they are semi trucks with all the extra padding(that will require you to carry more weight) whereas the Express Tech is a Ferrari with no unnecessary junk and very streamlined.

So for 700 you could get two fully customized and customizable BC's (with the zip touch system and I'd guess take 100 off of that if you go with belts) that are modular and allow you to adapt and fit you and your missus perfectly every time. Or for 600+ you can buy ONE BC that will require extra lead, is not customizable, and hope that it fits you since now you are trying to fit a mfg idea of what size you are.

[highflier]

Jim,
Thanks for the long reply,

I have visited all the shops near me, I am not in the keys right this second, I hope to use the gear not order it next time I am there.

Ziptouch is what I thought I needed, thanks for confirming.

The local guy offered us the ladyhawk for $425, Seems like a real deal, It was last years model (I.E. Blue not pink) but new in box.

I would need the deluxe version of the ET as I have a bad shoulder. Without a doubt I want to be able to unclip from the rig. Else I would seriously look at the standard. My right shoulder hurts just putting on my winter coat (Ohhh I said the naughty "w" word)

I know the horseshoe bladders had 2 rear dumps but the image I saw on the 30# donut only had one, besides the inflator that is. I could not tell which side it was on. I was asking because of that darn shoulder thing again.

I wanted the 30# not for the extra lift but just seems like it would be better at avoiding trapping gas in it. I suspect with the horseshoe you must pull the correct or both rear dumps in some cases.



Highflier

FWIW The mares seems a tad nicer, but have not seen good deals on it. I would not say it was 200.00 nicer. Also looked a oceanic with the I7 system. Just a little leary of how long before it has a failure, We are buying for the long long haul, 10-20 years.

[RTee]

Highflier,

a picture is worth a thousand words...how about two or three:

Ripcord: (30 lbs total capacity) Notice that each pouch as a zipper running on top. With the zipper closed, the tab is by the BP on each side
31.jpg

Zip Touch: (20 lbs total capacity. each pouch also has a zipper running along its side. In the closed position, the tab is by the BP on each side

288.jpg

Mesh Weight Pouch: What I use inside each pocket to store the weight . Notice the strap at the front.

563.jpg

Therefore, I will put the amount of weight I require in the pouch(es) and then insert each pouch in its respective pocket using the Zipper function of each pocket. If you look at the pouch and the pocket (Ripcord), you will see they have similar shape and this is how I insert them in. That way, the strap of the pouch is forward and fold back on top of the pouch. If I wanted to remove weight before climbing the ladder, I would use the top zipper function and not the red handle (red is for emergency and in this case by pulling on it would ditch all weights contained in both pouches through gravity) . Sequence would be to adopt vertical position in the water or on the ladder, unzip one pocket, grab strap of pouch, pull and lift and hand the pouch to boat staff or simply put it on the stern platform and then repeat process for the second one.

Zippouch: Very same process for normal usage. For emergency release, Zippouch allow you to selectively ditch weight (only one side at a time) rapidly by pulling on the respective red handle to open the bottom portion of the respective pocket to release the weight pouch through gravity.

Gravity...if you happen to be head down, both system will open the bottom portion of the pocket(s) but until you revert to a somewhat more head up position, the weight pouch(es) will remain inside the pocket(s) unless you use your hand to squeeze each one out (like you do with toothpaste) .

If you do not want to buy the pouch and WU is somewhat handy with a sewing machine, go to a Fabric store (Fabricland in Canada), buy heavy nylon material and make your own pouch either using velcro or a plastic zipper with applicable hand strap). Once it is built, you take a red hot needle and burn numerous pin size holes through the pouch. This will help to get the air out when you go in the water as well as drain the water out when coming out. Very easy to do.

Donut vs Horseshoe. Very personal and like Jim, I can dive comfortably using both systems. In fact I have a 65lbs lift Zeagle horseshoe bladder on my SS BP for my doubles. Normally, Donut system will have one rear dump valve (left lower side for mine) while a horseshoe system will have two...one on each side. For diving, each system is equally effective if you are properly trimmed in the horizontal plane. Vertically (head up) you use the deflator button of your vest. Head down, burp some air out one side at a time, or just burp some air out on one side, adopt horizontal trimmed position so the air can equalize on both sides and just keep diving.

Hope this helps