Madison Blue closed to cavern divers

[ktomlinson]

I'm curious to know the opinion of the group here about this recent development. Since getting my cavern certification last year I have dove Madison Blue around half a dozen times. When I finished my course my instructor even said it was a great cavern. On a recent dive trip I met a guy that told me he was denied entry to Madison recently because he was just cavern certified. I figured it must have been a misunderstanding. After looking into it, I think the rule has recently been changed. On the Florida Parks Madison Blue website, there is now a specific " no cavern diving" rule. I am sure that this rule was not there in October 2010 because I checked the page before driving down for a cavern dive. At that time the rule was just "no open water diving" and "stay within your limits". I was thinking about finding out if there were committees or appointees that set these rules and appealing to them to change the rule back, but first I'd like to ask more experienced divers for their opinion. Other than the obvious benefit to the cave environment that lowering the number of divers and raising the level of diver has, are there other reasons that a cavern diver shouldn't be able to dive within their limits at Madison Blue?

[ucfdiver]

There has been a rule that cavern divers cannot dive the system without a cave diver for at least the last 3-4 years. The enforcement has been confusing, to say the least.

[ktomlinson]

That's interesting to me, being that two different rangers let me in multiple times and even came over to the truck and had friendly chats with me. If you search for Madison blue on scubaboard you actually get a post listing the best cavern dives, and multiple people list it as one of their favorites. Ucfdiver, would you be in favor of allowing cavern diving there?

[ucfdiver]

Ucfdiver, would you be in favor of allowing cavern diving there?

I don't think there should be a cavern diver certification at all...IMO it should be intro and full (or c1/c2), so I'm a bad person to ask.

[FireInMyBones]

I don't think there should be a cavern diver certification at all...IMO it should be intro and full (or c1/c2), so I'm a bad person to ask.

After further study, I agree. I took Cavern in April of 2010 as it was recommended as a precursor to my DM training ( I am not sure why). It got me hooked. Now I am just waiting on the money to take all the classes I need to get where I want to go.

[ktomlinson]

More than likely I will take an intro class. Do many cavern divers push their limits or does the training do what it's supposed to and make divers aware of the dangers of cave diving? Or do you feel that cavern certs don't prepare divers adequately?

[ucfdiver]

More than likely I will take an intro class. Do many cavern divers push their limits or does the training do what it's supposed to and make divers aware of the dangers of cave diving? Or do you feel that cavern certs don't prepare divers adequately?

I don't understand how we can tell divers that a cavern can easily become a cave, then turn around and tell them not to go into caves because they're not ready.

That being said, cavern divers that I've been around tend to stick to their limits better than any other current training level. I suppose because they have fewer dives in the environment, the temptation to break rules hasn't built up yet.

[FireInMyBones]

I don't understand how we can tell divers that a cavern can easily become a cave, then turn around and tell them not to go into caves because they're not ready.

Good Point.

That being said, cavern divers that I've been around tend to stick to their limits better than any other current training level. I suppose because they have fewer dives in the environment, the temptation to break rules hasn't built up yet.

I would love to go in further. I only have two cavern dives out side of my Cavern training. I will not go beyond my training because I have a wife at home waiting for me to return.

[ktomlinson]

I see what you are saying. You are in favor of higher standards. It's hard to argue with higher standards really... But saying that, in my cavern class it was stressed that I should constantly be aware that a cavern can become a cave for a variety of reasons (swimmers, other divers, weather, etc.) and that I should stick to regularly visited, high flow, low silt potential caverns. So the agencies that have cavern certs at least agree that the risks are mitigated through the cavern course.

[Crush]

That being said, cavern divers that I've been around tend to stick to their limits better than any other current training level. I suppose because they have fewer dives in the environment, the temptation to break rules hasn't built up yet.

Prior to taking Cavern I did poke my head into some overhead environments, though I rarely ventured more than 30 ft beyond the grim reaper sign - I didn't know what I didn't know. After taking Cavern I don't go past those signs - I now know at least a little of what I don't know.