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Iguana Don

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Open letter to all members,

Does anybody see a pattern forming with the questions being asked here? I think we are seeing what I mentioned some months back as "Dive Mills". Turning out divers for the sake of a buck, just getting them through the course, collect the money and on to the next, without even caring if the student can dive or not. It is really great that they can have a place to turn to ask these questions. The sport is being taken way too lightly.

I must have been one of the fortunate ones, as I learned quite a bit in my O/W class & it prepared me for things to come. I had a very competent instructor & to this day we still dive together, and he even takes notes on my progress.

To all of the instructors & DMs here:
From the communications I have had with you, I feel you are all in the same catagory as above and would not hesitate one minute diving with any of you, even without having ever dove with or met you in person. And I feel that you all are a great bunch. All students should have the luxury of taking their classes from you. (No I'm not stroking you all, just the facts)

My question is: Where are these crappy instructors & how do we rid the sport of them? They do nothing except give the sport a black eye & open it up to critisim. And one day "Big Brother" WILL step in, if we fail to regulate it ourselves.

This board should be required reading for ALL O/W students or anybody even thinking about diving.

Thanks

Don
 
I agree completely that some instructors arent as good as they should be and send out divers who arent really qualified to dive HOWEVER you cant brand then all with the same brush.
When I did my O/W with PADI I had a very good instructor - it was the actually organisation that wasnt up to scratch. My videos were watched either with other people training for their DiveMaster around me laughing and joking, or in the reception of the nearest hotel.
I would by no means say I was a very experienced diver (and I am new to the board) but I do know that it isnt all down to the instructors - some are pressured into getting as many O/W courses complete to move on to the next "vicims".

-x-abby-x-

 
Originally posted by ScubaBaby

but I do know that it isnt all down to the instructors - some are pressured into getting as many O/W courses complete to move on to the next "vicims".

-x-abby-x-

To the pressured comment I say although the instuctor may be pressured they still have the final choice to pass or fail a student. They also have the choice to not remain with the facility that is pressuring them (be it the dive shop, training agency, or whatever). The risk of life is not worth farming students through.

Jennifer
 
I agree there is a problem with the quality of instructors in the dive industry. However...

1. On how widespread a problem we have, I think it is bigger that realized by many. It seems most folks think there are isolated cases of instructor incompetence. I believe the majority of instructors are incompetent. I believe most are clueless on teaching techniques and most teach inadequate standards.

2. I do not believe there is anything that can be done about the problem. While there are exceptions, many agencies are interested in numbers and not in quality. The philosophy of some agencies encourages instructors to push 'em through quickly and pass everyone.

It's a problem I combat in a small way by boycotting agencies which have inadequate OW standards (by my defination) and by teaching comprehensive classes on all levels.

Too many people pass the buck saying, "it's the instructor, not the agency," when in most cases it's blame shared by both the agency and the instructor. The Instructor because the incompetent instructor doesn't know any better. He's gone up the ladder in that agency's program and honestly believes the propaganda he's been fed.

Walter
 
What is important? I recently attended a Risk Management Seminar from a major diving agency. Aviation is my business and "risk management" implies how to stop accidents from happening and increase the safety margins. The seminar was only about how to have your paperwork correct so the defense team can win the lawsuit filed by the dead diver's family.

I understand we are in a litigation happy society but have numbers and profits outweighed quality? I have had some fantastic instructors who are technically very proficient. I have also encountered many others who can only parrot the diving agencies scripts and are just not that good.

Sorry if the newbie has irritated anyone.

Dave
 
Jennifer

I completely hear what you are saying and agree to a certain degree but at the end of the day - an instuctor doesnt just work cause they enjoy it but because they need to make the money to live! If they were to quit every place they felt wasnt sufficient enough with their O/W courses then they'd be quiting probably about 75% of the centres or training agencies.
If all instuctors were to group together and say no were not standing for it - then there would be a change, but in realiy everything is in numbers and it just isnt going to happen.

If you look at it, they were trained by someone who was trained by someone etc etc etc and it ends up going back and back and the blame lies on probably one or two individuals who decided not to teach instructors the morals associated with diving.

HOWEVER - i also feel this subject isnt a major issue. There are some divers who are O/W trained and they were trained to the best of any instructors tutition but they just arent very successful divers. At the end of the day - its down to each instructors discression to decide whether or not they should pass a diver on the O/W course.

If they have any sense they will fail them if they arent good enough - after all, if all instructors didnt care and passed every1 then we'd all be diving with people who couldnt dive to save theres (let alone your) life - which includes the instructors that taught them in the 1st lace!!!!

-x-abby-x-
 
-x-abby-x-,
With all due respect, this IS becoming a major issue. All one needs to do is to read the letters in Ragdales. To know that people are entering the water, unqualified, at an alarming rate. If these letters are from the people who write in, just think about the numbers that don't write in. I can speak from what I have personally seen.
I'm not saying ALL instructors, but I have seen the horror stories, and read about them in this forum.
All done for the sake of a $.
I've known instructors (2) that were on Prozac. Seen one certified that couldn't read or add, subtract, multiply and divide. Saw a young man certified as a DM that couldn't make the 60' deep dive. 20 of his 60 dives were setting the dive flag at the lake.
There ARE good instructors out there, a student needs to find them though. Too bad all new students can't find this forum "Before You Dive". Maybe it needs to be changed to "Before You Dive or Enroll"
I feel Walter is right, nothing can be done about the bad instructors, maybe in time word will get around and they won't have anymore students. But the GOOD ones will always be around, just harder to find.

Everybody should know

Don
 
Don

I can see that it is a problem and is becoming worse. I guess I can only judge from what I have seen and what I have seen hasn't been to awful.
If it carries on the way it is then it will get to be a very unsafe sport where you can only dive with people you know and know have been trained properly. I am looking to do a Live-a-board in April in the Maldives next year and I would not be happy diving with someone I hadn't dived with before just for the fact that you don't know how much you can relie on them to be there if anything does go wrong.
I am mainly judging instructors from that I know at Emperor Divers in Hurgurda as that is where my boyfriend worked. And Emperor Divers was very very strict on the divers it employed - I guess thats the kind of diving centres we need around.
As I said before, results are only ever in numbers, and its not something thats easy to correct. People are all money hungry and thats what they want.
It doesnt help that instuctors get commission for getting more people through courses and selling them the companies products. Thats where one major problem lies - especially if the instructor is money hungry!

At the end of the day - I have only been diving for 2 years now (expect for trydives) so I havent had much experience with instructors - I am only Rescue Diver with PADI. This board is just good for all divers - new and old, and gives everyone the opportunity to air their views.

I'm only 17 so I haven't seen many instuctors so I judge from what I have seen.

From the sound of this thread though - there are still many good instuctors - as they are contributing and showing their concern - that has to be a good sign!

-x-abby-x-
 
-x-abby-x-,
Be proud of your certification level, there's nothing wrong with being "only" a rescue diver. you have taken great strides in your diver education.

Take time and put to use what you have learned before going any further. If you decide to go further talk to the people on this board, listen to what they have to say, and then develope your style from what you have learned.

IMHO this is one of the best teaching tools in the industry.
Jennnifer & Dee can help you decide on which direction to take, they are two of the sharpest people around.
Just my .02, damn I'm almost broke.

Ya need to know

Don

BTW-Garlic necklaces are $2.49 ea. or 2 for $5.00



 
Greetings,:)

I have decided to alert the five star hotel of the diveshop that rents space, and offers their customers certification at the pool area.After my second trip to FLA to finish my checkouts, I listened to my DM on the boatride out to the reef tell his latest dive exp. Himself and the other DM went to a certain hotel in the Bahamas over the weekend and jumped into a tank that was on display;and swam with the marine life. I of course was shocked, and asked him "What if you got caught;What was in there? He replied"It was the most awesome dive of my life, we were swimming with Bulls,Hammerheads,etc... and the tourists facial gestures were hysterical" I asked again about getting thrown in jail etc... and his reply"You only live once, its a once and a lifetime experience" Myself and the other divers just looked at each other incredulously. "So I get to dive with James Bond" were my thoughts, as well as others.Having a career background in Psych counseling I found him obviously an adrenaline junkie,as well as a fool.But,I had come this far, and I was sick of weather dependency issues,the quoted certification fee that escalated for lame reasons(NO, I did not sign any $ agreement) I was fed up!!!!

In every industry Aviation, Car manufacturing, MONEY!!!MONEY!!!MONEY!!! The horror stories my old beau, an Aviation Mechanic has told me- Pressures of getting unfit planes up, etc... Nothing surprises me!!!!!
Pam
 
https://www.shearwater.com/products/perdix-ai/

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