Diving and spider veins?

[asaara]

After I was diving a few months ago, I noticed some red marks near one of my ankles that I thought might have been a reaction to something that could have been floating around in the water. After they didn't go away for a couple months, one of my friends said (when we were sitting around complaining about our bodies) welcome to old age, I'm just getting spider veins...ugh. Can diving cause them, or is it more likely that (coming from a cold country) I had them for a while and just never noticed until I went diving and wasn't in long pants all the time?

[TSandM]

In the absence of anything significantly constricting or binding, there is nothing about diving that should change the pressure gradient across vessel walls, and therefore, nothing that should create petechiae (small bleeding areas around capillaries) or varicosities (enlarged, tortuous veins).

[pescador775]

Asaara, the weightlessness of diving should decrease congestion in the legs, not increase it. The condition is probably harmless except when it is reflective of some general problem which, for example, could lead to stroke (cerebral hemorrhage) or to pblebitis(sp). People laugh off hemorrhoids and other common afflictions but I'm not so sure. I'll pass along the same advice which I gave to the nose bleed woman; try taking bilberry extract to strengthen the blood vessels. It works in some cases, especially where there is a hereditary component. If there are varicose veins and poor circulation it might be wise to take aspirin, daily. The "scuba doc" and others seem to believe aspirin could exacerbate bends because it could cause excess bleeding in areas which have been bruised in the wake of bubble expansion. I believe this is incorrect except in cases which would have had a fatal outcome irrespective of treatment. My opinion is that suppression of clotting is beneficial on balance in some individuals. This addresses the increased clotting in sluggish veins and as seen in some cases of bends without resorting to powerful drugs. Your case sounds mild but should be mentioned at the next checkup. I think you will agree.

[TSandM]

I am unable to find any data supporting the idea that bilberry extract "strengthens blood vessels", other than a couple of in vitro studies of vasorelaxation in porcine coronary arteries.

Spider veins, or superficial varicosities, are not a manifestation of deep venous incompetence and are not associated with a risk of deep thrombophlebitis or any other significant health threat.

Regarding the use of aspirin, some people have theorized that inhibiting platelet aggregation might attenuate the symptoms of DCS. On the other hand, aspirin in experimental animals appeared to exacerbate hemorrhage in central nervous system lesions. This article on the DAN website briefly discusses this and states that aspirin is NOT being recommended for DCS prophylaxis, although there is a study underway in Australia to more formally evaluate the effects.

Aspirin is prescribed to prevent atherothrombotic and embolic events related to ARTERIAL disease. It is not prescribed for venous stasis, which is primarily a hydrostatic phenomenon.

[DocVikingo]

Hi TSandM,

I see that bilberry extract is the naturopathy du jour. And here I thought that a combination of Japanese pagoda tree, horse chestnut, butcher's broom, grape seed, and vit K1 was the magic potion (http://www.venarin.com/spider-veins-...nt-venarin.htm) preferred by dermatologists, cosmetic surgeons and vascular specialists round the globe ; )

Regards,

DocVikingo

[DocVikingo]

Hi asaara,

Many factors increase a person's chances of developing spider veins (telangiectasia), including advancing age; a family history of vein problems; obesity, leg injury, prolonged standing and other things that weaken vein valves; sun damage; and, hormonal changes. They are associated with estrogen, which likely is why they're much more common in females. They tend to develop when estrogen levels are elevated, such as when pregnant, taking oral contraceptives and on estrogen replacement.

It is very unlikely that anything directly related to scuba either causes or makes them worse, and certainly not the transient and relatively infrequent pressure changes inherent in diving. In fact, veins most often dilate and become varicose as a result of increased downward pressure on the vein from a point above it. Scuba would be expected to decrease rather than produce such pressure.

While they can be unsightly, spider veins usually are not harmful or painful and do not need medical treatment. But, in some cases they may cause discomfort, become excessively dense or bleed, and if so evaluation should be sought.

Helpful?

This is educational only and does not constitute or imply a doctor-patient relationship. It is not medical advice to you or any other individual, and should not be construed as such.

Regards,

DocVikingo

[asaara]

It is very unlikely that anything directly related to scuba either causes or makes them worse, and certainly not the transient and relatively infrequent pressure changes inherent in diving. In fact, veins most often dilate and become varicose as a result of increased downward pressure on the vein from a point above it. Scuba would be expected to decrease rather than produce such pressure.

So basically, dive more and age gracefully?

[DocVikingo]

Bravo ; )

Regards,

DocVikingo

[pescador775]

Bilberry extract and grapeseed extract along with lutein are positively known to ameliorate or forestall certain types of macular degeneration as well as other conditions. In the case of the active polyphenols and proanthrocyanadins in berries (Bilberry,etc), this effect is attributed to the reinforcement of the small capillaries in the retina. This information (macular degeneration) has been reported in peer reviewed medical journals as recently as 5 years ago(grapeseed) and 6 months ago (lutein). I have recommended bilberry to several people with a problem of brittle blood vessels whereby the hands suffer swelling and bruising following the lifting or gripping of a heavy object. They were "easy bruisers". Complete relief from this condition was the result. As to the gentleman's alleged vascular problem I agree as to what has been said although I fear my recommendation of aspirin has been misunderstood. I stand by it without further explanation. As to the "varicosities" I suppose it is possible that the man could have cutaneous small vessel vasculitis. If that were the case it is possible that an adverse drug interaction or autoimmune disease could be the cause. However, I don't see a diving related problem per se.