On Jet Fins and Frog Kicks

[theatis]

After trying and failing to do frog kicks well, i decided to do two things: 1) ask for advice in learning how to do them better, 2) consider using the fins that most here seem to think are the most appropriate tool for that particular task.

So, can someone explain to me in terms of mechanics what i should be doing? I know that without watching me it's impossible to tell me what I'm doing wrong, but i'd like to know some general guidelines to doing it correctly (word chosen carefully!). Most people try to explain it in terms of what it should like rather than in terms of mechanics which is what i'm looking for.

The second part is that i figured that Jets are cheap enough that i can try them and see whether they help me improve on this and if i don't like them i'll just ebay them. Right now i use Mares Volo Powers (Size Regular) which are generally OK but according to many here not particularly suited for frog kicks.

I'm looking for size recommendations on the Jets. I found kidspot's website after searching here and this is what i got by comparing the foot pockets of the Volos (which fit me perfectly) and my boots (Mares Avanti size 9, they also fit me perfectly so i don't want to change them), let me know what you think:

..................................Inches..........Recommended JF Size (according to kidspot's table)

Boot width.....................4 1/4
Boot inserted length........8 7/8
Boot length...................11 1/2
Pocket depth.................9................XXL
Pocket base width..........4................Betweem XL and XXL
Pocket height................3................XL

I included the boot measurement just for reference. So, apparently the Jet pocket that most resembles the Volo pocket is a combination of XL and XXL! Which one makes most sense for me?

 

[King Kong Matt]

So, can someone explain to me in terms of mechanics what i should be doing? I know that without watching me it's impossible to tell me what I'm doing wrong, but i'd like to know some general guidelines to doing it correctly (word chosen carefully!). Most people try to explain it in terms of what it should like rather than in terms of mechanics which is what i'm looking for.

Maybe take a look at this video and try to compare...

http://www.divetekadventures.com/Videos/Videofrogkick1.htm

There are some other frogkick videos available on that site as well:

http://www.divetekadventures.com/Images.htm

Hope that helps!

 

[ABQdiver]

Check out Thumpers site for all the kicks on video. Might help you out.

FWIW, I use the XL Jets with wetsuit booties and I wear a 11.5 shoe. With my Bare drysuit (bigger, built in boot) I had to go with a Turtle. I've seen the XXL Jets, and those foot pockets are HUGE!!

 

[redacted]

I wear a 9.5 wide shoe. Real high arch. I tried XL jets and they were a little floppy with 3mm booties. Large jets fit fine with the 3mm booties and just a little snug with 5mm booties. Work fine, just a little hard to get off. The jets work OK but I don't really find much difference between them and my USD Blades that I converted to split fins.

 

[BabyDuck]

you're kinda trying to clap the bottoms of your feet together without moving your legs above the knees...it's all in the ankle!

 

[theatis]

Thanks for all the advice so far. I failed to mention that the booties are 5mm.

 

[TSandM]

I don't know what the fins you are using are like, but I took Fundies in a set of Razors. They were not split fins, but they were long and somewhat flexible. On video review the first night, you could clearly see one of my problems -- the fins were so floppy that they weren't getting a good "bite" on the water, and they weren't giving me the proprioceptive feedback I needed to get the kick figured out. I bought Jets that night, and the next day, got in the water and frog kicked. It was that simple.

You can help yourself a lot by practicing this out of the water. Lie on your stomach with your knees bent and your feet together. Move the feet apart, then rotate your ankle and bring the soles of your feet together. That's the motion of the frog kick.

 

[theatis]

Thanks TSandM. The Volos are floppy by design; as you can see in the picture there is a hole and a hinge on each side that are supposed to allow the blade to pivot more freely. I can't compare them to the (very funny looking) Razors but my guess is that they are equally, if not more, flexible.

I downloaded all the videos from the website that ABQdiver mentioned and it's immediately apparent from the motion of the diver that the thrust generated is a result of the fins' rigidity.

What you describe is exactly what i feel is lacking; feedback of how my body is moving and how i can adjust to make it work. Thanks for the tip, i'll give it a shot. I hope my GF doesn't walk in while i'm on the floor flailing about for no good reason.

 

[shark.byte.usa]

I hope my GF doesn't walk in while i'm on the floor flailing about for no good reason.

:lol: :rofl2:

 

[onfloat]

I hope my GF doesn't walk in while i'm on the floor flailing about for no good reason.

My wife once walked in while I was practicing my back kick on the back of the couch with my fins on.

You might go to this web site and order the intro to tech DVD. It breaks down the kicks with some narration. Even if you don't plan on getting into tech diving.

http://www.customflix.com/Store/ShowEStore.jsp?rtnPt=0&id=209712&isPreview=true