Full Face Mask Advice.

[RJ805]

I'm looking to buy a Full Face Mask in the near future. I am looking at the O. T. S. Guardian. Or the Ocean Reef Neptune Space Raptor.

Does anyone have any thoughts on these two? Meaning dived them both in real world situations and can give a good comparison.

Thank you for all the help.

Cheers.

Rich

[Allen Herron]

I can compare the Gaurdian to an AGA. I dive both thanks my aquarium experience. My personal choice is AGA, it seams to breath a little easier but if your face is narrow the Gaurdian will fit better. I would also compare the cost of service on the regs. My AGA costs a small fortune to service. I have made about 400 dives in FFM and I love them. No fog, no snot, no dry mouth, better vision, and atleast in theory, safer if you have a Heart Attack or seasure since you won't lose your reg.

[Akimbo]

Tell us more about your objectives. Communications, cold water, contaminated water, added safety in a blackout, deep air or Trimix, rebreathers? Nothing is free and there are no perfect solutions to anything. Have you considered the trade-offs such as breathing down your supply on long surface swims, vomiting in the mask, switching to alternative air sources (expensive switching blocks), proprietary regulator repair issues, and second stage failure?

Have you looked at the Kirby-Morgan SuperMask and EXO-BR? The EXO has spectacular regulator performance and the SuperMask allows rapid regulator removal. Also, a much less expensive option that may suit your needs, has been around for 50 years, and allows you to use your own regulator is the Cressi Full Face Rubber Mask.

For rebreathers, definitely look at the Dräger

Edit: I forgot to mention dead air space. CO2 buildup is an issue, especially for shallow breathers. You really need to develop a habit of deep slow breathing on a FFM or commercial hat with an oral-nasal. Of course, the Cressi FFM does not have this issue.

[SolarStorm]

I will second the SuperMask from Kirby-Morgan. My kids say it makes me look like DarthVader.

[RJ805]

Thank you all for your replies. The main reason is TMJ. The mouth piece is just to much for the jaw clamp issue. Causes a world of Anxiety issues once it kicks up. As for for Tech stuff. Would use it in the TV/Film industries and photog. As for chucking in the mask, yes I have thought about that. The tech at a local store mentioned the use of air with such a mask. The OTS has a valve near the top that allows for surface breathing and if I understood right, also for swimming to locations. The valve automaticlly shuts with you go under. The OST reg can be removed somewhat easily as well. Not so sure of the Ocean Reef. Mainly because I have not seen one. I understand that the OTS is more widely used, therefor parts and repairs are much better. And its made if the US, whereas the Ocean Reef is an Italian product shipped here. (not real sure on that one though). As for the Kirby-Morgan I have seen it. Not moved one way or another. The EXO-BR is for my use to much. But a very cool unit.

Thanks again and I look forward to discussing this more.

Cheers.

Rich

[MSltr]

I can only comment on the Ocean Reef Neptune Space. Fortunately, my son won it during a scuba treasure hunt at Athens (TX) SCUBA Park; consequently, he didn't have much of a selection. It is mine in the short term since he is the Navy dive program. Interestingly, the OTS mask is the issue FFM used by Navy. Having said all that, Ocean Reef has several different models. The Neptune Space comes with an integrated manual surface air valve. Two things that I find attractive are the quick disconnect at the 2nd stage and the optical inserts. Beside the convenience of the quick disconnect for removing the mask, it also allows him to keep his mask on during an OOA. Using the same type quick disconnect hose on my octo allows me to disconnect the 2d stage and give him the hose to replace on his mask second stage inlet. The drawback is the closest dealer is two hours away on the turnpike for annual service.

[manni-yunk]

About a year ago - I know I wanted a FFM and look at everything out there. I narrowed it down to the AGA, Guardian, and Ocean reef nepture. I liked the AGA, but didnt like the need for a quick disconnect on the host and I didnt like the way the regulater faces. As for ease of breathing - I would contend that no one can truely tell the difference between an AGA and Guardian. The difference is so small if under identical conditions and same first stages - that it is irrelevant. My reasons were similar to those posted - jaw fatigue, communications for safety, theory of "what if" you pass out, also - cold diving - etc

Guardian fit better than AGA and the market seemed/seems to be going more toward the newer guardian. So - I eliminated the AGA.

Then I went to BTS last year and spent an hour talking to the OR Neptune sales guy. He was very knowledgeable and had a few sales pitchy angles - like the old guardian recalls and the "scratch proof" visor on the neptune. I played with the nepture but it just felt like a toy.

If you hold the Guardian in one hand - then the nepture...it really fells like a tool VS a toy. The Guardian feels better made, sturdier, and overall more durable to heavy use.


I bought 2 guardians that day and havent looked back. I have close to 100 dives with my guardian and the guys on my boat probably have more than that on the other guardian. Everyone loves it. I even travel with it now. I brought it to the keys and Antigua.........Once you get used to it - its hard to go back.

[mntdiver]

MSltr, please don't be offended by this, but are you recommending that you use a QD fitting on the side of the mask as a solution to an OOA situation? Have you tried disconnecting and reconnecting an alternate QD fitting underwater on the blind side of your mask? Then with gloves and even a minor task loading, I think you'll find the feces heading for the propeller. You're probably better off with a manifold block, gas switch block or even going directly to a bailout of the system.

[MSltr]

My son and I practice this drill at the end of every dive, and is quite simple. It is no easier than disconnecting a stuck BCD inflator or drysuit hose; albeit they are usually under full pressure. The quick disconnects come off very easily and it re-connects instantly to his mask. It is quicker than removing a full face mask and then w/o a mask reaching for a safe second and then locating and putting on a spare face mask. And then you ascending while you are dragging your mask below you. It was a recommended practice by the dealer that sells the mask and gave us the training--Athens SCUBA Park, TX.

[manni-yunk]

My son and I practice this drill at the end of every dive, and is quite simple. It is no easier than disconnecting a stuck BCD inflator or drysuit hose; albeit they are usually under full pressure. The quick disconnects come off very easily and it re-connects instantly to his mask. It is quicker than removing a full face mask and then w/o a mask reaching for a safe second and then locating and putting on a spare face mask. And then you ascending while you are dragging your mask below you. It was a recommended practice by the dealer that sells the mask and gave us the training--Athens SCUBA Park, TX.

I'll bet that with training - you can either (a) switch at a manifold OR (b) remove the mask and go to a back up reg and back up mask faster,safer, and easier than what you are currently doing.

And although pretty inconspicuous - Mntdiver is probably one of the foremost authority on FFM on this site......or any other. I wont "sell him" to you - but he is one of the best. He was involved with the design of a FFM as well as director of training for one of them. That being said (design and training), if there is a way you "should" and "should not" be doing something - I would trust his advice.

A quick disconnect can be added to any mask - thats nothing specific to a neptune so its not vendor specific.