Dive shop & Charter boat didn't check C-Card...so what??

[RaginCajun]

I went on a dive charter recently and nobody checked my C-Card!

No, I won't post their name publicly....for a few reasons.

First, is this illegal in some respect? I doubt that the PADI police will run around executing undercover SCUBA ID rings. Secondly, I was not very happy with the price structure for the dive and quality of the rental gear so I was a bit pissed when I stepped off the boat. This notwhistanding, I did go over to the shop and speak with the (dude on duty-no manager there). He explained things to me and in the end, they were only a few bucks high on tank rentals in my opinion, so it's not a big deal. Next time I'll ask more specific questions about other rental gear. I am glad that I went over to talk about my gripes and that I didn't haul off and post a half truthful post on the internet. I did point out that nobody checked my C-Card to the guy on duty and he took the comment seriously and indicated that he'd follow up on it.

So what do yall think? Is this a public outrage? Is it a legal issue, or it it no big deal? Should the shop be repremanded for checking no C-Cards on a 10+ person charter? Although I do not believe that any of the other divers lacked proper documentation, I was quite surprised.

 

[ReefHound]

There's certainly nothing "illegal" about it as there are no laws requiring you to even have certification. PADI doesn't really get involved in charter operations but their insurer might have an issue with it. The problem is there is really no reason not to check as part of a standard procedure. Did they have you sign waivers?

 

[drbill]

I can't speak for the laws of the State of Texas. It is my understanding that here in California, one is required to have a c-card to get an air fill. At least that is what I was told when I moved here nearly 40 years ago after diving uncertified for eight years.

Perhaps if the boat does not actually fill tanks, a c-card verification may not be required. I've never been on a boat, or had a tank filled, here without being asked to see my c-card (unless they knew me already).

What burns me is when an operator checks a valid c-card and is hesitant to accept it because it isn't one they recognize or from their agency. I was certified by Los Angeles County Underwater Unit, one of the finest training operations in the States and the source for most of the original PADI and NAUI folks. I've had PADI facilities hesitant to accept that c-card, and finally ended up getting a PADI certification in Australia (where the instructor not only recognized my c-card and agency, but declared it to be a museum piece).

 

[ArcticDiver]

I went on a dive charter recently and nobody checked my C-Card!

No, I won't post their name publicly....for a few reasons.

...
So what do yall think? Is this a public outrage? Is it a legal issue, or it it no big deal? Should the shop be repremanded for checking no C-Cards on a 10+ person charter? Although I do not believe that any of the other divers lacked proper documentation, I was quite surprised.

First of all it is good you didn't mention their name.

Public outrage? Nope, it is your job to keep yourself safe, not theirs. Anything they do is between them and their insurance company.

Legal or no big deal? No big deal except as it may affect their insurance. Assuming of course they had you sign one of the umbiquitous waivers that are common in the scuba industry. Legal only to the extent of any Coast Guard or other marine laws that apply to you being on the boat regardless of scuba.

Should they be reprimanded? Again, no. It is strictly self protection for them to check certifications. It is not their responsibility to make sure you are safe. In fact, most times, and probably your incident was one of them, the diver signs a document saying they are not responsible.

Bottom line is that the individual diver is responsible for their own safety. Anything the dive shop or dive charter does in that regard is good business to try not to kill off their customer base. Take a good look at the waiver you undoubtedly signed and you will see just what they are not responsible for; just about everything. No waiver? Then I'd worry because they obviously aren't very intelligent in conducting their business and I'd wonder if that lack carried over to how they pumped breathing gas, maintained the boat, etc.

 

[ReefHound]

I can't speak for the laws of the State of Texas. It is my understanding that here in California, one is required to have a c-card to get an air fill. At least that is what I was told when I moved here nearly 40 years ago after diving uncertified for eight years.

Must be tough on paint ballers.

As for accepting cards from lesser known agencies, if the purpose of a card is to verify qualifications then determining authenticity is an inherent step in that. If they don't recognize an agency name and still accept the card then what's the point of checking at all? Anyone could just print up their own card using whatever agency name they created.

 

[Noboundaries]

I went on a dive charter recently and nobody checked my C-Card!

I'll bet you filled out a waiver form and had to put your c-card number and cert level on the form. On the charters I've used in both northern and southern California, no one has ever checked my actual c-card, but it came out of my wallet when I filled out the form because I don't have the ten digit number memorized.

 

[Web Monkey]

I went on a dive charter recently and nobody checked my C-Card!

No, I won't post their name publicly....for a few reasons.

First, is this illegal in some respect?

No it's not illegal, and in reality nobody cares if you're certified except the dive operator's insurance company. If you get hurt or killed and aren't certified, the lawyers would be lining up down the hall trying to take the case.

If someone didn't check my C-Card, I'd be a little worried that they figured that they had nothing to lose.

Terry

 

[deco_martini]

Sometimes (especially when you are with other people with c-cards) you may be overlooked due to human error.

 

[Tom Smedley]

There is no law saying that an operation must check your c-card, however it is an industry standard that protects from liability.

The question is the circumstances in which you came to the shop:
Were you alone, just there as an open boater.
Were you a part of a group - where your group leader verified your certification.
Did the person behind the counter recognize you as a repeat customer.

If you were not a part of a group and were an open boater they should have verified your certification. If you were there as a group with a recongized group leader then that person would be responsible for verifying the credentials of the divers they brought aboard.

In the case of at least one operation, they do check c-cards even if folks are there with a group but another operation does not, they take my word that my divers are certified.

There is also the possibility that the person behind the counter was preoccuped and forgot. In that case, if you are uncomfortable, be assertive and challenge them. "Aren't you going to verify my credentials?"

 

[tc]

I can't speak for the laws of the State of Texas. It is my understanding that here in California, one is required to have a c-card to get an air fill. At least that is what I was told when I moved here nearly 40 years ago after diving uncertified for eight years.

Perhaps if the boat does not actually fill tanks, a c-card verification may not be required. I've never been on a boat, or had a tank filled, here without being asked to see my c-card (unless they knew me already).

What burns me is when an operator checks a valid c-card and is hesitant to accept it because it isn't one they recognize or from their agency. I was certified by Los Angeles County Underwater Unit, one of the finest training operations in the States and the source for most of the original PADI and NAUI folks. I've had PADI facilities hesitant to accept that c-card, and finally ended up getting a PADI certification in Australia (where the instructor not only recognized my c-card and agency, but declared it to be a museum piece).

Bill- No, there are no state wide laws in California that require a C-Card. The only local law I'm aware of is Laguna and I beleive they stopped attempting to enforce it a couple of years back.

It is however common practice to verify certification before filling tanks, etc.

But yes, if you walk in to a shop and say the tank is for paintball you will most likely get a fill with no other questions asked.

Had a non-certified (and non-student of course) diver gotten hurt the shop/boat's liability carrier would have undoubtedly have had a difficult time hiding their smiles when they informed them that the policy terms had been violated and they were very sorry but their coverage was void.