OPEN WATER TEST Problem

[lkn2myis]

My girlfriend and I just got back from Dutch Springs to do our Open Water dives for certification. We both have colds.

She could not equalize, severe ear problems brought on by the cold.

We both rented equipment from where we took our lessons.

I had a different issue.
After suiting up, I felt WAY too 'tight' - hood and wet suit.

When we hit the water, I could not inhale or exhale - regulatore, etc., working, but I couldn't breathe.

I left the water, loosened by BCD, figuring that was the problem. However when I went back in, the same problem . SEVERE tightness in the arms, chest, thighs, legs, and particularly the neck.

I do not have claustrophoblia, and I wasn't particularly nervous.

I think that the wet suit and the hood did not fit properly and were restricting blood flow and muscle movement. The suit was 7mm.

One of the instructors told me that where I rented the suit bought only the suits that were not 'made or sized properly, so they get them cheaply'. I also think the hood was WAY too tight, particularly by the lower throat, where the wet suit went over it.

One of the owners tells me that this wouldn't be a problem, the other owner tells me it could be a problem.

Anybody have any advice? I might try some pool dives with different suits, or just might wait for my Carribean trip and do the OW dives there.

I'd appreciate advice/suggestions. This put a really bad taste in my mouth.

 

[MaresMan1]

lkn2myis once bubbled...
My girlfriend and I just got back from Dutch Springs to do our Open Water dives for certification. We both have colds. She could not equalize, severe ear problems brought on by the cold.

We both rented equipment from where we took our lessons.

I had a different issue.
After suiting up, I felt WAY too 'tight' - hood and wet suit.

When we hit the water, I could not inhale or exhale - regulatore, etc., working, but I couldn't breathe.

I left the water, loosened by BCD, figuring that was the problem. However when I went back in, the same problem . SEVERE tightness in the arms, chest, thighs, legs, and particularly the neck.

I do not have claustrophoblia, and I wasn't particularly nervous.

I think that the wet suit and the hood did not fit properly and were restricting blood flow and muscle movement. The suit was 7mm.

I'd appreciate advice/suggestions. This put a really bad taste in my mouth.

First let me say Welcome to the Wet World and good luck with your training.

Second, no one should be diving with any kind of cold. This can cause serious problems and injury. You should have learned this in you training class. I am surprised that the instructors would even allow it.

Wet/Drysuits:
It is very important that you use a properly fitting Wet or Drysuit. Especially for the reasons you mentioned. Water pressure will do enough to your body, you do not want the suit to add to that.

A wetsuit should fit snugly to minimize water flow, but not be uncomfortable or restrict movement, or worse breathing. You were right to about the dive. The importact points are the wrist, ankle and neck seals (arm, thigh and neck if it's a shorty). Additionally, there should be no large open spaces in the underarm or groin regions. If you can, try different suits until you find one that you feel snug but comfortable.

Good luck with your training and read and try as much as you can to see what really works for you and makes you comfortable.

Dive Smart, Dive Safe
Enjoy the ride
:mean:

 

[lkn2myis]

Thanks, you are right on all counts.

We did indeed cover this in class with our instructors (diving with colds). When we told the dive shop worker prior to going for the weekend, we were told to 'take plenty of drugs'.

We mentioned this to the shop because we were indeed concerned.

My belief for my own problem was that the suit and hood constricted breathing and movement. The tightness around the neck was noticable when standing, and when going face down into the water, it probable restricted blood flow even more.

Not a good way to start - I am a little disappointed.

 

[Arnaud]

Being able to appreciate the difference between snug and too tight is virtually impossible when you're wearing a wet suit for the first time ever.

However, there are plenty of other causes that may prevent you from breathing properly. Some of these causes could be medical. Have you taken a physical prior to getting in the water? If not, you should, preferably with an ENT who understands diving. Some other causes could be a BC that's too restrictive or overinflated, or a faulty reg.

Also, a hood that's too tight may cause a carotid sinus reflex and you could black out. It can also create a dangerous squeeze in your ears and prevent you from equalizing.

Finally, I would stop using this shop and report them to whatever agency they're affiliated with. Whoever recommended that you take "plenty of drugs" before diving should be fired on the spot. You just don't dive if you're not feeling 100% well. The damages that could result from a cold or an infection could prevent you from ever diving again. As a rule of thumb, you simply don't dive if you're medicated, unless a physician who knows and understands diving has given you his or her blessing.

 

[lkn2myis]

The person who suggested the drugs was a worker there, and I should have known better and spoken with the owners who are excellent. That was my error. My experience with this worker is that occasionally the worker rushes and does not pay enough attention to what is going on. It was MY responsibility to go back and check the fit, etc., with the owner. I did not do this.

However, my real concern is whether the suit and hood fit caused my problems.

At first I thought my problem WAS the BCD. I exited the water and loosened it tremendously, they went back in. No real change.

The tightness centered around the area the wet suit covered, particularly where the neck meets the collarbone beneath the Adam's apple. However, the suit was constricting legs, thighs, arms, and chest.

All the equipment did,indeed, feel odd. The weight belt was 30 lbs, as opposed to 8 lbs in the pool.

I have regular physicals and had myself cleared by a physician before takine my first lesson. I am about 6 feet tall and weigh about 200 lbs, 52 years old. I have certainly been in better shape, but I am not in THAT bad shape.

I am on medication regularly for cholestoral, and my physician gave me the okay (as well as a release letter) that the medication should not affect the abilitiy to scuba dive.

I'm trying to figure if my perception of what was happening makes sense. Seems to to me, but I guess I'm looking for any input I can.

 

[Arnaud]

lkn2myis once bubbled...
The person who suggested the drugs was a worker there, and I should have known better and spoken with the owners who are excellent. That was my error. My experience with this worker is that occasionally the worker rushes and does not pay enough attention to what is going on. It was MY responsibility to go back and check the fit, etc., with the owner. I did not do this.

I appreciate the fact that you want to take responsability, but you may not do a favor to the store's future clients. No one working at an LDS should be giving that kind of ill-fated advice.

However, my real concern is whether the suit and hood fit caused my problems.

At first I thought my problem WAS the BCD. I exited the water and loosened it tremendously, they went back in. No real change.

Again, if the BC fit OK when you were out of the water, but was too restrictive on the surface, it might have been overinflated. This is typical of a jacket style BC, especially if you have too much lead on.

The tightness centered around the area the wet suit covered, particularly where the neck meets the collarbone beneath the Adam's apple. However, the suit was constricting legs, thighs, arms, and chest..

There seems to be a real problem, here. If the hood or the suit is too tight and restricts circulation, the brain will send a signal to the heart to slow down. This can cause a black out.

All the equipment did,indeed, feel odd. The weight belt was 30 lbs, as opposed to 8 lbs in the pool...

I thought the owners were "excellent"... Poor rental equipment is another indication that you may want to take your business somewhere else.

Also, the 30# may have contributed to your over inflating your BC to be positive on the surface, pressing the BC against your chest and restricting breathing. Were you using a snorkel?

I have regular physicals and had myself cleared by a physician before takine my first lesson. I am about 6 feet tall and weigh about 200 lbs, 52 years old. I have certainly been in better shape, but I am not in THAT bad shape.

I am on medication regularly for cholestoral, and my physician gave me the okay (as well as a release letter) that the medication should not affect the abilitiy to scuba dive....

Looks like you did what you had to do. However, is your doctor a diver? Does he know diving medicine?

 

[MaresMan1]

Don't be dissapointed, just use this as a lesson not to forget. Sounds like you have a good rapport with the LDS, but when something doesn't feel right, don't do the dive.

Arnaud is right on with his statements and concerns. You are correct when you say that you are responsible for yourself. Ask lots of questions and learn, learn, learn, before you enter the water.

30lbs, 7mil WS, fresh water? Sounds a little over weighted to me. Ask your LDS to show how to do a proper weight test (they should have done this also), to see what the best weight is for you.

It's never a good idea to dive on any sort of drugs. You have the added issue of making sure that additional drugs don't interact with your cholestoral meds.

A good diver nevers stops learning and improving Good luck!

Dive Smart, Dive Safe
Enjoy the ride
:mean:

 

[lkn2myis]

My doctor was a diver, hasn't dove in about 4 years. I trust his advice. He examined my ears, discussed equalization methods, etc. While I don't know the extent of his knowledge, it certainly exceeded mine.

I do indeed tend to follow-up with the LDS owner. We had a conversation about what transpired when I returned the rental equipment. I indicated to the owner that I suspected I was poorly fitted for the equipment. He agreed, the other owner disagreed, but could come up with no other suggestions.
They both suggested I come back to the pool and do some confined water stuff with different set-ups to find what works for me, or what the problem I experienced was.
Since I suspect the equipment, they offered to waive any rental fees for other dives to complete my OW stuff.

My partner's rental equipment appeared to be VERY new. By contrast, mine was on th other side of the spectrum.

The owner's are excellent, not a problem there. I believe the issue lies with the worker. The worker outfitted both my partner and I on different days. We compared the equipment at the dive site, and mine was inferior. I do not know if my equipment was 'standard' for the shop, or if my partner's was. I mentioned this to the owner, and he paid close attention.

My weights were upped to 30# after we tested for weight in about 3 feet of water. With the 7mm suit and 25# of weight, deflated BCD, I could not get to the bottom. Hovered about 12" from the bottom. At that point, they added an additional 5# of weight, and I was able to bottom out. The owners were not at the dive site - two instructors were there. Mine and another one.

I was using a snorkel, and the same thing happened. That's when I loosened the BCD and tried everything all over again. No real change.

 

[Arnaud]

lkn2myis,

1. A snorkel has dead airways which could amplify the breathing difficulty (you end up rebreathing your own CO2). You should try to breath without it or with your reg on the surface and see if it changes anything.

2. Try to slightly deflate your BC or get the next larger size.

3. Weight checking in 3' of water is definitely not the recommended method. Instructors tend to overweight their students to make sure they stay at the bottom. You should ask your instructor to revisit the issue.

Basic method with a full tank: you should be floating at eye level with a deflated BC. Once you're there, add between 4 and 6# to make up for the weight of the air you'll be using in your tank.

Recommended method with an empty tank (500 to 750 psi): at the end of your dive, you should be neutral at 15' with a deflated BC. If you go down, you're overweighted, if you go up, you're too light.

Remember, the whole point of diving is to have fun. If your gear is not adequate or if you're not properly weighted, it will bother you (as it did). The good news is that it can easily be fixed. It takes a little more time and some cooperation from your instructor.

Looks like you took the good steps with your doctor.

Don't be frustrated by a less than perfect experience. Diving takes a lot of trial and error.

 

[lkn2myis]

Arnaud -
Thank you, you have been very informative.
I am not at all ready to give up, just ready to rectify this and get on with the fun.
I'll keep the forum posted as to how things work out.
This is one of the reasons that forums such as this are invaluable.
A heartfelt thanks.
Lkn2myis